# Is impeller kit mod worthwhile?



## Jim_MI (Jan 7, 2020)

I have a well maintained Troy-Bilt 42010 2-stage. Works well, but in anticipation of pte-season maintenance I was wondering if it would be worth doing an impeller kit mod on it. Right now there is about 1/4" clearance between the edge of the impeller blade and the side of the barrel that it rotates inside of. I know I could close this gap and get some marginal power/throwing gain, but would you do it? Seems like it could cause other issues with balance/bearing wear, more parts to loosen and fly off, etc. Your thoughts? If you recommend doing it, is there a kit you would recommend or just do the farm belt + washer on self-tapping screws job?

Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## jerryvvv (Apr 23, 2020)

if you are happy with its performance, i would leave it alone


----------



## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Of my eight snowblowers, and the ones I have worked on through the years, I do not, nor have I ever, needed to install any impeller modifications on any unit..

I am not saying there is not an improvement, as many here take on the task, but in all my snow blowing years, my snow discharge from any unit I have run goes exactly where I want it


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

Jim_MI said:


> I have a well maintained Troy-Bilt 42010 2-stage. Works well, but in anticipation of pte-season maintenance I was wondering if it would be worth doing an impeller kit mod on it. Right now there is about 1/4" clearance between the edge of the impeller blade and the side of the barrel that it rotates inside of. I know I could close this gap and get some marginal power/throwing gain, but would you do it? Seems like it could cause other issues with balance/bearing wear, more parts to loosen and fly off, etc. Your thoughts? If you recommend doing it, is there a kit you would recommend or just do the farm belt + washer on self-tapping screws job?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


It is not much of a gain in throwing distance to close a 1/4" gap I think. It would throw 2-4 feet farther. About the same as raising the engine rpm from 3500 rpm to 3600 rpm. The only real gain is when you are blowing slush. Using wax and PTF spray will help eliminate some of that problem.

With any impeller mod, you would have to check for rust and loosen bolts yearly. People like to exaggerate the throwing distance a little bit. I calculate the throwing distance where most snow landed, not where the wind carried it to. Also, I don't buy into using self-tapping screws to prevent rust. With self-tapping screws, it is just held by the threads and they do get rust.

Depend on how much are you into snowblowers. I might worth it.


----------



## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

1/4" probably won't make much difference. On Honda's the gap is much more. 3/8th's of an inch or more. as an experiment I put a kit on an old Honda HS80 and my other 80 had none. both were running at 3600 rpms at full throttle.

the difference was remarkable on wet slushy snow. the one without continually clogged. the one with the kit threw the wet slushy snow about 10-15 feet. we get a lot of wet snow here.

on regular snow did not notice much difference. to me it's worth it. only takes a little time and if the blower no longer clogs it means a lot under wet conditions.


----------



## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

depends on whether you got the space to throw the snow farther? i have done the impeller mod on a few machines and have seen the difference and would do it to my machines in a heart beat. i almost sold off a tiny 8/24 that a friend gave me to make it someone else's problem. it only threw the snow about 6-8 ft tops. with the impeller mod it easily moves the snow 14-16ft and won't clog on slush. with the impeller mod on my machine i can almost throw the snow into the neighbors driveway which is about 40-50ft away. it is nice when you can move the snow far enough that you only have to deal with it once.


----------



## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

If you invest in a snow blower impeller kit be sure you have nylock nuts to hold everything in place.


----------



## Jim_MI (Jan 7, 2020)

Thanks for the advice, guys. Covid lockdown has me looking for projects, so I'll probably "fix it", whether it's broken or not. Do you recommend a metal bar over the width of the rubber strip, or just SS washers, bolts & nylock nuts?

Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

Buy a kit with all the parts rubber sheet metal strips bolts and nuts so you do not have to rube goldberg anything.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

With metal plate on top of rubber, you can tight the nuts a little more. It would clamp and protect the rubber better as well.

Use thin metal plates so it won't step up too much. They sell reinforced rubber sheet/bar/conveyor belt on Ebay if you need them. I did say 1/4" reinforced rubber is good enough for your gap.

I just came up with a new idea to close my impeller gap without drilling holes into the impeller (I actually put a lot of thoughts into this new idea). No, I'm not using rubber, bolts and nuts. My gap is only 3/16". I have an Ariens 14" curved shaped impeller so, it is harder to do the impeller mod. My idea will close the impeller gap completely, follow the curve shape, won't step up as much, look nice, secure and won't rust. I'm not sharing my idea, because I don't need to share it and I don't want to write it in details. I'm just telling you this so you can be creative with your impeller mod.


----------



## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

dman2 said:


> With metal plate on top of rubber, you can tight the nuts a little more. It would clamp and protect the rubber better as well.
> 
> Use thin metal plates so it won't step up too much. They sell reinforced rubber sheet/bar/conveyor belt on Ebay if you need them. I did say 1/4" reinforced rubber is good enough for your gap.
> 
> I just came up with a new idea to close my impeller gap without drilling holes into the impeller (I actually put a lot of thoughts into this new idea). No, I'm not using rubber, bolts and nuts. My gap is only 3/16". I have an Ariens 14" curved shaped impeller so, it is harder to do the impeller mod. My idea will close the impeller gap completely, follow the curve shape, won't step up as much, look nice, secure and won't rust. I'm not sharing my idea, because I don't need to share it and I don't want to write it in details. I'm just telling you this so you can be creative with your impeller mod.


So you came up with an idea that you won't share? LOL good luck then?


----------



## Johnny G1 (Jan 28, 2020)

It ain't hard to close up a small gap like that, just got to know how to weld and grind.


----------



## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@Dman,

I also have an idea on how to modify my machine, but I am not sharing it ...


----------



## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Curious, ... why do the manufacturers not address this impeller issue, if indeed there is a design flaw, at the design stage of manufacture?

Has anyone ever contacted one of these companies for an answer to this situation?


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

Johnny G1 said:


> It ain't hard to close up a small gap like that, just got to know how to weld and grind.


I already did that and still have a 3/16" gap. It won't fit in (very hard to get in/out) if you close that gap some more.


----------



## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ou2mame said:


> So you came up with an idea that you won't share? LOL good luck then?


probably a sleeve.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

ou2mame said:


> So you came up with an idea that you won't share? LOL good luck then?


It is an idea and I'm not searching for approval, or recommendation. I'm going to patent it.

I'm using wired mesh reinforced plastic with wide strap (probably made out of reinforced plastic as well) around the impeller blade to secure it. My impeller has grooves and ridges for the paddle to seat on and the strap to hold up, so it will be secured and won't move. I have done a lot of plastic welding/forming and be very confident with it (it flex and strong with wired mesh reinforcement). Fiberglass and carbon fiber would be nice, but they are hazardous. You can also use lid-quid rubber, silicon, ...

There you go. You have my idea and say whatever you want.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> probably a sleeve.


Yes, close enough.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

I have an MTD snowblower with plastic impeller and it actually hold up very well. I have thrown icy snow with it. Plastic chute also work well. People just like everything metal. I start to see them using reinforced plastic gears on the Toros. It is some type of fabric/fiber reinforced.


----------



## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

dman2 said:


> I already did that and still have a 3/16" gap. It won't fit in (very hard to get in/out) if you close that gap some more.


You can bring the gap down to less than an 1/8" with easy in and out replacement of the impeller into the housing. Best approach i found is to place the bucket so the impeller is lowered vertically into the impeller housing and clears the front lip. It is even easier with the impeller attached to the shaft and auger.

My 6 blade had a wider gap where it takes in the snow, near the lip, so welded metal to each blade to make gap an even 3 mm (0.118") across the blade tip in the spring of this year. The auger/impeller spins smoothly at 1,447 rpm as it did before the mod. No experience with this mod in the snow yet.

Good luck with yours.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

oneacer said:


> Curious, ... why do the manufacturers not address this impeller issue, if indeed there is a design flaw, at the design stage of manufacture?
> 
> Has anyone ever contacted one of these companies for an answer to this situation?


The impeller gap? They have their own reasons not to close the gap completely, as discussed many times on here before. Toro came up with a hollow belly on the impeller housing to solve clogging issue so, no need to close the gap anymore. Hopefully, they will have that on other snowblowers as well. It seems to work.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

Town said:


> You can bring the gap down to less than an 1/8" with easy in and out replacement of the impeller into the housing. Best approach i found is to place the bucket so the impeller is lowered vertically into the impeller housing and clears the front lip. It is even easier with the impeller attached to the shaft and auger.
> 
> My 6 blade had a wider gap where it takes in the snow, near the lip, so welded metal to each blade to make gap an even 3 mm (0.118") across the blade tip in the spring of this year. The auger/impeller spins smoothly at 1,447 rpm as it did before the mod. No experience with this mod in the snow yet.
> 
> Good luck with yours.


I might take it out to weld it again someday. At 1/8" gap, you are piston sliding it in the cylinder already. I had some paint scratches the last time even with 3/16" gap. It is just too much times and effort so, I'm considering something else.


----------



## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

dman2 said:


> It is an idea and I'm not searching for approval, or recommendation. I'm going to patent it.
> 
> I'm using wired mesh reinforced plastic with wide strap (probably made out of reinforced plastic as well) around the impeller blade to secure it. My impeller has grooves and ridges for the paddle to seat on and the strap to hold up, so it will be secured and won't move. I have done a lot of plastic welding/forming and be very confident with it (it flex and strong with wired mesh reinforcement). Fiberglass and carbon fiber would be nice, but they are hazardous. You can also use lid-quid rubber, silicon, ...
> 
> There you go. You have my idea and say whatever you want.


hey an idea is an idea. try it and see if it works. could you also do the same thing as a plastic inserted sleeve that just pushes it. for a honda it would need to be 3/8 of an inch thick. not actually sure how wide it would need to be. depends on model. you could probably just cut to length and insert it . use some glue or something better to hold it in. make it so it is easy to install or take out to replace.

now, you have me thinking.......


----------



## leftymechanic (Dec 31, 2019)

I have had good results with slush, simply cut pieces from a mudflap and (at some risk of seeming slack) used self tapping screws. They are stainless, for what it is worth. We get lots of slushy snow, and especially at the end of the driveway, this mod has been a great improvement as I used to shovel the slush since my Troybilt 3090 was ineffective, and now it pushes slush far enough to use the snowthrower unless it is almost all water. I first removed the impeller and installed the flaps, but I couldn't fit the impeller back into the housing, so I took the flaps off and re-installed with the impeller in place, screwing through the chute. My gap was about 5/16 or 3/8" or so. Now it is about 1/16th. Hope this is helpful.


----------



## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

orangputeh said:


> hey an idea is an idea. try it and see if it works. could you also do the same thing as a plastic inserted sleeve that just pushes it. for a honda it would need to be 3/8 of an inch thick. not actually sure how wide it would need to be. depends on model. you could probably just cut to length and insert it . use some glue or something better to hold it in. make it so it is easy to install or take out to replace.
> 
> now, you have me thinking.......


found the material and have already applied for a patent on my new alternative to impeller kits.

gonna be RICH RICH RICH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

dman2 said:


> It is an idea and I'm not searching for approval, or recommendation. I'm going to patent it.
> 
> I'm using wired mesh reinforced plastic with wide strap (probably made out of reinforced plastic as well) around the impeller blade to secure it. My impeller has grooves and ridges for the paddle to seat on and the strap to hold up, so it will be secured and won't move. I have done a lot of plastic welding/forming and be very confident with it (it flex and strong with wired mesh reinforcement). Fiberglass and carbon fiber would be nice, but they are hazardous. You can also use lid-quid rubber, silicon, ...
> 
> There you go. You have my idea and say whatever you want.


Sounds pretty cool! I was just messing with you! But if you get to production I would love to see it succeed. New ideas are the best kind of ideas.


----------



## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

ou2mame said:


> Sounds pretty cool! I was just messing with you! But if you get to production I would love to see it succeed. New ideas are the best kind of ideas.


What if it injures someone and they sue me for it? I'm more about computer programming. I will graduate in a year and be rich. You can patent it if you like. If you get rich, just remember me.


----------



## Tompaul (Mar 19, 2020)

Jim_MI said:


> I have a well maintained Troy-Bilt 42010 2-stage. Works well, but in anticipation of pte-season maintenance I was wondering if it would be worth doing an impeller kit mod on it. Right now there is about 1/4" clearance between the edge of the impeller blade and the side of the barrel that it rotates inside of. I know I could close this gap and get some marginal power/throwing gain, but would you do it? Seems like it could cause other issues with balance/bearing wear, more parts to loosen and fly off, etc. Your thoughts? If you recommend doing it, is there a kit you would recommend or just do the farm belt + washer on self-tapping screws job?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


I’m not sure you’ll gain much if current gap is 1/4. I have 3 10hp blowers in Wyoming. The gap on the snapper machine was close to 3/8” + for some reason. I made my own flappers and it made a huge difference on that machine. The other 2 machines were fine. If you do do it through bolt with stainless bolts washers and locknuts and just have pads kiss housing. There has been no bearing or balance issues. I move a lot of snow and need big throw to spread things out. My guess is that these machines aren’t built to particularly tight tolerances or people have goofed around with them so some are better than others. Check belts for slipping before you embark on this.

Btw i have 3 because my house guests help sometimes and more importantly at least one is usually broken.


----------



## Jim_MI (Jan 7, 2020)

Well, I'm convinced. Ordered a kit yesterday off Amazon. Just wondering though; some have warned about increased impeller rust due to the holes being drilled in the impeller blades. So it occurred to me that (assuming that the tools can be adequately manipulated via the chute exit) I can cut a bolt-matching thread into the impeller blades. Properly doused in marine grease, the bolts holding the rubber in place would then leave no space for water at the attachment points and should reduce the rust formation. But on the other hand, if there is rust, it may also make replacement tougher later on if the bolts do sieze up. I would not want to be putting a torch on the bolt heads to break them free with flammable rubber right there. Opinions, anyone?

Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## deezlfan (Nov 8, 2017)

Only time I attempted to add rubber scrapers, I found out that the impeller in that particular blower was not concentric to the housing. There was almost a 3/4" difference from one side to the other. It rubbed so hard on one side it didn't want to turn and it wouldn't touch the other side of the auger house. After close inspection, we could see the housing was egg shaped. There were other issues with the machine that made it not worth the effort to research a fix. It's in the boneyard now.


----------



## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

Jim_MI, I'm as guilty of it as anyone. But even I wouldn't over-think this too much  

I made my kit with stainless bolts & washers, and stainless nylock nuts. I would certainly add a coating of anti-seize to the fasteners, to protect them from rust, especially if they aren't stainless.

But tapping threads into the impeller? I would skip that. It will be awkward to tap, and I don't know what it really gains you. Since they'd no longer be clearance holes in the impeller, now they might need to be located a bit more accurately, to match with the holes in the rubber.

Fill that area with grease first, if you'd like, to block the water out. I'd look for a grease compatible with rubber, to avoid degrading the rubber. As I recall, petroleum-based greases are not great with rubber? Maybe silicone-based would be better (do some reading on this first), perhaps like a dielectric grease. 

You could even paint the drilled holes if you really wanted. But I suspect that grease would likely be enough.


----------



## Jim_MI (Jan 7, 2020)

Got my kit and did the install today. And discovered a scam on Amazon along the way! 

I purchased this kit 








Amazon.com: fastoworld FIT SNOW BLOWER IMPELLER KIT- 1/4" 3-Blade Universal- Modifies 2-Stage Machine : Patio, Lawn & Garden


Amazon.com: fastoworld FIT SNOW BLOWER IMPELLER KIT- 1/4" 3-Blade Universal- Modifies 2-Stage Machine : Patio, Lawn & Garden



www.amazon.com




The Amazon description, pictures and documentation all came from SnowBlowerImpellerKit.com, (SBIK) but the kit did not. It was supplied by Fastoworld Fit. The Amazon description is a direct plagarization of the SBIK website! When my kit arrived it was missing one of the backing plates and all the nuts-n-bolts. When I tried to contact the seller, there was no way to do that through Amazon. The online Amazon documentation led me to the real SBIK website and contact info. There, I learned that this is one of several 3rd party sellers on Amazon that are cannibalizing parts from SBIK kits and reselling. I sent mine back for refund, which revealed that my kit actually came from a company in China. I reordered directly from SBIK and very quickly received exactly what I wanted, made in USA and shipped from NH.

Long story short, if any of you want to go with a prepackaged kit, I would recommend ordering directly through SBIK at Snow Blower Impeller Blade Modification Kit


Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## 140278 (Aug 27, 2020)

good one jim
seems a lot of people fail to take the time to read amazons note of 
(Available from these sellers. )
Ships from
ZHANNA
Sold by
ZHANNA


----------



## tpenfield (Feb 24, 2015)

Adding some fuel to the fire here . . .

I have 3 machines . . . each of which I have done an impeller mod on.

Troy-Bilt 2410 - had about a 3/8" gap impeller blade/housing
Toro 521 - had about 1/16" gap
Toro Powershift 824 - had about 1/4" gap

The Troy-bilt was the worst snow thrower out-of-the-box . . . and slush - forget-about-it 
The mod kit turned the machine into a snow and slush throwing marvel.

The Toro Powershift was good, but not great - it is now great for all kinds of conditions.

The Toro 521 - having the smallest gap - virtually no difference before/after.

So, my experienced-base guess would be a 1/4" gap (or more) is worth filling with the impeller mod. I'd go the bailer-belt route, rather than the kit.


----------



## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

tpenfield said:


> Adding some fuel to the fire here . . .
> 
> I have 3 machines . . . each of which I have done an impeller mod on.
> 
> ...


agree. you can make your own kit for a couple bucks. have done about a dozen or so and now can do very quickly.

The first one I did was following the you-tube video thru the chute......to me it was a waste of time. hard to be accurate.

On a Honda I can take the whole auger and impeller assembly out in 5 minutes. It's a good opportunity to service the augers anyway with cleaning the gearbox arms or whatever you call them and applying anti-seize to them. Also if the shear pin holes on augers are wallowed out you can weld and drill new holes.

It's easier for me to have the impeller out to drill the holes more accurate and install the flaps. I think on most snowblowers you will find that the auger housing is not a perfect circle. The Honda isnt but close. The gap is around 3/8 of an inch so when I install the flap I do just a little more than that.

Then install the impeller first and of course it doesnt fit so I use a flap disk on my grinder to take a tiny bit off each flap until I have a snug fit. Then install the augers etc. To break the flaps in and not melt them I lubricate the housing first and turn the impeller slowly at first. The fit is just slightly snug ( not tight ) so go slowly at first and then go faster. It only takes less than a minute to break in the flaps this way.

Only been doing these for 2 seasons and have had great results. the people I have done these for take the time to email their appreciation of performance and have even posted videos.

I did 2 exact Honda HS80's for comparison. One with kit and one without. Last March when we had the typical wet slushy late winter storm I took them out for a good test. The HS80 without kit performed very poorly. Got clogged over and over. The one with kit threw the snow about 10-15 feet or so. Was able to clean driveway. Not the usual 40 feet in regular snow but it did not clog. 

Hope this helps. Took 20 minutes to type out and at my age 20 minutes is a lot.....


----------



## Jim_MI (Jan 7, 2020)

Orangputeh - Just curious. What did you use to lubricate the housing during the initial wear-in? Seems like most oil-based lubricants would be harmful to the rubber.

Sent from my SM-G970U1 using Tapatalk


----------



## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

dman2 said:


> The impeller gap? They have their own reasons not to close the gap completely, as discussed many times on here before. Toro came up with a hollow belly on the impeller housing to solve clogging issue so, no need to close the gap anymore. Hopefully, they will have that on other snowblowers as well. It seems to work.


You want a theory on why manufacturers leave a wider gap based purely on observations? first item is that a little more gap allows easier assembly during production, so can use less talented workers and/or do it quicker. Second I suspect is a little more applicable: noise and damage. Get a little wear or have a bearing not perfectly centered and the impeller will be hitting the housing, causing noise and possibly damage. If you see someone using a blower that's banging, would you go out to buy that same brand no matter how it works otherwise?


----------

