# Repowering an older model 21"



## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

I just bought this and plan on putting a predator on it... I'm thinking about pulley and belt size. Any thoughts? Has anyone done it before? This is a pretty cool little machine. It has a transmission and an extra large impeller.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

When you say transmission, hope you don't mean those plastic geared, non fixable ones.


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

There appear to manuals on line for a troy-bilt 42000 that seems to be same machine. That unit has a Peerless mdl 700 3- spd transmission with serviceable parts.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Darby said:


> There appear to manuals on line for a troy-bilt 42000 that seems to be same machine.


Yup, the GardenWay is 1990s pre-MTD Troy-Bilt version, just like my chipper. They are built very well! Per Brent Chalmers:

_The reason it is often difficult to find parts for Troy-Bilt and Bolens equipment manufactured prior to 2000 is that following the bankruptcy of Garden Way Inc. of Troy, N.Y - owner of the Troy-Bilt and Bolens brands - several of the lines were broken up, purchased by different companies and in some cases completely abandoned. It is a complicated string of events. _​​_In 1988, Bolens was purchased by GardenWay; then in 1993, GardenWay purchased Troy-Bilt. The company manufactured very durable, sturdy equipment but eventually filed for bankruptcy, was broken up and the parts were sold off._​​_MTD Products Inc (Modern Tool and Die Company) acquired Garden Way in 2001. According to their company history page, "The MTD family of brands includes Cub Cadet, Cub Cadet Commercial, Cub Cadet Yanmar, Troy-Bilt, White Outdoor, Yard-Man, Yard Machines, Bolens, Arnold, GardenWay, MTD Pro and MTD Gold."_​​_The MTD purchase included the Troy-Bilt and Bolens brands but did not include the debris lines (chipping, shredding, vacuuming and/or debris related equipment). These assets were purchased by Murray Inc. in January of 2002._​​_Finally, Briggs and Stratton Power Products purchased Murray which subsequently included the Garden Way Inc. debris equipment. So, if you own a Troy-Bilt chipper from the mid 1990's, what few replacement parts you can find will be through Briggs and Stratton and will generally have MA following the original part number. For example, 1902808 becomes 1902808MA. _​​​


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

Oneacer said:


> When you say transmission, hope you don't mean those plastic geared, non fixable ones.


Noo its definitely steel cased metal geared transmission. It has 3 speeds, neutral, and reverse. And yes, its a peerless transmission.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

Well, my dreams are destroyed. I have a paperweight lol. It's a dual shaft setup 😿😿😿😿


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## Darby (Dec 18, 2020)

I hope you find a good used replacement engine for it.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

its not hard to find a used engine if you know what to look for. i still see mtd machines with them all the time. you look for the older mtds that use 3 nuts per side to hold the bucket to the tractor. 

funny enough i think i got a transmission similar to that in a lawn tractor but it has 5 forward gears and 1 reverse.


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## sledman8002002 (Jan 20, 2021)

crazzywolfie said:


> to find a used engine if you know what to look for


I agree, Its not uncommon to see the dual shafts for sale. The overall chassis looks to be in great shape for its age, I wouldnt give up on it just yet. How about an auger/bucket pic?


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Yeah, just pick up a good used double shaft ... I see them frequently here in CT.

I had a new Ariens machine someone took the engine off, double shaft, but it had a friction disc drive, and I mirror imaged the drive system, and put in a smaller drive pulley, works great I used a 7HP single shaft I already had on my shelf.


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## carguy20 (Feb 8, 2021)

Keep the machine and keep an eye out for a dual shaft engine, even a 5hp one should work on there. They are not as common, but not too hard to find. If the machine works well other than the engine, it would be worth fixing up.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

it wouldn't be worth putting a 5hp on it. if your going to find a engine for it minus well jut wait to get a 8-10hp engine. plus with where the studs are mounted it looks like it came from the factory with a 8-10hp engine.


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## sledman8002002 (Jan 20, 2021)

crazzywolfie said:


> it looks like it came from the factory with a 8-10hp engine.


I was thinking along those lines too.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

With respect, I honestly doubt they put an 8 or 10HP engine on a 21 inch blower from the factory.

I see he posted the info, let me look ...... came with 5HP

I would say a 7HP dual shaft would be just fine ... I just saw one on Marketplace for like 50.00 .......


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

i was just going off where the stud sit in the picture. the look like they are a decent distance back from the but there is usually less about 1" between the 5hp and 8hp mounting holes that some machines


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

I may have found a 5hp dual shaft engine on half an 80s craftsman blower that's actually local to me. He says it runs good. 

Here's some pics. It's very clean. I'm building it for my friend who lives in NYC. They don't need a big blower, but they do need to move EOD slush and clear the sidewalk and the single stage blower they have isn't cutting it. If I do get it together I'm going to tell him he can have it, but it has to come back to me if he ever wants rid of it lol


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## Ziggy65 (Jan 18, 2020)

Do you know the history of this TB?
It appears to have seen very little use, condition is like new. What happened to the original engine?


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

Ziggy65 said:


> Do you know the history of this TB?
> It appears to have seen very little use, condition is like new. What happened to the original engine?


I have no idea. it looks pretty much unused. Any stuffs in the paint appear to be from storage not use. I bought it from a guy who "got it from a friend" without the motor and I think he realized it was a dual shaft and unloaded it onto me. BUT, I looked in my pile and found a craftsman II snowblower with a dual shaft! I'm back in business! I hope the pulleys fit the belts that would be sweet.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

This is the donor.. Almost seems like a waste but this blower kinda stinks.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

I would keep that 523 Craftsman intact .... those are a nice little machine, and that one looks to be in great shape ..... I just sold one .... I would put the Snow Hog's you have on the Troy-Built shell on it and get rid of the lawn tires.

Keep looking for a 7HP dual shaft for the Troy-Built.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

Oneacer said:


> I would keep that 523 Craftsman intact .... those are a nice little machine, and that one looks to be in great shape ..... I just sold one .... I would put the Snow Hog's you have on the Troy-Built shell on it and get rid of the lawn tires.
> 
> Keep looking for a 7HP dual shaft for the Troy-Built.


I haven't seen any 7hp dual shafts... but I can get an 8hp possibly. Though, I would have to put new motor mount holes, and also I'm not sure if the pull start will fit around the shifter lever.


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## carguy20 (Feb 8, 2021)

Keep the craftsman one intact for now. That should be an easy flip if you wanted to sell it. Or, give that one to your friend and keep the Troy bilt for yourself. Not a bad idea considering the condition of the blower. Chances are the machine you give them will take a bit of a beating.

I looked up the model (42000) on the Troy Bilt, and it showed that it came with a 5hp. It may not be a powerful machine, but it will be less work to get it put together and give to your friend. A 5hp 21" machine will work ok for the end of driveway mess if you take your time. I just gave a Murray 5hp 22" to a neighbor and told them that if it bogs down doing the end of driveway, just try to move a little at a time. You don't need to take a full bucket width every pass.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

carguy20 said:


> Keep the craftsman one intact for now. That should be an easy flip if you wanted to sell it. Or, give that one to your friend and keep the Troy bilt for yourself. Not a bad idea considering the condition of the blower. Chances are the machine you give them will take a bit of a beating.
> 
> I looked up the model (42000) on the Troy Bilt, and it showed that it came with a 5hp. It may not be a powerful machine, but it will be less work to get it put together and give to your friend. A 5hp 21" machine will work ok for the end of driveway mess if you take your time. I just gave a Murray 5hp 22" to a neighbor and told them that if it bogs down doing the end of driveway, just try to move a little at a time. You don't need to take a full bucket width every pass.


I was leaning that direction, but I have no love for the craftsmans of that era, especially the dual shaft units. What I'm thinking is rob the engine off the craftsman, and then down the road if I do come across an 8hp dual shaft, I can put it on the craftsman and make it a little fun.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

if that craftsman is anything like the 1 i use to have a 8hp swap on it should be easy and all the holes should be there. i personally prefer that style craftsman over the slightly newer version with the rectangle impeller output.


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## carguy20 (Feb 8, 2021)

ou2mame said:


> I was leaning that direction, but I have no love for the craftsmans of that era, especially the dual shaft units. What I'm thinking is rob the engine off the craftsman, and then down the road if I do come across an 8hp dual shaft, I can put it on the craftsman and make it a little fun.


It may be awhile for you to find a good 8hp or larger dual shaft engine. Is the Craftsman in as good of shape as the Troy Bilt? 

I look forward to pictures when you are finished.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

carguy20 said:


> It may be awhile for you to find a good 8hp or larger dual shaft engine. Is the Craftsman in as good of shape as the Troy Bilt?
> 
> I look forward to pictures when you are finished.


The craftsman is in good shape... No issues except it needs a new auger belt since the one I got for it was a little too big and slipping under load. I'm sure it's an OK machine, I just think the troy bilt is more interesting lol. I found a couple machines that may be really cheap and have dual shaft engines, so we'll see. I haven't done anything yet. I'm going to exhaust my options before stripping the craftsman, but I would like to get this troy bilt running before it snows and the snow's acomin'!


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

I got this leaf vacuum a while ago for 30 bucks and I've been slowly working on it. Finally got it running today. It runs like a dream! I was switching through the gears and realized it has the same transmission as the snowblower I'm working on! This thing is pretty cool. I have a large toro leaf vacuum, and I might have to sell that and keep this one. It has 2 vacuum attachments and a 4" hose attachment too.


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## sledman8002002 (Jan 20, 2021)

ou2mame said:


> I got this leaf vacuum a while ago for 30 bucks


Heck of a deal, basically free!


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## Plan - B (May 3, 2021)

Going to ask, what is a dual shaft. From what I can fugure out by the pic. The crank shaft is one shaft, then there must be a gear box comming of the crank, to run the other shaft. How close did I come. Thank for explaning.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Plan - B said:


> Going to ask, what is a dual shaft.


Crankshaft runs augers and camshaft runs drive, counter rotating.


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## carguy20 (Feb 8, 2021)

ou2mame- I have that exact same chipper / shredder! My dad had brought one brand new for my grandfather back in the early 90's. I still have a copy of the manual and receipts, etc. (Pricewise, you made out like a bandit!) 

After he moved in with us, it came here and still gets used from time to time. That machine will cut up some pretty heavy branches. It runs like a dream.

Now you know, after posting the picture of them together, you can't get rid of the troy bilt snowblower. It's like breaking up a set.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

carguy20 said:


> ou2mame- I have that exact same chipper / shredder! My dad had brought one brand new for my grandfather back in the early 90's. I still have a copy of the manual and receipts, etc. (Pricewise, you made out like a bandit!)
> 
> After he moved in with us, it came here and still gets used from time to time. That machine will cut up some pretty heavy branches. It runs like a dream.
> 
> Now you know, after posting the picture of them together, you can't get rid of the troy bilt snowblower. It's like breaking up a set.


I really like the transmission in the troy bilt leaf vacuum. Reverse is cool! My toro only does forward and with a loaded bag up hill is not fun.

I just picked up another 42000! This one has a motor too haha.. I guess I'm just going to shelve the other one and wait for a cheap motor to pop up. This one has drift breakers too!


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Careful, you'll wind up with a fleet, and no room .... Ask me, I know ...


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

Oneacer said:


> Careful, you'll wind up with a fleet, and no room .... Ask me, I know ...


LOL yeah I've seen your fleets  I'm pretty good at selling them. But now I'm torn about the leaf vacuum! So many important decisions hahaha


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## AriensProMike (Dec 2, 2014)

Where are you located? I have a 8hp two shaft from an ariens that may work. Also have another motor from a yard king (MTD). It's a newer 6 hp ohv tecumseh. Have not checked to see if it's a two shaft but the engine is pretty much spotless.


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## ou2mame (Dec 23, 2019)

AriensProMike said:


> Where are you located? I have a 8hp two shaft from an ariens that may work. Also have another motor from a yard king (MTD). It's a newer 6 hp ohv tecumseh. Have not checked to see if it's a two shaft but the engine is pretty much spotless.


I'm in long Island


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## wingerr (Jan 10, 2022)

I've recently got one of these old Garden Way 42000 snow blowers, and in Long Island also- 
I'm just tried it out for the first time with this past snow, and it's got a pretty pitiful throw to it; the electric Toro single stage I have actually throws further. I probably could manually throw a shovelful further. 
The engine is running at 3600 rpm, and the impeller measured 1200 rpm no load, and auger was 120 rpm. As far as I can tell, I don't think it's slowing under load due to belt slip, as I was able to bog the engine when I loaded it up with wet driveway end slush. 
I was figuring the impeller just wasn't designed all that efficiently back then; it all looks perfect as far as the three impeller blade's condition.
Are these old machines just not expected to be able to throw very far compared to new designs?
I probably could check the belt tension to make sure it's not slipping, if this isn't typical performance. Or try doing an impeller modification, but with the thickness of the impeller blades they used back then, it's not going to be easy drilling the holes to mount rubber extensions.


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