# Why Honda snow blowers are rated poorly?



## evilmate99

I am just curious. Recently while researching on snow blowers, I found that Honda snow blowers are rated poorly on Amazon.Com . Don't they meet customer satisfaction or there's some other reasons behind it?


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## detdrbuzzard

price is the reason Honda snowblowers get a low rating


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## YSHSfan

+1 Unfortunately is is the price of the units that get them rated low, not their performance.


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## nwcove

^ yep its bang for the buck short term that drives that rating deal .


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## orangputeh

how can the price have anything to do with it???????

that should not matter at all.

all I know is that we live in big snow country in the High Sierras and the Honda is the most popular blower up here.......Hands Down.

I wouldn't own anything else.


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## tinter

Dollar for dollar, you have a 30 plus year machine, you definitely get what you pay for.


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## detdrbuzzard

orangputeh said:


> how can the price have anything to do with it???????
> 
> that should not matter at all.
> 
> all I know is that we live in big snow country in the High Sierras and the Honda is the most popular blower up here.......Hands Down.
> 
> I wouldn't own anything else.


 and you are willing to pay the price for a Honda but just look at what you or your neighbors were using before you or they got a Honda others only have a craftsman pocketbook so sears sells a ton of them


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## orangputeh

detdrbuzzard said:


> and you are willing to pay the price for a Honda but just look at what you or your neighbors were using before you or they got a Honda others only have a craftsman pocketbook so sears sells a ton of them


If Craftsman was BETTER than Honda, then I would own a Craftsman. You can buy used Craftsman up here for next to nothing.

20 year old Honda's still go for $1000 or more. Check out Reno craigslist.

I bought a used Honda HS624 with very low hours for $500 years ago and it is the best blower I have ever owned . I could get more than I paid for it tomorrow.

You can not say the same thing about a Craftsman. They have been going downhill for years. Sears will be out of business within 5 years, probably. Craftsman used to have quality tools and equipment but no more.

That is my opinion. I am not trying to change yours. I am just stating the facts as I see them.


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## YSHSfan

orangputeh said:


> how can the price have anything to do with it???????


You wouldn't think so but the reality is YES (it is not fair I agree with it). They rate it low because for "them" it is too expensive. I think I've seen the movesnow.com (or something like that) and Consumers Report rate it low because the price is a lot higher than its closest competitors (Ariens and Toro). And I have seen Cub Cadete Snowblowers rated as the best (go figure).


orangputeh said:


> that should not matter at all.
> .


I wish Yamaha would still sell snowblowers in US, it would make a big difference as Honda would not be the only top performance snowblower rated low for being "not too affordable"
JMMHO :blush:


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## hfjeff

It is definitely a territorial product. Around here Ariens is king. In my entire life of living in WI, I have never even known anyone who owns a Honda or seen one being used. It would be like spotting Bigfoot.


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## orangputeh

hfjeff said:


> It is definitely a territorial product. Around here Ariens is king. In my entire life of living in WI, I have never even known anyone who owns a Honda or seen one being used. It would be like spotting Bigfoot.


i'll have to give ariens another try.


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## E350

The Honda HS1332TA tracked model is the snowblower of choice at every ski resort I have ever skied at in the Sierras including the one I work at.

Ski resorts get alot of snow...

I own a Honda HS1132TA. I am very very very happy with it.


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## Freezn

I think it's important to remember that Honda Snow Blowers are commercial rated machines so to compare them against residential rated machines like Craftsman or MTD is like comparing apples and oranges. Tough to beat a Honda Snow Blower when it comes to performance, reliability, and longevity... but those attributes don't come cheap.


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## buffettck

Freezn said:


> I think it's important to remember that Honda Snow Blowers are commercial rated machines so to compare them against residential rated machines like Craftsman or MTD is like comparing apples and oranges. Tough to beat a Honda Snow Blower when it comes to performance, reliability, and longevity... but those attributes don't come cheap.




Hi, first time poster on this forum. 

Does that "commercial rating" also apply to the smaller Honda single stage units? Just got an HS720AA delivered yesterday. It starts and runs fine, but I haven't had a chance to use it yet, though. Come on snow! LOL


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## The Q

Price is most likely the main reason that Honda 2 stage snowblowers are not even mentioned in the Consumer Reports buying guide. The top 3 are:
Cub Cadet 3X30HD 31AH57SZ710
Troy Bilt Vortex 289031AH55Q
Craftsman 88874
Where I live, with the amount of snow we get,I just can`t justify the initial cost to own one, but I would love to find a good deal close by someday.


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## Marlow

Consumer Reports is absolutely garbage anyway!

Their "top rated" snowblowers won't last 5 years where I live. 

Stick to Honda or Yamaha, and if you don't want to pay that much then Toro and Ariens is a good alternative. And get the most powerful machine you can reasonably afford. You'll never complain of having too much power, but you will complain with too little.


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## jrom

My HS828TAS has cost me (initial cost + tax, rounded up) $56 per year and if I was on a mega-monthly installment plan: $4.60 per month...so far. 

Put about $350 into it 4-5 years ago. Belts, cables, extra shear bolts, crawler pipe and an OEM carb (on the shelf still).

Its seen 30-50 hours per year...great little chugger.


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## sr71

Also …if you purely compare "spec" sheet features the result almost never benefits the top shelf product. For instance how do you quantify the unwritten guarantee the Honda engines never let you down – even in the coldest temps. Or.. that the machine will still look (and perform) like new 10+ years down the road etc. Or….that the hydrostatic transmission / track drive is near bulletproof. Even if places like consumers reports take them all for a test spin…. they all mostly can be expected to start… blow the snow and generally work well out of the box….


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## packetloss

I think you also have to consider that many folks writing these reviews don't understand that you need to do basic maintenance and a $3000 snow blower will fail just like a $600 snow blower if you leave crap gas in it and don't bother to change the oil, etc. etc.


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## jrom

Decided to post a shot of my 828 taken in 2015. I've always taken good mechanical care, but not always cosmetically. I did paint the inside of the auger housing and chute with Rustoleum Sunrise red and you can tell it doesn't match. 

This bugger has eaten a fair share of small rocks over the years. At my garage my drive is more sand, but down a ways it's more gravel.

May sound like BS to some people, but it has never clogged in 25 years, not once. I use a little stick of wood hanging off the chute lever to nock out ice that forms between the belt cover and auger (impeller section) housing.


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## Strato

*Love Honda. But...*

I've always been impressed with Honda. Their quality is superb (I have a GX Honda engine on my power washer, and a Honda mower - both outstanding machines).

But, when it comes to snowblowers, I value raw power as much a durability and engineering refinements (which Honda blowers have oodles of).

I've seen some Honda blowers retailing for $2500 with just a 190 cc power plant. If you're willing to spend a bit more (between $2,500 and $3,000), you can step-up to a 270 cc engine. 

For a big engine, say 390 cc, the price tag zooms to $3,600.

Admittedly, these are GX engines, with iron bore, and commercial longevity. The quality is unsurpassed - top-tier.

But, longevity and build-quality are only part of the equation. Where I live, in western MA, snow is abundant, wet, and heavy. The EOD crud can feel like cement. Sometimes, above all else, you just need horsepower.

I'd love to own a Honda. But, for me, there's not enough ponies under the hood.


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## jrom

I bought my 1332 in 2015 for $2,900. Local dealer. Coming from an 8hp, plenty of power. I used the 8hp exclusively for 24 years...30-50 hours a year, heavy wet snow about 80% of the time. Get between 190" to 340" a year.

There's a 2014-2015 used HS1332TAS going for $2,000 on craigslist in Marquette, MI and I say if you could get it for $1,900 or $1,800 it would be a steal, especially amortized over its projected life.

And Strato, you must mean not enough ponies under the hood for the money, or what you could get with another brand for less, right?


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## Apple Guy

hsblowersfan said:


> You wouldn't think so but the reality is YES (it is not fair I agree with it). They rate it low because for "them" it is too expensive. I think I've seen the movesnow.com (or something like that) and Consumers Report rate it low because the price is a lot higher than its closest competitors (Ariens and Toro). And I have seen Cub Cadete Snowblowers rated as the best (go figure).
> I wish Yamaha would still sell snowblowers in US, it would make a big difference as Honda would not be the only top performance snowblower rated low for being "not too affordable"
> JMMHO :blush:


The Yamaha would be #1 and Honda #2. My 20 year old Yamaha 828 out performed my 2011 Honda 928 by to me a large margin, this was even after on the model I bought had a power/torque increase. After 20 years it still had the original belts, with 2 driveways and a blvd. bike path that gave a total of 4 EOD piles of hard packed or iced up EOD piles. Being in Minnesota, I could of drove up and bought a Yamaha . But they are only track now, and with the exchange rate at the time and duty it would of been $4,500 for a 828 Yamaha track. I hate tracks! 

.


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## jrom

Apple Guy said:


> The Yamaha would be #1 and Honda #2. ...I hate tracks!


I would have gone Yamaha in 1991, but I'm pretty sure that's when they pulled from the US market, because I wanted one pretty badly.

Back then I would have had to go to Sault Ste. Marie (3.5 hours), Sarnia (4.5 hrs) or Windsor, Ontario (5 hours) to get a Yammy and with the parts availability question, too much a risk.

On the tracks, they're perfect for me. A few of my neighbors (similar layout and conditions) have tires and all I can say is they're not for me. In fact, don't like 'em at all...perfect inflation, under inflation, over inflation, chains, studs, new, old. Haven't met a set I like, yet.

After 24 years, I can say I'm pretty impressed with my Hondo's (some of my clients call me Hondo). Not bad for No. 2...but those Yamaha's look mighty good.


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## Strato

jrom said:


> I bought my 1332 in 2015 for $2,900. Local dealer. Coming from an 8hp, plenty of power. I used the 8hp exclusively for 24 years...30-50 hours a year, heavy wet snow about 80% of the time. Get between 190" to 340" a year.
> 
> There's a 2014-2015 used HS1332TAS going for $2,000 on craigslist in Marquette, MI and I say if you could get it for $1,900 or $1,800 it would be a steal, especially amortized over its projected life.
> 
> And Strato, you must mean not enough ponies under the hood for the money, or what you could get with another brand for less, right?


Yes, JROM, that's what I meant. You can definitely get lots of ponies from Honda, they're just high-priced thoroughbreds. 

I would have considered a used Honda, if one had been available in my area. There wasn't (perhaps a testimony to how their owners cherish them).

Therefore, I bought an Ariens EFI Platinum 24 this year, with 369 cc, for $1800. For $300 less, I could have purchased the non-EFI version.

There's no question I'd rather have a new Honda than a new Ariens, at about the same power. But, for what I paid, I'm not sure there even is a Honda 2-stage option. I believe the cheapest begins at about $2300, with a much smaller engine.

The current HSS1332AT and ATD models (may be different than yours) appear to be advertised at $3200 and $3400 MSRP respectively on Honda's website. Those units come with an engine larger than mine - 389 cc. They look like a beautiful machines. If those are similar to yours, it sounds like you got a good deal.


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## pearlfinish

Honda may be king of blowers, but Ferraris are kings as well, and I wouldn't go out and buy it either. Lol. $4000-$5000 for a snowblower is way too much in my books...I can buy almost 5 of mine for the price of a honda


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## jrom

Strato said:


> Yes, JROM, that's what I meant...I would have considered a used Honda, if one had been available in my area...Therefore, I bought an Ariens EFI Platinum 24 this year, with 369 cc, for $1800.


I thought you meant that. Good deals, especially on clean, low hour machines are really hard to come by around here.

I'd love to have an A-EFI-P 24 - Awesome.


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## jrom

pearlfinish said:


> Honda may be king of blowers, but Ferraris are kings as well, and I wouldn't go out and buy it either. Lol. $4000-$5000 for a snowblower is way too much in my books...I can buy almost 5 of mine for the price of a honda


It does come down to where you are and what your resources are.

Here, you don't clear snow, you don't go__anywhere__for several hours.

I put less money into my home and vehicles, but more into snow clearing equippage...no Ferrari vs Unimog stuff here. Fun to talk about it though! :tempted:

* Man, would I like to have a Unimog decked out for winter snow removal and firewood transport.


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## Marlow

Apple Guy said:


> The Yamaha would be #1 and Honda #2.
> .


The Yamaha is just way too fat these days. A 1332 Yamaha weighs 538 pounds! While my 1332 Honda weighs 275 pounds. I realize these things basically drive themselves, but there is still some "manhandling" involved with operating a snowblower. Is there really any need for Yamaha to be near doubling the weight of their direct competition? It's not like they throw the snow farther or move more snow per hour. I know they are top notch machines but it's just way too much machine for me.


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## YSHSfan

Marlow said:


> The Yamaha is just way too fat these days. A 1332 Yamaha weighs 538 pounds! While my 1332 Honda weighs 275 pounds. I realize these things basically drive themselves, but there is still some "manhandling" involved with operating a snowblower. Is there really any need for Yamaha to be near doubling the weight of their direct competition? It's not like they throw the snow farther or move more snow per hour. I know they are top notch machines but it's just way too much machine for me.


Heavier snowblower for me translates to Heavier Duty build. I'd be concerned with its weight if it was a wheel unit, not at all for a tracked unit. Also there is a huge advantage for a heavier tracked snowblower in deep snow or at the EOD to keep it from riding up. (JMHO)


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## charley95

E350 said:


> The Honda HS1332TA tracked model is the snowblower of choice at every ski resort I have ever skied at in the Sierras including the one I work at.
> 
> Ski resorts get alot of snow...
> 
> I own a Honda HS1132TA. I am very very very happy with it.


I think the HS series has proven to be less problematic than the HSS. I bought the HS 724 3 years ago and love it! I was very tempted to trade it on a HSS but, glad I didn't. I really like the extra features on the new ones but, not worth the headache to me since it's used a lot less than my Honda mower. I don't think I've used more than a gallon of fuel each season, therefore I pay the extra $$ and just run Tru-Fuel through it.


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## Marlow

hsblowersfan said:


> Heavier snowblower for me translates to Heavier Duty build. I'd be concerned with its weight if it was a wheel unit, not at all for a tracked unit. Also there is a huge advantage for a heavier tracked snowblower in deep snow or at the EOD to keep it from riding up. (JMHO)


I'm sorry but 275 pounds already IS a heavy duty build for a snowblower. 538 pounds is just completely ridiculous for a hand operated machine. I don't see the advantage in deep snow, both machines will chew it up and spit it out at basically the same rate. As for riding up, if you're going to fast for conditions both machines will ride up, I've seen it. There are a bunch of yamaha's in my neighbourhood. To prevent riding up, go an ideal speed and tilt the bucket down.


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## jrom

Marlow said:


> ...275 pounds already IS a heavy duty build for a snowblower...


You may not have a shop manual, but it lists dry and operating weight. Hate to tell you but our 1332s weigh in at 320 lbs /145 kg operating weight. :images:


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## Marlow

jrom said:


> You may not have a shop manual, but it lists dry and operating weight. Hate to tell you but our 1332s weigh in at 320 lbs /145 kg operating weight.


My machine has a dry weight of 275.6 pounds. 

http://powerequipment.honda.ca/snowblowers/dual-stage/HSS1332act/specs


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## matto

detdrbuzzard said:


> price is the reason Honda snowblowers get a low rating


I don't understand. The op asked about reviews on Amazon. People buy an expensive snowblow on Amazon then rate it poorly because it was expensive?


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## Strato

matto said:


> I don't understand. The op asked about reviews on Amazon. People buy an expensive snowblow on Amazon then rate it poorly because it was expensive?


Just checked Amazon.

They have 3 Honda blowers listed, but none of them have any reviews.

"snowblowersatjacks.com", is the company selling these Hondas through Amazon.

On their website, they list about 10 models (some probably from last year), of which only 5 have reviews (all good). The others are listed as "zero reviews". Most of of the reviewed models only have one to three reviews.

It's therefore hard to gauge overall market satisfaction due to the limited feedback.

None of this means much, IMO. Honda blowers are not a mass-consumer product. Honda isn't trying to compete with Craftsman. Honda's quality and price puts them in another category - "prosumer".

As a result, they don't have much visibility in the market.


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## drumsonly2002

I had an old 28" 10hp Track Craftsman that outlasted my expensive Honda 928. I am going to rebuild the Honda as it is an awesome machine to use. It's downfall is the thin metal getting hosed from the city plow incessantly backfilling my driveway with gravel filled tight packed snow (makes me so mad I want to spit every time I think about it.. girrrr ). The gravel ruined the inner impeller housing. The Craftsman held up very well in that department, but the engine seized one day, so I gave it away. After using the Honda, cannot go back to another make. So now I pay a plow until the unit is rebuilt. To say I like the Honda is an understatement. A Honda is made for snow not small rocks, but I would guess the Yamaha is a lot better unit for gravel vs Honda. Nonetheless, I am going to replace the inner housing with thicker material and have a fantastic Honda, better than before. Love those Yamaha's but fixing the awesome Honda and it will be a thing of beauty. Do I regret spending the money on getting a Honda? No way, worth every cent, even though the impeller housing should have been made thicker. The new impeller housing will be stainless with the addition of an impeller kit.


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## jrom

Marlow said:


> My machine has a dry weight of 275.6 pounds. Honda Canada


I see you don't have the 12v starter. Makes sense.

For mine I think it odd that some fluids would add 32 lbs. 298 dry/320 operational.

I'm from the opinion that heavier usually equates to better materials unless we're talking really expensive alloys.

Next time I go to the city with my blower I'll have it weighed at the metal recycling center. Just for fun. Strange, but my 828 never had a trip to the dealer (or any repair shop) or any trip to the city after I picked it up over 25 years ago.


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## Marlow

jrom said:


> I'm from the opinion that heavier usually equates to better materials unless we're talking really expensive alloys.


"Better materials" is useful in this instance how? Will it move more snow? Throw the snow farther? Get the job done quicker? Outlast the Honda? Probably not imo. Are Honda's materials no good? The structure of a snowblower is something that rarely goes unless grossly abused. 

What that massive weight will do is hinder maneuverability which obviously plays a huge beneficial role in operating a snowblower.


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## jrom

Marlow said:


> "Better materials" is useful in this instance how? Will it move more snow? Throw the snow farther? Get the job done quicker? Outlast the Honda? Probably not imo. Are Honda's materials no good? The structure of a snowblower is something that rarely goes unless grossly abused.
> 
> What that massive weight will do is hinder maneuverability which obviously plays a huge beneficial role in operating a snowblower.


Better materials as in usually lasts longer before metal fatigue and breakdown, longer times between replacement. That means better in my book. Metal gears and bushings instead of plastic, bearings instead of bushings, cast iron instead of...aluminum, more bolts instead of fewer, on and on.

Use of high-end alloys such as titanium changes some of that theory, but there is a limit. 

Of course there are design issues that play a huge role, but my neighbors lighter snow blowers don't do nearly as well as my heavier one at the EOD buildup.

The US made HSS steering control and variable auger height kind throws the _hard to maneuver_ theory almost out the window. I say almost as my wife likes to use our 828 more than the 1332, but it could be due to the simplicity of the 828.


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## Marlow

jrom said:


> Better materials as in usually lasts longer before metal fatigue and breakdown, longer times between replacement. That means better in my book. Metal gears and bushings instead of plastic, bearings instead of bushings, cast iron instead of...aluminum, more bolts instead of fewer, on and on.
> 
> Use of high-end alloys such as titanium changes some of that theory, but there is a limit.
> 
> Of course there are design issues that play a huge role, but my neighbors lighter snow blowers don't do nearly as well as my heavier one at the EOD buildup.
> 
> The US made HSS steering control and variable auger height kind throws the _hard to maneuver_ theory almost out the window. I say almost as my wife likes to use our 828 more than the 1332, but it could be due to the simplicity of the 828.


Too much of anything is a bad thing. And a 540 pound 32" walk behind snowblower constitutes too much in my books. And I live in an area where Honda's and Yamaha's have been around for decades, and I can tell you they both stand the test of time, Yamaha doesn't have a leg up on Honda there..


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## Marlow

jrom said:


> The US made HSS steering control and variable auger height kind throws the _hard to maneuver_ theory almost out the window. I say almost as my wife likes to use our 828 more than the 1332, but it could be due to the simplicity of the 828.


Not sure what you're trying to refute here? I am saying the Yamaha is inherently going to be more difficult to maneuver due to the massive weight difference. That's not to say it will be really hard to maneuver, obviously Yamaha designed it knowing what it was going to be used for. But it will slow down maneuverability for sure. 

Like with my honda 1332, when I want to do a 180 degree turn at the end of the driveway, I just tilt the bucket up, squeeze both steering triggers and turn it myself without activating the drive lever. I do this in the name of quickness and it's quite easy and effortless to do. When you spend this much on a snowblower you want to get the job done as quick and easy and possible, I can only imagine the tank that is the yamaha would slow me down.


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## jrom

Marlow, I must not be following you very well. I think you're comparing the weight of your 1332 to the weight of the Yamaha YT1332, correct? If so, that makes more sense on what you are saying.

From most reports of Yamaha users, it seems that they throw snow about the same distance as a Honda (and a number of others, especially some of the big Ariens, and some big Toros), but at a "stronger" pace for lack of a better term, less bogging of the engine. If you haven't heard/felt your blower bog a bit, you probably haven't tested it under the harshest of heavy, wet, deep snowfall, or plowing into deep set up banks or layers and drifts...but maybe you have. 

I don't have time to search right now, but aren't Yamaha's more $ than Honda in Canada?


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## Tomatillo

Not to change the subject, but who buys a snow blower on Amazon? I buy many things there, but really I saved a heck of a lot by going to my dealer, plus it was assembled by trained mechanics who have done it before; who have dealer support if they have questions on the new unit, who will adjust it expertly, who will appreciate my business on a local level, and on and on.

Save money; keep the little guy in business; get service where you bought it.

I saved $500 over the price at Amazon:





 





evilmate99 said:


> I am just curious. Recently while researching on snow blowers, I found that Honda snow blowers are rated poorly on Amazon.Com . Don't they meet customer satisfaction or there's some other reasons behind it?


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## jrom

Marlow, posted before I saw your post.

Not trying to refute. Just read your post with a little more comprehension. :redface:


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## jrom

Tomatillo said:


> ...I saved $500 over the price at Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=w_bl_hs...rch-alias=aps&field-keywords=Honda_HSS1332AAT


Where the heck do they get $3,995.99 for an HSS1332AAT?

I know it's been over a year now, but I paid $3,100.00 for my HSS1332ATD from my local dealer. He discounted it to make up for the tax we pay over mail order, so after tax, it was about the same as snowblowersdirect.

I too like to keep local businesses going as best as I can afford to.


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## jrom

I see my local dealer has 2017 HSS1332ATDs listed at $3,399.00.


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## Marlow

jrom said:


> I don't have time to search right now, but aren't Yamaha's more $ than Honda in Canada?


Some models yes, some no. 

The 1332 Yamaha is $5600. The 1332 Honda WITH electric start(just to compare apples to apples as I opted for the one without electric start) has been marked down to $4800 for several months now. 

The 1028 yamaha and 928 honda with electric start are both the same price $4300. The 624 yamaha is $2700 and the 724 honda with electric start is $3700! Wow quite the price difference there on fairly comparable machines. 

And yes I have ran my 1332 to the point where it will bog, but that will happen with any machine. Both the 1332 Honda and Yamaha are rated to move the same amount of snow per hour. The engine in the 1332 yamaha has a displacement of 358cc, while the honda is 389cc.


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## Tomatillo

Yep. Nice.




jrom said:


> I see my local dealer has 2017 HSS1332ATDs listed at $3,399.00.


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## Tomatillo

jrom said:


> Where the heck do they get $3,995.99 for an HSS1332AAT?


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## Marlow

Never mind that amazon pricing. The MSRP set by Honda is $3399 in the US and seems like most people get them for less than that.


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## jrom

Marlow, I can't remember what your situation is exactly - clogging, right? – and I can't look up your posts as I'm reading and typing between client input on a job right now.

Have you heard back from Honda Canada? Did you talk to your dealer? If so what do they say?


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## Marlow

I never heard back from Honda Canada, not good but I honestly didn't expect to. My main point in emailing them was so that they'd have a complaint on record, and hopefully if others do the same Honda will become aware and make some changes. If they'd just add a resin liner in the impeller housing and chute(like yamaha has) and maybe reshape the bottom collar on the chute and also make it a resin no stick material that may well solve the majority of the issue. I don't think that would be that difficult for them to implement. Here's hoping!

I mentioned it to the dealer as well, they didn't really have much to say about it.


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## Tomatillo

Yep. Hey, the price includes "Free" shipping! :icon_smile_wink:


Also free "you assemble and prep."




Marlow said:


> Never mind that amazon pricing. The MSRP set by Honda is $3399 in the US and seems like most people get them for less than that.


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## Coby7

Reason why you can't go by reviews is that mostly only people with problems bother with typing a review. Happy people have better things to do like smile and laugh.


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## matto

Coby7 said:


> Reason why you can't go by reviews is that mostly only people with problems bother with typing a review. Happy people have better things to do like smile and laugh.


Sure but that doesn't mean that reviews are useless. Not every item on the planet has bad reviews. 

Comparing reviews across multiple versions of a similar item can be very insightful, assuming you have enough reviews.


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## Marlow

matto said:


> Sure but that doesn't mean that reviews are useless. Not every item on the planet has bad reviews.


This is very true. But the OP cites amazon.com as the source of the bad ratings. I am just not seeing it when I go there. And previous to the brand new redesigned '16 model, Honda's were widely known as the best. I have to believe they will strive to get there again with this new model, and that the issues that have arisen didn't in their own r&d - which is common. When you release something new like this on a mass scale, it goes well beyond the scope of what their own r&d possibly can. 

Based on Honda's reputable past, I think once the complaints start rolling in, they will make the appropriate revisions. I will give them a few years on that, if they don't well then it will be time for me to start rethinking the regard I have for them. 

No manufacturer is perfect, it is how they address and solve their imperfections is what makes them reputable - and that takes time. So we'll see!


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## str8shuutr45

Coby7 said:


> Reason why you can't go by reviews is that mostly only people with problems bother with typing a review. Happy people have better things to do like smile and laugh.


Couldn't agree with you more. There are some people in this forum that can't stop beating the horse even though it died months ago. Every time I log on here the same people are crying about their snowflake issues. I came here to learn what others are doing with their Honda blowers and find that every thread gets taken over by the same people crying about their same snowflake problems.
Get over it.


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## jrom

str8shuutr45 said:


> ...I came here to learn what others are doing with their Honda blowers and find that every thread gets taken over by the same people crying about their same snowflake problems.
> Get over it.


Gotta admit, you have a way with words...couldn't agree more.


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## Marlow

str8shuutr45 said:


> Couldn't agree with you more. There are some people in this forum that can't stop beating the horse even though it died months ago. Every time I log on here the same people are crying about their snowflake issues. I came here to learn what others are doing with their Honda blowers and find that every thread gets taken over by the same people crying about their same snowflake problems.
> Get over it.


Either add the users whose postings you dislike to your ignore list, or you heed your own advice and "get over it" - that goes both ways you know.


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## jrom

For Sale 1969 Snow-Flake - $650
condition: like new
make / manufacturer: Snow-Flake-Snow Pony
model name / number: Snow-Flake

For sale is a very nice 1969 Snow-Flake mini snowmobile. Has very good track and wheels. Chassis has been painted as well as the skis. Hood is original paint. Has a 6.5 hp *Honda* 4-stroke. Starts easy and runs excellent. Has a new comet clutch and new belt. New windshield. New seat. Nice for kids.


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## Tomatillo

Cool! I've been looking for the opportunity to use this: :icon-deadhorse:


Thanks! 


(BTW, what's a snowflake issue?)




str8shuutr45 said:


> Couldn't agree with you more. There are some people in this forum that can't stop beating the horse even though it died months ago. Every time I log on here the same people are crying about their snowflake issues. I came here to learn what others are doing with their Honda blowers and find that every thread gets taken over by the same people crying about their same snowflake problems.
> Get over it.


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## jrom

Tomatillo said:


> ...BTW, what's a snowflake issue?


Well, it gets a little...political. A number of things the left does that the right finds they are being...too sensitive about...and whiney...to put it nicely. :icon_whistling:

I've got 'em both in my family. I try to be neutral. Not always easy.


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## buffettck

Tomatillo said:


> (BTW, what's a snowflake issue?)


 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Snowflake


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## jrom

buffettck said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Snowflake


Wikipedia is not telling the full story here...:smile: In my experience, almost 99+% of snowflakes come from left leaning or very left leaning households.

A large number of my friends with grown kids fall into this category. Not saying one way or the other :icon_whistling: ...but...


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## buffettck

Oh, there's plenty of conservative/right leaning helicopter parents who produce special snowflake children, believe me. If anything, it's coming from the more affluent households, be they left or right leaning.


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## packetloss

Strato said:


> I've always been impressed with Honda. Their quality is superb (I have a GX Honda engine on my power washer, and a Honda mower - both outstanding machines).
> 
> But, when it comes to snowblowers, I value raw power as much a durability and engineering refinements (which Honda blowers have oodles of).
> 
> I've seen some Honda blowers retailing for $2500 with just a 190 cc power plant. If you're willing to spend a bit more (between $2,500 and $3,000), you can step-up to a 270 cc engine.
> 
> For a big engine, say 390 cc, the price tag zooms to $3,600.
> 
> Admittedly, these are GX engines, with iron bore, and commercial longevity. The quality is unsurpassed - top-tier.
> 
> But, longevity and build-quality are only part of the equation. Where I live, in western MA, snow is abundant, wet, and heavy. The EOD crud can feel like cement. Sometimes, above all else, you just need horsepower.
> 
> I'd love to own a Honda. But, for me, there's not enough ponies under the hood.



Just out of curiosity I took a look at the Honda 24 inch models and was only able to find a 196cc model. There simply is no bigger engine unless you move up to a 28 (which warrants a bigger engine than a 24 regardless). I looked at the torque specs and it's 9.1 lb-ft (12.4 Nm) @ 2,500 rpm. That is an underpowered engine for a 24. You can get by with it, but not if you have to deal with heavy wet EOD snow and still want some decent throwing distance. 


I'm sure the GX200 is worthy of it's reputation and will last 30+ years, but if I were spending that much on a snow blower I'd expect it to have a 300cc engine on it (which would be super powered), and at the very least a 250 which would appropriately powered.


The 32 looks properly powered with a 389cc engine, but if I don't want a 32 (regardless of price), I'm SOL. So basically with Honda you either get the 32 or you have an underpowered engine.


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## str8shuutr45

You know the deal with a snowflake - the are beautiful and no two are alike. For this reason they are all special. Individually they are very weak because it takes almost no heat to melt them. 
What the snowflakes don't understand is that together they can be be a snowball, an avalanche, or a blizzard. They just want to be snowflakes.
It's no different than the whiners on this forum. They have snowflake issues and want snowflake responses by the manufactures.


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## jrom

buffettck said:


> Oh, there's plenty of conservative/right leaning helicopter parents who produce special snowflake children, believe me. If anything, it's coming from the more affluent households, be they left or right leaning.


Believe you're right. I just haven't personally seen it. I shouldn't generalize the way I did.


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## jrom

str8shuutr45 said:


> You know the deal with a snowflake - the are beautiful and no two are alike. For this reason they are all special. Individually they are very weak because it takes almost no heat to melt them.
> What the snowflakes don't understand is that together they can be be a snowball, an avalanche, or a blizzard. They just want to be snowflakes.
> It's no different than the whiners on this forum. They have snowflake issues and want snowflake responses by the manufactures.


I could have added to the Snowflake craigslist post: "Can be outfitted with safe space homing device for $500 more - two week wait. $1,000 for 2 day turn around."

Seriously, I was looking up Honda snowblower listings when that one popped up.


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## jrom

packetloss said:


> ...The 32 looks properly powered with a 389cc engine, but if I don't want a 32 (regardless of price), I'm SOL. So basically with Honda you either get the 32 or you have an underpowered engine.


I was not interested in a 32" machine. I only got the 1332 for the power. 24 years with an 8hp/28" was pushing it for me.


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## Tomatillo

Thanks everyone. I'm with you fellers ... _Can't stand those whining whelps of a *****!_ Whoops. A little too strong. This is a family show.


"Snowflakes" eh? Ole Tom's been fallin' behind on his slurs.


To quote my disturbed pal, Leroy: _* "I've been way behind the times heretofore!"*_

*https://youtu.be/MgpZ5-yDzhk?t=46*

Thanks for enlightening!




jrom said:


> Well, it gets a little...political. A number of things the left does that the right finds they are being...too sensitive about...and whiney...to put it nicely. :icon_whistling:
> 
> I've got 'em both in my family. I try to be neutral. Not always easy.


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## mrinouk

Honda Snowblower are well made but they're overpriced. Honda could drop their prices by 30%-40% and they would still make money. They build same snowblower since 20 years with small improvements, their R&D is paid long ago. Making snowblower isn't complicated.

I could by 2 MTD-alike more powerful snowblowers for a price of one Honda and still get best bang for the buck in the long term.

I worked with a Honda HS928 but right now, I own a Craftsman trackdrive 8/28, year 1992, and I'm happy with it. 

It removes snow, it does it job for 40% the price of a Honda.

I have a small issue with drive pulley (it spins by itself) but this is a 1992 snowblower (over 24 years old!) and it's easy to fix it.

To say that Honda is able to remove snow that other brands couldn't, I think this is an exaggeration.

If you have many Honda's in your area, often, the main reason is the proximity of the dealer for parts/services. If you have a choice between two stores: home depot that is 50 miles or dealer that is 2 miles from your home, which one you would usually go buy a new snowblower if parts/services is your main concern ?


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## Loco-diablo

mrinouk said:


> Honda Snowblower are well made but they're overpriced. Honda could drop their prices by 30%-40% and they would still make money. They build same snowblower since 20 years with small improvements, their R&D is paid long ago. Making snowblower isn't complicated.
> 
> I could by 2 MTD-alike more powerful snowblowers for a price of one Honda and still get best bang for the buck in the long term.
> 
> I worked with a Honda HS928 but right now, I own a Craftsman trackdrive 8/28, year 1992, and I'm happy with it.
> 
> It removes snow, it does it job for 40% the price of a Honda.
> 
> I have a small issue with drive pulley (it spins by itself) but this is a 1992 snowblower (over 24 years old!) and it's easy to fix it.
> 
> To say that Honda is able to remove snow that other brands couldn't, I think this is an exaggeration.
> 
> If you have many Honda's in your area, often, the main reason is the proximity of the dealer for parts/services. If you have a choice between two stores: home depot that is 50 miles or dealer that is 2 miles from your home, which one you would usually go buy a new snowblower if parts/services is your main concern ?


I agree with the 'overpriced' part. They price their lawnmowers competitively with other premium mowers, I own one and love it, but I think the blowers are way overpriced. Don't get me wrong, they make a great machine, but you could buy 2 Ariens for the price of 1 Honda. I could run a new Ariens for 20+ years, then buy another new one and it would still be less than the price of a Honda. They don't remove snow any better than any other premium blower.


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## Marlow

Loco-diablo said:


> I agree with the 'overpriced' part. They price their lawnmowers competitively with other premium mowers, I own one and love it, but I think the blowers are way overpriced. Don't get me wrong, they make a great machine, but you could buy 2 Ariens for the price of 1 Honda. I could run a new Ariens for 20+ years, then buy another new one and it would still be less than the price of a Honda. They don't remove snow any better than any other premium blower.


Comparing apples to apples, a top of the line 32" Ariens is $3400
https://www.snowblowersdirect.com/Ariens-926069-Snow-Thrower/p77409.html

Honda's top 32" version is $3200
https://www.snowblowersdirect.com/Honda-HSS1332ATD-Snow-Thrower/p50345.html

Just because Honda is not in the market of low-mid tier snowblowers doesn't mean they're overpriced. Honda only makes top tier snowblowers, a top tier ariens is actually more expensive! And the re-sale value on that Honda will be far greater than the ariens as well! So at the end of the day, Honda is much cheaper than Ariens when leveling the playing field.

Yamaha(another company who is only into top tier snowblowers) is generally more expensive than Honda too, if you live in a market that offers both. It's complete ignorance for people to think like you.

So I have to ask, what company makes a top tier snowblower that is both cheaper and better than honda? Because I can guarantee you, it's not Yamaha or Ariens. But I'd love to know the who.. as that'll be my next machine. And don't even try to say toro, been there done that and my Honda is in a whole nother league!


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## Loco-diablo

Marlow said:


> Comparing apples to apples, a top of the line 32" Ariens is $3400
> https://www.snowblowersdirect.com/Ariens-926069-Snow-Thrower/p77409.html
> 
> Honda's top 32" version is $3200
> https://www.snowblowersdirect.com/Honda-HSS1332ATD-Snow-Thrower/p50345.html
> 
> Just because Honda is not in the market of low-mid tier snowblowers doesn't mean they're overpriced. Honda only makes top tier snowblowers, a top tier ariens is actually more expensive! And the re-sale value on that Honda will be far greater than the ariens as well! So at the end of the day, Honda is much cheaper than Ariens when leveling the playing field.
> 
> Yamaha(another company who is only into top tier snowblowers) is generally more expensive than Honda too, if you live in a market that offers both. It's complete ignorance for people to think like you.
> 
> So I have to ask, what company makes a top tier snowblower that is both cheaper and better than honda? Because I can guarantee you, it's not Yamaha or Ariens. But I'd love to know the who.. as that'll be my next machine. And don't even try to say toro, been there done that and my Honda is in a whole nother league!



As I said they’re great machines, but overpriced imo. So are the ‘top tier’ Ariens. These have one simple purpose. Blow snow from point a to point b. These are not rocket ships. They’re simple 4 stroke machines.
I stand by my argument that two $1500 Ariens blowers will outlast 1 $3400 Ariens or 1 $3200 Honda.

I don’t know why your post had to be edited, but take it easy pal. Don’t get so angry. It’s not good for you!



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## Marlow

Loco-diablo said:


> I don’t know why your post had to be edited, but take it easy pal. Don’t get so angry. It’s not good for you!


I edit a lot of my posts because I am somewhat of a perfectionist. It could probably be something as simple as a misplaced comma or period. And even after an edit, I am far from perfect. I know this. 

What's lost in text is tone. I am not angry at all! If you've read what I said to be in an angry tone, that's not how it was intended. 

All I am saying is when comparing prices from ariens to honda, you have to compare apples to apples. Then you'll plainly see the honda is priced ACCORDingly. Accord.. lol

If for your needs you prefer a mid tier machine, that's totally fine! Just like for my needs I prefer a civic over an audi s4. But that doesn't mean an audi s4 is overpriced. That's all I am saying. Different strokes for different folks.

In Canada, I can pay $5k for a new 13hp honda and sell it for $2500 in 10 years. Meanwhile, an equivalent ariens which would cost brand new $4k would have essentially zero value at 10 years. So... what's TRULY cheaper?


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## sscotsman

Marlow said:


> In Canada, I can pay $5k for a new 13hp honda and sell it for $2500 in 10 years. Meanwhile, an equivalent ariens which would cost brand new $4k would have essentially zero value at 10 years. So... what's TRULY cheaper?


Wow! Let me know where I can find those 10 year old Ariens Pro models for free! 
I'll take ten..

But seriously, thats a major flaw in your math! 
Ariens certainly do not have zero value after 10 years..I would say most are also worth half at 10 years old.
(And the Honda would likely be worth more than half)
45 year old Ariens, in decent working condition, that sold for $400 in 1971 are worth $250 today..

Scot


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## Marlow

sscotsman said:


> Wow! Let me know where I can find those 10 year old Ariens Pro models for free!
> I'll take ten..
> 
> But seriously, thats a major flaw in your math!
> Ariens certainly do not have zero value after 10 years..I would say most are also worth half at 10 years old.
> 
> 
> Scot


I am speaking of where I live. Honda is king here and nobody gives a crap about ariens. You can disagree with the viewpoint of my local folk. But, you'll never change it.


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## drumsonly2002

drumsonly2002 said:


> I had an old 28" 10hp Track Craftsman that outlasted my expensive Honda 928. I am going to rebuild the Honda as it is an awesome machine to use. It's downfall is the thin metal getting hosed from the city plow incessantly backfilling my driveway with gravel filled tight packed snow (makes me so mad I want to spit every time I think about it.. girrrr ). The gravel ruined the inner impeller housing. The Craftsman held up very well in that department, but the engine seized one day, so I gave it away. After using the Honda, cannot go back to another make. So now I pay a plow until the unit is rebuilt. To say I like the Honda is an understatement. A Honda is made for snow not small rocks, but I would guess the Yamaha is a lot better unit for gravel vs Honda. Nonetheless, I am going to replace the inner housing with thicker material and have a fantastic Honda, better than before. Love those Yamaha's but fixing the awesome Honda and it will be a thing of beauty. Do I regret spending the money on getting a Honda? No way, worth every cent, even though the impeller housing should have been made thicker. The new impeller housing will be stainless with the addition of an impeller kit.


I wrote this Jan 5th 2017. Update: Snowblower still broke. Purchased a used older Yamaha 8-28 last week to get by this winter. Going to order a 13hp GX 390 Honda power plant. Thus my Honda will be supersized. This is a passion project. I think Honda is expensive but a feature-rich machine, and a luxury machine. I think bang for the buck Ariens are impressive and better built. But for features and style Honda and Yamaha rules the roost. It is the Harley of Snowblowers. Costly but fun to own. Something about owning a Honda that puts a grin on my face even though it`s broke heh. The grin will be bigger once the 13HP GC 390 is blasting snow across the road without mercy. Gravel and Honda does not mix. For a non-gravel scenario, Honda rules. The new Yamaha`s seem amazing. I am a Honda, Yamaha and big Ariens fan. I say, for a lifetime purchase Honda is worth it. Maybe I am a collector, have Honda, Yamaha, and a 1969 20 inch MTD (going to mod). Always wanted a track Ariens. Why Honda, why Harley. Fun to own I guess.


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## Loco-diablo

Marlow said:


> I am speaking of where I live. Honda is king here and nobody gives a crap about ariens. You can disagree with the viewpoint of my local folk. But, you'll never change it.




You’re the one who said “my new Honda has given more headaches than my toro did in 6 years at 3.5x the cost “?

Well in New England, Ariens is the king. 
I paid $800 for my first ‘non premium’ Ariens in 1992. I sold it 17 years later in 2009 for $400. I sold it not because it was broken or bad, but because I wanted something new. I would NEVER pay $2500 for a 10 year old used snow blower. I don’t care what brand it is. My current 2009 $1200 27” Ariens is a beast. For snow removal and reliability, I’d put it up against any new Honda in the same 7/9hp class.

So in my opinion, a new non premium $1500 Ariens is the best value for the buck.

To each his own. 









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## Marlow

Loco-diablo said:


> You’re the one who said “my new Honda has given more headaches than my toro did in 6 years at 3.5x the cost “?


Yes I did. I have have since taken it back. Any issue I had was user error. Now that I am used to it, it's virtually flawless. 

I agree that if your budget is $1500 for a snowblower, Ariens(or Toro) is the way to go. But, that doesn't make Honda overpriced. That's all I am saying. You may think I am nuts for buying a top of the line snowblower, and somebody else may think your nuts for paying $1500 because they get by with their $800 snowblower. And then the next guy may think he is nuts because he gets by with his $15 shovel..

As with anything in this world, you can ALWAYS get by with something cheaper. Be it a home, a car, electronics,clothing etc. Like, take for example the iphone you post here using, my asus zenfone suits me just perfect for a quarter of the price!! That's not to say your iphone is overpriced, it just doesn't appeal to me.


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## Loco-diablo

Marlow said:


> Yes I did. I have have since taken it back. Any issue I had was user error. Now that I am used to it, it's virtually flawless.
> 
> I agree that if your budget is $1500 for a snowblower, Ariens(or Toro) is the way to go. But, that doesn't make Honda overpriced. That's all I am saying. You may think I am nuts for buying a top of the line snowblower, and somebody else may think your nuts for paying $1500 because they get by with their $800 snowblower. And then the next guy may think he is nuts because he gets by with his $15 shovel..
> 
> As with anything in this world, you can ALWAYS get by with something cheaper. Be it a home, a car, electronics,clothing etc. Like, take for example the iphone you post here using, my asus zenfone suits me just perfect for a quarter of the price!! That's not to say your iphone is overpriced, it just doesn't appeal to me.




Agreed. To each his own. 
We’re fortunate to have free markets here in the US and up in the Great White North where the choices are plentiful.




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