# HS70 Hungry for belts



## Firefox (Dec 12, 2014)

Hi all,

I have inherited a 1984 HS70 TA (tracked Canadian version) from a neighbour who moved away and it seems to have a real appetite for wrecking auger belts.

When I got the blower at the start of last winter it had been sitting for a long time (5+ yrs) without use. I cleaned out the fuel system, new oil, new plug all that on the engine side, and inspected the augers & belts. 

The drive belt for the tracks was fine, but the auger belt was very worn. 

I ordered an OEM replacement belt from Honda power equipment dealer and installed it and all seemed great. Used the machine to clear the lane on the 1st big snow we got and it worked like a champ. About the 3rd time I used it the range of the snow being thrown started to drop - and within 5 minutes the auger stopped running. Pulled the belt cover off and there was a very strong burnt rubber smell and black 'dust' everywhere. I tried adjusting the tension wheel but the belt seemed "ground down" evenly all along the belt such that it no longer sat high enough in the pulleys to generate the force needed to push the impeller when it had snow loaded.

I ordered a 2nd belt from Honda and when I replaced it the 2nd time I noticed that the pulley on the engine side was quite rough from rust/corrosion. I used a wood sanding block to clean the rust and bumps off the pulley and got it quite nice and smooth and installed the 2nd belt. Only had to use it twice the rest of the winter but it was working great.

Come this winter I got the blower all ready to go again and we just got our first big snow. Cleaned 80% of the driveway and noticed that the throw distance was dropping, and again within 10 minutes the machine is no longer turning the impeller/auger. Took the cover off the belts and it seems that the same issue as last year is back -- its like the belt is being eaten slowly by the machine. The old drive belt for the tracks is still rock solid.

I relalize that this is an older machine, but overall for its age its very solid (especially the engine) and I would like to see it continue to work rather than just become a parts donor, but I certainly dont like the idea of having to change the auger belt every 4 hours of running time - rationing the snowblower time vs shovel time is not on my wishlist.

Do the folks on here think that it would be worth changing/replacing the rusty pulley that drives the auger belt ? there is a bit of rust on the large impeller pulley as well - could these pulleys be the cause of the belts getting destroyed ? Any other suggestions ?

Thanks

Fox


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

That's not at all normal and a small amount of rust shouldn't eat the belt that quickly. With tension on the belt signt down it and see if it is running in line without any diversion. Another thing. Is it possible that you may have it improperly installed and it is runnimg over top of a belt guard/retainer? 
It seems it's more of alignment problem.


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## Thump_rrr (Dec 22, 2013)

Did the belt come in its OEM packaging? 
IE: plastic bag with original Honda part number?
I would check to ensure proper tension and routing of the belt first.


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

maybe the impeller bearings.


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## Shryp (Jan 1, 2011)

Or the idler pulley bearings are seized. Something definitely is not working right. Have you tried running it with the belt cover off to see what it is doing? You can get generic belts for a lawnmower shop that are the same size that will work. Just be sure it is rated for torque loads. Regular auto parts belts will not work.


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## Firefox (Dec 12, 2014)

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the info and tips.

@micah68kj : I think that I have the belt installed correctly. The pulleys look quite aligned to me and I did spend time to check on the last belt change that everything was running smooth with the belt cover off and the auger handle down. 

@Thump_rrr : Yes the 2 belts were Honda OEM, in the bag with the Red and white sticker picked up at the local Honda powersports dealer. P/N [ 22432-736-701 V-belt SB-32 , 33"x0.625", cogged ]

@43128 : Not sure how I would know that the impeller bearings were responsible. Running the unit with the belt guard off and the auger running it seems to be running true. Love the old school Honda commercial 

@Shryp : I did go out and take a closer look under better light today and took some photos of the unit, and a video of it running.

The belt doesnt seem that bad actually in the full light of day. Its still sitting flush or just a little above the edge of the engine side pulley and there are no worn spots, rough edges, breaks, etc.

I already checked that the idler tension wheel is fully adjusted to the max belt depression (following these instructions on the web)






and the idler pulley seems to go all the way in -- its practically touching the main large auger pulley that drives the tines and impeller. I also tried adjusting the cable up at the handle to get more pressure on the belt, but the idler pulley just cant go in any furthur without hitting the main impeller driven pulley.


I have uploaded a series of photos of the unit as it is today to the link below - each one has a description of the photo and any other additional details, ehich you can see by clicking on the individual photos.

Honda HS70 Photos by FirefoxHS70 | Photobucket

There is also a short handshot video of the machine running and what happens when I press the auger handle down. In the video you can see that when the idler pulley is engaged the auger turns a little but, but even with no resistance its barely turning. Towards the end of the video I took a chunk of hardwood board that was lying around and carefully put a little tension on the belt top. Stupid I know, but with just a little bit of extra tension the auger roars to life - so that part of the machine seems to be working fine as well. If I turn the engine off and hold the auger handle down to disengage the break I can turn the impeller pretty easily with the chunk of hardwood.

In some of the photos I tried to show the amount of slack that there is in the belt as installed. Im not sure if there is too much slack here -- could it be that this belt is not correct for my machine and its too long, so a little wear (the 2 or 3 hours that its run) wears the edges of the belt just enough to not grab anymore ?

Thanks again for all your help.

Fox


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## Shryp (Jan 1, 2011)

Definitely looks like the belt is too long. Has anyone done any work to the machine before you bought it? Maybe they put smaller pulleys on it or changed the engine for one that isn't as tall? Maybe the dealer just keeps giving you the wrong size belt. I didn't think older machines like that used cogged belts.

Also, with new belts you should be running the adjustments on the loose side. The tight side of the adjustment is for when the belt is completely worn out. If you have everything adjusted as tight as possible and still have that much slack something is wrong.

Are you sure the front blower section is bolted to the tractor section correctly? Does everything line up?

If it was mine and everything looked all right I would probably just go to a local place like Tractor Supply Company and buy a couple generic belts and see if one would fit well. Maybe 1/2" x 32" and 1/2" x 31". Don't run them and don't rip up the cardboard sleeve and then take back whatever belts you have that don't fit.


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## 94EG8 (Feb 13, 2014)

What's the serial number on the machine? There are two different belts. The one you have is good from serial 1006861 on. If yours is an earlier machine use belt number * 22432-736-003.*​


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## bosco659 (Feb 1, 2013)

I agree that the belt is most likely too long. Combined with rust on the pulley will destroy the belt quickly. 

If you have another new belt and it is too long, try to get a fractional sized belt (increments of 1/2") and try that. I personally have not had great luck trying to replace OEM belts with generic ones. The OEM's intentionally use unusual sizes of belts to force you to buy from the dealers at an inflated price. I also found that once you run back and forth a couple of times (gas and time wasted) to find a non OEM belt that fits, you may as well have purchased the OEM belt.

Maybe the alternate belt number posted will help. Good luck.


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

you can check the impeller bearing by grabbing the impeller pulley. if there is any play/slop in the impeller pulley, you will have to tear it down and replace it


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## Firefox (Dec 12, 2014)

Once again thanks for the tips guys, I would really like to get this machine working well - otherwise its back to shovelling 

The bucket seems to be attached correctly as far as I can tell, and I dont see any vibrations in the belt when the auger is running, but I will check the auger bearing when I break the machine apart over the next few days when I get a new belt to install.

I looked up the frame and engine info and the serial numbers on my machine are :

Frame serial # : 1000697
Engine serial # : g300-1324479

I have been spending a fair bit of time trying to search out information on the web and Im not sure that Im making it any clearer for me. There are a number of sites that have electronic versions of the Honda microfiche parts list, like this one :

All Years HS70 TA Honda Snowblower DRIVE PULLEY Diagram and Parts

These online sites are from the USA and its not clear if there is a difference in machines (or serial numbers) between USA machines and Canadian machines.

When I first got given the machine and ordered the first belt from the Honda dealer, I am 99.9% sure that I got the part # 22432-736-003 V-BELT (B-31.3). This belt lasted on the auger about 3 hours of running time before it could no longer power the auger. I regrettably have lost the receipt and the belt is worn enough on the outside to have rubbed the identifying mark off . I measured this worn belt and it appears to be also 33"x5/8" and it is not a cogged belt. When this first belt stopped working that is when I discovered the rust on the auger pulley on the crankshaft. Before installing the 2nd belt I did use a sandpaper block to try and smooth out the pulley.

The second replacement belt supplied by the Honda dealer was part 22432-736-701 V-BELT (SB-32 R.E.C.) which also measures 33"x5/8". This is the cogged belt present in my photos and my searching on the web turned up a very interesting post by [email protected] on this forum about a potentially related issue on a HS55 here 

http://www.snowblowerforum.com/forum/116234-post13.html

The bulletin here about installing engine spacers and new pulleys on the HS70 engine and then switching the belts to the SB-32 R.E.C. auger belt leads me to believe that this SB-32 R.E.C. belt is not for my machine since I cant see any spacers under my engine and my serial number appears to be one of the earlier units. 

The extra confusing part to me is why all specifications/ cross reference guides I can find all show both of the Honda auger belt part #'s measuring the same (33"x5/8") and l am quite certain that my original replacement belt was the (B-31.3) belt. One of the belts runs north of $45 here in Canada so its an expensive thing to test out.

I may try out the suggestion of a shorter generic kevlar belt, but I don’t have much hope for that one.

Otherwise I think my only choice is to try again the 22432-736-003 V-BELT (B-31.3) from Honda and try to make sure that the rust is removed from all pulleys and that the bearing on the large auger pulley attached to the bucket. 

Any other suggestions that might help would be welcomed.

Thanks

Fox


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## roversvx (Aug 18, 2016)

Hey Fox did you ever get figure this out with the HS70? I had the exact same problem last winter; went through three belts. I know this post was from two years ago, but really hoping to figure this out before this fall. Thanks!

-Rover


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

roversvx said:


> Hey Fox did you ever get figure this out with the HS70? I had the exact same problem last winter; went through three belts. I know this post was from two years ago, but really hoping to figure this out before this fall. Thanks!
> 
> -Rover


Which serial number do you have, if you go to Boats.net they offer two belts depending on the serial number, maybe you have the 32" belt instead of the 31.3" belt installed...?
Just a thought. :blush::blush::blush:

All Years HS70 TA Honda Snowblower DRIVE PULLEY Diagram and Parts

Look at #6 in the diagram.


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## roversvx (Aug 18, 2016)

My HS 70 is the earlier serial number so I would be looking for the 31.3 belt, I have tried that one and also the 32" belt. My model is the track mounted version so I just purchased all of the replacement parts listed under the auger belt modification service bulletin that [email protected] posted about.....Unfortunately the 2.6mm engine mount spacer is totally obsolete. So now I have a new auger pulley and different belt but no spacer...thinking maybe i can get some metal shims. Anyone have any other ideas?


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Maybe look for "fender washers" (this are very wide washers) at the hardware store that are about 2.6mm thick and use them as shims.....??? :blush:


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## Firefox (Dec 12, 2014)

Hi Rover,

I did finally get the HS70 working to my satisfaction. I used a small block of wood wrapped with fine sandpaper to remove all the rough rust pitting from the inside face of the small engine mounted auger pulley and then followed the suggestion from the forum here of trying a slightly smaller belt than the honda OEM part. 

I used a 5/8" x 32 kevlar belt (code 5L320K) from the supply store and the machine works great - 2 winters on that belt so far of Ontario winter and still kicking along. It makes no sense why the OEM part is not working here, but at this point Im just happy to have the machine.

Good luck

Fox



roversvx said:


> Hey Fox did you ever get figure this out with the HS70? I had the exact same problem last winter; went through three belts. I know this post was from two years ago, but really hoping to figure this out before this fall. Thanks!
> 
> -Rover


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## Mike H. (Jan 6, 2017)

*Impeller is bent*

Looking for a new or used Blower (Impeller), for my Honda HS-70 Snowblower. Part #HO72411-736-000


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