# Not Starting and a Rattle



## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

Good Evening,

23 year old from Wisconsin who has no idea what he's doing.

My father passed away unexpectedly a year ago so I moved back in with my Mother to keep her company. With that I adopted the responsibility of a 2 acre yard and a plethora of small-engine toys that I know nothing about. If it runs on gasoline, oil, and has a carburetor, it's my worst enemy. Things seem to break ****-near every week. But hey, nothing good comes without a struggle, right?

Anyways, I'm joining because my snowblower won't start for the second time this year. I took it in the first time and they did the following...

-Starter Drive
-Skid LH
-Skid RH
-Cables
-Spairs
-Boil Out Carb
-Repair Starter
-Replace skids and choke contact
-Run & Adjust

This cost me $201. Did I get ripped off here? I probably seemed like fresh-blood when I went in to the shop (I am engine illiterate).

Anyways, It ran fine for about a month and now it won't start again. It was COLD AS **** (-15 degrees) this past couple days, and wondering if that has anything to do with it.

I put fuel stabilizer in the machine a month ago and have ran it 4-5 times since having it fixed. The oil level is fine. The key is in the ignition and on. The choke is on. Speed thinger is in a 3/4 position. And neither the pull nor the electric start works.

When I use the electric start (my preferred method) it rattles for a couple seconds, the rattling stops, and the exhaust fan continues to run. I tried multiple different outlets, including an outlet I've started it from many times.

Is the rattle a bad sign?

I'm thinking the carb needs to be cleaned, which is odd since it was cleaned about a month ago AND I have stabilizer in it.

Where would you start in my situation?

The machine is a Husqavarna HL1027STEB.

Help me out!


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

Glad to see you stepped up to help out your Mom and sorry for your loss. Your blower has a 10hp Tecumseh brand engine and there are a LOT of videos out there on cleaning the carb, Might be as simple as cleaning the jet. (Very easy to do) I would just try the first step of this video and clean just the main jet as that is the issue 90% of the time, To clean out the small holes I use a strand of copper wire so I won't damage the jet. Well anyway hope this helps. Just did the exact same to my neighbors that could not get his to start. Had it running in 15 minutes. OH and thinking about it, Check to see the condition of the fuel line at the carb, If it's leaving black marks on your hands it most likely is the thing blocking up the carb as small bits will come off the rubber and block the jets. If it is bad come back here BEFORE you pull out the old fuel line as there is a trick to putting in the new one but you need the old one still in to do it.


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## Grunt (Nov 11, 2013)

Hello and welcome to SBF Jordan. My condolences on your loss and my respect for moving back home to help your mother.

Make sure the fuel valve is on, the choke is set to closed, the throttle is set to fast and push the primer at least two or three times ( fuel will\might drip from the carb and that is normal). Not sure what you mean by the starter rattles and the exhaust fan is running? Have you tried starting it with the pull starter?


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

Exhaust fan? What, exactly are we talking about? The impeller, perhaps? That should not turn at all when starting . . . at least if the controls are set correctly.


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## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

Must be the impeller. Sorry for lack in terminology. Is there a way I can post a video I took at home to explain the rattle?

Thanks a ton for the advice. I will let you all know how it goes tomorrow when I have some time.

Edit: All controls set in the correct positions. I honestly can't find the fuel valve on this machine but it's turned on multiple times since it was fixed and no one else would have touched my blower.

Also, I thought I'm not supposed to prime when using electric start?

I'll take a look at a diagram tomorrow to get terminology down.


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

You are correct in that you typically don't prime with electric start. My Tecumsehs electric start by setting throttle to about 3/4, hitting the button, then closing the choke until it fires, and then immediately backing it off a step immediately, and more as threngine warms up. Nothing is turning at that point other thsn the engine . . . (at least on a Toro or Ariens). You might also check interlocks, depending on how your unit is set up.


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## RIT333 (Feb 6, 2014)

tadawson said:


> You are correct in that you typically don't prime with electric start. .


That is new to me. I prime a cold engine no matter whether I am using my arm, or electricity. The electricity just doesn't hurt my shoulder the next day - LOL. With my procedure, I have never had an issue getting any engine started.

Thoughts ?


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

Priming, or not, has nothing to do with electric start vs. pull start..
Priming, or not, has to do with temperature..the colder it is, the more priming helps.
Actually, I hit the primer button, once, even on my push-mower in the summer! 
but it does help the most when its cold..
but electric start or pull start has zero relevance to priming..
For a snowblower, since they are used in the cold, IMO the primer is good to use, every time starting..

Jordan,
the starting problems you are describing have a few likely causes:

1. The fuel valve is turned off, but based on what you said, that seems unlikely.
2. "bad gas", also seems unlikely since it was used recently..although..when did you *buy* the gas that is currently in the blower?
3. Choke controls not in the right position for starting..that one could be likely, since you arent super-familiar with the machine.

a video would help! best way to post one: youtube.
if you dont have an account, you can create one for free..

one thing that definately isnt a factor:


> I tried multiple different outlets, including an outlet I've started it from many times.


If the starter turns with one outlet, no need to try any other outlet..the outlet isnt the problem. 

When you press the starter button, can you tell if the engine is turning? or is only the starter itself spinning?

Scot


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

Jordan,

Hello and welcome!

There is a lot of good advice above... look into some of the things that have been suggested, and definitely post a video if you can... it'll help us figure out what's going on. If you can in your video, make sure to cover everything you do before attempting to start the machine... control positions and so on.

Also you might edit your profile and enter the city/town as well as the state you live in. It's possible someone here lives nearby and would be willing to help in person!


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*What do you mean by spairs????????????? you posted they repaired the starter on it. so if that is acting up I really don't think they fixed that.*


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

RE priming and electric start .. . . Then why do many (at least older) engine manuals tell you not to with electric? The higher rotational speed plus the choke accomplish exectly the same thing . . . no advantage to flooding it with the primer at all. Heck, a lot of the older blowers we had didn't even have a primer and started fine . . .


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## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

Grunt said:


> Make sure the fuel valve is on, the choke is set to closed, the throttle is set to fast and push the primer at least two or three times ( fuel will\might drip from the carb and that is normal). Not sure what you mean by the starter rattles and the exhaust fan is running? Have you tried starting it with the pull starter?


See the video below. I believe everything is in the correct position. It has started because using this exact same method about a month ago.



Dauntae said:


> Glad to see you stepped up to help out your Mom and sorry for your loss. Your blower has a 10hp Tecumseh brand engine and there are a LOT of videos out there on cleaning the carb, Might be as simple as cleaning the jet. (Very easy to do) I would just try the first step of this video and clean just the main jet as that is the issue 90% of the time, To clean out the small holes I use a strand of copper wire so I won't damage the jet. Well anyway hope this helps. Just did the exact same to my neighbors that could not get his to start. Had it running in 15 minutes. OH and thinking about it, Check to see the condition of the fuel line at the carb, If it's leaving black marks on your hands it most likely is the thing blocking up the carb as small bits will come off the rubber and block the jets. If it is bad come back here BEFORE you pull out the old fuel line as there is a trick to putting in the new one but you need the old one still in to do it.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GizmWDmOX6o


I appreciate the recommendation. I will definitely check back with you when I make the decision to clean the carb! 



tadawson said:


> You are correct in that you typically don't prime with electric start. My Tecumsehs electric start by setting throttle to about 3/4, hitting the button, then closing the choke until it fires, and then immediately backing it off a step immediately, and more as threngine warms up. Nothing is turning at that point other thsn the engine . . . (at least on a Toro or Ariens). You might also check interlocks, depending on how your unit is set up.


Is there any particular order? I usually choke THEN move the throttle to 3/4.



sscotsman said:


> Priming, or not, has nothing to do with electric start vs. pull start..
> Priming, or not, has to do with temperature..the colder it is, the more priming helps.
> Actually, I hit the primer button, once, even on my push-mower in the summer!
> but it does help the most when its cold..
> ...





ELaw said:


> Jordan,
> 
> Hello and welcome!
> 
> ...





POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *What do you mean by spairs????????????? you posted they repaired the starter on it. so if that is acting up I really don't think they fixed that.*


The bill they gave me said they Boiled Out the Carb, Repaired Starter, Replace Skids and Choke Contact, and Run and adjust. The "parts sections said... Starter Drive, Skid LH, Skid RH, Cables, and Spairs. Each had a part number and a price. I can post more details later when I am by the bill.


*Hey guys, I posted a video here below on youtube. Hopefully this helps.*

When I try to prime the engine, it sounds as if no liquid is pushing through, it actually sounds like it's suctioning on the release if you listen closely. I was able to locate the fuel valve and made sure it was in the "on" position. I turned it off to test that it was working and not stuck, hopefully that didn't impact the dry, suctioning, sound when priming. I swear when I hit the primer yesterday it sounded much more "liquidy" if that makes sense.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

Welcome to the forum! I'm sorry for your loss, but it's nice that you're helping out your mom like that, that's great, and I'm sure she appreciates it. 

Your starter motor isn't engaging with the engine, it's not actually making the engine spin. You're just hearing the electric starter motor itself turning. There should be a bigger "whump whump whump" noise if the engine was actually being spun. 

There is a gear on the front of the starter motor while extends, to engage with the teeth on the engine's flywheel, when the electric starter runs. Maybe this gear is stuck, and not extending, and that's why the electric starter isn't doing anything useful. 

Your starting technique seems good, and it doesn't matter whether you set the choke first, then raise the throttle. The primer noise didn't sound bad to me. That "sucking" sound may be good, mine sounded different after the rubber primer hose (behind the metal shroud) kinda crumbled and broke into 2 pieces. 

What does it do if you use the pull cord?


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## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

RedOctobyr said:


> Welcome to the forum! I'm sorry for your loss, but it's nice that you're helping out your mom like that, that's great, and I'm sure she appreciates it.
> 
> Your starter motor isn't engaging with the engine, it's not actually making the engine spin. You're just hearing the electric starter motor itself turning. There should be a bigger "whump whump whump" noise if the engine was actually being spun.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the help and for spelling it out! Pulling the cord, it does nothing at all. I've actually _never_ used the cord to start it. I've always used the electric start. But I tried pulling the cord a few times yesterday with no avail.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

This video briefly shows what it should sound like, using the electric starter: 
https://youtu.be/JE15-jbRJGc?t=29s

"Unfortunately", his engine starts quickly, so you don't get to hear the sound of the electric starter for long. But it's a different, and "bigger" noise than yours is making. 

The repair bill says "repaired starter", which they didn't, if they're referring to the electric starter. Or maybe it would be incorrect no matter *which* starter they're referring to... 

When you say the pull starter "does nothing at all" when you pull the cord, do you mean the cord pulls easily, with no resistance at all (that is, it's not making the engine turn)? Or does the engine turn when you pull the cord, but just not start? 

If the pull starter also doesn't making the engine turn, then no matter which starter they say they repaired, they likely need to fix *something* again. However, if the machine got some snow on it, and then froze up, it's possible that the snow could have melted onto the pull-starter mechanism, and frozen it up so that it can't work properly. Is it stored above freezing? Or is ice in the starter mechanism a possibility? 

I'm going to guess that the rattling noise is the starter motor's teeth maybe just barely engaging with the teeth on the engine's flywheel, but then that noise stops for some reason, and you just hear what seems to me like the electric starter motor spinning freely, not making the engine turn, and not doing anything useful. 

If the pull starter makes the engine turn, but not start, that's one problem. And if the pull starter doesn't even make the engine turn, that's a different cause/problem, so getting a better understanding of that will be useful.


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## nwcove (Mar 2, 2015)

is that smoke or vapor from the exhaust ? sounds like the starter engages , but not at first ? that sucking noise from the primer bulb is not normal from my experience. can you post a vid of an attempt to start from the rope start ?


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## tpenfield (Feb 24, 2015)

I got my $5 on the fact that the starter tries to engage with the flywheel (rattle), but does not, then the starter just spins freely, doing a whole bunch of nothing.

When you do the pull start do you feel the engine turn?


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## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

RedOctobyr said:


> This video briefly shows what it should sound like, using the electric starter:
> https://youtu.be/JE15-jbRJGc?t=29s
> 
> "Unfortunately", his engine starts quickly, so you don't get to hear the sound of the electric starter for long. But it's a different, and "bigger" noise than yours is making.
> ...





nwcove said:


> is that smoke or vapor from the exhaust ? sounds like the starter engages , but not at first ? that sucking noise from the primer bulb is not normal from my experience. can you post a vid of an attempt to start from the rope start ?





tpenfield said:


> I got my $5 on the fact that the starter tries to engage with the flywheel (rattle), but does not, then the starter just spins freely, doing a whole bunch of nothing.
> 
> When you do the pull start do you feel the engine turn?


That's EXACTLY what is sounds like. (Well, what I imagine it would sound like)

*UPDATE!* 
I was able to start it on a solid 3 pulls, but it gave a couple puts and died out right away. The primer still has that "dry" sound. Same exact control settings as yesterday. By the way, the "vapor" was my breath. It's just cold here, still.

Also, I store it in my garage, which is mostly above freezing except for really cold days (which we had a few of those this past week).


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## AL- (Oct 27, 2014)

I'm surprised the repairs list did not include a new spark plug, so maybe that one is good and clean. If it were mine I would check it , as a fouled plug could make hard to start. Spark plugs should not be tightened in to tight, just fairly snug.
If you start it again you could try opening the choke up maybe to half after it runs as its not all that cold in your garage.


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

As others have said, clearly there's something very wrong with the electric starter. If the shop claims they fixed it, you should contact them and have them make good on that issue.

You mentioned it sounding "dry"... have you looked to see if there's a fuel valve under the tank, or elsewhere? Or - I hate to say this because it's going to sound insulting, but have you checked that there's gas in the tank?

If there's enough fuel in the tank (at least 1/2 to make sure) and there's no fuel valve or there's a valve and you're sure it's open, try unscrewing the gas cap a turn and see if it helps. The gas cap is supposed to have venting in it, and if the vent is blocked a vacuum can develop in the tank and prevent fuel from getting to the carburetor.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

Jordan Todd Pogorzelski said:


> *UPDATE!*
> I was able to start it on a solid 3 pulls, but it gave a couple puts and died out right away. The primer still has that "dry" sound. Same exact control settings as yesterday. By the way, the "vapor" was my breath. It's just cold here, still.


When you get those first couple puts, try to get to the choke control right away and move the lever slightly away from full choke while its still putting..that might be enough to get the engine to stabilize. 

Sounds like a gas delivery problem though. If the tank is only about 25% full, sometimes that can cause issues.

On my '71 Ariens a few years ago, it stalled out when I was almost done with the driveway..I looked in the tank: getting low, but not empty, so i thought "gas is fine, its not out"..puttered around with it, couldnt get it to start again! On a whim, I filled up the tank..presto! Fired right up. I figure the added weight of a full tank "pushed" the gas to the carb better than an almost empty tank. Gas gets to the carb from gravity alone. Since then, I always run with the tank more than half full.

Scot


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

If the fuel line is getting old, it can degrade internally and slowly close off, which would make the fuel level scenario possible. Oh, and to your question regarding throttle and choke sequence on start, it depends what you are doing. A closed throttle butterfly can limit effectivenesss of the choke if attempting to pull over on choke pre-start. Myself, I can't think of any reason not to just set the throttle at about 3/4 first, and go from there.


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## stromr (Jul 20, 2016)

*Lol!*



POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *What do you mean by spairs????????????? you posted they repaired the starter on it. so if that is acting up I really don't think they fixed that.*


I would guess the "technician" who wrote "spairs" isn't a spelling bee candidate. Imagine he meant "spares." Maybe not much of a technician either if this is an example of his work fixing the starter!


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*That electric starter is gone with the Schwinn. I want you to do the whole schtick over this time using the rope starter and run the throttle right down the center line. post a longer vid of youse doing that for us.k:k:k:k:k: and find your yourself a pitbull of a lawyer and sue the snot out of that place that claims to have fixed it.*


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## tpenfield (Feb 24, 2015)

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> * . . . and find your yourself a pitbull of a lawyer and sue the snot out of that place that claims to have fixed it.*


I know . . . you can spend several $K getting your $201 back :grin:


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

tpenfield said:


> I know . . . you can spend several $K getting your $201 back :grin:


*Well there is always small claims court. but I think wapner is retired now.*


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## tpenfield (Feb 24, 2015)

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *Well there is always small claims court. but I think wapner is retired now.*


Yes, he would have to go before Judge Judy :smile2:


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## Jordan Todd Pogorzelski (Feb 6, 2018)

Hey Guys,

I gave it a run today and it works on the second pull. It's still cold (around 10 degrees), but maybe it was just the cold causing it to not start?

I ended up calling the shop that "fixed" it and they offered to pick it up and fix it again for free. Should I still let them pick it up and maintenance while I can get it for free? Thoughts? Maybe something actually is still wrong with it and I got lucky? Still a "dry" sound when priming.

I didn't try the electric start. I got stoked when it turned on when I get home from work and went straight to plowing the driveway.


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## AL- (Oct 27, 2014)

Jordan Todd Pogorzelski said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> I gave it a run today and it works on the first pull. It's still cold (around 10 degrees), but maybe it was just the cold causing it to not start?
> 
> I ended up calling the shop that "fixed" it and they offered to pick it up and fix it again for free. Should I still let them pick it up and maintenance while I can get it for free? Thoughts? Maybe something actually is still wrong with it and I got lucky?


 I would at least let them know your starter is not working properly IF IT IS NOT , that it spins freely but does not crank the engine. Maybe keep your option with shop open for awhile, IF THEY AGREE. You could use it some more by hand pull starting and then make your decision if you are skeptical about the shop.
I find my machine is harder to start by hand the colder it is. I use 5w30 synthetic oil which helps. Its good being able to use the electric start in colder weather.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

Agreed. If what they "fixed" was the electric starter, I would absolutely have them pick it & fix for free. Maybe try the electric starter one more time first, to make sure it's still misbehaving. But I see no reason to pay for a repair that didn't fix the problem. 

I'm glad you got it started by hand, at least!


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## stromr (Jul 20, 2016)

Jordan Todd Pogorzelski said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> I gave it a run today and it works on the second pull. It's still cold (around 10 degrees), but maybe it was just the cold causing it to not start?
> 
> ...


If it was 10 degrees and you got it to start by the pull cord I'd guess the primer is working. Remember the primer doesn't actually blow gas into the carb. It blows air into the float bowl which forces gas up thru the main jet into the carb throat. Mine sounds similar. Some engines take more primes than others. My neighbors old flathead Tecumseh takes 3-4 primes. My OHV engine takes 2 only. Once you've had the engine running awhile if you shut it off and go to restart it even after just a couple of minutes you probably won't have to prime it but you may have to choke it.
Think of it this way. An engine is like a woman, what makes one happy makes another one mad. Once you figure out what makes her happy (your snowblower) she'll be a one pull starter!


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## UNDERTAKER (Dec 30, 2013)

*Well then if they are going to do that for free then let them come and get it and tell them aboot the electric start.*


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

I vote for letting them take a look at it and also when it's done have the guy delivering it watch you try to start it to see if he sees something you might be doing wrong. It should be stone cold when they deliver it so that's the best time to see how it goes. As long as they are willing to try and make it right it's in your best interest to let them. Especially if you might need them again later down the road, like lawn mower time !!

As for being cold. It needs to start at very cold temps, it's a snow blower !! Rope or electric you should be able to get it to fire up at minus 30, especially if it's recently tuned. The big thing to remember about the choke and primer is that if you don't do enough you can try again but if you do too much you run the risk of flooding it. You will get used to it and you'll get a feel for it.


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