# new member here from iowa



## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

im new to the page and looking for some information on my bobcat walkbehind snowblower.
The tag on my snowblower say I.D. T4-20-1014
Wisconsin Marine INc. Lake Mills Wis., USA
4 hp briggs & stratton model 100212 type 0261-01 code 7706290.

the snowblower doesnt seem to like the heavy or deep snow like i think it should. its always getting bogged down to the point i have to stop and wait for it to catch up. 
I had tried to find a replacement belt for the auger thinking it was too old and slipping, but i am not willing to spend $50 on a single belt as that is more then i paid for the machine.

Any information on how to stop this issue would be great.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*ALOHA from the paradise city.:smiley-rpg027::smiley-rpg027::smiley-rpg027::smiley-rpg027::smiley-rpg027:*


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

:welcome: to the forum stealraine


:moved: to the Bob-Cat section

How wide is the auger ??

.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

I'm not sure the auger size atm but id say its a 20" just from the id number


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## bad69cat (Nov 30, 2015)

Hard telling without seeing it run - but it sounds like the governor is not adjusted or operating the way it should. 





Mark where it's at before you adjust......


congrats on the old Bob Cat - they are cool old machines!


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## bwdbrn1 (Nov 24, 2010)

:white^_^arial^_^0^_


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

bad69cat said:


> Hard telling without seeing it run - but it sounds like the governor is not adjusted or operating the way it should. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B12rX9pWtTk
> 
> 
> Mark where it's at before you adjust......
> ...


thanks ill try that. it just seems the blades aren't spinning fast enough when I look at them. I was wondering what would happen if I tightened or loosened the nut on the Impeller drive?


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## Bob Cat (Jul 15, 2014)

Welcome to the forum. I hope we can help. In my limited knowledge of BobcaTs , I wasn't aware they put a 4 hp engine on their machines.I was going to look up the torque clutch spring tension for you but I only have info on 5,7 and 8 hp models . Maybe others can chime in on the use of 4 hp engines. Could you post some pics of the engine output. By your engine code there is no 6:1 reduction on the output. That itself is no problem as the Crary models did not either when they went with Tecumseh engines.I am interested to see the drive train configuration coming off the engine.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Welcome to the Forum and Congratulations on the Bob-caT!

There were 4 H.P. models built into the late 60's. The 1st stage auger should turn somewhat slowly, while the second stage impeller should spin pretty quickly.
In proper working order, the 4hp versions, like the later 5 hp ones, will chew into heavy snow, but slower than a later machine with the bigger engines.

As said, the governor could be out of adjustment.

Does dis-engaging the drive wheels help at all?

Did you put oil into all of the lubrication points? All of the machine's bearings have lubrication points with little spring loaded caps on the top... they look like the rain flap on the top of a tractor or rig's diesel engine smoke stack. You need to wipe off any grime on them, then oil them with an oil can (think Dorothy and Tin Man). Keep adding W30 oil slowly until you start to see oil weeping out of the bearing centers... DO NOT ADD GREASE!!! It will cause the bearings to lock up when they are cold and will put lots of stress on everything, eventually leading to extra wear and stress cracks.
With the spark plug out, sowly rotate all of the moving parts by hand and see if the bearings turn easily, are stiff, or are sloppy. They should turn freely.

How does the engine run?

If the engine isnt building enough power, it will definately bog out in heavy snow. There could be a number of engine issues that could cause it to act this way. That engine's valves were designed for use with Leaded Gasoline, not today's gas. You could have a valve wear issue a causing power loss under load. Could also be a fuel issue. Being that old, the carb may need to be rebuilt. 

Next up would be replacing the belts... dont assume that the belts you find listed online are correct for the machine. There are a number of different belts used over the years and the sizes were not the same... You will need to take off your originals and use those as examples. They are a little tricky to slip on/off past the belt guide fingers, but it can be done if you take your time. Carefully pry gently up on the guide finger, while turning the pulley and pressing the belt past the guide finger, Either in or off., make absolutely sure the spark plug is out of the engine block... you dont want to kick start the engine by turning the pulley over... that would be VERY BAD.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Here are some photos for you. I'll post more after I'm off work today.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Brother Al said:


> Welcome to the Forum and Congratulations on the Bob-caT!
> 
> There were 4 H.P. models built into the late 60's. The 1st stage auger should turn somewhat slowly, while the second stage impeller should spin pretty quickly.
> In proper working order, the 4hp versions, like the later 5 hp ones, will chew into heavy snow, but slower than a later machine with the bigger engines.
> ...




I have tried the govener yet but I do keep it oiled regularly. 
The engine runs fine with no real issues until the snow bogs it down. 
I am in the process of looking for new belts but so far can not find the right profile belt in my town. I could order from online but the matching numbered belts are frankly to spendy in my opinion. I found the belts for it from that steve waites website. My belts, or at least the auger drive, still say bobcat 65091 on them.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

I havent tried the govener yet but I do keep it oiled regularly. 
The engine runs fine with no real issues until the snow bogs it down. 
I am in the process of looking for new belts but so far can not find the right profile belt in my town. I could order from online but the matching numbered belts are frankly to spendy in my opinion. I found the belts for it from that steve waites website. My belts, or at least the auger drive, still say bobcat 65091 on them.[/QUOTE]
Forgot the pic sorry


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Looks like its in pretty good shape! It looks like a late 60's machine, because of the Briggs' "Easy Spin' Decals. Essentially, it is the same as the 5hp machines of similar vintage. Could be just the lighting, but the auger chain drive seems to need a good cleaning and regreasing...When Ive servived mine, I hosed it down with compressed carb cleaner, to wash out all the old crap and sand that builds up in there. I let the chain air dry for about 5 minutes, a repeat until its clean... amazing how much crap gets into the chain. Ive been using Mobil 1 "green" full synthetic bearing grease... works great.


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## bad69cat (Nov 30, 2015)

Yeah - it's in great shape! I'd drop the carb out for a thorough cleaning. Put a fresh kit in it wouldn't hurt. Use a carb wire cleaning tool to get into the tiny passages with afer a good soaking.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Just read your post. Steve knows these machines VERY WELL. His "65091A" belts are a specialized size/design order that he set up with Gates because many belts simply dont fit right. The "A37" belt is pretty generic you just need to use the length measurement. I cant remember what length I used offhand but I rounded it down to accomedate for age/stretching. I also found a special order belt from a guy in the Carolinas that matched the original 65091... the 65091 out there in stores will fit, but its not the same side-angle taper. Ive read many people stating, including Steve, that it gets chewed up until it either fits the sheave, or burns up and slips because its glazed... My 7hp had the wrong belt on it when I got it... the whole belt drive area was full of rubber dust, but it worked... I replaced it recently, and havent had enough snow to test it thoroughly, but it engages very nicely.


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## Bob Cat (Jul 15, 2014)

That engine is a 1977. Brother Al ,do you know if they were still using the 4 hp engines then?


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

They may have. I dont have my Bob-caT engine spec sheet handy. Memory says they killed that in the late 60's, but I could be wrong. I havent looked at my info book for awhile, so my memory might be off. Its one of a number of things I intend to post, but I need to scan it all.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Also, in the pic of his belt, it does have its gear reduction drive.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

I will try to look it up tonight and post it.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Also, looking at that belt the "7D 1" on the belt may be the designation of the belt side-angle taper.


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## Bob Cat (Jul 15, 2014)

According to this http://www.briggsandstratton.com/us...tions/Engine/Numerical Designation System.pdf it's not a reduction engine ,but in the pic my eyes tell me otherwise.
Maybe it's just underpowered for the job. I've tried 5 hp BobcaTs that never bogged down but going to 4 hp is a 20 per cent drop and maybe that is the issue. We need someone with another 4 hp BobcaT to chime in.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Thanks everyone for the information. i'm going along trying all the suggestions you have given me but family and work is keeping me busy at the moment. 
I will get better photos uploaded next time I get a chance to take some.


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Some photos


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## Bob Cat (Jul 15, 2014)

You might want to check the key way on the sheave coming out of the engine and the one on the smaller driven sheave. It looks like the hub on the big sheave could be closer to the engine (depending on the alignment). Keys sometimes shear .That impellar should spin like Jack the Bear.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

"Bob Cat", Ive found a lot of B&S info to be "off", they didnt account for a number of their product sales to various vendors... Bob-caT seems to be amongst those lost/forgotten ids. I had a pain of a time to find clear info on my Bob-caTs' engines. Neither engine ID was "recognized" in their modern and archived info rolls. I had to find period-correct Briggs n Stratton manuals to flesh out the correct Sno-Guard engine info.


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## mikebby20 (Jan 31, 2016)

new member from Bucks County, PA. hello everyone!!


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

I pulled out my info and found the last reference to the 4hp T4-20 being 1977 models... serial numbers 1001-1504. This would make your unit number 14 off the line in 1977. Prior to this, it appears they stopped making the 4 hp Bob-caT at the end of 1966...
For whatever reason, they brought it back for 1977.
Input Belt - "A-35" Bob-caT Part Number: 65082
Impeller Belt "11MR" Bob-caT Part Number: 65091


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Added to my post above.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

The 65091 Belt Bob-caT belt is not the same one found in stores with that part number.... "Steve" offered 65091A as a direct replacement... I have found that Gates 11M1360 Belt is a good replacement... this is the belt I utilized on both of my Bob-caTs... it seems to fit well and engages nicely
The belt measures roughly out to be 7/16" X 53.54" x 60°


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Thanks Brother Al for the info and personal time you took to look this up for me. I'll do some searching at my local stores and see what i can find. 
Unfortunatly i have run into another issue, the auger chain keeps kicking itself off, possibly a bent impeller gear, worn teeth, or chain. 
But at least I had it up and running when we got the 12+ inches of snow tuesday. :wavetowel2:


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Stealraine, take and post a picture of your chain sprockets, with and without the chain. The chain may have stretched over time... Hard to believe that these machines put that much load to do it though. 
Looking at these two issue, it sounds like something might be binding up, causing the engine to slow and the chain to get tossed... that said, the 4hp machine is really not designed to tackle serious snow/ice conditions. I primarily use my 5hp for light storms and my 7hp for the heavy/thick stuff...


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## stealraine (Jan 24, 2016)

Brother Al, since posting that last issue i have fixed it. Just today actually :wavetowel2:.

Seems that when i powerwashed my machine i either cleaned all the crud off the gears which let the chain jump off and damage some of the teethor the master link finally decided to break and cause it to jump off. I simply took the chains off and unmounted the impeller drive (i think thats what its called) four carriage bolts and filed the burrs off. Upon reassembly i made sure the chain was tight enough when remounting the 4 carriage bolts. Took it out after reassembly and it ran great. I'm thinking that if I was to make the auger blades sprocket smaller they would spin faster, unfortunately its welded to the shaft, so that wont be happening. 

Thanks for all the info and help tho Brother Al.

I will take some more photos and post them when it warms up. My garage is not heated currently and working with cold steel in negative temps is not a good time.
This is my only snowblower so I don't have an option of using a bigger sized one for heavier storms, up until this year its worked great tho. It does chew threw the ice chunks and wet snow fine, just takes a little longer then I like. 

Thanks for all the help everyone, ill be posting around trying to help others out when I can.


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## thestonecarver (Jan 22, 2013)

You will find the info you need on my page. If the belt is slipping it could be stretched or it needs adjustment.


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## Brother Al (Nov 12, 2015)

Very Glad to help... funny enough, my master link just broke...LOL... 
Its an "35M" chain and link if anyone is curious.


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