# Toro vs Ariens



## Sparky78

Hi All,

I just made my first post in the Ariens section. Here comes number 2. I planned to get a Toro Powermax 724 before I actually looked at blowers. I have a great Toro dealer I work with. However I must say when I was at Home Depot the other day with my daughter I saw them both side by side for the first time. The Toro was a huge let down. The dinky little 13" tire, all the plastic (I know, I know its guaranteed for life but still) and the 212cc engine that looks like a Harbor Freight Preditor engine didn't make me thing wow, I got to have one. Did I miss something? DO the dealers get a better machine? The Depot listed th 724 AT $800 dollars and the Ariens Compact 24 at $900. I have not run a snow blower in 10 plus years but from looking at them and holding the controls, etc, I don't see how I could spend my hard earned money on a Toro. If I missed something please speak up. Like I said, I have a great Toro dealer that I buy my trimmer, blowers, Chain Saws, etc from. I would rather deal with them but I can't buy a lesser machine either. Thanks for your help JB


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## UNDERTAKER

Have you looked at the HD'S yet????????????* ALOHA from the paradise city.*


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## Sparky78

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> Have you looked at the HD'S yet????????????* ALOHA from the paradise city.*


powermax hd? no i havent. whatam i missing? i dont think they offer a 24" in an HD do they? Also price wise aren't they more. I think $1000 is about all I want to spend.


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## cbnsoul

I have also been looking at the Toro models. While I agree the Toro's do look a bit cheaper with the plastic parts, I think the plastic chute may work better than the steel version on the Ariens models. I had some issues with snow sticking to the Ariens chute even with anti-stick sprays. 

One advantage of the Toro Power Max is the lower weights. Aries has the Compact 24 coming in at 212 lbs whereas the new PowerMax 826 OXE 37781 (listed for some reason as a 828 OXE on the mobile web page) is only 176 lbs. The PowerMax HD 826 OXE has the same engine but jumps to 243 lbs. I'm with you on the non-HD tires, though. As I mentioned in your other post, traction is a big issue for me and 13" tires just aren't big enough. I was wondering if I could add the HD tired to the non-HD model but it looks like that would cost $200, even if they fit. BTW, the only non-HD model to have assisted steering is the 826 OXE which has "automatic steering" similar, I guess to the new SnowMaster, whereas the HD versions have "power steering". Our dealer doesn't have the new models in stock yet so I haven't had the chance to ask the difference.

I still have no idea what I'm gonna get but it looks to be down to 3 Toro models - the 721 QZE single stage, the biggest SnowMaster 824 QXE or the non-HD 826 OXE - or possibly the Ariens track Compact 24.


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## Sparky78

cbnsoul said:


> I have also been looking at the Toro models. While I agree the Toro's do look a bit cheaper with the plastic parts, I think the plastic chute may work better than the steel version on the Ariens models. I had some issues with snow sticking to the Ariens chute even with anti-stick sprays.
> 
> One advantage of the Toro Power Max is the lower weights. Aries has the Compact 24 coming in at 212 lbs whereas the new PowerMax 826 OXE 37781 (listed for some reason as a 828 OXE on the mobile web page) is only 176 lbs. The PowerMax HD 826 OXE has the same engine but jumps to 243 lbs. I'm with you on the non-HD tires, though. As I mentioned in your other post, traction is a big issue for me and 13" tires just aren't big enough. I was wondering if I could add the HD tired to the non-HD model but it looks like that would cost $200, even if they fit. BTW, the only non-HD model to have assisted steering is the 826 OXE which has "automatic steering" similar, I guess to the new SnowMaster, whereas the HD versions have "power steering". Our dealer doesn't have the new models in stock yet so I haven't had the chance to ask the difference.
> 
> I still have no idea what I'm gonna get but it looks to be down to 3 Toro models - the 721 QZE single stage, the biggest SnowMaster 824 QXE or the non-HD 826 OXE - or possibly the Ariens track Compact 24.


Thanks for all the feedback!!! I really appreciate it. I wonder about those tires however. If they are that much smaller would the weight on they be more concentrated and they actually bite better? Maybe, maybe not. I get wha you are saying withh the plastic. It makes sence. I think i am leaning towards no steering assisted sytsem. I just dont see a machine this small being a big deal to muscle around. I see the 724 is listed as either having a briggs 205cc or the 212cc that I know nothingg about. hats better? Is thee 212cc the replacement for the Briggs?


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## cbnsoul

The 212 is the Toro Premium engine, which I believe is made by LCT, the same company that makes the Ariens engines so no difference there. My prior Compact 24 had the Briggs that I thought was nothing special. People seem to be happy with the Ariens LCT's. I didn't think the Briggs was anything special. If you are going for Made in the USA, someone on these boards mentioned that only the larger Briggs snowblower engines are still made here. Everything else comes from China.


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## sscotsman

Sparky78 said:


> I wonder about those tires however. If they are that much smaller would the weight on they be more concentrated and they actually bite better? Maybe, maybe not.


No, it wouldnt be better..when it comes to traction (and especially traction is snow) bigger is always better..

imagine snowbower wheels only 4-inches in diameter..first, they can get buried in the snow and not move at all, and second, they wont have much surface area in contact with the ground..

now imagine the same snowblower with wheels 4-feet tall..they will have more surface area in contact with the ground, more "rubber meets the road", and will have much better traction..

bigger is better, when it comes to wheels.

Scot


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## Sparky78

sscotsman said:


> No, it wouldnt be better..when it comes to traction (and especially traction is snow) bigger is always better..
> 
> imagine snowbower wheels only 4-inches in diameter..first, they can get buried in the snow and not move at all, and second, they wont have much surface area in contact with the ground..
> 
> now imagine the same snowblower with wheels 4-feet tall..they will have more surface area in contact with the ground, more "rubber meets the road", and will have much better traction..
> 
> bigger is better, when it comes to wheels.
> 
> Scot


Thanks Scot, I knew I was rematch in a little on that. Just surprised how dinky these small Toros look next to an Ariens.


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## UNDERTAKER

The HD'S have 16 inch tires on then. it is a 8-26. for 1400.00


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## 43128

you know why the toro looks almost exactly likes the predator? its made by loncin, the same company that makes the predator from harbor freight, very reliable engines


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## detdrbuzzard

well the toro's tires are not going to get buried in the snow, they are behind the bucket 
no toro doesn't make an HD model with a 24" bucket
hello sparky, welcome to *SBF*


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## Sparky78

detdrbuzzard said:


> well the toro's tires are not going to get buried in the snow, they are behind the bucket
> no toro doesn't make an HD model with a 24" bucket
> hello sparky, welcome to *SBF*


True.......

thanks for the welcome!!!!!


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## laptopquestions

sscotsman said:


> No, it wouldnt be better..when it comes to traction (and especially traction is snow) bigger is always better..
> 
> imagine snowbower wheels only 4-inches in diameter..first, they can get buried in the snow and not move at all, and second, they wont have much surface area in contact with the ground..
> 
> now imagine the same snowblower with wheels 4-feet tall..they will have more surface area in contact with the ground, more "rubber meets the road", and will have much better traction..
> 
> bigger is better, when it comes to wheels.
> 
> Scot


I don't know if it extends to snowblowers, but with my old Acura, I use to downsize my tire. The wider 'sport' tires make it a skate board during winter  

A smaller and narrower tire has better grip and performance in snow or ice. This is both because the smaller tire cuts through snow more effectively, and because the weight of the car is pressing on a more focused set of contact patches.

That said, my new Toro HD 826 OXE tire is both _taller and narrower_ than my Troy-bilt 2620, which is a good thing. In the end, it isn't just the size of the contact patch that can make a difference but also the downward force. For me at least, the HD was the only way to go. Small and wide is the worst of both worlds....


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## laptopquestions

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> The HD'S have 16 inch tires on then. it is a 8-26. for 1400.00


The going rate (pre-season) seems to be $1299 for the Toro Power Max HD 826 OXE and $1499 for the Toro Power Max HD 928 OHXE, assuming that was what you were referring to. Only familiar with the pricing since I just got a Toro Power Max HD 826 OXE. Unfortunately forums like this make you second guess everything


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## laptopquestions

detdrbuzzard said:


> well the toro's tires are not going to get buried in the snow, they are behind the bucket
> no toro doesn't make an HD model with a 24" bucket
> hello sparky, welcome to *SBF*


And Ariens doesn't make a 26. I am sure there must be a rhyme and reason for this in the industry, but I haven't figured it out yet


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## sj701

*SnowCommander replacement*

The smaller SnowMaster looks like the replacement for the SnowCommander. Toro is stretching the truth by calling this a Two stage, it is CLEARLY a Single stage design. Loncin 212 HEMI head engine can be seen in the video footage.


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## laptopquestions

sj701 said:


> The smaller SnowMaster looks like the replacement for the SnowCommander. Toro is stretching the truth by calling this a Two stage, it is CLEARLY a Single stage design. Loncin 212 HEMI head engine can be seen in the video footage.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bL208zDiYjE


Looks like others agree with you .....

Introducing the 2015 Toro SnowMaster - This May Be Your Next Snow Thrower - movingsnow.com

_*Tech Note:* *Toro is calling this “in-line two-stage technology.”* *The term is a play on words* but Toro has changed the design of the rubber front paddle from the smooth transition of the single stage Power Curve® models to a cupped center section that grabs the snow and throws it farther. They can use the term “in-line two-stage technology” because the all steel rotor has a outer helical design which quickly breaks up and gathers snow to the center section that throws snow far through its tall chute opening. The new auger is all metal with a small center section of replaceable rubber paddles. The front rotor spins ten times faster than the front auger on a 2-stage snow blower so it grabs the snow and gets rid of it quickly. Toro states this new model will throw snow up to 40 feet! It is a single stage snow thrower but the front paddle does not touch the ground. Unlike many 2-stage snow blowers it handles wet, heavy snow!_


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## sj701

laptopquestions said:


> Looks like others agree with you .....


Apparently Toro didn't appreciate my honest comments on their YouTube video. They Ghost Banned me so nobody can see my comment. Oh well I guess they don't want the truth to be known on their new pride and joy. :icon_whistling:


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## 43128

going to see what happens to my comment now that you said something


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