# some "play" in impeller- is this normal?



## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

I can get a tiny bit of (circular) play in my impeller, when machine (Craftsman) is shut off. Is this normal?
(attempting to load a video! I'm hopeless at this! can anyone suggest a good file-sharing thingy, so I can send a video from my ipad to the forum here?)

New video by x x


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

anyone?


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## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

that seems a bit excessive to me, but im not sure how you can correct it,

i have never had an impeller held together with bolts like that

are those bolts on the shaft tight?


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

hey jerry. thanks. one was kinda loose. both tight now, & still get the little play...


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

gam said:


> I can get a tiny bit of (circular) play in my impeller, when machine (Craftsman) is shut off. Is this normal?
> (attempting to load a video! I'm hopeless at this! can anyone suggest a good file-sharing thingy, so I can send a video from my ipad to the forum here?)
> 
> New video by x x


Not normal, I just checked mine ( Craftsman) and can't move at all not a hair..
I don't know what model you have?
I would say, no not normal.


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## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

the holes that go through the shaft are probably worn a bit, and have "enlarged" themselves over the years,

not much you can do without replacing the entire shaft,

i wouldn't worry about it personally

worst cases scenario is, one of those bolts might snap,

take a look at them after every plow


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

1450 Series, Model No. 944.522430 (Husqvarna made, I think)
I'm not an expert, like you guys, but here's a schematic of how the thing is built...


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

jerryvvv said:


> the holes that go through the shaft are probably worn a bit, and have "enlarged" themselves over the years,
> 
> not much you can do without replacing the entire shaft,
> 
> ...


which bolts? no. 10 in the schematic?


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

gam said:


> I can get a tiny bit of (circular) play in my impeller, when machine (Craftsman) is shut off. Is this normal?
> (attempting to load a video! I'm hopeless at this! can anyone suggest a good file-sharing thingy, so I can send a video from my ipad to the forum here?)
> 
> New video by x x


Does the impeller move with the shaft or is the play between the impeller and the shaft?

If the circular play is between the impeller and its shaft then it is due to worn attaching roll pins or bolts or shear pins. My 2003 model Craftsman 11/30 (made by Husqvarna) used 2 roll pins 3/16" by 1-1/8" and typically roll pins are very hard. They do not usually wear to cause a little looseness but may crack and become loose. If you have shear pins or bolts they may wear and get loose causing the movement. It is similar to looseness in the auger shear pins but the impeller center boss metal is much thicker so wear is reduced and so play is not as noticeable.

Generally the impeller retention shear pins or bolts are fairly easy to remove through the chute opening. Roll pins are spring loaded and a very tight fit and not so easy to remove. You should take a look at the way the impeller is secured to its shaft and go from there, but the play needs to be removed. 

If the impeller and shaft are moving together a small amount in a circular pattern then the attachment of the shaft to the impeller pulley or the gearbox may need attention.


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

Those are shear bolts, I would replace with new ones.
Edit, Yes #10 in the diagram.


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

Town said:


> Does the impeller move with the shaft or is the play between the impeller and the shaft?
> 
> If the circular play is between the impeller and its shaft then it is due to worn attaching roll pins or bolts or shear pins. My 2003 model Craftsman 11/30 (made by Husqvarna) used 2 roll pins 3/16" by 1-1/8" and typically roll pins are very hard. They do not usually wear to cause a little looseness but may crack and become loose. If you have shear pins or bolts they may wear and get loose causing the movement. It is similar to looseness in the auger shear pins but the impeller center boss metal is much thicker so wear is reduced and so play is not as noticeable.
> 
> ...


Not sure I comprehend all that, Town, but no, the shaft doesn't move, just the impeller. ( can you see, in my video?)


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

@gam the Craftsman model that I was referring to is 944.522300 and it uses roll pins for the part #10 in your post #7 and the pic seems to confirm roll pins. You mention in post # 4 that they are bolts on your machine. They are probably grade 5 and too soft (not appropriate) for your machine. I would replace them with grade 8 which are much harder or better still use the roll pins that would have been factory installed on your machine.


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

part #30 is a Roll Pin
(.....confused here.....)


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

Town said:


> @gam the Craftsman model that I was referring to is 944.522300 and it uses roll pins for the part #10 in your post #7 and the pic seems to confirm roll pins. You mention in post # 4 that they are bolts on your machine. They are probably grade 5 and too soft (not appropriate) for your machine. I would replace them with grade 8 which are much harder or better still use the roll pins that would have been factory installed on your machine.


Part # 30 is a roll pin, my Craftsman's shaft use all roll pins.
His at the impeller shows 2 shear bolts, #10.
If they where loose they could be worn side to side on the thread.
Cheap enough to replace and get a few for spares.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

have seen this problem in older Honda's because the impeller shear pin is loose for time.long enough to elongate hole in impeller. assuming that your bolt is tight and still has that play.

if that is the case ( not sure if we are talking about the same thing here ) I would remove impeller and weld up hole a little and then drill new hole for bolt. or shear.


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## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

orangputeh said:


> if that is the case ( not sure if we are talking about the same thing here ) I would remove impeller and weld up hole a little and then drill new hole for bolt. or shear.


or just weld the impeller to the shaft,

most are rusted on there so bad, they might as well be welded on,

i am surprised how freely this one moves


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

It is a shoulder shear bolt 1/4-20.
The same ones are used for the auger.
He should buy extras.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

I would not weld the impeller to the shaft .... I would much prefer to replace a roll pin or shear bolt than possibly damage an engine. Just sayin.


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

Big Ed said:


> Part # 30 is a roll pin, my Craftsman's shaft use all roll pins.
> His at the impeller shows 2 shear bolts, #10.
> If they where loose they could be worn side to side on the thread.
> Cheap enough to replace and get a few for spares.


they call no. 10 part "Screw", not "Shear Bolt"
Shear Bolt is part no. 37


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## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

oneacer said:


> I would not weld the impeller to the shaft .... I would much prefer to replace a roll pin or shear bolt than possibly damage an engine. Just sayin.


Lol

how would you damage an engine?

if the impeller stopped your auger belt would break


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

gam said:


> they call no. 10 part "Screw", not "Shear Bolt"
> Shear Bolt is part no. 37


This what I get from his number.


https://c.searspartsdirect.com/mmh/lis_pdf/OWNM/1801363L.pdf




LOOK PAGE 16.



If like mine, it has a spacer for the bolt.
Just like my augers do to.
It can only go on one way, because of that spacer.
But mine has 2 roller pins on the impeller.
Shear bolts for the augers.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

oneacer said:


> I would not weld the impeller to the shaft .... I would much prefer to replace a roll pin or shear bolt than possibly damage an engine. Just sayin.


agree . that something you can't reverse very easily.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@jerry,

Why would you want to weld an impeller to its shaft, this doing further damage from any jam if something is bound in the impeller housing?

I would rather let the sacrifical shear bolt let go.


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## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

oneacer said:


> @jerry,
> 
> Why would you want to weld an impeller to its shaft, this doing further damage from any jam if something is bound in the impeller housing?
> 
> I would rather let the sacrifical shear bolt let go.


they arn't shear bolts,

there isn't any point in having a shear bolt in that location,

impellers are not protected by shear bolts,

most impellers just slide onto the shaft with a key, no bolts are required at all

having a shear bolt there is not nessessary

some impellers and shafts are sold as one part, they do not come apart

i have never had a snowblower that has bolts holding the impeller to the shaft


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

^^^^^^^
see Fig. 17 below:


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

jerryvvv said:


> they arn't shear bolts,
> 
> there isn't any point in having a shear bolt in that location,
> 
> ...


 are you kidding?


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

gam said:


> hey jerry. thanks. one was kinda loose. both tight now, & still get the little play...


Both bolts are tight and don't seem to move when you rock the impeller back and forth.
They seem to stay right with the impeller. 
To me that means you may have some play in the shaft itself, (ie. your shaft holes have enlarged). If I was right there doing the movement I could tell you for sure. 
I'd be tempted to go to a slightly larger in diameter shear bolt and see what happens. I've owned Husky, Honda, Ariens, Simplicity, etc and there's many different bolts. Ariens has 2 different shear bolts currently. 
Best way would be to disassemble it and take some measurements.


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## deezlfan (Nov 8, 2017)

Make sure the shear pins [bolts] aren't already damaged and if so replace them. Then just run it the way it is. It is not critical. The play will disappear the second the belts engage.


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## 3vanman (Nov 21, 2017)

I would remove the bolts, and inspect them. It is possible the bolt hole has elongated, and it is also possible the bolts are damaged by the impellor.
Replacing them with a shear bolt is not a bad idea, as just like the augers we want the impellor to b e protected..cost of a shear bolt is far less than re and re and disassembly/replacing the impellor (which ranges in price from $70-$150 in Canada.
Yes some machines were built with roll pins, and years ago the impellor was actually welded to the shaft, but my experience with this particular machine and the impellors on it is they will bend fairly easily, causing the impellor to actually push snow against the flow from the augers, reducing the machines performance.


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

thanks all.
hate to be a pain but....in your suggestions about bolts, screws, shear bolts & pins etc., would it be possible to reference exactly which part no. you are talking about, as per this parts diagram:
🧐


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

@gam Part # 30 is a roll pin that stops the impeller moving forward into the augers if the impeller retention screws (part #10 and #9) break and fall out.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Yup .... #10 and #9

I would imagine the #30 roll pin is there as a safety, for if the shear bolts let go, it will prevent the impeller from sliding forward.


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## Big Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

This is an old shear bolt that was bent a little so I replaced.
3 piece, the bolt , the nut, and the collar.

















The collar fits in to the auger hole, these shear bolts can only go in one way so the collar sits in the hole made for it.
My shear bolts look like bolts, not like some of the ones others show where the bolt has a breaking groove cut in.
Mine looks like a bolt.
I have 2 roll pins to hold on the impeller, 2 shear bolts on the augers.
The diagram I listed for him is for a different model then the his. His number didn't come up with anything? But the diagram I posted is for the 1450 series.
And calls them shear bolts.
His diagram from the his (?) manual calls them screws mine calls them shoulder shear bolts.
If it takes a shear bolt with a collar then that is what you need, not just a shear bolt.
Someone might have replaced his before? So you can't just go with what he has in there now.
And it may be that his collar is missing because someone replaced the shear bolt with a regular bolt, without that collar it will never sit tight.


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## gam (Aug 23, 2020)

thanks all. 
just to reiterate, the movement is circular (like clock hands, back & forth) by the impeller.
Not "in & out" on the shaft. does that make sense?


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