# Snow blower recommendations (Boston area, 130' paved driveway)



## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

New user here. Fairly new to New England and snow. I moved to the Boston MetroWest area a couple of years ago and have been through two winters, both of which I'm told were quite moderate (_though each year we got at least one 15" storm_). When I arrived, I bought a slightly older Troy-Built Storm 2410 with the 179cc engine as a hand-me-down. It has worked decently well for two seasons, but the gear that turns the chute is plastic and has separated from the chute control. To adjust, I have to grab the chute itself and rotate. The transmission also has some issue - I can only put it in the the 2 slowest forward speeds, so turning/maneuvering requires some manhandling. It also struggles with the snow that gets piled at the end of my driveway.

So, I'm looking to upgrade to something more sturdy and capable. My driveway is about 130' long; two-thirds of it is 12' wide (single car width) but the last third expands to the width of a two-car garage + entryway. It's flat (no incline), straight, and paved (with some cracks); the walkways + area near the house are brick. My neighborhood has no sidewalks, but the street gets salted and plowed during/after each snow storm. The fill pipe for my oil tank is on the other side of the house from the driveway, so I also have to clear a path over part of the lawn to make sure that's accessible.

I've recently spent some time at Lowe's, Home Depot, and my local power equipment dealer. I've looked at Cub Cadets, Toros, Craftsmans, Ariens, and Hondas. I'm partial to the latter two manufacturers after some touching and feeling; the others all have too much plastic for my liking. The local dealer doesn't have many blowers (_pandemic supply chain issues are real_); he suggested I look at the following models sitting on the floor:

Deluxe 28" SHO (Ariens)
Deluxe 24" (Ariens)
HSS724AATD (Honda)

The Honda is almost twice as expensive as the 28" SHO - why? The salesman said he almost never has to work on Hondas, so apparently they're really well built? I like the hydraulic height adjuster. I own a driving lawn mower with a hydrostatic transmission, and having one on a snow blower seems cool, though I don't know how practically useful it is. I like the idea of steering with levers (though in practice I may find I think differently). I wonder if the track drive is overkill for my needs. I also wonder if the 196cc engine is too small.

Each of the Ariens seems well built, though I'm a little leary of an auto-turn mechanism that doesn't require me to actively activate it. The bigger machine has a bigger engine compared to the smaller machine, which seems to be the way it should be. One of my neighbors has an older Ariens (ST927) that he likes pretty well, but says it occasionally feels underpowered and is generally less solidly built than the Ariens he had before that.

A 24" blower fits easily in my garage. I'm confident a 28" will too; I don't want to go larger than 30".

What do you all recommend?


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

Welcome to SBF, glad to have you aboard.

New machines are of course very nice indeed, but some of the older models were built to a much higher standard and hold up very well even after many years of use.

Do you have the wherewithal to do a little wrenching from time to time, or do you require something that's plug 'n play?


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> Do you have the wherewithal to do a little wrenching from time to time, or do you require something that's plug 'n play?


I have lots of tools but not a lot of experience. Both would be good, I know, but generally speaking if it's on YouTube or if someone shows me how to do something, I learn decently quickly.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

Well having the tools is a leg up, and they are fairly simple machines.

Getting late on that side now, but someone from the area will likely chime in tomorrow.


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

Hi Phen. I'd be proud to have any of those three machines in my garage. At the intersection of form following function and bang for buck, I would go Deluxe 24. YMMV, and maybe 28" swath is an important one in your case. Good Luck.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Hi phendric, and welcome ...

Many enlightened individuals here with a wealth of experience and knowledge in the use and maintenance of snowblowers.

I am pretty well versed in the operation of and the maintaining of various snowblower makes, as well as have had the opportunity to tear down and completely restore many different machines, including my vintage Ariens Tiller as well as my Ryan Core Plug Aerator, as well as go through and refurbish many different brands of snow blowers as well.

The fact that you have tools, and the interest and ability to learn, in my opinion is key to not only repairing a machine, but to keep it well maintained. Regardless of what you decide on a machine going forward, I would keep that Troy-Built you have now and use it as a learning project, go through and adjust and repair it, and keep it as a backup as well, as in my opinion, just about everything can be adjusted and repaired ... Maybe with a 160 foot driveway, etc., you could even teach the significant other to operate one and help out as well in a big storm ... 

The majority of my equipment is older, and some even vintage, as over 50 years old ... Everything I own is in top operating and running condition. I currently have 6 units in my personal fleet line-up, including a new Cub Cadet with all the bells and whistles that I just acquired, which will be getting its first use this year, as well as the JD 826 which I just finished restoring, and a newer Ariens 724 which I just put an engine on. I have sold many machines in the past, that I picked up for free or was gifted that were not working, went through them, and then sold them for cheap, basically for the parts I had put in and a small pittance for time and shop supplies, to assist others and get these classic units back into another life. (Being retired now helps ...  ) Without a doubt, the older units were mostly just built better, with thicker gauge metal, rods instead of flimsy wire cables, etc.. Many older units had slip differentials that actually worked better than some of the so called zero turn units of today. I have never bought a new snow blower in my entire life, as I never had a need for one.

Whatever you decide, keeping them maintained and cared for is key. I never owned a Honda unit, as I don't see many here in CT, but no doubt, I am sure they are a good machine, but I never had a need for a tracked machine ... Of course Ariens has built a good reputation over the years, and many of their older units are still in operation today, due to the build quality of years ago. I personally would keep under 28 inches, as the 30 inch and above can be a bit of an undertaking to operate in my opinion ... but with a 160 ft driveway, that would be your call for sure. I have two 26 inch machines, all others 24 inch, and never felt anything more is needed, even with my double driveway EOD, as well as doing other driveways in my neighborhood as well.

My current personal fleet line-up ....... ( we all like photos here ...  )

Two of the Ariens 10000 series (one fully restored, both with new engines) appx 50 years old
YardMan 7100 series appx 50 years old ( my Dad bought new)
John Deere 826 - older, just fully restored
Cub Cadet - repaired
Ariens 724 - picked up with no double shaft engine on it ... put on a single shaft Tecumseh


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## Tseg (Jan 29, 2021)

OP, your driveway sounds exactly like mine, but I am in Detroit…sounds like similar weather the past 2 years. Last year I upgraded to a HSS724AWD (wheels). With no incline on my drive I like the wheels for increased maneuverability and higher speed to motor back to the garage when I finish blowing at the far end of the property down the drive then down the sidewalk. No issues with deep thick hard EOD stuff… I even now plow out a parking spot on the curb in the street . What I like about the HSS is I have some tight spots and the hydrostatic transmission allows me to be very precise. I also spent the extra $150 or so to buy the parts for the articulating chute mod. I figure it will help me place snow exactly where needed in tight areas… was a fun Spring afternoon installing, but not yet used in the snow. I also added a larger main jet which provides both a more immediate start and I am anticipating a reduced bog feel of the engine for the EOD this coming year.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Darby said:


> Hi Phen. I'd be proud to have any of those three machines in my garage. At the intersection of form following function and bang for buck, I would go Deluxe 24. YMMV, and maybe 28" swath is an important one in your case. Good Luck.


Thanks. I have exactly 0 experience with 28". I haven't been unhappy with 24", though, especially given the manhandling I've had to do with my current machine (_ie smaller = lighter_).

I see some folks say "get the biggest displacement/torque/HP that you can for the size," though, which is why I'm considering the larger SHO model. (_As an example of this, see my neighbor, who has a 27" Ariens with a 318cc engine and says it sometimes feels underpowered._)



Oneacer said:


> ...I would keep that Toro you have now...


Does Troy-Built == Toro?



Oneacer said:


> Maybe with a 160 foot driveway, etc., you could even teach the significant other to operate one and help out as well in a big storm ...


Yes. I also have kids...and a lot of snow shovels (for that reason).



Oneacer said:


> Whatever you decide, keeping them maintained and cared for is key.


Yes. Lots of things in life are like that, not just things with engines in them.



Oneacer said:


> I personally would keep under 28 inches, as the 30 inch and above can be a bit of an undertaking to operate in my opinion ... but with a 160 ft driveway, that would be your call for sure. I have two 26 inch machines, all others 24 inch, and never felt anything more is needed.


Thanks.



Tseg said:


> OP, your driveway sounds exactly like mine, but I am in Detroit…sounds like similar weather the past 2 years. Last year I upgraded to a HSS724AWD (wheels).


What did you upgrade from?

The local dealer only had 4 or 5 Hondas. All of them except 1 has track drive and I don't remember how big the wheeled one was.

Have you ever wished the Honda had a larger engine?



Tseg said:


> With no incline on my drive I like the wheels for increased maneuverability and higher speed to motor back to the garage when I finish blowing at the far end of the property down the drive then down the sidewalk. No issues with deep thick hard EOD stuff… I even now plow out a parking spot on the curb in the street . What I like about the HSS is I have some tight spots and the hydrostatic transmission allows me to be very precise.


Thanks. So a) wheels give you speed and agility, b) with a flat driveway, there's no need for the extra traction of tracks, and c) if I don't have tight spots I probably won't need hydrostatic? Is that a good summary?


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

" Does Troy-Built == Toro? "

Thanks for noticing my type-o ... all corrected ...  Guess I had Toro on my mind ...


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Oneacer said:


> Thanks for noticing my type-o ... all corrected ...  Guess I had Toro on my mind ...


🤣

I'll probably end up doing what someone did for me when I moved in, and pass the Troy-Built onto someone new to the state....unless someone here tells me I should really keep and repair it. I have room for a single blower, not more than one.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Update: I just called the local dealer. They have 24" Hondas (both wheeled and track) and they have a 28" track. No 28" wheeled. They've also received word from Ariens that they'll be getting a platinum 24 SHO or two in the next couple of weeks.

I add this just because any recommendations will need to be matched to local supply.


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## Ziggy65 (Jan 18, 2020)

Welcome to the forum.

Bonus points for doing some research and getting hands on the actual machines.

With a snow blower, you want/need it to work perfectly every time you need to use it, especially after a big snow storm. I am a fan of the older machines (I have two 50 year old Ariens) and agree, many were better built than the machines of today. I also have a Deluxe 28 SHO, which I purchased after we moved to our new home which has a large (+200') U shaped driveway, I wanted a larger machine than 24". I also blow a path in our yard around the house and our fenced in dog run. We average 130" of snow annually.

If you are not planning on keeping a back up machine, and have little experience with snow blowers, I would probably go with a new machine, especially with a larger driveway that would be difficult to shovel if you had a break down. The used market is heating up and starting to thin out, and new machines may be limited this year, so you will want to make a decision ASAP on your new purchase.

I would recommend Deluxe 28 SHO, it is a great bang for the buck machine. If your budget allows, the tracked 28" Honda is a great choice, the Rolls Royce of walk behind machines. The Platinum 24 SHO is a beast with the big HP to width ratio. Any of these machines will handle whatever size snow fall you get.

If your budget allows for one of these new machines- great, if not look for one of them on the used market in good, well serviced condition.

Check all the machines out again in person, and go with what your gut tells you, remember it is better to buy more snow blower than you think you need and have no regrets.

My Deluxe 28 SHO has handled all types of snow conditions flawlessly without issue for the past 3 winters.


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## ktl5005 (Oct 19, 2020)

For that size I'd be looking at Ariens Platinum. More powerful engines, more snow throwing capability. When I went with a Platinum 24 SHO over a Deluxe 28 SHO. No replacement for displacement. 369cc > 308cc


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## 1132le (Feb 23, 2017)

28 sho install impeller kit and a 10 buck led light
hot coco or gold schalger after blowing at midnight


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Ziggy65 said:


> If you are not planning on keeping a back up machine, and have little experience with snow blowers, I would probably go with a new machine, especially with a larger driveway that would be difficult to shovel if you had a break down. The used market is heating up and starting to thin out, and new machines may be limited this year, so you will want to make a decision ASAP on your new purchase.


I share the same concern about shoveling a long driveway. I haven't yet experienced a heavy winter but figure one's gonna come sooner or later. And I agree about the concern about limited inventory this season.



Ziggy65 said:


> remember it is better to buy more snow blower than you think you need and have no regrets.


This would be the conservative-leaning strategy, yes.




ktl5005 said:


> For that size I'd be looking at Ariens Platinum. More powerful engines, more snow throwing capability. When I went with a Platinum 24 SHO over a Deluxe 28 SHO. No replacement for displacement. 369cc > 308cc





Ziggy65 said:


> I would recommend Deluxe 28 SHO, it is a great bang for the buck machine. If your budget allows, the tracked 28" Honda is a great choice, the Rolls Royce of walk behind machines. The Platinum 24 SHO is a beast with the big HP to width ratio. Any of these machines will handle whatever size snow fall you get.


I'm not so worried about budget; I want to get the right thing and not worry about it for another decade or two (except maintenance).

So, it seems folks generally recommend one of the smaller Ariens SHO machines or the Deluxe 24. On the Honda side, there's a smattering of recommendations for either 24" or 28".

What I'm struggling with is why Honda's are so much more expensive, and whether the added expense is worth it. I've never owned a Rolls Royce, but I'd guess their high price has as much to do with marketing and image as it does with practically useful things. 

How much of the cost of a Honda is image/marketing vs build quality/materials/etc?


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

phendric said:


> Does Troy-Built == Toro?


No, modern Troy-Bilt=Cub Cadet=MTD... The Toro/Ariens/Honda lines are a better choice, I believe.


phendric said:


> Have you ever wished the Honda had a larger engine?


I have the HSS1332AATD, so plenty of width, good size engine and tracks (which I personally adore). Some have taken the GX390 from the HSS1332A and put it onto a 28" body, making a HSS1328A.


phendric said:


> Thanks. So a) wheels give you speed and agility, b) with a flat driveway, there's no need for the extra traction of tracks, and c) if I don't have tight spots I probably won't need hydrostatic? Is that a good summary?


I would tend to disagree...
a) My tracked HSS1332AATD goes 3.44MPH forward & 2.38MPH in reverse. The trigger steering and auger height piston make it very agile for a large machine.
b) Tracks come into play when you tackle the snowplow pile at the end of the driveway, as well as when you want to vary auger height on the fly for grass or gravel surfaces.
c) Infinitely variable hydrostatic drive (rather than just a few preset speeds) is truly wonderful.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

tabora said:


> a) My tracked HSS1332AATD goes 3.44MPH forward & 2.38MPH in reverse. The trigger steering and auger height piston make it very agile for a large machine.


That's....fast for something that moves snow.

Also, I love your sig.


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## Ziggy65 (Jan 18, 2020)

What I'm struggling with is why Honda's are so much more expensive, and whether the added expense is worth it. I've never owned a Rolls Royce, but I'd guess their high price has as much to do with marketing and image as it does with practically useful things. 

How much of the cost of a Honda is image/marketing vs build quality/materials/etc?
[/QUOTE]

For a better apples to apples comparison, you should be comparing the Ariens Professional series snow blowers with Honda machines. 









Professional Series | Snow Blowers | Ariens


Shop the Professional Series snow blower from Ariens. Designed and built for professionals, but also used by homeowners who don’t mess around. The 420cc engine blows snow up to 60 feet.




www.ariens.com


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

A ford will get you from point A to B, as well as a BMW ... depends on how you want to get there and arrive ...


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## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

Just the status they have earned for dependability , other makes from Japan were pricey too I think like Yamaha ?


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## uberT (Dec 29, 2013)

Phendric, welcome aboard!! I guess I've lived in Boston MetroWest for 30 years now. The winters and their snowfall amounts are hugely variable - - I suspect you've figured that out already. I've had 4 late model Ariens and a big MTD machine. My only recommendation is buying something with an engine *bigger* than you think you need. We get those brutally heavy and wet snow falls that require some real horse-pressure to move. There's simply no alternative to big displacement.

I've settled on the 24" SHO machine and a 21" single stage, both by Ariens. I'm having good luck with that combo. My driveway is about 240' long, paved and steep.

Buy/order soon !! You're going to be in trouble as soon as the weather turns cold if you don't.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

phendric said:


> Update: I just called the local dealer. They have 24" Hondas (both wheeled and track) and they have a 28" track. No 28" wheeled. They've also received word from Ariens that they'll be getting a platinum 24 SHO or two in the next couple of weeks.
> 
> I add this just because any recommendations will need to be matched to local supply.


I'd get the honda if in your price range while they have them in stock. Since your driveway is long and flat i would get a wheeled machine.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Ziggy65 said:


> For a better apples to apples comparison, you should be comparing the Ariens Professional series snow blowers with Honda machines.


Oh! Didn't realize Honda essentially only makes professional machines.



Oneacer said:


> A ford will get you from point A to B, as well as a BMW ... depends on how you want to get there and arrive ...





nitehawk55 said:


> Just the status they have earned for dependability , other makes from Japan were pricey too I think like Yamaha ?


Thanks. I can relate to the BMW analogy a little better than the Rolls Royce one. 



uberT said:


> Phendric, welcome aboard!! I guess I've lived in Boston MetroWest for 30 years now. The winters and their snowfall amounts are hugely variable - - I suspect you've figured that out already. I've had 4 late model Ariens and a big MTD machine. My only recommendation is buying something with an engine *bigger* than you think you need. We get those brutally heavy and wet snow falls that require some real horse-pressure to move. There's simply no alternative to big displacement.
> 
> I've settled on the 24" SHO machine and a 21" single stage, both by Ariens. I'm having good luck with that combo. My driveway is about 240' long, paved and steep.
> 
> Buy/order soon !! You're going to be in trouble as soon as the weather turns cold if you don't.


Thanks. And yuuup (_to the "buy soon"_).



CarlB said:


> I'd get the honda if in your price range while they have them in stock. Since your driveway is long and flat i would get a wheeled machine.


Thx. 24" is the only wheeled Honda they have, which is too bad: I like the larger engine in the 28".


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## badbmwbrad (Jul 30, 2019)

Don't get a tracked Honda (or any other make of tracked snowblower) because you don't need it with your flat driveway. The disadvantages of a tracked snowblower will out-weigh its advantages. Tracks are not nearly as maneuverable as wheels. When it's time to put away the tracked snowblower in a garage, its tracks make it even more difficult to push across the dry garage floor. 

There are not enough heavy winter snow storms around here (I'm located in Plymouth, MA) to justify tracks with the exception of the Winter of 2015 (Winter from hell!). A wheeled Ariens is likely your best choice but the wheeled Honda is likely a better built machine. A hydrostatic drive comes into its own when tackling the heavy snow windrow left behind by the snowplow. It's easy to work the hydrostatic transmission between forward and reverse repeatedly to chip away at the snow windrow.

I've been running an Ariens ST-824 (8 HP 24" wide) for 32 years on a driveway with ~five times more surface area than your driveway. The only time the Ariens struggles is when heavy, wet 12"+ deep snow needs to be thrown _twice; _that is, the snotblower couldn't discharge the snow far enough to eject it from the driveway and it fell back onto the driveway. I'm sure an impeller kit would eliminate this shortcoming.

It's only under these conditions where use of my Honda HS1132TAS (tracked) would probably be better because it's powerful enough to discharge the wet snow so high and far that it doesn't land on the driveway and require a second launch. As for its tracks, they are bad on a gravel surface at the very beginning of the Winter or near the very end of Winter. Only when there is a thick ice layer on the driveway from repeated snow storms during the coldest Winter months do the tracks come into their own. The last time that occurred was during the Winter from hell and that was the last time I used that big Honda machine. For all other times, an 8 HP, 24" wheeled Ariens Sno-Thro is completely adequate. 

Find Jack Melanson in Hudson, MA (he's on the Ariens sub-forum) and see if he can sell you an Ariens SHO Sno-Thro with a 6-blade impeller and tall discharge chute. That machine will handle anything you'll encounter in eastern Massachusetts.


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## Darkwoods (Dec 25, 2020)

Welcome! 

I have the Ariens deluxe 28SHO and a tracked Honda HSS928CTD. 

The Ariens would definitely handle your snow moving needs and it’s one of the best bang for the buck models out there. My driveway is sloped and uneven, and i there is also a gravel alleyway that I move snow on, so I decided to give the tracked Honda a go. While the Ariens got the job done, it’s quite a bit easier for my needs with the tracked unit.

There is definitely a major price difference between the Honda and HSS, and given how well the SHO Ariens performs, the short answer is, no, the price hike does not mean you are getting a huge performance difference. 

The main differences with the Honda are hydrostatic drive, auto style starter, Auger hydraulic adjust, electric chute controls, trigger steering, and of course tracks. Obviously different house brand engines. 

You are primarily paying for bells and whistles, with the extra features and there is always a price hike going to a hydrostatic drive. With that said, i really like the Auger height adjust for going off pavement and just for moving the machine when not blowing snow. The electric chute controls offer extra articulation on the Honda and is useful for snow placement. Downside is future maintenance because of the electric motors and controls that will inevitably fail. Tracks offer more traction and I find the Honda to be more effective at removing the end of drive pile left by the plow. It digs in more whereas wheeled units tend to ride up and over. Some Ariens owners add weights to the front to alleviate this because the newer machines have a weight bias behind the axles.

I have noticed my Honda starts easier, is a touch quieter and runs a bit more smoothly than the Ariens. Do I think it’s really worth the premium in price over the SHO? No, not really but it comes down to preferences. Good luck.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

phendric said:


> Oh! Didn't realize Honda essentially only makes professional machines.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





phendric said:


> Oh! Didn't realize Honda essentially only makes professional machines.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I understand if you want the larger clearing width, but the 24 inch honda is more than capable of handling most any storm. you will need to make more passes but the 24 will be more maneuverable than the 28"

that being said what is the HP / Width ratio of both machines. 
good luck on your quest. I believe most places will sellout very quickly this year and restocking may difficult.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

badbmwbrad said:


> <snip>
> 
> Find Jack Melanson in Hudson, MA (he's on the Ariens sub-forum) and see if he can sell you an Ariens SHO Sno-Thro with a 6-blade impeller and tall discharge chute. That machine will handle anything you'll encounter in eastern Massachusetts.


Thanks for the advice. I'll try IMing Jack (_I've tried twice, but something about the message keeps getting flagged as "spammy" and then my account gets locked; I don't know why._)



Darkwoods said:


> There is definitely a major price difference between the Honda and HSS, and given how well the SHO Ariens performs, the short answer is, no, the price hike does not mean you are getting a huge performance difference.
> 
> I have noticed my Honda starts easier, is a touch quieter and runs a bit more smoothly than the Ariens. Do I think it’s really worth the premium in price over the SHO? No, not really but it comes down to preferences. Good luck.


Thanks.



CarlB said:


> I believe most places will sellout very quickly this year and restocking may difficult.


That's what I'm being told.

Another local dealership has 3x Platinum 24" SHO EFIs (#921053). 2019. Anything there that should raise red flags, either the year or the EFI?


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

I understand quite a few people have issues with the new EFI systems .... Your certainly not going to fix those for under 20.00 when they go bonkers, like you can with a carburetor.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

Ariens Deluxe 28 SHO. I would also look at a Toro Power Max HD 928 or HD 1030 (if you can secur one within a reasonable distance) also very nice machines that perform well.


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## Toolboxhero (Dec 24, 2010)

Those "once a year" 15 to 24-inch snows are always heavy/wet snow. The Ariens Deluxe 24 will throw the snow well but the Deluxe 28 SHO will get your driveway cleared a little faster. The Ariens with their 14-inch impeller will not clog on that heavy/wet snow. 
You don't need an impeller kit on the Ariens. They will both throw that heavy/wet snow 40 feet or more right out of the box.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

phendric said:


> Thanks for the advice. I'll try IMing Jack (_I've tried twice, but something about the message keeps getting flagged as "spammy" and then my account gets locked; I don't know why._)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Im not a fan of EFI on a snow blower.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

phendric said:


> (_I've tried twice, but something about the message keeps getting flagged as "spammy" and then my account gets locked; I don't know why._)


Sorry about that... for some reason the System keeps flagging your stuff. The only control I have is to go in and clear it as soon as I notice. I'll keep on it and also kick a message upstairs to see what can be done.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

phendric said:


> Thanks for the advice. I'll try IMing Jack (_I've tried twice, but something about the message keeps getting flagged as "spammy" and then my account gets locked; I don't know why._)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The fact that he still has them and they are 2019 models should tell you something. I would not buy an EFI snowblower.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

Personally agreed about the EFI... over-complication that's not overall beneficial.

Maybe someday... but why mess with tried and true.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Oneacer said:


> I understand quite a few people have issues with the new EFI systems .... Your certainly not going to fix those for under 20.00 when they go bonkers, like you can with a carburetor.





CarlB said:


> Im not a fan of EFI on a snow blower.





CarlB said:


> The fact that he still has them and they are 2019 models should tell you something. I would not buy an EFI snowblower.





Yanmar Ronin said:


> Personally agreed about the EFI... over-complication that's not overall beneficial.


Okay, a number of people saying the same thing here. And yes, I thought about the fact that they're 2019.



Yanmar Ronin said:


> ...but why mess with tried and true.


Because it's what's available?



Cardo111 said:


> Ariens Deluxe 28 SHO.


This may be what it comes down to. Smaller body+larger engine+EFI (_Plat 24 SHO_) or larger body+smaller engine+carbs (_Deluxe 28 SHO_)?


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> ...for some reason the System keeps flagging your stuff.


Conversations (IMs) don't appear to like quotes, either from earlier in the conversation or from other forum posts. I've had a warning pop up every time I've tried to put a quote into a conversation.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

phendric said:


> Conversations (IMs) don't appear to like quotes, either from earlier in the conversation or from other forum posts. I've had a warning pop up every time I've tried to put a quote into a conversation.


Are you using the 'Reply' or the 'quote' function?


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

phendric said:


> Because it's what's available?


Never settle for less because it's the shiny thing dangling in front of you. They're available because the vote is in.

Wait, and pounce on known good... imo. Thirty year-old machines with carbs will still be hauling ... when parts for the transitional electronics of 'improved' machines have gone the way of the dinosaurs they were supposed to replace, and they'll be scrap.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> Are you using the 'Reply' or the 'quote' function?


I've been using both. I forget which (or both) I used for the conversations.




Yanmar Ronin said:


> They're available because the vote is in.


Very possibly, yes. 



Ziggy65 said:


> ...you will want to make a decision ASAP on your new purchase.





uberT said:


> Buy/order soon !!





Yanmar Ronin said:


> Never settle for less because it's the shiny thing dangling in front of you.


These are potentially conflicting opinions; finding the right balance between choosing the right product and finding something that's available is always important. 

I'm also not sure I'm convinced that EFI in a snow blower is bad. There's certainly debate about that with folks arguing it's either great or terrible. Paul Sikkema said in 2018 that it's great (hi @Toolboxhero!), but I don't know if he's changed his mind since then.

I haven't yet gone to look at the EFI machine...that's later this morning. If I feel like I'm settling, I'll walk.


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

Just a question/point on engine size relevant to OP's quest... If an older well made respected machine with a L head in good condition is a excellent choice, why must a new machine have a 400cc monster to make the cut. 250cc on a 24" inch bucket is in no way underpowered in my opinion. (Edit. I do not need nor want to throw snow 60 feet. Really, 30 feet or so real world is reasonable)


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## Surfwooder (Sep 20, 2021)

After moving from the deep South, near New Orleans, 4 years ago, I decided we needed a snow machine. For two years I traveled back to the Gulf Coast for Winter, but since Covid, and Mississippi's attitude about the vaccine, we decided to remain home, in New Hampshire. Last Winter I became acquainted with the driveway monster, and a sore back. When I bought this house, and land, I bought a lawn tractor, from the local Simplicity Dealer, in Concord. The tractor was delivered to my house, with a dump trailer, and lawn sweeper. 6 months later the deal came to my house, and serviced the tractor, free of charge. Now, I've bought a new Simplicity Signature Pro Dual-Stage Snow Blower. It will be delivered to my door Mid November, before the first snow. Simplicity has a 3 year warranty for the home owner. Plus, the Pro models have hand warmers, and pro transmissions. I looked a Troy-Built, Cub Cadet, and others, and fount the Simplicity to be built of more substantial steel, and other parts. I also looked at Honda, and think they are a bit over priced, for a machine that will be in storage for months between seasons. My machine will be stored between my two cars in the garage, during snow season. I'll store it in the basement during the rest of the year. I'll be using Av Gas 100 oct. LL in my machine, to get away from ethanol.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

A 400cc On a 24 inch blower is all about bragging rights ....


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Surfwooder said:


> It will be delivered to my door Mid November, before the first snow...


...you hope. I've only been in New England for 2 winters and we got snow before Halloween one of them. Hope you're enjoying NH!



Darby said:


> Just a question/point on engine size relevant to OP's quest... If an older well made respected machine with a L head in good condition is a excellent choice, why must a new machine have a 400cc monster to make the cut. 250cc on a 24" inch bucket is in no way underpowered in my opinion. (Edit. I do not need nor want to throw snow 60 feet. Really, 30 feet or so real world is reasonable)





Oneacer said:


> A 400cc On a 24 inch blower is all about bragging rights ....


Maybe. I think @Darby's question is a very good one. Folks say, on the one hand, "bigger displacement is better" but on the other hand "old(er) is better." Older blowers don't typically have bigger engines than newer ones do.



phendric said:


> Another local dealership has 3x Platinum 24" SHO EFIs (#921053). 2019.


I was wrong about the year - whoops! The dealer lists "2019" on their website, but the blower is in fact one they ordered and Ariens shipped them this year.

They have several Platinum 24" SHOs and at least one Deluxe 28" SHO. That, I think, is what I'm deciding between.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

phendric said:


> I've been using both. I forget which (or both) I used for the conversations.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I can rebuild a carb in minutes. Try getting parts for an EFI, I'll say no more. Gas miles don't matter to me, reliability does.


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## uberT (Dec 29, 2013)

What's the scoop with Ariens concerning EFI at this point? I know for a while you could buy essentially a version with EFI or carburetor. Is the EFI system becoming more common now within their line up? I really haven't looked.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

uberT said:


> What's the scoop with Ariens concerning EFI at this point?


Here's their EFI page:








Benefits of EFI Snow Blowers | Ariens







www.ariens.com




While I like the concept of EFI to eliminate carburetor woes and provide more power at the higher RPMs, and it seems to work well on the Honda EU7000is generators, I'm leery of the small 7.2V battery that Ariens is using to power it up. On my HSS1332AATD with its 18Ah 12V starting battery, it would be a no-brainer.


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## Nick S (Sep 26, 2021)

phendric said:


> New user here. Fairly new to New England and snow. I moved to the Boston MetroWest area a couple of years ago and have been through two winters, both of which I'm told were quite moderate (_though each year we got at least one 15" storm_). When I arrived, I bought a slightly older Troy-Built Storm 2410 with the 179cc engine as a hand-me-down. It has worked decently well for two seasons, but the gear that turns the chute is plastic and has separated from the chute control. To adjust, I have to grab the chute itself and rotate. The transmission also has some issue - I can only put it in the the 2 slowest forward speeds, so turning/maneuvering requires some manhandling. It also struggles with the snow that gets piled at the end of my driveway.
> 
> So, I'm looking to upgrade to something more sturdy and capable. My driveway is about 130' long; two-thirds of it is 12' wide (single car width) but the last third expands to the width of a two-car garage + entryway. It's flat (no incline), straight, and paved (with some cracks); the walkways + area near the house are brick. My neighborhood has no sidewalks, but the street gets salted and plowed during/after each snow storm. The fill pipe for my oil tank is on the other side of the house from the driveway, so I also have to clear a path over part of the lawn to make sure that's accessible.
> 
> ...


I personally bought an st1236, and if you are willing to wrestle that big of a blower they are amazing especially the older ones that are built heavier. I can clear a 9x140ish foot area in under an hour, it takes 3 passes in 2nd or 3rd gear with 8in of snow, and an impeller kit.


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

tabora said:


> Here's their EFI page:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Always great stuff Tabora, but what am I missing when chart shows next to zero HP and torque at 3600 rpm? The sharp decline (carb) at 3380 ish surprises me too.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Darby said:


> Always great stuff Tabora, but what am I missing when chart shows next to zero HP and torque at 3600 rpm? The sharp decline (carb) at 3380 ish surprises me too.


I'd guess torque drops off at high RPMs (for that engine) because it can't get air and/or fuel into the cylinder quickly enough; the piston is moving so quickly that the cylinder gets starved of oxygen+fuel. That, at least, is a primary reason that any engine's power drops off as the RPMs increase.

Edit: the reason the torque drops off sooner with a carb than it does with EFI is likely because you can get fuel into a cylinder more quickly when it's pressurized (EFI) than you can when you only have gravity helping you (carb).


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## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

EFI on small engines is new and is bound to have some problems and of course it's the EPA regs driving this to reduce emissions . Stihl just came out not long ago with their first EFI chainsaw but prior to that Stihl and Husqvarna both had computer operated systems to regulate the carbs on saws to reduce emissions and have had quite a few problems . I'm glad I saw the glory days from the 80's to the mid 90's , chainsaws like all OPE was simple and without frustrated owners and repair shops trying to fix things no one understands ! 
I should add I saw this happen in automobiles too thru my tenure as a mechanic......was not fun.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Darby said:


> what am I missing when chart shows next to zero HP and torque at 3600 rpm? The sharp decline (carb) at 3380 ish surprises me too.


As @phendric said, the carbed unit likely can't maintain a stoichiometric air/fuel ratio as it nears the max RPM of 3600. The EFI can always keep things balanced until the ECU says whoa at 3600.


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

tabora said:


> As @phendric said, the carbed unit likely can't maintain a stoichiometric air/fuel ratio as it nears the max RPM of 3600. The EFI can always keep things balanced until the ECU says whoa at 3600.


Yes, I understand that point, I just see that black line that shows a 420cc carbed motor making _Zero torque and hp at 3600 rpm_. Does it not show that intersection plainly or is it me?  Its just an idle comment, but that cannot be or we'd all shovel.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm just guessing, but perhaps the drop in the graph is related to an RPM fuel cutoff in the EFI system.


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> I'm just guessing, but perhaps the drop in the graph is related to an RPM fuel cutoff in the EFI system.


IDK but I find it confusing when your look at the HP dropping to near zero around 3600 RPM. Which is where your run to do the work. It is the actual numbers that are driving the confusion for me. If that was a percent change or a Delta it would be more understandable. But the Y axis is labled Out put in Horse power. What am I missing?


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Toro-8-2-4 said:


> What am I missing?


Suggest you contact Ariens and then let everyone here know what they tell you...


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> I'm just guessing, but perhaps the drop in the graph is related to an RPM fuel cutoff in the EFI system.










Shows zero hp and torque at 3600 rpm. Would think it would like more like this B+S vanguard making maximum power at 3600 rpm.Injected or otherwise Just sayin', and said enough.


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

tabora said:


> Suggest you contact Ariens and then let everyone here know what they tell you...


I just sent them a question about their graph. Let's see if they reply with a substantive answer.


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## Toolboxhero (Dec 24, 2010)

phendric said:


> I've been using both. I forget which (or both) I used for the conversations.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, I still think it's great. Especially for high altitudes or if you want your snowblower to start on the first pull everytime. EFI handles old fuel a lot better than carbs and it responds to loads faster so it feels like it has more power than a carb.


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## phendric (Oct 5, 2021)

Toro-8-2-4 said:


> I just sent them a question about their graph. Let's see if they reply with a substantive answer.


Did you ever hear back from Ariens, @Toro-8-2-4?



CarlB said:


> I can rebuild a carb in minutes.


I cannot. And in every video I've watched of someone disassembling, cleaning, and reassembling a carb, they take longer than minutes. I don't doubt you can do it, but I I certainly can't; it seems few people can.



Toolboxhero said:


> Yes, I still think it's great. Especially for high altitudes or if you want your snowblower to start on the first pull everytime. EFI handles old fuel a lot better than carbs and it responds to loads faster so it feels like it has more power than a carb.


Thanks!



phendric said:


> They have several Platinum 24" SHOs and at least one Deluxe 28" SHO. That, I think, is what I'm deciding between.


Just to update and close the thread, I picked up a Platinum 24 a week or two ago. Model 921053, manufactured in 2020, the EFI version. With dealers not sure when new machines were going to be delivered, I decided to buy one that I knew I could get. Power-to-size ratio (_Plat 24_) beat non-EFI (_Deluxe 28 SHO_) for me. And new beat old for me, partially because of my (lack of) wrenching skills, and partially because with kids at home I want the safety features of new machines.

Thanks everyone for the help! Once we get some snow, I'll post a picture or two.


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

phendric said:


> Did you ever hear back from Ariens, @Toro-8-2-4?


Nothing. Silence.


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