# Impeller kit, does it really help?



## ChrisJ

So I keep seeing guys talking about these and I'm curious how much it helps with slush.

I often get slush at the end of the driveway from salt on the road and by slush, I mean horrible to move even with a shovel. It's the slush you get that looks almost clear from the amount of water in it.

Will my Ariens 24" be able to handle this with an impeller kit?


And, how can anyone get themselves to drill into their impeller without crying?


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## Pathfinder13

On youtube there is a guy that put out a with/without video. He's blowing heavy wet slushy edge of street stuff. It helps. He demonstrates it. 






I prefer the method of thru-holes and small bolt/washer,nylock nuts over his method of self-tappers. Other than that it's the way to go.


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## caddydaddy

The very wet stuff that fell last night was no problem for my 208cc Cub Cadet with the impeller kit. I did my whole driveway of slushy snow and didn't have to clear the chute once!


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## Geno

It helps.. hands down the best addition to a snowblower if you want to add or change anything. The holes being drilled is minor to the machine as they get filled with bolts and rubber on one side. You could put nylon or rubber washer on head side if worried about rust- but never is a issue after several years of use. Drill the holes carefully and remember to start with pilot holes so bit don't jump on you. take chute off and have too it. You'll be glad you did.


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## caddydaddy

Geno said:


> and remember to start with pilot holes so bit don't jump on you.


The instructions for my kit said to use a center punch. I did and the drill bit didn't jump.


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## brickcity

all i read about here is how great impeller kits are.
must be a reason no manufactuer sells them. if they are so great i would think some company would have a line from the factory with them


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

+1 on everything Geno said. I put one on the old toro 5/24 I have and it was like a different machine after I was done. It amazed me how much of a difference those little pieces of rubber made. I used and old tractor trailer mudflap that I ripped down to size on a tablesaw.


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## greatwhitebuffalo

ChrisJ said:


> So I keep seeing guys talking about these and I'm curious how much it helps with slush.
> 
> I often get slush at the end of the driveway from salt on the road and by slush, I mean horrible to move even with a shovel. It's the slush you get that looks almost clear from the amount of water in it.
> 
> Will my Ariens 24" be able to handle this with an impeller kit?
> 
> 
> And, how can anyone get themselves to drill into their impeller without crying?



it will no doubt help. when you get that heavy slush sleet snow, it's best to just plow it. or, let it melt, if at end of season. snowblowers never were made to move that stuff. they are snowblowers, not mudblowers or slushblowers. 

to move slush you need something like a hydraulic pump, the kind they use to pump concrete. 

the paddle kits help seal the impeller housing, but they also fill the impeller full of holes, and add a bunch of weight to the impeller. they are a catch 22, i.e. 2 steps ahead, one back.


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## ChrisJ

brickcity said:


> all i read about here is how great impeller kits are.
> must be a reason no manufactuer sells them. if they are so great i would think some company would have a line from the factory with them





greatwhitebuffalo said:


> it will no doubt help. when you get that heavy slush sleet snow, it's best to just plow it. or, let it melt, if at end of season. snowblowers never were made to move that stuff. they are snowblowers, not mudblowers or slushblowers.
> 
> to move slush you need something like a hydraulic pump, the kind they use to pump concrete.
> 
> the paddle kits help seal the impeller housing, but they also fill the impeller full of holes, and add a bunch of weight to the impeller. they are a catch 22, i.e. 2 steps ahead, one back.




See this is what I don't understand.
If they are so great why doesn't a brand new Ariens or Honda come with it installed? It's $5 worth of rubber and hardware if you're doing it in mass production.


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## micah68kj

brickcity said:


> all i read about here is how great impeller kits are.
> must be a reason no manufactuer sells them. if they are so great i would think some company would have a line from the factory with them


There *is * a company that produces them. I have done this modification to two different blowers and *they work.*


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## micah68kj

ChrisJ said:


> See this is what I don't understand.
> If they are so great why doesn't a brand new Ariens or Honda come with it installed? It's $5 worth of rubber and hardware if you're doing it in mass production.


Don,t know. Why don't you ask the manufacturer directly? All I know is there are a thousand guys on this forum who happily use them.


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## Prof100

ChrisJ said:


> See this is what I don't understand.
> If they are so great why doesn't a brand new Ariens or Honda come with it installed? It's $5 worth of rubber and hardware if you're doing it in mass production.


 Simplicity introduced the concept on its snow blowers decades ago but dropped it. Like many manufacturers cost savings probably entered into the decision to drop the feature. Current impeller and housings are simple welded fabrications and the extra tolerance between the housing and impeller is designed for piece-to-piece variability. The Impeller kits we install are custom fit to our machines. The impeller to housing clearance has a broad tolerance and gap between both is kept large to prevent metal to metal contact. Fitting rubber wipers to each impeller is tailored to each unique machine. In mfg. doing that on thousands of production machines requires custom fitting.


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## ChrisJ

micah68kj said:


> Don,t know. Why don't you ask the manufacturer directly? All I know is there are a thousand guys on this forum who happily use them.


No need to get nasty.
I'm just asking for opinions and explaining my thoughts. I'm sorry if I offended anyone.


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## Georgegn

*Impellor kit*

Heavy wet snow in Boston last night. My old Ariens would always clog the chute in that kind of stuff.I recently put kit on ..Tried as hard as I could today to get chute clogged and I could not..Throws regular snow lots higher and farther.I wish I had done it sooner.


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## micah68kj

ChrisJ said:


> No need to get nasty.
> I'm just asking for opinions and explaining my thoughts. I'm sorry if I offended anyone.


I wasn't intending anything nasty. I just asked why don't you contact the machine manufacturer. That's all I intended. Maybe no one has approached them with the idea. My thought is they build in that distance to make their machines more "friendly". You know when machine performance is altered, tolerances closed off etc... Things tend to get a'little dicier.


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## Geno

One reason 'maybe' is that Clarence probably holds the Patent. Some machines.. Like Honda already got close tolerances so don't need them. Good question though- Really don't know the answer.


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## 43128

honda wouldnt put them on because it would make it throw to far. imagine an hs1332 throwing the snow halfway down your street


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## Rob711

Did it on my 68 ariens with 212 predator, cannot clog chute, it will pump water


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## Pathfinder13

Prof100 said:


> Simplicity introduced the concept on its snow blowers decades ago but dropped it. Like many manufacturers cost savings probably entered into the decision to drop the feature. Current impeller and housings are simple welded fabrications and the extra tolerance between the housing and impeller is designed for piece-to-piece variability. The Impeller kits we install are custom fit to our machines. The impeller to housing clearance has a broad tolerance and gap between both is kept large to prevent metal to metal contact. Fitting rubber wipers to each impeller is tailored to each unique machine. In mfg. doing that on thousands of production machines requires custom fitting.


I would think they could design some simple flexible rubber flaps thick enough to do the job, have the impellers predrilled with 1/4 inch holes, and manufacture the flaps with slotted holes with varibility in mind so that during manufacture they could be installed easiliy, slid almost to contact with the housing and tightened with nylocks. 

It's too bad they don't do it, as drilling inside the chute isn't all that fun with the machine put together. That said, I'm glad I have an extensive drill collection including extended length bits as it wasn't a problem with the right tools.


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## GustoGuy

Rob711 said:


> Did it on my 68 ariens with 212 predator, cannot clog chute, it will pump water


A couple years ago in March we had a wet heavy snow fall of about a foot of snow and about a week later it had melted and left a 2 inch deep puddle in the driveway and then we got another 6 inches of snow on top of it. I was blowing it and I went into the puddle and my machine was throwing a wet slushy water and snow mix about 4 feet out of the chute with out clogging at all. Before the impeller kit it it would have never been able to throw water and slush out like this. Great addition to any two stage blower


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## Bob J

I put them on my 1988 vintage Toro 624 and got to use it after the last storm...... Was amazed at the difference..... Like a totally different machine..... Throws roughly 50% further and no longer clogs when I get down to the edge of the street....

Cut truck mudflaps and had to drill/tap my impeller since the toro uses heavy steel for their second stage.... 1/4-20 bolts with shoulder washers to secure them seem to be holding up so far....


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## Dave C

Added them to my Craftsman 5/22 a couple weeks ago. We just had an inch of wet slushy stuff that would have brought it to it's knees and now it throws like magic. Unbelievable difference.


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## micah68kj

ChrisJ said:


> So I keep seeing guys talking about these and I'm curious how much it helps with slush.
> 
> I often get slush at the end of the driveway from salt on the road and by slush, I mean horrible to move even with a shovel. It's the slush you get that looks almost clear from the amount of water in it.
> 
> Will my Ariens 24" be able to handle this with an impeller kit?
> 
> 
> And, how can anyone get themselves to drill into their impeller without crying?


Chris, trust us. If your blower has a gap between impeller and drum this mod *will definitely help.* . As I said there are so many in here who have made this mod to their machines and have been "blown away" ( pun intended) by the better performance. And as to drilling holes in your impeller.... They're only holes. I drilled holes in the impellers of two of my machines and shed not a tear. 
Another mod I strongly suggest is to get rid of your metal skids if you have them and get some type of composite or plastic skids. Driveway/concrete friendly and wear " like a pig's nose" as a very wise forum member told me.


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## Koenig041

It works! It works! It works! I did it last season on the '79 Toro 1132. Prevents clogging on the really heavy stuff. Light, fluffy snow goes easily 50% farther, like another member posted. 

Take your chute off for better access to the impeller. Have a couple of "quality" drill bits on hand and use a lubricant. The steel used in the old blowers was meant to last and not bend. I went thru a few of the cheaper drill bits. That old metal is tough. I also used self tapping machine screws once the holes were made.


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## DaHen

Koenig041 said:


> Have a couple of "quality" drill bits on hand and use a lubricant. The steel used in the old blowers was meant to last and not bend. I went thru a few of the cheaper drill bits. That old metal is tough. I also used self tapping machine screws once the holes were made.


All I have around the garage are the run-of-the-mill bits that are pretty well worn out. Exactly which "quality" bits did you use? 

I've got a heavy duty corded drill standing by and ready to go on my impeller kit.


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## Prof100

DaHen said:


> All I have around the garage are the run-of-the-mill bits that are pretty well worn out. Exactly which "quality" bits did you use?
> 
> I've got a heavy duty corded drill standing by and ready to go on my impeller kit.


I used a Harborfreight unibit clone. These come in 3 pack sets of different sizes for $9 to $20 (price based on standard price to sale price). The steps keep from punching through and driving your knuckles into some bare sheet metal. A 7" extension works well. You really should remove your chute to get easy access to the impeller. Also, because the impeller wants to turn when drilling you'll need to keep it in position with strong broomstick, 2x2 or whatever.


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## Koenig041

I used a drill with a cord as well. As far as quality, if it breaks while being used, need a better bit. I second using something to stop the impeller from moving. You will need to apply some down force to drill the holes. Some youtube videos on the process.


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## Grunt

Another installation tip. Wear gloves and put an old towel or rags around the chute opening. When the drill goes through the impeller, "You WILL skin your knuckles on the chute opening". Don't ask how I know.


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## Tachead

Another tip... pay someone who knows what they are doing if you are not a tradesman or mechanically inclined. I have seen many machines destroyed by the likes of ignorant owners and back yard mechanics.


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## Dave C

I did it myself, and it would have been much easier if I had a helper. Took the chute off first and put the machine on my motorcycle lift for better access. I used the kit as supplied. Some double sided tape between the backing plates and rubber kept them in alignment. Also used tape between the rubber and impeller blades. After rotating the impeller I found the tightest spot and added a small C-clamp to hold the pieces in place. Then drilled through the impellers with a Milwaukee 3/16" bit on a 12" extension, using the backing plate as a template. One hole at a time, dropping a bolt in place to ensure alignment while drilling the next one. I used a wrench on the output shaft to keep the impeller from turning while applying drill pressure.

An issue to be aware of is that if your impellers have a vertical support underneath, you need to insure that there'll be clearance to put the nut on underneath. Mine came very close. On the next machine, I think I'll use truck flaps and aluminum stock so I can have a custom length and position the holes in a clear area.

As someone here said, it's not hard but it's no fun. And yes, it works.


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## Pathfinder13

DaHen said:


> All I have around the garage are the run-of-the-mill bits that are pretty well worn out. Exactly which "quality" bits did you use?
> 
> I've got a heavy duty corded drill standing by and ready to go on my impeller kit.


I used extended length bits and drilled from above. Center punch, then 1/4" bit about 10 inches long, they are called "installer's" bits. Think they make them for the guys that install cables after a home is built. I used wood to block the impeller from moving, removed the plug wire too. Drilled from above with chute removed. The hardest part was drilling the holes.


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## DaHen

Ok. Thanks everyone for the info.
We've had Harbor Freight stores popping up around eastern Massachusetts in the last couple of years. I'll get to my friendly neighborhood one this weekend and get those bits.


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## Prof100

DaHen said:


> Ok. Thanks everyone for the info.
> We've had Harbor Freight stores popping up around eastern Massachusetts in the last couple of years. I'll get to my friendly neighborhood one this weekend and get those bits.


 The long bits HF has are for wood not metal. The step drills can drill steel.

Below are the installer bit (wood) link. You don't want those. 

3/8 in. x 48 in. Flex Drill Bit

The step drill set you want is below and it looks like the price is $12.99:

Steel Step Drill Set - 3 Piece, Titanium Nitride Step Drill Bits


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## micah68kj

Grunt said:


> Another installation tip. Wear gloves and put an old towel or rags around the chute opening. When the drill goes through the impeller, "You WILL skin your knuckles on the chute opening". Don't ask how I know.


Ah. I see I have company.


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## micah68kj

I got this Irwin step drill set for $20.00 on a craigslist sale. Only one of the bits had ever been used and it wasn't used much. Craigslist is the place to shop!
Irwin 10225 4-Piece Unibit Step Drill Sets - Ace Tool
These bits will get a ton of drilling jobs done.


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## Prof100

micah68kj said:


> I got this Irwin step drill set for $20.00 on a craigslist sale. Only one of the bits had ever been used and it wasn't used much. Craigslist is the place to shop!
> Irwin 10225 4-Piece Unibit Step Drill Sets - Ace Tool
> These bits will get a ton of drilling jobs done.


Real Unibits are great. I have a couple of sets but they tend to wander around the shop. I like the HF clones because I don't mind losing them. They work great for sheet metal work too! Using them on 1/8" steel is pushing it but they will work if you don't over heat them.


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## Pathfinder13

Prof100 said:


> The long bits HF has are for wood not metal. The step drills can drill steel.
> 
> Below are the installer bit (wood) link. You don't want those.
> 
> 3/8 in. x 48 in. Flex Drill Bit
> 
> The step drill set you want is below and it looks like the price is $12.99:
> 
> Steel Step Drill Set - 3 Piece, Titanium Nitride Step Drill Bits


 My mistake, sorry, they are Aircraft bits.. 

Vermont American 13266 1/4" x 12" Black Oxide Extended Length / Aircraft Drill Bit: Aircraft Extension Drill Bits: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific

I only buy quality bits. That said, the step bits that I do have from HF are pretty darn good. I just didn't use it for this job, the steel on my Toro impellers is too thick for those. They work splendid on thinner material though.


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## silwan

I used a long drill bit from Home Depot, was not expensive. Drilled through an old Toro with a weak 12V old Makita. 6 holes are not a problem. Drill bit is still like new. Use oil to lube drill bit.

New belt this season, the modification on the impeller and the 5hp Toro handled the slush no problem in North Jersey 2 days ago. Throws 2x the distance. Was thinking of repowering with a 212 cc Predator prior to the modification. No need for that now.


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## Koenig041

Ebay has a nice selection of stepped bits as well.


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## Prof100

Prof100 said:


> The long bits HF has are for wood not metal. The step drills can drill steel.
> 
> Below are the installer bit (wood) link. You don't want those.
> 
> 3/8 in. x 48 in. Flex Drill Bit
> 
> The step drill set you want is below and it looks like the price is $12.99:
> 
> Steel Step Drill Set - 3 Piece, Titanium Nitride Step Drill Bits


Above stepped drills are on sale this weekend for $9. With a coupon for all of March they are $8.99. If you drop by a Harbor Freight this weekend (March 6-8) you don't have to mess around with any coupons to get the above set for $9. Coupons are available by signing up with your email address. HF doesn't spam you like crazy.


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## Pathfinder13

Prof100 said:


> Above stepped drills are on sale this weekend for $9. With a coupon for all of March they are $8.99. If you drop by a Harbor Freight this weekend (March 6-8) you don't have to mess around with any coupons to get the above set for $9. Coupons are available by signing up with your email address. HF doesn't spam you like crazy.


I can vouch for those, I have used mine on sheet metal and aluminum angle and they work very well for what they are designed. They are still sharp too


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## Prof100

Pathfinder13 said:


> I can vouch for those, I have used mine on sheet metal and aluminum angle and they work very well for what they are designed. They are still sharp too


 I can vouch for drilling through the 1/8 inch thick impeller in my Bolens to install the Impeller kit. The trick is to go slow and lubricate the drill. I would not normally attempt to drill through steel that thick but they worked fine.


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## dtheo

Are there impeller paddle kits available for the Toro 824? Where can you find them? Thanks


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## tpenfield

dtheo said:


> Are there impeller paddle kits available for the Toro 824? Where can you find them? Thanks


The kits are generic. Lots of folks just buy some bailer belt and hardware to 'make' their own kit.

The only real difference between different models of blowers is in the number of impeller blades . . . usually 3 or 4.

To buy a 'kit', check eBay.


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## JLawrence08648

I did discover a company making kits for specific models. The difference of course is not only the number of the impellers but they cut the rubber to fit the impeller blade exactly with the notches, curves.

To me, if you are capable of installing these, using the drill etc, you are capable of cutting the rubber. However, a kit does make it easier as many do not know where to go to buy the rubber material or the bailing belt, or don't want to spend the time. It's easier ordering from the net and having it come to your door rather than spending the time visiting a Tractor Supply or looking for the "right" material.

I visited a local rubber distributor and picked up the right hardness rubber though it is not reinforced with thread. I got more than enough to do several machines for $12? $20? The right width, length, thickness, and hardness I wanted.


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## CarlB

**** yea it helps a lot.


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## dtheo

Where can you buy the rubber? What should I be looking for? Thanks


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## cranman

Tractor Supply...4" Baler belt


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## Vermont007

I don't know why they always refer to these as "Kits"; mine was made with material from Truck Mudflaps:









And all of the hardware is readily available at the local Hardware Store. Here is a set of those homemade Paddles mounted on a spare Impeller:







I 

I made the holes in these Paddles elongated holes, and just last week, advanced the Paddles by about 3/8" after roughly 3 year's of usage.


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## vinnycom

i had an old bad tire so thats what i used, maybe a pia to cut but the rubber is great for the mod.
my sig has videos on my cutting the tire and i just used self tapping screws with pre drilled pilot holes. best mod to make any sb with a gap between impeller blades and frame throw any kind of snow further than without the mod.


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## orangputeh

what would be the optimum thickness of the rubber. i may use some old rubber floor mats but they may be too thin?

also have had good luck with Hogg drill bits that i got on ebay. made in USA and knock on wood have not had one fail yet. lifetime guarantee.


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## aldfam4

tpenfield said:


> The kits are generic. Lots of folks just buy some bailer belt and hardware to 'make' their own kit.
> 
> The only real difference between different models of blowers is in the number of impeller blades . . . usually 3 or 4.
> 
> To buy a 'kit', check eBay.


...or 6 blades (my Ariens 924) I made my own and put the paddles on all 6 blades. When I finish my driveway I have to do my neighbors to remove my snow from his driveway:grin:


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## nwcove

orangputeh said:


> what would be the optimum thickness of the rubber. i may use some old rubber floor mats but they may be too thin?
> 
> also have had good luck with Hogg drill bits that i got on ebay. made in USA and knock on wood have not had one fail yet. lifetime guarantee.


i did both of my two stagers with sidewall from a light truck tire, the cheapest and durable way to go is with material from used single stage paddles imho.


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## thefixer

I've been using mud flap material from a small mudflap I got at the local auto parts store. It's 1/4 inch thick and is pretty sturdy, and yet still very flexible. I have tested the flaps I've installed (close to 50 sets) with dirt,gravel, ice, and they hold up very well and show minimal wear.


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## orangputeh

thefixer said:


> I've been using mud flap material from a small mudflap I got at the local auto parts store. It's 1/4 inch thick and is pretty sturdy, and yet still very flexible. I have tested the flaps I've installed (close to 50 sets) with dirt,gravel, ice, and they hold up very well and show minimal wear.


thanks for the info. with your experience do you use self tapping screws or just drill holes and use ss bolts and hardware?


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## 1132le

i used big self tappers with washers and a suv tire 
oldest kit is 6 winters old no issues
1 hr job to install


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## aldfam4

nwcove said:


> i did both of my two stagers with sidewall from a light truck tire, the cheapest and durable way to go is with material from used single stage paddles imho.


I agree. Both of my 2 stagers have paddles from my Toro CCR-2000 single stage rubber auger.


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## thefixer

orangputeh said:


> thanks for the info. with your experience do you use self tapping screws or just drill holes and use ss bolts and hardware?


Most of the impellers that I have done are Hondas and the impellers are so easy to take out, and it's much easier to drill and fit everything on the bench. I slot the rubber flaps and then slide them out and tighten once everything is back together. I'm using 1/4 inch grade 8 hardware with a piece of flat bar on top of the rubber. I made templates for the HS series and the HSS series as the impellers on these are different.


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## orangputeh

so they are slotted so you can readjust as needed, I assume.


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## thefixer

Yes the rubber is slotted. It makes the install easier and you can readjust for wear as needed. Give me a call and I'd be happy to set you up with some pieces and you could slap them in.


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## Vermont007

orangputeh said:


> so they are slotted so you can readjust as needed, I assume.


I made mine with holes that are 3/4" long (¼" X ¾") so that all I had to do was loosen the bolt and nut and push the paddle back out to butt to the Barrell (theoretically).

Last week, when I went to adjust them for the 1st time after 3 years, I found that they were frozen in place, so I had to put a hair dryer to each blade for a couple minutes before I could get them to budge . . . . I guess I expected to be doing that re-adjusting in warmer weather instead of the in the dead of Winter.

You can see a bit of my slot behind the nuts in the pictures I posted yesterday.


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## orangputeh

Vermont007 said:


> I made mine with holes that are 3/4" long (¼" X ¾") so that all I had to do was loosen the bolt and nut and push the paddle back out to butt to the Barrell (theoretically).
> 
> Last week, when I went to adjust them for the 1st time after 3 years, I found that they were frozen in place, so I had to put a hair dryer to each blade for a couple minutes before I could get them to budge . . . . I guess I expected to be doing that re-adjusting in warmer weather instead of the in the dead of Winter.
> 
> You can see a bit of my slot behind the nuts in the pictures I posted yesterday.


i've seen these kits online for 40-50-60 bucks and it seems like all you need is some 3/16 to 1/4 inch rubber, some shear pins and some washers. in the video on you tube the guy uses self tapping screws but i think i will just drill through.

and you are right . on a honda you can take the impeller off in a couple minutes which i do all the time to grease the shafts anyway and do a better accurate job on installing an impeller kit.

can't wait to see the difference.


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## all3939

*42" JD snowblower*

This what it has done for me. Bought a new to me second hand 42" in excellent condition for my JD L120 lawn tractor. The Impeller gap was quite big being this is not a high tech high tolerance blower. Went ahead and put a homemade kit in. The result is fantastic. I know it because I used it in slush the first time and not only did it not clog but it had a good far arc on the the watery slushy consistency. Yesterday it was used on an 8" snow fall and all I can say is wow. I'm all for this mod as I have it on several other machines too. In a nut shell, it makes what ever it's in a more capable machine barring all else is in good working order.


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## caddydaddy

Yesterday we got about 5 inches of heavy wet snow in CT. My Cub Cadet with the impeller mod performed amazing and blew slush and water quite far! No clogs at all.


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## drmerdp

orangputeh said:


> i've seen these kits online for 40-50-60 bucks and it seems like all you need is some 3/16 to 1/4 inch rubber, some shear pins and some washers. in the video on you tube the guy uses self tapping screws but i think i will just drill through.
> 
> and you are right . on a honda you can take the impeller off in a couple minutes which i do all the time to grease the shafts anyway and do a better accurate job on installing an impeller kit.
> 
> can't wait to see the difference.


There is really no need to remove the impeller. I fab up and install impeller seals in 30-40 minutes these days. I use 3/16th belted rubber and 16 gauge plate steel.


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## thefixer

I found that it's a lot easier to drill the impeller out of the machine. My template goes on easier and all the ones I've done are the same. Makes repairing or replacing much easier. I like repeatability (if that's a word). I've done a lot of these and it's nice when they're all the same.


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## all3939

I drill the Impeller while on the shaft. Only once was it done out since it was all apart due to a repair. As far as repeatability, I will do all the same for the same Impeller but as we all know the Impeller gussets are not in the same place machine to machine so I don't make an all in one template.
I also don't go the self tapping route and use SS nuts and bolts. I can see vibration and rust getting the best of them at some point.


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## dbert

for what it's worth...I'm still happy with my plastic impeller seals. I'm not sure how many hours I have on them now but they still fill the old gap from the old worn steel.
What I like most about them is how smooth they are (snow doesn't stick) which was my original goal.


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## all3939

dbert said:


> for what it's worth...I'm still happy with my plastic impeller seals. I'm not sure how many hours I have on them now but they still fill the old gap from the old worn steel.
> What I like most about them is how smooth they are (snow doesn't stick) which was my original goal.


I can see what you have there and it'll work no doubt. As you said it's working for a good time now so my theory of the plastic being brittle is non exsisent. I use conveyer belting which is shiny and smooth on the working surface so again sticking a non issue.


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## Vermont007

Are you attempting to hijack this thread ?


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## Dannoman

This impeller mod... Would you do it only if your machine clogs a lot or doesn't throw far enough? If it blows far enough and problem free, would you do it anyways?


----------



## vinnycom

Dannoman said:


> This impeller mod... Would you do it only if your machine clogs a lot or doesn't throw far enough? If it blows far enough and problem free, would you do it anyways?


if theres a big enough gap between impeller blade and housing then yes, it improves efficiency of snow clearing, throwing and less chance of snow clogs if at all, keeps housing free of snow that can turn into ice that would normally freeze up the impeller. plus who ever complains that there snow blower throws too far, that like saying their car has too much power, their brakes stop the car too soon, their tires grip too much etc.


----------



## thefixer

I think that besides the improvement in all around performance, I've found that it really helps with the problem of gravel or small rocks getting between the impeller and housing, bringing everything to a halt.


----------



## drmerdp

thefixer said:


> I think that besides the improvement in all around performance, I've found that it really helps with the problem of gravel or small rocks getting between the impeller and housing, bringing everything to a halt.


I second that. The thousands of pebbles my town spreads with the salt use to beat up my impeller housing a lot. The pebbles are the perfect size to jam and gouge. 

Since adding my impeller seals, all I see are superficial scratches

The HSS gap is really small and I don’t think I’ve improved dry snow throwing distance, but I do believe that I’ve gained more efficiency in wet soaked snow.

If a small gap is good, no gap is better, am I right?


----------



## Dannoman

Do some manufacturers now include this on their machines? And if not why not?


----------



## RIT333

Dannoman said:


> Do some manufacturers now include this on their machines? And if not why not?


I don't think any do, and great question why they don't. Maybe they want to up-sell you to a stronger snowblower.


----------



## vinnycom

Dannoman said:


> Do some manufacturers now include this on their machines? And if not why not?





RIT333 said:


> I don't think any do, and great question why they don't. Maybe they want to up-sell you to a stronger snowblower.


you would think they would, better performance, cheap to produce and install and a part that eventually needs replacing for end user purchase, but i dont see my rubber that i used from an old tire wearing out anytime soon


----------



## Jatoxico

Dannoman said:


> Do some manufacturers now include this on their machines? And if not why not?


Have asked this question many times in many places and have never received an answer that satisfies me. As said above, a potential replacement part they could sell you that improves performance giving an advantage over the competition and no one does it?

I investigated a long time before I did an impeller mod looking for the potential downside. Never found one so in it went.


----------



## tpenfield

Jatoxico said:


> Have asked this question many times in many places and have never received an answer that satisfies me. As said above, a potential replacement part they could sell you that improves performance giving an advantage over the competition and no one does it?
> 
> I investigated a long time before I did an impeller mod looking for the potential downside. Never found one so in it went.


I also have wondered why the manufacturers don't have the equivalent of the impeller mod in their designs. They are certainly capable of making a machine with close enough tolerances. 

One aspect that has occurred to me is the curve that most impellers have at the front of the blades where it 'grabs' the snow from the augers. From a design geometry perspective, they either have to bevel the curved portion a bit, or offset the blade from the housing a small amount ( 1/2" ish ) in order to make clearance of the impeller. I guess they chose to offset the blades rather than bevel the curved portion.


----------



## Jatoxico

tpenfield said:


> I also have wondered why the manufacturers don't have the equivalent of the impeller mod in their designs. *They are certainly capable of making a machine with close enough tolerances*.


Impeller design notwithstanding, putting in a "wear" part would actually allow the manufacturers to be less precise in tolerance in the impeller/housing (if they chose) and still achieve better performance. I still don't get it.


----------



## tpenfield

We should send them an email . . . :smile2:


----------



## Dannoman

You would think the manufacturers would care about how people here feel about this issue. Honda, Ariens, Cub Cadet... Are you listening?


----------



## cranman

Don't tell them....its a gold mine for us........


----------



## paulm12

I'v wondered as well why no manufacturer has included this concept. I know it is a potential wear part, but so is the paddle on a single stage. I keep thinking there has to be a concern (increased wear on the bearings, etc?) . I know it costs a few dollars, but the good reviews would surely offset any price increases.


----------



## detdrbuzzard

Dannoman said:


> You would think the manufacturers would care about how people here feel about this issue. Honda, Ariens, Cub Cadet... Are you listening?


we know about impeller kits but the majority of people that use snowblowers don't so the manufactures have no incentive to add a kit on their machines. on the other hand if they did add an impeller kit and it wore out and the snowblower started clogging up we could probably find some good deals on machines that need nothing more than a carb cleaning and a replacement impeller kit


----------



## cuz

Hello all, please help a confused newbie. If the idea of the impeller kit is to reduce the gap to improve performance, why do the Ariens Pro models have 14” impeller with a 16” auger diameter? It seems that by increasing the auger diameter on the Pro models without increasing the impeller size they are decreasing the performance over their Platinum line. 

Or, it’s possible (and more likely) that I have no idea what the auger diameter spec refers to. I thought it was the opening where the impeller is. Am I missing something here???

Thanks,
Cuz


----------



## Dauntae

cuz said:


> Hello all, please help a confused newbie. If the idea of the impeller kit is to reduce the gap to improve performance, why do the Ariens Pro models have 14” impeller with a 16” auger diameter? It seems that by increasing the auger diameter on the Pro models without increasing the impeller size they are decreasing the performance over their Platinum line.
> 
> Or, it’s possible (and more likely) that I have no idea what the auger diameter spec refers to. I thought it was the opening where the impeller is. Am I missing something here???
> 
> Thanks,
> Cuz


Augers are the things that go side to side that pull the snow into the impeller, The impeller is in the center that spins and tosses the snow out the chute, One feeds the other, The housing is sized to match the size of impeller and augers used.


----------



## cuz

Dauntae said:


> Augers are the things that go side to side that pull the snow into the impeller, The impeller is in the center that spins and tosses the snow out the chute, One feeds the other, The housing is sized to match the size of impeller and augers used.




Ahh, so I guess this clearly served as a good first question and introduction to let everyone know that I don’t know anything about snowblower terminology. 

Thanks for the quick response and for clearing up my confusion. Truly appreciate it. 

-Cuz


----------



## Dauntae

It's all good, Once you start learning this repair stuff you'll be addicted like the rest of us LOL


----------



## orangputeh

on the honda 928 impeller has anyone here tested putting the rubber on front and then backside to see which is better?


----------



## CarlB

backside probably wont work well just bend down and tear.


----------



## JLawrence08648

Years ago there was a windshield wiper blade that had a dual edge, then they came out with a triple edge. What about a double set of rubber on each blade? Ridiculous? Reached the point of diminishing return?

I wouldn't put a single set on the backside because of too much pressure pushing it away from the blade itself, but a double set may reduce the pressure. However, I won't try it! No time for such shenanigans.


----------



## Tony P.

J, it seems to me the effectiveness of an impeller modification lies in how successful we are in filling the impeller gap. Once we get to 1/8" or less very little improvement can be achieved. Beyond that, I believe the type and thickness of the rubber used can have an impact. However, using incorrect rubber (too thin or flexible) can reduce, not improve, effectiveness.


----------



## orangputeh

JLawrence08648 said:


> Years ago there was a windshield wiper blade that had a dual edge, then they came out with a triple edge. What about a double set of rubber on each blade? Ridiculous? Reached the point of diminishing return?
> 
> I wouldn't put a single set on the backside because of too much pressure pushing it away from the blade itself, but a double set may reduce the pressure. However, I won't try it! No time for such shenanigans.


the reason i asked was to see if anyone has done it and report results.i am concerned that on the front side there would be too much ice build up . fellow member 'The Fixer" does not report any . i agree that the back side would perhaps tear more or start to bend backeven with a proper back plate instead of washers.

I have the time so maybe next winter I will try both ways. was hoping someone here has put them on the back and they maybe worked as well over time. time tested is the key.


----------



## Kielbasa

A 1971 Ariens Sno Thro with a 24" bucket throwing to the left (WITH OUT) an impeller kit, with a later model 15" Ariens chute, but is waxed around and under the exit hole and on the inside of the chute and deflector.




A 1974 Ariens Sno Thro with a 32" bucket throwing to the right with an impeller kit with the original 11" Ariens chute.

What do you think? Is the impeller kit needed?


----------



## 1132le

JLawrence08648 said:


> Years ago there was a windshield wiper blade that had a dual edge, then they came out with a triple edge. What about a double set of rubber on each blade? Ridiculous? Reached the point of diminishing return?
> 
> I wouldn't put a single set on the backside because of too much pressure pushing it away from the blade itself, but a double set may reduce the pressure. However, I won't try it! No time for such shenanigans.


way over thinking it
spend 40 min put on the front side with big self taps and washers and check it in 10 yrs
what was the cooking guy use to say

set it anddd forgettttt it


----------



## jim5554

There seems to be two different camps when it comes to these things. The first camp has installed them and swears by them. The second camp has not installed them and either can't accept the assertion that they work well enough to justify the purchase or who warn of serious damage to your machine if you do install them. I would like to hear from someone who has actually installed them and who is not happy with them. There has to be at least one.


----------



## 1132le

Kielbasa said:


> A 1971 Ariens Sno Thro with a 24" bucket throwing to the left (WITH OUT) an impeller kit, with a later model 15" Ariens chute, but is waxed around and under the exit hole and on the inside of the chute and deflector.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A 1974 Ariens Sno Thro with a 32" bucket throwing to the right with an impeller kit with the original 11" Ariens chute.
> 
> What do you think? Is the impeller kit needed?


yes it is my toro power shovel can blow powder
try that with very wet or eod snow and let me know
is a snowblower really needed? 
dont understand why people would ask if its needed when its clear its 100% better
and the cost is free to maybe 5 bucks and takes 30 min to install
wax 8 bucks or more many reapplications plus the time
still 100% fails in rain soaked snow or slush

EOM


----------



## 1132le

jim5554 said:


> There seems to be two different camps when it comes to these things. The first camp has installed them and swears by them. The second camp has not installed them and either can't accept the assertion that they work well enough to justify the purchase or who warn of serious damage to your machine if you do install them. I would like to hear from someone who has actually installed them and who is not happy with them. There has to be at least one.


good luck

those that say they are not needed have to change how they blow snow when its rain sôaked snow or rain soaked eod
they feel the machine start to clog and they stop and hope it clears itself or bang the bucket up and down if it doesnt they clear the clog they pretend it didnt happen iam the best blower operator 
meanwhile its raing on them and it takes and extra 30 min to finish
meanwhile iäm going through it like powder in 3rd gear and inside sipping coco thinking
you can lead a horse to water mmmm good coco been like that since 2009


----------



## Kielbasa

The reason for my post was... 

Where I am throwing snow in the first photo (with out) an impeller kit and I just happen to be throwing the snow to the left. We all know that sno thros... throw snow better to the right than to the left. The second photo shows the user throwing snow to the right with an impeller kit. Is the throw better after installing an impeller kit? I do not think so. I was making a simple comparison. It's too bad that I am not throwing to the right... 

Another point about my waxing... :grin: is... my machine never blocks or clogs with wet heavy or slushy snow now because of the waxing around and below the exit hole no matter if I am clearing my driveway or the apron area. 

Again, I was making a comparison and I think I proved my point pretty well. 

Maybe the way I look at it is... I am solving a problem where the root of the problem is actually occuring and in the area prior to where the problem is actually occuring.


----------



## 1132le

Kielbasa said:


> The reason for my post was...
> 
> Where I am throwing snow in the first photo (with out) an impeller kit and I just happen to be throwing the snow to the left. We all know that sno thros... throw snow better to the right than to the left. The second photo shows the user throwing snow to the right with an impeller kit. Is the throw better after installing an impeller kit? I do not think so. I was making a simple comparison. It's too bad that I am not throwing to the right...
> 
> Another point about my waxing... :grin: is... my machine never blocks or clogs with wet heavy or slushy snow now because of the waxing around and below the exit hole no matter if I am clearing my driveway or the apron area.
> 
> Again, I was making a comparison and I think I proved my point pretty well.
> 
> Maybe the way I look at it is... I am solving a problem where the root of the problem is actually occuring and in the area prior to where the problem is actually occuring.


you proved nothing your vids are of blowing powder
perhaps you installed the impeller kit wrong?
wax stopping clogging did you win publishers clearing house too?


----------



## 1132le

orangputeh said:


> the reason i asked was to see if anyone has done it and report results.i am concerned that on the front side there would be too much ice build up . fellow member 'The Fixer" does not report any . i agree that the back side would perhaps tear more or start to bend backeven with a proper back plate instead of washers.
> 
> I have the time so maybe next winter I will try both ways. was hoping someone here has put them on the back and they maybe worked as well over time. time tested is the key.


I have seen pics of someone who put them on the back
as stated that may lead to ripping the rubber
ive had the kit on the front side of 1 machine since 2009 tek screws and washers no build up at all set it and forget it
no need for spray pam which i used prior or WAXING or any other stuff
what goes in comes out quick


----------



## aldfam4

orangputeh said:


> the reason i asked was to see if anyone has done it and report results.i am concerned that on the front side there would be too much ice build up . fellow member 'The Fixer" does not report any . i agree that the back side would perhaps tear more or start to bend backeven with a proper back plate instead of washers.
> 
> I have the time so maybe next winter I will try both ways. was hoping someone here has put them on the back and they maybe worked as well over time. time tested is the key.


orangputeh, I installed both sets on the Top/Front of my 10/28 Ariens and 10/28 Craftsman - secured with 1/4" stainless bolts with stop nuts on the bottom and fender washers on the top.., there not going anywhere! I hit the bucket, auger and impeller blades up Fluid Film and life is good during snow events here in Western New York. When you take the chute off, stick a 2x4 through the auger to the bottom of the impeller blades - this way when you push down through the chute opening to drill your holes the impeller blade doesn't get away from you!


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## Kielbasa

I am not going to get in to a debate with you because my (PHOTOS) do prove what I have experienced and they also back me up so... until you try what I have tried... 

Unfortunately... I didn't win the Publisher's Clearing House. :sad2: 




1132le said:


> you proved nothing your vids are of blowing powder
> perhaps you installed the impeller kit wrong?
> wax stopping clogging did you win publishers clearing house too?


----------



## 1132le

Kielbasa said:


> I am not going to get in to a debate with you because my (PHOTOS) do prove what I have experienced and they also back me up so... until you try what I have tried...
> 
> Unfortunately... I didn't win the Publisher's Clearing House. :sad2:


Impeller kits are for blowing SLUSHY WET SNOW that cause clogging and having to CHANGE how you blow snow/slush and being outside longer in rainy conditions that make it take much longer to finish
with the kit you go through it just the same as your pics no matter how bad it is out you finish faster with less stress on yourself an the machine
your pics are not showing those condtions
there isnt anything to debate its right in the picture


----------



## JLawrence08648

There are before and after pictures on YouTube where a person video pics of blowing snow, went in the garage and installed the rubber impeller kit, same machine, same snow, and took video again. There was a difference. I don't remember, but to speed the install, I'm sure he had the parts bought, gathered, and laid out, and possible the holes were already drilled. One could dispute the video by saying it was a fraud, yea, sure, and the world is flat and the pics from space are a fraud too! There's are too many people on here that have installed the kit and swear by it to dispute them. They have experienced too many snows in all types of conditions without the kit to dispute them. At $10/blade or less, the cost is minimal so if no difference, no advantage, your not out much, and the potential benefit is great.


----------



## thefixer

I think another way to look at it is - Impeller kit, is it gonna hurt? In my experience, the pros outweigh the cons. I agree with JLawrence, pretty simple upgrade for the truly measurable gains. Try it, you just might like it!!


----------



## Vermont007

I'm pleased with my Impeller Paddles, and as I mentioned a few weeks ago, I just advanced then about ¼" or ⅜" after 3 years.









One thing I noticed is that the heads of the Carriage Bolts inside the Barrel seem to be responsible for most of the wear on my paddles, and I'm wondering if others have encountered this ?

I'm thinking of notching the paddles (truck mud flaps in my case) to prevent any more than minimum damage in the future.


----------



## ChrisJ

Bringing back an older thread.

Impeller kit (flaps) thickness.
I've seen 1/4", I've seen 3/8" and I've seen fairly thin like the one above this post.
Wouldn't 1/8" or 3/16" be plenty thick if made using decent rubber? Something with cords in it etc?

I'm not sure how much this will help mine, it doesn't look like it has a huge amount of gap, but, hopefully I'm wrong?


----------



## orangputeh

ChrisJ said:


> Bringing back an older thread.
> 
> Impeller kit (flaps) thickness.
> I've seen 1/4", I've seen 3/8" and I've seen fairly thin like the one above this post.
> Wouldn't 1/8" or 3/16" be plenty thick if made using decent rubber? Something with cords in it etc?
> 
> I'm not sure how much this will help mine, it doesn't look like it has a huge amount of gap, but, hopefully I'm wrong?
> View attachment 181255


This is your thread.

Once again the best material is conveyor belting. I get mine from Tractor Supply.


----------



## Darby

ChrisJ said:


> Bringing back an older thread.
> 
> Impeller kit (flaps) thickness.
> I've seen 1/4", I've seen 3/8" and I've seen fairly thin like the one above this post.
> Wouldn't 1/8" or 3/16" be plenty thick if made using decent rubber? Something with cords in it etc?
> 
> I'm not sure how much this will help mine, it doesn't look like it has a huge amount of gap, but, hopefully I'm wrong?
> View attachment 181255


By the looks of it I would say your machine is a prime candidate for the mod. In my case I used what I had, and it was thick unreinforced rubber from a sewer drain coupling ! It has only been one season so time will tell as to longevity, My gut feeling is now its worn in, it is all set, given it is a thick piece.. Hope it lasts as long as I do. It did noticeably improve my blowers through put in the wet stuff. Good luck.


----------



## nitehawk55

I'm going to have a look at my Craftsman I just got and see how the gap is . I would have no problem installing if it helps with slush and clogging.
I hope I can get that bailer belt, but an old truck flap shouldn't be hard to find , I'm sure and place that repairs trucks will have some old ones around.


----------



## tabora




----------



## nitehawk55

Thanks , I would be curious to try mine before just so I know , BUT I don't want to be doing that in my unheated garage .
I checked online for that baler belt but no luck , I think a mud flap will be what to look for.


----------



## crazzywolfie

nitehawk55 said:


> Thanks , I would be curious to try mine before just so I know , BUT I don't want to be doing that in my unheated garage .


could always do it before it gets too cold out. the other option is bring the machine inside to warm up lol. i brought one in a few years ago and did the impeller mod right in the kitchen in the middle of winter. this machine would have been parts had it not been for the impeller mod. the impeller mod made it throw just good enough to consider keeping as a beater machine.


----------



## nitehawk55

crazzywolfie said:


> could always do it before it gets too cold out. the other option is bring the machine inside to warm up lol. i brought one in a few years ago and did the impeller mod right in the kitchen in the middle of winter. this machine would have been parts had it not been for the impeller mod. the impeller mod made it throw just good enough to consider keeping as a beater machine.


Not bringing in the house , it would be near impossable .
What did you use for the flaps and from where ?


----------



## Darby

A torpedo kerosene heater can take the edge off working in the cold.


----------



## crazzywolfie

nitehawk55 said:


> Not bringing in the house , it would be near impossable .
> What did you use for the flaps and from where ?


hahaha it is pretty easy since there is very tiny steps into the house here. you could always separate the bucket from the tractor and bring only the bucket in. i have done it a couple times to replace rusted shear pins. 

i used truck mud flap. i have got some from friend but i would assume you could possibly call some truck or trailer repair place's to see if they have any. i don't think they are expensive since i think my friend even has them in his truck as floor mats. you really don't need much. could try something like this. if the measurements are correct 7.6mm in the thicker area's which i think should be thick enough but may be worth checking out.


https://www.princessauto.com/en/mud-guards/product/PA1000001707?skuId=8685117


----------



## nitehawk55

Thanks Darcy , actually I do have one available I could borrow.

OK , I'll try truck repair first if not I'm off to see the princess.


----------



## Tony-chicago

If it can really prevent clogs and also pump water, it is worth its weight in gold.
Edit: wrote this afternoon but somehow never posted so here it is.


----------



## nitehawk55

This would be perfect but it's not available up here . Our TSC stores changed to Peavey stores and I guess they don't carry everything . I wonder if TSC will ship to Canada ?


https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/wcco-belting-baler-belting-2-ply-4-in-x-60-in


----------



## Ziggy65

The TSC stores in the US are a completely different company than our former TSC stores, which have always been owned by Peavey. They have always been called Peavey in other parts of Canada and switched from TSC in Ontario during the past year. I think shipping from TSC in the states would be very costly.

I purchased a HD large truck mud flap from Princess Auto and used the thicker corded rubber from the edges to make impeller flaps.


----------



## Oneacer

I would think any truck stop repair center or construction company would just give you an old one they have kicking around.


----------



## nitehawk55

I'm sure , just saw that roll and thought it would be nice to have , but yeah a mud flap will do.


----------



## dr bob

I used some scrap 1/4"-thick urethane I had hidden in my TMJ collection.


My try at this was a bit of a lark really, but seems to help a bit with both heavy snow/slush and light powder. The in-between consistency "normal" snow doesn't show as much improvement, but it is still a bit better. Perhaps the biggest telltale is that the engine seems to be working harder, throwing more and bypassing less. I might also be able to move a bit faster since the barrel is cleared faster by the tighter-sealing impellor. That could as easily be pee-sy-kellog-ikal.

I used a vice-grip pliers to hold the pads in place with the chute removed, braced against the opening. Impact screw gun and some TEK screws (self-drilling and tapping with hex heads) made it a single-step operation getting them held in place on the paddles. They self-clearanced a little in the barrel in the first few minutes, now work fine. Removing the chute was most of the work really.


----------



## gossamer

I thought I would also try the impeller mod on my MTD 31AE611D120 and purchased this one from Amazon:









Amazon.com: 100% 304 Stainless Snow Blower Impeller Modification Kit, 3/8inch 3-Blade Universal - Modifies 2-Stage Machine Including Installation Hardware, Repeated and Use Durable in Various Conditions (3) : Patio, Lawn & Garden


Amazon.com: 100% 304 Stainless Snow Blower Impeller Modification Kit, 3/8inch 3-Blade Universal - Modifies 2-Stage Machine Including Installation Hardware, Repeated and Use Durable in Various Conditions (3) : Patio, Lawn & Garden



www.amazon.com





I cut the rubber a bit long, figuring it would mold itself up the bend in the impeller. However, it appears the gap is so wide between the impeller and the housing that I'm unsure whether I'm too close to the edge of the impeller to start drilling holes. Should I start looking for a different kit? Other ideas for materials I could use?

This is a 3/8" kit - perhaps 1/4" would be enough?

Maybe something like this 3/8" 6x6" sheet would work if I cut it into pieces?


Amazon.com



[I'm also unsure why there's such a gap below the image in this post]


----------



## orangputeh

gossamer said:


> I thought I would also try the impeller mod on my MTD 31AE611D120 and purchased this one from Amazon:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon.com: 100% 304 Stainless Snow Blower Impeller Modification Kit, 3/8inch 3-Blade Universal - Modifies 2-Stage Machine Including Installation Hardware, Repeated and Use Durable in Various Conditions (3) : Patio, Lawn & Garden
> 
> 
> Amazon.com: 100% 304 Stainless Snow Blower Impeller Modification Kit, 3/8inch 3-Blade Universal - Modifies 2-Stage Machine Including Installation Hardware, Repeated and Use Durable in Various Conditions (3) : Patio, Lawn & Garden
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I cut the rubber a bit long, figuring it would mold itself up the bend in the impeller. However, it appears the gap is so wide between the impeller and the housing that I'm unsure whether I'm too close to the edge of the impeller to start drilling holes. Should I start looking for a different kit? Other ideas for materials I could use?
> 
> This is a 3/8" kit - perhaps 1/4" would be enough?
> 
> Maybe something like this 3/8" 6x6" sheet would work if I cut it into pieces?
> 
> 
> Amazon.com
> 
> 
> 
> [I'm also unsure why there's such a gap below the image in this post]
> 
> View attachment 182406


why dont you make your own. ?read the posts here.


----------



## dr bob

orangputeh said:


> why dont you make your own. ?read the posts here.


 ^^^^ This ^^^^

Find the material you want to use. Can be part of an old truck mud flap, a piece of a worn tire, a piece of conveyor belt, or whatever. I had some polyurethane sheet left form a long-ago project. Anyway, cut rectangles that fit on the paddles. Screw the rectangles onto the paddles. Trim the rectangles so they just clear the bore of the impellor barrel all the way around. The bulk of the work was removing the chute.

Here's a picture that shows the material I used, screwed onto the paddles for my machine. I used self-drilling TEK screws initially and they work great; Just drive them through the chute opening with a drill or driver, and they drill and tap the paddle for you in one shot. I decided to replace them with shorter sheet-metal screws after looking at the sharp ends and deciding I'd surely figure out a way to get fingers or gloves caught in there some day. I could drill the holes out and use bolts/washers/nuts, but so far the screws are doing fine.

Picture is the impellor out on the garage floor for a different reason. I installed the paddle flaps while it was still in the barrel though. The second pic is after I trimmed the edges with a razor knife for barrel clearance.


----------



## gossamer

dr bob said:


> ^^^^ This ^^^^
> 
> Find the material you want to use. Can be part of an old truck mud flap, a piece of a worn tire, a piece of conveyor belt, or whatever.


That's part of the reason why - I don't have any of that, so to experiment by purchasing one or another is time-consuming and expensive.

Here's $35 worth of conveyor belt material - what would I ever do with all of that?


https://www.lowes.com/pd/Rubber-Cal-Rubber-Cal-Heavy-Black-Conveyor-Belt-Rubber-Sheet-0-41-3Ply-Thick-x-4-in-Width-x-36-in-Length-Black/5001635723



Do you have specific ideas of something I can obtain online for this that is known to work?

I have the technical ability to do all of this, but not necessarily the time.

I'll run down to the tire place tomorrow and see if they have an old tire to give me, but I otherwise have no ideas. It's almost easier for me to buy something that I know will work, than the 1/2 hour+ it will take to cut up a car tire, then have to deal with getting rid of it afterwards.



> I had some polyurethane sheet left form a long-ago project. Anyway, cut rectangles that fit on the paddles. Screw the rectangles onto the paddles. Trim the rectangles so they just clear the bore of the impellor barrel all the way around. The bulk of the work was removing the chute.


Yeah, I've already done that.

I also have bolts/nuts to use for this to avoid the same problem with self-tapping you mentioned.

I've also just ordered this SBC rubber from amazon, but it's not belted. Is that necessary? Is 1/2" too thick?


Amazon.com



Thanks so much for your help.


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## JLawrence08648

The belting lasts longer and may stay a little more flexible in cold.

TSC Tractor Supply is the place to go for belted rubber.


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## dr bob

If you don't have anything to try and really don't want to go scrounge the bits, especially if it involves extra time and driving. then the kit you linked to will be just fine. Go for it!

Cutting tire tread is a chore and the steel cords in the treads will carve up your hands pretty quickly. I could easily make the paddle flaps from a new $0.99 plastic cutting board from the Big Lots store. Lots of options if you keep your eyes open. Meanwhile, a Sure Thing is a couple clicks away.



My TMJ (Too Much Junk) collection has just a little bit of lots of things. Some are leftovers from previous projects. Most of that should have been tossed decades ago. But every once in a while, some little project need matches up with something in the TMJ collection. Deciding which "most of that" to toss is the tough decision.

It's a hobby, not a disease. That's what the voices in my head tell me anyway...


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## Oneacer

I believe we crossed the hobby bridge awhile back ..... Look at our projects and work area, and don't forget the storage .... Just saying ......


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## ChrisJ

I don't want a hobby I just want a machine that does what I need.

And if all goes as planned I'll have that in 2 months.


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## 1132le

JLawrence08648 said:


> The belting lasts longer and may stay a little more flexible in cold.
> 
> TSC Tractor Supply is the place to go for belted rubber.


it does not wear out
my oldest kit is 12 yrs old built out of junkie tire
looks the same as 3 min after break in 12 years ago
pumps water like a fire hose


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## gossamer

1132le said:


> it does not wear out
> my oldest kit is 12 yrs old built out of junkie tire
> looks the same as 3 min after break in 12 years ago
> pumps water like a fire hose


Okay, I drove around town and collected a few bits - some old paddles from a single-stage snowblower from my local shop, and an old tire from the tire repair place. First, a few questions.

What is the normal distance/gap people are trying to close? I thought mine was more than a half-inch at the bottom of the chute itself, but there are significantly closer gaps in the impeller housing that prevents me from adding more than a 1/4" beyond the end of the impeller blade. Is it really worth it for a 1/4"?

I also think I was using the rubber that was included with my kit wrong. It measures about 2" by 4" - the width of my impeller is about 2.75", so I assumed the idea was to cut the 4" length to the proper width, but now that I think about it, it was always intended to go lengthwise, leaving 3/4" of the impeller uncovered.

So, that means the 2" paddles were also too small for me to bother.

Instead, I spent about 40m trying to use a jigsaw to cut up the sidewall of an old tire. The problem with that isn't so much that it's difficult to cut (although it is), but that the thickness of the sidewall changes, not to mention trying to be precise in the measurements.j

Another problem I faced was that the impeller itself is all rusted, so making any marks with a pen or a punch wasn't very effective because I couldn't see it. Had to get some white spray paint and put a quick coat on all three impellers first.

After doing all of that, I realized the half-inch I was about a quarter-inch too long beyond the end of the impeller because it hits the top of the impeller housing as it tries to go through/into the housing.

That leaves me with still a 1/4" gap in the chute itself.

I guess I was just hoping for input - am I going to see the big returns people are talking about from doing this mod? I've done one of the impellers now, and going to finish the other three hopefully this afternoon, but it's been a really long process.


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## Tony-chicago

My reading is that it will still help. Especially in very wet conditions. I will be doing the same on my new...to me 5524.
On my neighbors craftsman, I was thinking of cutting up an airplane wing to close the gap. But I needed more than one plane...
I had trouble at the end of the season. The slush just clogged the best running machines I had. Maybe more slick spray would work.


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## Oneacer

@gossamer,

You actually only need to do the opposite corresponding fin on a four fin impeller in my opinion.

I only needed to do it on a new CubCadet, which had a wide clearance ..... I did all three fins.


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## gossamer

Oneacer said:


> @gossamer,
> 
> You actually only need to do the opposite corresponding fin on a four fin impeller in my opinion.
> 
> I only needed to do it on a new CubCadet, which had a wide clearance ..... I did all three fins.


Actually, I typed that wrong - it only has three. The chute is really quite small on this 22" MTD.


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## Tony-chicago

Is the impeller at least 12 inches? Or is it the plastic 9.5 inch one.


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## Oneacer

I have never seen a plastic impeller?


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## tabora

Oneacer said:


> I have never seen a plastic impeller?


Here you go... Another wonderful MTD feature.


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## JLawrence08648

Oneacer said:


> I have never seen a plastic impeller?


Plastic impellers are on the MTD snowblowers with the plastic transmission and the plastic wheels, they are one speed with a bail.


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## Tony-chicago

I could be wrong. But iirc someone here told me the craftsman 522 was a 9.5 inch plastic impeller.


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## Tony-chicago

Yep that is the one. On the bright side. Maybe it hurts less when you do something stupid. Ask me how.....


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## dr bob

Back to the 'clearance' questions:

My first pass at adding the plastic flaps had them just touching the barrel at the widest gap point in the rotation. I figured they were soft enough that they'd clearance themselves. I figgered wrong... Just past the chute opening in the impeller barrel there's a thicker steel piece that's intended to take the abuse of snow and junk as it exits the barrel and makes the turn up the chute. The way that steel piece is made, it sticks down into barrel a little. I'm not sure if that's a bug or a feature. I took the piece out (secures with two of the bolts that hold the plastic chute base to the barrel...) and did little creative re-forming so it doesn't stick down so far. With that little change, I trimmed the plastic flaps so they clear the inside of the barrel by about 1/8" everywhere except at that steel piece, where there's virtually zero clearance (about 1/32"). I'll have to give it the blue smoke test and report back after we get some snow to test it out.

The largest initial clearance I saw was more than 3/8" in some places bit never greater than maybe 1/2".


Were I sitting with a clean sheet, I'd be tempted to try some curved paddles with a slight cutting edge facing forward towards the augers. The cross sections need to increase from the point where snow enters the paddle to where it exits, so it doesn't get compacted there. It may be that the relatively tiny paddles are that way to limit the amount of snow that gets launched out the chute anyway. For all of us home-office engineers and designers, I'm sure there some feet-on-the-ground folks rolling their eyes at the crazy stuff that I think "should work better".


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## orangputeh

JLawrence08648 said:


> The belting lasts longer and may stay a little more flexible in cold.
> 
> TSC Tractor Supply is the place to go for belted rubber.


ya. i think this has been mentioned a half a dozen times. people don't want to read other posts/


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## gossamer

orangputeh said:


> ya. i think this has been mentioned a half a dozen times. people don't want to read other posts/


I think the issue is that there's a lot of "this MAY work" or "I scrounged up this thing" without any real definitive direction or advice. Not every suggestion works for everyone. Also, spending $35 at Tractor Supply when I have no other use for the belting other than this project, seems like a waste.


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## orangputeh

gossamer said:


> I think the issue is that there's a lot of "this MAY work" or "I scrounged up this thing" without any real definitive direction or advice. Not every suggestion works for everyone. Also, spending $35 at Tractor Supply when I have no other use for the belting other than this project, seems like a waste.


depends if you wanna do it with the right materials to begin with or have to redo every couple years using the wrong materials. I deal with this everyday with hundreds of Honda's over the years and see this all the time.

I used to use mud flap. it works but only for awhile before it breaks up. Have used other material with similar results.
use this belting with NO issues.

You can buy a kit on ebay for $40-50-60 dollars but I think that is a waste of money. I bought 5 feet of this belting at Tractor supply for $17USD. Did not know this price doubled but once again......do you wanna do it right or do it over and over?

I cut out the extensions from this belting and gift them to friends and neighbors that wanna do it themselves.

Or I charge a couple hours.since I remove the auger assembly/impeller . I also service the augers while out. Clean out shafts and auger gearbox arms , apply anti seize grease , and weld up elongated shear pin holes on auger and drill new holes.

Most pros recommend the belting.

good luck.


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## ChrisJ

I'm trying out some fabric reinforced EPDM rubber, 1/4" thick.

I suspect it'll hold up for a long time.


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## tabora

Everybody seems to want to reinvent the mousetrap... Another recommendation here for Tractor Supply baler belt. $24.99 for 4"x60"


https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/wcco-belting-baler-belting-2-ply-4-in-x-60-in?cm_vc=-10005



Also great material for barn door wipers.


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## ChrisJ

I certainly didn't reinvent anything, I bought raw material to make them.


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## gossamer

orangputeh said:


> You can buy a kit on ebay for $40-50-60 dollars but I think that is a waste of money. I bought 5 feet of this belting at Tractor supply for $17USD. Did not know this price doubled but once again......do you wanna do it right or do it over and over?


It comes out to $34 with tax and shipping for me - I don't have a location near me, and don't meet the minimum for free shipping.

I ended up cutting up a tire, which is sure to last, but certainly not as good as the belting item you listed for other reasons.

This snowblower is also 22+ years old - I'm doing everything I can to extend the life of it, but it's severely worn now.


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## gossamer

ChrisJ said:


> I'm trying out some fabric reinforced EPDM rubber, 1/4" thick.
> 
> I suspect it'll hold up for a long time.


Is that like a neoprene foam rubber? Like this?









Amazon.com: Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B : Industrial & Scientific


Buy Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B: Sheets, Rolls & Strips - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



www.amazon.com





Do you otherwise have a specific recommendation?


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## ChrisJ

gossamer said:


> Is that like a neoprene foam rubber? Like this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon.com: Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B : Industrial & Scientific
> 
> 
> Buy Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B: Sheets, Rolls & Strips - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you otherwise have a specific recommendation?


No,
It's just EPDM, not SBR and it's not foam it's solid rubber with strands of rope through it, kind of like a belt or hose.

I really can't make a recommendation yet as I haven't tried it.


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## orangputeh

gossamer said:


> Is that like a neoprene foam rubber? Like this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Amazon.com: Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B : Industrial & Scientific
> 
> 
> Buy Neoprene Foam Closed Cell Sponge SBR EPDM Foam 1/4" Thick x 42" x 12" SCE41B: Sheets, Rolls & Strips - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
> 
> 
> 
> www.amazon.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do you otherwise have a specific recommendation?


ha, this is the other material I tried in the beginning that did not fare well. But in your case it may work for a couple seasons. Your tire material will probably do fine for awhile.
Depends on amount of use.
Around here we use our machines 30-50-70 hours a season or more. depending on winter conditions.
Snow removal pros can use their machines hundreds of hours a season. Everything has to be heavy duty.
I stopped working on commercial machines a couple years ago since they need so much work. Not fun to work on and I'm in this for the fun of it/


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## nitehawk55

I still haven't got anything to do mine yet , at the speed I'm going it will be next spring when I get at it.
Got to get around to a truck repair place and find an old mud flap.


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## Oneacer

I only needed to do one, and finish one someone started .... I used composite/rubber track pad from the RR. I had them and they seem to work great. I'll know after it snows ....


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## 1132le

gossamer said:


> It comes out to $34 with tax and shipping for me - I don't have a location near me, and don't meet the minimum for free shipping.
> 
> I ended up cutting up a tire, which is sure to last, but certainly not as good as the belting item you listed for other reasons.
> 
> This snowblower is also 22+ years old - I'm doing everything I can to extend the life of it, but it's severely worn now.


just cut the strips out of a tire==free
8 self tapping screws and 8 washers maybe 2 bucks
people try and build the space shuttle
oldest kit 2009 pumps water like a fire house
no need to pre drill yada yada
maybe take the chute off ive done some with it on
takes 20 min to install


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## KJSeller

I used an old bike tire and some self tapping screws. Works fine for me.


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