# Honda @ GIE+EXPO



## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

Found some info and high-res pics on the new HSS blowers on MovingSnow.com. Thought I would share with you'all. Click the link below and scroll down a bit.

What I Found At The 2015 GIE+EXPO For Moving Snow - movingsnow.com

I found it interesting that Honda would not even comment on the trans issue to industry leaders/experts. My guess is that they're embarrassed because once they discovered the issue, they knew that major delays were going to occur.

The comment about the chute design and motor concerned me. How long has the Canadian models had the electric chute and how have it held up - anyone?


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

I also read Paul's article and was surprised by his opinion on the new Honda 2 stage machines. At least Honda is doing the right thing and waiting to ensure their reputation for high quality OPE is upheld. I know this is essentially an all new design after many years of the previous generation and now with the North Carolina plant manufacturing this new model there are bound to be some hiccups. Unfortunately there pre-testing did not uncover this issue prior to the peak season for these machines.

There is obviously a lot of excitement from those who value high end equipment and can afford it. However IMHO if I had an older model Honda 2 stage that was still working well I would hold onto it as long as possible as the new units are not necessarily better despite having more features only time will tell. Similar to an all-new car 2nd year reliability is always considerably better than first year and then it only gets better in year 3 and so on.


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

_This is the Honda part....

_*Honda HSS724AW*
*Honda HSS928AAT*
*Honda HSS932AAT*
Honda had models of the 24, 28 and 32 inch tracked and tire outdoors to test. These new models are advertised to be a major improvement over the previous versions.
The new HSS models have an increased housing height, increased impeller size, power steering, and larger tires on the wheeled models. They kept the low clearance two pulley tracks on the track drive units.
They added some nice to haves like an LED light, electric chute control, piston assisted variable height (track models), and 12v electric start, all for the same price.
One of the more interesting features they added is a torque switch on the front gearbox of the 32 inch model that will kill the engine if the front auger hits an obstruction. The district rep I was talking to claimed it would stop the unit before any damage could occur.
*I had a chance to look and drive them at the show and I am very disappointed in the new models. The ergonomics are not near as good as I expected and many of the features are still “old school.” It almost appeared that they let engineers design this snow blower without any input from actual users. Specifically the chute is still the old style friction type that rests on the impeller housing. The chute turning gear is thin sheet metal and not replaceable. I have a feeling that it will bind from dirt and rust and take out the electric chute motor. I’m also concerned with the 12 volt electric start. Why would you put a battery start on a cold weather machine?
Other features that have long ago proven not the best design include wimpy skid shoes, huge plastic throttle control. flush shear plate carriage bolts, and offset auger shear bolts. The engineer made a big deal of the fact that they now stamp the side of the auger housing “to give it more strength”. Funny, the rest of the industry has been doing that for years.
Finally, the dash is weird. The electric joystick for the chute is a big lever in the middle of the dash and you have to reach all the way across the dash to adjust the speed lever. The only thing I really like about the new machine is the infinite height adjustment. It’s a better design than the notched system other brands use for tracks.*
They started building these in July but as of last week they had just started shipping them. They would not tell me why they have been delayed. Many dealers are stating that they may not even get them to sell this year.
It’s great that Honda is now making them in the U.S. but *in my opinion they are making just an average snow blower with an above average engine at an outrageous price!!!* We’ll see if my opinion holds when they actually get them out of the warehouse and into the hands of people who have used other brands of snow blowers.


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

*The chute base gear is replaceable on the new HSS independently from the chute itself.
*There is a plastic "bushing" in between the chute and auger to keep it from freezing.
*12 volt starting system and power chute controls with an on board battery had been arround for near 3 decades on some snowblowers including Yamaha Ricky (to me it is very convinient). 
*How do snowmobiles start?, are they only pull start?, Does your 12volt electric start on your vehicle not work in winter?

:blowerhug::blowerhug::blowerhug:


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## bwdbrn1 (Nov 24, 2010)

Last August, Paul borrowed some of my pictures from the original thread I posted about the new HSS series over on MTF. In his article on movingsnow.com he added his own comments below the pictures I had taken and had linked to the MTF thread through photobucket. Both the thread I made and the photos I took were posted in public formats, so I have no problem with him using them. He did make note of my screen name and linked the thread on MTF to his article. I posted the same initial thread about the HSS series here on SBF,and MTF and got different responses on each forum which in my mind just shows that different audiences will respond differently to the same material.

Here' movingsnow.com's article:
New 2015 Honda 2-Stage Snow Blowers - A First Look - movingsnow.com

Here's my thread on MTF:
First hand look at the new Honda 2 stage snowblowers! - MyTractorForum.com - The Friendliest Tractor Forum and Best Place for Tractor Information

Take a look and compare the responses to the ones here on SBF:
http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...-hand-look-new-honda-2-stage-snowblowers.html

I've looked at movingsnow.com, but never reached out to communicate directly with Paul, or posted any comments on the site. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions. Paul and movingsnow.com is no different in that respect. I've found the site to be chock full of good useful information. Some of it seems to be Paul's, or his contributor's take, some of it stock information available through the particular manufacturer being referenced. 

Looking at the captions that were made under the different pictures in the movingsnow.com article back in August about the HSS series, I kind of got a feeling for which way movingsnow.com might be leaning in the opinion of Honda's new 2 stage. For instance, the caption "Attendees got the chance to blow sawdust! Yee-Ha!" under the first photo that was copied. Maybe just kind of a humorous comment, and now I guess it's to be seen if something similar is said about Ariens use of cracked corn by Ariens in their recent demonstration shown in a photo Ariens gave me that I shared in the Ariens thread. I guess when there's no snow on the ground, you got to use something to substitute for demonstration purposes. I especially found the last comment under the picture about the power steering interesting because when I talked to the engineers at Honda, they never made the claim that the idea of power steering was new, or exclusively theirs, just that they incorporated the feature into their HSS models in response to handling issues in the older HS series.

[email protected] has come here to snowblowerforum.com offer up a bit of explanation about the transmission issues in direct response to member's concerns and comments. None of us here that I know of are industry leaders/experts. No offense to anyone who is, but instead, I'd categorize our membership as "consumer experts" who have a pretty darn good idea of what it is we want in the snowblower we spend our hard earned dollar on and will turn to places like movingsnow.com and snowblowerforum.com to help get the information we might need in making the most informed decisions we can before plunking the cash down.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

I knew those photos looked familiar. Paul's website is certainly a good resource and he is a knowledgeable guy regarding OPE. Unlike this site which is more of an open forum dealing with machine recommendations, mods, repairs, restorations...his website is mainly novices to snowblowers asking him for advice on what machine they should buy and only he answers them. He does get a disclosed small commission on certain brands bought through certain website links on his site. Overall he seems unbiased in his opinions and like many of us he liens towards Toro and Ariens. I do know one of his peeves especially with Consumer Reports is that they test snowblowers with sawdust and not real snow. 

I liked your post referring to us as Consumer Experts, that is a fair assessment. As most of us are not mechanical engineers actually working in the industry and designing/engineering these machines or industry execs/leaders despite our strong opinions. I think "nafterliven" was referring to Paul (who he considers an industry expert) or the industry press at the show when he mentions this in his thread.


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## obthedog (Oct 16, 2015)

*Wow thats quite disappointing... I have been a loyal Honda person including 3 Blowers, 2 lawnmowers and 2 cars. I have a new 928 on order but have to say the facts seem to be piling up that I may have made a bad decision to pay through the nose for a new HONDA. Like you said time will tell and thanks for sharing the article.*


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

obthedog said:


> *Wow thats quite disappointing... I have been a loyal Honda person including 3 Blowers, 2 lawnmowers and 2 cars. I have a new 928 on order but have to say the facts seem to be piling up that I may have made a bad decision to pay through the nose for a new HONDA. Like you said time will tell and thanks for sharing the article.*




You sound like me in terms of your collection of Hondas. However I have an Ariens Platinum 24 SHO snowblower. The 928 looks like a really nice unit and you will likely be very happy with it. Worst case scenario if there are additional bugs to be worked out I am confident Honda will address them during the warranty period. Best of luck with your new machine!


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## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

Cardo111 said:


> I think "nafterliven" was referring to Paul (who he considers an industry expert) or the industry press at the show when he mentions this in his thread.


Yes, when I said that Honda would not even comment about the trans issue to industry leaders/experts, I was referring to the attendees of the GIE+EXPO show (i.e. Paul). It's my opinion that they don't want information about the trans issue out to the public. I've noticed that [email protected] has been quiet ever since he shared that info here.


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## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

By the way everyone, I shared the link and information not to "stir the pot" on the Honda delays but rather to share more information, mainly the high-res pics - some of which I've never seen before. It's obvious we all want the best of the best and these delays are unfortunate to everyone.

I'm in the market for a new blower myself. It's either going to be the Honda 928 wheel or Ariens HydroPro 28 wheel. I'm very anxious to get a new blower but I'm waiting for the Honda's to appear so that I can feel and compare it against the Ariens. Both are great machines. Just not sure which may fit me best until I put my hands on them. Thankfully, snow is not falling here yet so I have some time. I just hope that whatever units do come to market, the supply doesn't dry up once I make my decision and I can't get the one that I want.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

That is a nice area, I'm sure you will get your share of snow in the Poconos.

Good choices, I am partial to Ariens and really like the track models if you are going to go Honda. If you are going to go wheeled I don't think you can beat the Ariens Hydro Pro 28, however I understand that you would like to look at both before making your decision, and it is a big one. The Ariens promos expire at the end of the month, good luck with whichever machine you choose!


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## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

Cardo111 said:


> That is a nice area, I'm sure you will get your share of snow in the Poconos.


Honestly, I would be happy without snow in my life but I accept it and deal with it when it comes. I do like the area.



Cardo111 said:


> Good choices, I am partial to Ariens and really like the track models if you are going to go Honda. If you are going to go wheeled I don't think you can beat the Ariens Hydro Pro 28, however I understand that you would like to look at both before making your decision, and it is a big one. The Ariens promos expire at the end of the month, good luck with whichever machine you choose!


I noticed that A LOT of people opt for the track models. I'm sure that they have their reasons but I just hate the fact that they are such a bear to move around, with or without steering assist. I often find myself free-wheeling the machine at a fast pace using neutral when moving from location to location. And moving a wheel drive around in a crowded garage is much much easier than a track.


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## raptorchris (Aug 31, 2015)

My local Ariens dealer told me Tuesday that Ariens has sold out of Hydro Pro's. Dealers have what they have, but that's it.
As for tracked vs wheeled, I did check out a tracked HSS928AT in person back in September. 1st thing I did was walk up to it, pull the 2 power steering levers and move it (not running). It moved and turned quite easily. I didn't get to run it to see how it moves under power. It was on the showroom floor.


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## obthedog (Oct 16, 2015)

I don't know if you saw my other post but I am one of the ones who received a HSS928 that Honda identified as one with potential tranny issues. I could not replicate the problem and personally believe Honda is doing the right thing and looking long term by insuring no effective product reaches the market. * I also had a chance to play with the new machine. I have to say that I absolutely loved the way the machine handled compared to my old Honda track drive and a standard Airens I once owned. I am not an expert but my blush response was that they machine was equally or better built than the older ones. *

I am like other concerned about the comments in that article but my novice hands on with the machine makes me completed to be patient and wait.


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## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

raptorchris said:


> My local Ariens dealer told me Tuesday that Ariens has sold out of Hydro Pro's. Dealers have what they have, but that's it.
> As for tracked vs wheeled, I did check out a tracked HSS928AT in person back in September. 1st thing I did was walk up to it, pull the 2 power steering levers and move it (not running). It moved and turned quite easily. I didn't get to run it to see how it moves under power. It was on the showroom floor.


Thanks for the tip. My local dealer doesn't even STOCK hydro-pro's. But there are other dealers with availability in my area. My local dealer carries both Ariens and Honda and they flat out said that when someone is willing to pay over $2000 for a blower, they sell them a Honda. Yet they sell more Ariens than Hondas.


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## [email protected] (Nov 21, 2011)

nafterclifen said:


> It's my opinion that they don't want information about the trans issue out to the public. I've noticed that [email protected] has been quiet ever since he shared that info here.


Not much to update right now. The Service Bulletin for the transmission update will be released when a suitable stock of updated transmissions are packaged and delivered to the parts warehouse. Honda wants to have all the parts in position and ready to ship to dealers before the bulletin is released. FYI, it is my understanding the goal is to have all units in the affected range updated, even if they do not exhibit any problems. That's a firm indicator Honda is committed to making them _all_ "right." 

Most equipment manufacturers would treat this issue as "fix as fail" and update only those machines where customers report a problem and get it repaired under warranty. Honda is literally going the extra mile and authorizing / reimbursing dealers to provide pick-up and return to the customer's location.


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## malba2366 (Jan 2, 2014)

[email protected] said:


> Not much to update right now. The Service Bulletin for the transmission update will be released when a suitable stock of updated transmissions are packaged and delivered to the parts warehouse. Honda wants to have all the parts in position and ready to ship to dealers before the bulletin is released. FYI, it is my understanding the goal is to have all units in the affected range updated, even if they do not exhibit any problems. That's a firm indicator Honda is committed to making them _all_ "right."
> 
> Most equipment manufacturers would treat this issue as "fix as fail" and update only those machines where customers report a problem and get it repaired under warranty. Honda is literally going the extra mile and authorizing / reimbursing dealers to provide pick-up and return to the customer's location.



@robert. Im sure your hands are tied about releasing info but I thought Id try to pry something out of you :smiley-confused009: Are the machines leaving the factory, and are these mid December delivery dates for the Northeast correct?


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## [email protected] (Nov 21, 2011)

malba2366 said:


> Are the machines leaving the factory, and are these mid December delivery dates for the Northeast correct?


New HSS machines are indeed being built at the Swepsonville, NC plant and shipped out to Honda warehouses (briefly) before being loaded out for delivery to dealers. Most of the plant activity for November is focused on production of USA-market HSS machines. 

I don't have data on what specific machines are going to which individual dealer, but all dealers get real-time details direct from Honda through a special portal called the iN (Interactive Network). The iN handles all transactions between Honda and the dealers, and its where your dealer can get the most current status of pending orders. 

Of course, delivery dates are _estimates_, not cast-in-stone, guarantees, but they are pretty tightly calculated, and each day the plant builds more units, the more firm the dates become.


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