# 3 or 6 blades on 14" impeller for best performance...?



## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Hello,
I am starting to tinker a bit on my Honda HS1128 project.
I have the option of extending the current impeller blades 1" on each blade to match the modified 14 impeller housing, or to use a 6 blade 14" impeller.
Which arrangement do you think will give me the best overall performance...?

:blowerhug::blowerhug::blowerhug:


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

go with the 6 on the 14. on that 1.k:k:k:k:k:


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Today I was a Home Depot and I was looking at an Ariens deluxe 30" blower and I noticed that the impeller being a 14" had only 3 blades vs 6 blades that a lot of older Ariens larger models had on 14" impellers (maybe the new more expensive models have more blades on the impeller ???).
I started wondering, did they change it from 6 to 3 to save money on production, or did they realized that 3 blades are all what is really needed to do the job.
I went to a site that had specs for larger snowblower attachments and found that they listed 4 blades for impellers from 21" to 28" and 5 blades for a 32" impeller with an impeller speed of 540rpm.
I am starting to think that 3 blades should be enough for a 14" impeller if it is going to be turning at 1000-1300rpm.
Another interesting factor is that older Hondas (HSXX series) had 4 blades impellers and the later Honda (HSXXX series) have only 3 blades and they kept the 3 blade impeller design on the latest HSSXXX series.

:blowerhug::blowerhug:.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

All the current Ariens seem to have 3 blades. All my snowblowers have had 3 blade impellers of about 12". The 44" blower mounted to my son's new John Deere D140 has a 14" impeller with 3 blades. They are all running at 1,000 rpm or a bit more. A full size tractor with rear mounted blower run off the PTO usually has a gearing system to run the auger and impeller at the right speed based upon a 540 rpm PTO speed input. The ones I have used and seen are all 4 bladed, but they are very large diameter impeller openings.

I have never seen a 6 bladed impeller.


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Town said:


> I have never seen a 6 bladed impeller.


Here are a few Ariens 6 blade 14" impeller pictures.


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

Hey just to add to the confusion a little bit... most of the 'blowers I've owned have been Ariens but way back when I had a Hahn-Eclipse "snow giant" 2-stage machine. For the most part I hated that machine (it broke down constantly) but it threw snow farther than any machine I've owned since.

And that one had a *two*-bladed impeller! Or one blade, depending on how you look at it. Just one piece of sheet metal going all the way across, with a small "lip" bent in the direction of rotation on each side. The impeller had no shaft coming out of the front like on most other 2-stage machines.


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## JLawrence08648 (Jan 15, 2017)

ELaw said:


> Hey just to add to the confusion a little bit... most of the 'blowers I've owned have been Ariens but way back when I had a Hahn-Eclipse "snow giant" 2-stage machine. For the most part I hated that machine (it broke down constantly) but it threw snow farther than any machine I've owned since.
> 
> And that one had a *two*-bladed impeller! Or one blade, depending on how you look at it. Just one piece of sheet metal going all the way across, with a small "lip" bent in the direction of rotation on each side. The impeller had no shaft coming out of the front like on most other 2-stage machines.


Well this is interesting. Let's give this some thought.

There has to be a point of diminishing returns and then a point of no returns regarding the number of blades whether or not it makes a difference throwing either more snow, snow further, or (less clogging Lol) increasing the number of blades.

I would think that 3 or 4 largest and the widest blades that can fit would be ideal. IMO, the blades are not wide enough, these small little blades will throw snow? Well maybe some. Maybe more metal needs to be welded on making them wider? I would think more blades than the usual 3 or 4 would reduce the amount of snow being excited. There's are some Ariens that have 6 blades. I would think the snow would clog in between the blades if there were too many. Then that comes down to Why is the snow being thrown out? Is it being carried out and thrown or is it being carried out and then blown out like a fan? More blades would increase the fan effect. Or maybe a 3 bladded impeller with 3 smaller blades in between to create more of a fan.

YSHSfan has experience with water impellers and regarding water, more impeller blades are better. I can see that with a flowing liquid substance that can leak out but with snow, a solid substance, is different, it may offer more resistance and definitely will clog compared to water. Water won't clog.

And then if you only had 2 blades, a piece going straight across, would that really throw snow to the max? Or if that why 3rd was added? To throw more. Maybe the max efficiency is with 4? After that diminishing returns that's why few Sixers.


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

no impeller kit i think 6 would be better
impeller kit dont think it would matter
Id prefer my 921037 20 ft lbs 28 inch had a 4 blade still instead of a 3

that being said i think this 1336 has the 6 blade on it


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

JL,

My guess is there is only one way to find out and it is to test two identical snowblowers, one with standard 3 blades and modify the other one by installing a modified six blade impeller and test them in various conditions. (I think the 6 blade impeller would perform better, but I could be proven wrong).

Maybe next season I'll do that.....


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## DriverRider (Nov 20, 2016)

1132le said:


> that being said i think this 1336 has the 6 blade on it
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93TbPGL3Fm8


Any f??l can crank the engine RPM way up and that one sounds mighty fast to my ear over that horrendous music.:laugh:


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

actually i had the same engine sounds stock to me 3750 mine was higher 3800
we know you like to run yours part throttle with a max of 3400
with a 12 inch impeller you will still be throwing 45 feet for 2200 bucks
this thread isabout the 6 blade impeller vs 3 vs 4
not if you like the music
carry on


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

The Ariens 1336 model 926501 has the 6 bladed 14" impeller driven at 1209 rpm, so that is probably the stock setup shown in 1132le's posted video. That is the setup that I want based upon YSHSfan's guidance in another thread. I will be talking to a local machine shop soon to increase my spare engine impeller pulleys from 2.75" to 3" and installing the Ariens 00258451 (14" 6 blade impeller). Together with my stock 414 AX (LCT) engine running at stock 3700 rpm then I should achieve 1230 impeller rpm giving impeller tip speed of about 4500 ft/min. All in line with YSHSfan recommendations.

I did see a drawing of the Ariens 14" by 6 blade impeller and it appears to be 5" wide so is perfect for my impeller housing and the desired increase from stock that I wanted. The angle of the blades is quite different to the other multi bladed impellers and looks to engineered to better follow a water pump design shape. I am sure this masterpiece is going to be expensive when I see my dealer tomorrow.

Most of the 926xxx models use the 14" 4 bladed impellers for those interested. The part number appears to be 00258251.


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## legarem (Sep 9, 2017)

I Had an Ariens 926LE with a B&S 1350 (305CC) which originally had a 4 blades fan. My brother had near the same (more modern) snowblower wth the same engine but with a 3 blades fan. Snow projection was straigther from A to B with his Ariens. I decided to buy a 3 blades fan for my 926LE. Results were near the same with 3 or 4 blades fan but straighter projection with the 3 blades. Projection distance was near the same. Last fall I installed a Honda GX390 with a 3.25 inch pulley to replace the 2.75 inch pulley. Snow projection distance was near the same as it was wit the B&S with 2.75 pulley. The big diffetence was I could go in the snow full bucket in 3 rd speed without disturbing the motor. I would like to get snow projection like we see on the video but unfortunately my ariens don't do that. Look here to see what I dreamed.




Maybe with added pads on impeller next year it will do the same thing (???)


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## aldfam4 (Dec 25, 2016)

Town said:


> All the current Ariens seem to have 3 blades. All my snowblowers have had 3 blade impellers of about 12". The 44" blower mounted to my son's new John Deere D140 has a 14" impeller with 3 blades. They are all running at 1,000 rpm or a bit more. A full size tractor with rear mounted blower run off the PTO usually has a gearing system to run the auger and impeller at the right speed based upon a 540 rpm PTO speed input. The ones I have used and seen are all 4 bladed, but they are very large diameter impeller openings.
> 
> I have never seen a 6 bladed impeller.


This is what a 6 blade impeller looks like on my Ariens ST28 (924 series) the impeller kit was installed and it tosses all kinds of snow really, really far:grin:


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

Here is my take on this if you will, A 3 blade and a 6 blade with all else being even, Same amount of snow to each, The 6 blade will each grab 1/2 the amount as the 3 blade but have twice as many throws as the 3 blade so should actually have a more solid stream of snow with less quantity in each amount thrown so I would think the lighter amount may not go as far. The 3 blade will toss twice the amount in each throw throwing a heavier load. Think of 2 rocks, one twice the weight of the other both tossed with a catpult at the exact same speed, Which one will go further and which one will slow and fall first? Of course snow is different and more fluid if you will so not so noticable. But IMHO the 6 blade will throw a more even stream of snow and the 3 blade will be slightly farther as long as both are running the same RPM.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

aldfam4 said:


> This is what a 6 blade impeller looks like on my Ariens ST28 (924 series) the impeller kit was installed and it tosses all kinds of snow really, really far:grin:


Thanks for the picture. I ordered the 14" 6 blade impeller for a 1336 model 926501 today from my dealer. The cost is CAD$177 so not too bad compared to the US prices. Was there much of a gap between the impeller and the housing that needed an impeller kit?


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

Town said:


> Thanks for the picture. I ordered the 14" 6 blade impeller for a 1336 model 926501 today from my dealer. The cost is CAD$177 so not too bad compared to the US prices. Was there much of a gap between the impeller and the housing that needed an impeller kit?


Will be the same gap as the others or close
you will want a kit


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

Iam prolly wrong but i thought no 926 series got the 6 blade it shows 4 blade in the pic but quotes 6 blade in the desciption
924516 1332 dle
924517 1336dle
was my understanding had the 6 blade along with a couple of smaller units better check that mr town


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

1132le said:


> Will be the same gap as the others or close
> you will want a kit


Good to know gap will be about 5/16" same as my current. Not likely I will put an impeller kit on.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

1132le said:


> Iam prolly wrong but i thought no 926 series got the 6 blade it shows 4 blade in the pic but quotes 6 blade in the desciption
> 924516 1332 dle
> 924517 1336dle
> was my understanding had the 6 blade along with a couple of smaller units better check that mr town


The 1336 Ariens 926501 has the 14" 6 blade, while the others in that series have the 14" 4 blade impeller, different part numbers. You will notice the 6 blade is not just 2 more than the 4 but has differently angled blades. I believe the different (lower) trailing blade angle will eject a larger % of snow for each compartment than the 90 degree 4 or 3 blade. This is based upon fluid dynamics and how I have observed engineers design their impeller shapes rather than snow dynamics. So I will know more next season when I get to try out the theory.


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

Town said:


> The 1336 Ariens 926501 has the 14" 6 blade, while the others in that series have the 14" 4 blade impeller, different part numbers. You will notice the 6 blade is not just 2 more than the 4 but has differently angled blades. I believe the different (lower) trailing blade angle will eject a larger % of snow for each compartment than the 90 degree 4 or 3 blade. This is based upon fluid dynamics and how I have observed engineers design their impeller shapes rather than snow dynamics. So I will know more next season when I get to try out the theory.


My 2004 1332le was also rated at 1209
it wasnt even close to that
it was 1040 and [email protected]
[email protected] 3750 rpm
that was with the stock 2.75 top pulley there was no larger pullry then they were all 2.75

1209 not even close many were rated at 1209 the 10/24 pro as well ive seen red quote his at that
ill bet 50 bucks his 1050 or lower


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

1132le said:


> My 2004 1332le was also rated at 1209
> it wasnt even close to that
> it was 1040 and [email protected]
> [email protected] 3750 rpm
> ...


I got the 1209 rpm for the impeller from the Ariens owner manual on the 1336 model 926501. I was researching the 14" 6 blade impeller based upon many recommendations on its superior performance compared to the 14" 3 bladed impeller. I have no experience with the 926501, your video of the 1336 blowing snow impressed me for its volume and I had no reason to doubt the 1209 rpm based on that performance.


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

Town said:


> I got the 1209 rpm for the impeller from the Ariens owner manual on the 1336 model 926501. I was researching the 14" 6 blade impeller based upon many recommendations on its superior performance compared to the 14" 3 bladed impeller. I have no experience with the 926501, your video of the 1336 blowing snow impressed me for its volume and I had no reason to doubt the 1209 rpm based on that performance.


mr town my 1209 was in the specs as well as 15 or so other machines its a bs number
i complety rebuilt my 1332 including a new impeller bearing it was butter
the machine threw snow 50 feet and it had and impeller kit 
the impéller rpm was 1080ish 1209 is and ariens wet dream
just like the pro impeller rpm ariens quotes now that you found to be bs

http://apache.ariens.com/manuals/00294700B_ENG.pdf
page 29 1209 across the board epic fail ariens
[email protected] 3700 they would have been thowing 65 feet instead of 50 feet


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

https://www.ereplacementparts.com/a...ower-parts-c-157125_157126_157932.html?page=5

926501 shows a 3 blade impeller pretty sure all 926 series use 3 blade impeller

they made 1 yr with the new bucket style but it was still a 924 series thats the machine i had but mine was an le but still had the pro bucket and rakes
the pro series had the 6 blade impeller and also use a larger impeller bearing as did my 2004 1332le

that machine in the video is a 924 series


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## legarem (Sep 9, 2017)

1132le said:


> no impeller kit i think 6 would be better
> impeller kit dont think it would matter
> Id prefer my 921037 20 ft lbs 28 inch had a 4 blade still instead of a 3
> 
> ...


That's simply amazing to see the straight snow and long distance projection. I found a picture of this model. Look at the chute angulation. It is perhaps one of the tricks that do such a good job with the 6 blades impeller.


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

legarem said:


> That's simply amazing to see the straight snow and long distance projection. I found a picture of this model. Look at the chute angulation. It is perhaps one of the tricks that do such a good job with the 6 blades impeller.


thats a 924517 beast of a machine


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## legarem (Sep 9, 2017)

How old is it ?

It is for sale at $950 Can ($750 US)


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

around 2003


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

1132le said:


> https://www.ereplacementparts.com/a...ower-parts-c-157125_157126_157932.html?page=5
> 
> 926501 shows a 3 blade impeller pretty sure all 926 series use 3 blade impeller
> 
> ...


Yes that does show a 3 blade impeller with the part number 00485551, but the part I ordered is 00258451. My dealer showed me all the different series of the 926501 based upon serial #. The series I got from Ariens and the one my dealer showed me have two impeller possibilities. The 926501 has the 14" 6 blade while the other models have the 14" 4 blade. The 3 blade is considerably cheaper than the 6 blade, at least 1:2 and in CAD$ probably 1:3. 

Thanks for looking out after my best interests, it is appreciated.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Installed the Ariens 14x6 impeller and it fits the housing better than the original 14x3 impeller. It is a little larger in diameter than the stock 14x3 impeller and each blade is wider and deeper, and is better centered in the output opening. 

Here is what it looks like:


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

It may need a bit of tweaking with a different larger B+S carburator or larger B+S jets to maintain a high amount of torque.

When I looked at the B+S jets today thinking about larger jets for the series 120000 engine they looked like they had all the same physical size and threads.


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

leonz said:


> It may need a bit of tweaking with a different larger B+S carburator or larger B+S jets to maintain a high amount of torque.
> 
> When I looked at the B+S jets today thinking about larger jets for the series 120000 engine they looked like they had all the same physical size and threads.


he has the lct 414cc


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