# Is there spec for Toro auger shaft bearing play/slop?



## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

I am repairing and repainting a 1980 Toro 421. I got it cheap, hadn't run in years. Had to do the usual fuel system purge and clean. Has surface rust that I will repaint. Everything else runs ok. I have the auger housing and assembly off. I have not worked on snowblower bearings and gear cases much, so I don't have a reference for normal play. There is around 1/8" of back and forth play (side to side) of the auger shaft in the gear case. The whole shaft moves side to side, there isn't much if any lateral play. See pics for visual of the issue, you can see the oil seal movement. I don't want to spend money to rebuild and replace all of the auger system bearings if not needed. (I will replace the main impeller spherical bearing). Also, if I do need to open up the gear case, are there any tips to know?

Thanks for looking.

correction: this unit is my spare 421, not the one I got running. I have no idea how well the motor or the auger works. I decided to take it apart, since the metal was in better shape than the other 421.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*Yeah that is the right amount of end play. those seals are are gone with the Schwinn. if you plan on keeping it for any length of time. I would go in and replace all seals, gasket, and clean the whole BLOODY thing up. that auger bearing is more than likely a sealed roller bearing. not that egg crate job thing. if it is dripping from the gasket that keeps the end plates together. if you don't replace it, you are fighting a losing battle.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

thanks PS93. Do you mean the impeller bearing? It is the spherical bushing, it may have been replaced, but the parts drawing calls it a bearing, but shows the bushing. (the unit is a 1980 model 38010). Do you know the approximate cost of the seals and gaskets for this. This is my 2nd backup unit, so not sure if I will keep or sell. Also, what holds the 2 auger shaft oil seals in place?

Thanks again.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

paulm12 said:


> thanks PS93. Do you mean the impeller bearing? It is the spherical bushing, it may have been replaced, but the parts drawing calls it a bearing, but shows the bushing. (the unit is a 1980 model 38010). Do you know the approximate cost of the seals and gaskets for this. This is my 2nd backup unit, so not sure if I will keep or sell.  Also, what holds the 2 auger shaft oil seals in place?
> 
> Thanks again.


*Yeah that is what I meant instead of the auger bearing. I REALLY NEED TO GET SOME SLEEP. then they used that egg crate bushing as I call it. the whole gasket shebang should not be more than 25-30 bucks. I just got a spare set 4 "SR" at Johnson hardware the other day. before they slammed those doors shut for good now. the seals seat in the case itself. you will have to pry the old 1's oot with a pick or something. then take a socket that is the same as the outer DIA of the seal itself and tap them back in there. TRUST ME it is not hard to do. any other questions you have PM me. or just call me oot here.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

Well, thinking whether to take it apart lasted about 2 minutes. Its apart, and, woo hoo, a quick parts count shows everything is there (sometimes little parts fly away during disassembly). Now off to cleaning. I cant find a service manual for this model (38010, year 1980), only a parts diagram. Are the directions the same from the 1995 724 (I have that manual). 

Thanks again PS93.


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## Grunt (Nov 11, 2013)

Is this the same manual you have?

http://shryp.ashendust.com/Snowblowers/2stagdrv.pdf


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

yeah Grunt, that is what i have. Thanks for posting.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

1 more question. I assume the bushing in the case on the right is sitting a bit low (in the pic). The 2 stage directions say to bring the bushing to flush with the inside of the case. Do I need to remove and re-seat these bushings, or just press that one bushing into place.?


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

paulm12 said:


> 1 more question. I assume the bushing in the case on the right is sitting a bit low (in the pic). The 2 stage directions say to bring the bushing to flush with the inside of the case. Do I need to remove and re-seat these bushings, or just press that one bushing into place.?


* Just take a socket and a hammer and tap it back in. if it goes oot the other side then you just might need a new 1.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

Got it set in place. Gaskets and seals are on order at my dealer. Thanks again.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

1 more question, what is proper orienatation of the gear? There is no stamping on the gear as the 2-stage service manual shows. Thanks.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

paulm12 said:


> 1 more question, what is proper orienatation of the gear? There is no stamping on the gear as the 2-stage service manual shows. Thanks.


 *Take you right hand and thumb and line up on it. facing the front of the machine. and that is the way she goes.*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

sorry, I wasn't clear on the question. See new pic. Should the wear mark on the driven gear be back towards the impeller, or forward towards the front of the bucket?


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

paulm12 said:


> sorry, I wasn't clear on the question. See new pic. Should the wear mark on the driven gear be back towards the impeller, or forward towards the front of the bucket?


*Toward the front of the bucket.*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

and 1 more question: there are 2 thrust washers surrounding the thrust bearing on the impeller shaft, next to the worm gear. The 2 washers are different, and I do not recall the order they came out. I am not replacing, as they are in good shape. I did notice the following:

washer 1: p/n 257-3 costs around $10
washer 2: p/n 252-80 costs around $6. Goes closest to worm gear. 

one of the washers is slightly thicker than the other. I am going to assume that the thicker washer is p/n 257-3. Does anyone know for sure?

Thanks


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

paulm12 said:


> and 1 more question: there are 2 thrust washers surrounding the thrust bearing on the impeller shaft, next to the worm gear. The 2 washers are different, and I do not recall the order they came out. I am not replacing, as they are in good shape. I did notice the following:
> 
> washer 1: p/n 257-3 costs around $10
> washer 2: p/n 252-80 costs around $6. Goes closest to worm gear.
> ...


*Just stick them back on. it really does not matter which side they came off of.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

ok, now just 1 more question. I have all the parts, hope to assemble in next day or 2. Which way do the 2 auger shaft oil seals get installed? Does the ID seal go to the outside? On the part diagram below does the top of the part as shown go inside. 

diagram of the part: https://www.mowpart.com/7-0045-toro...ISQLytPIMh8_kus7lTWft70ETMxOLUR0aAsn5EALw_wcB

Thanks.


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

paulm12 said:


> ok, now just 1 more question. I have all the parts, hope to assemble in next day or 2. Which way do the 2 auger shaft oil seals get installed? Does the ID seal go to the outside? On the part diagram below does the top of the part as shown go inside.
> 
> diagram of the part: https://www.mowpart.com/7-0045-toro...ISQLytPIMh8_kus7lTWft70ETMxOLUR0aAsn5EALw_wcB
> 
> Thanks.



From what I'm seeing, on the auger gearcases I've rebuilt the edge that's point up goes into the opening first. Drive it in even and should be good.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*Looking at that pic flip it the other way when putting back in the gear case.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

like this ...


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

* Yep just like that.........*


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

is all back together. Got about 4 oz of lube in there, manual says 1/3 tube which would be 4-2/3 oz, so I will syringe a bit more through filler hole. Spins easy, and the side to side slop is lessened. My first auger gearcase rebuild, now I know a few of the tricks. Thanks all for the help.

Next is prepping the augers and housing for paint.


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*MAZEL TOV on that 1.:wavetowel2:*


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