# Honda HS828K1 WA - Gear Oil / Marine Grease



## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

Hi,

Here to ask if I can just throw some 75w-90 gear oil in the auger gearbox? If there's a specific one I should be using, please let me know asap, I would like to get it for this weekend. Snow is coming soon to the northeast, and my auger is completely out as I had to get the rust welded auger shaft out. I'll try to get some pics up.

Also I wanted to ask if I could use this water resistant marine grease as lubrication on the new auger shaft and other spots? My train of thought was that snow is wet and water resistance is good..
Set me straight.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Per @jrom, according to the shop manual: SAE 75W-90 GL-5 gear oil.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Honda had an updated auger shaft years ago for that. It had a smaller diameter hole in it where that one broke at. They made the hole smaller to help prevent the break.
I remember installing the kits with the new shafts to prevent the breakage like you have there.
You can use 75-90 oil in the gearbox. Marine grade grease is good to use on the shaft to auger to help keep the augers from "Welding"/rusting fast to each other.
If you got the new auger shaft in a kit, it will be the updated shaft with the smaller pin hole in it, and the kit came with new seals and the blocks that attached the augers to the shafts where the shear bolts went through, and the pins that drove the mount block/adapter boss.
Amsoil 75/90 severe gear oil is the best synthetic oil to use, it is expensive oil though.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

That is the early style gear box you have. The newer style box had the mounting tabs for the box support/hanger bracket that mounted to the auger housing and gearbox.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

Hi All, thanks for the feedback! Here's the picture of the new auger shaft I have; ordered from Boats.net. Also, yes this snowblower was sold new in 1994... just 3 short years after I joined this world!

I'll stick with the gear oil I have already, I don't have a picture of it but it's pretty close to what's recommended.

Picture might be flipped.. sorry


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> Hi All, thanks for the feedback! Here's the picture of the new auger shaft I have; ordered from Boats.net. Also, yes this snowblower was sold new in 1994... just 3 short years after I joined this world!
> 
> I'll stick with the gear oil I have already, I don't have a picture of it but it's pretty close to what's recommended.
> 
> Picture might be flipped.. sorry


wow, you're lucky you got that brokrn shaft outta the auger. those augers look pretty good. i usually use anti-seize grease on auger shafts to prevent rust/corrosion but may try marine grease in future to see if there is any difference.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> Honda had an updated auger shaft years ago for that. It had a smaller diameter hole in it where that one broke at. They made the hole smaller to help prevent the break.
> I remember installing the kits with the new shafts to prevent the breakage like you have there.
> You can use 75-90 oil in the gearbox. Marine grade grease is good to use on the shaft to auger to help keep the augers from "Welding"/rusting fast to each other.
> If you got the new auger shaft in a kit, it will be the updated shaft with the smaller pin hole in it, and the kit came with new seals and the blocks that attached the augers to the shafts where the shear bolts went through, and the pins that drove the mount block/adapter boss.
> Amsoil 75/90 severe gear oil is the best synthetic oil to use, it is expensive oil though.


i went on boats and couldn't find the kit. just the main shaft for $71 and everything else is separate . do you happen toknow which model Honda on boats has the whole kit?


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> wow, you're lucky you got that brokrn shaft outta the auger. those augers look pretty good. i usually use anti-seize grease on auger shafts to prevent rust/corrosion but may try marine grease in future to see if there is any difference.


Hahaha thanks, I'd been working to get that out since early october since I bought the blower. Left it with PB Blaster in the open end for a couple weeks, and also tried to heat with my propane torch a few times throughout. Ended up buying a ~$2.38 1/4" x 36" round steel rod at home depot on Monday and some MAPPro gas; heated the broken end for about 15 seconds, then took my 16oz hammer to the exposed end of the rod... Let's just say I beat the **** out of that rod. :icon-deadhorse:

Happy it's out now!

Just waiting for the new bearings, oil seals to show up and I can grease it up, fill up the gear oil and put it all back together before the snow shows up! I'm playing with fire as it's been getting chilly up here, @tabora knows very well. :smiley-gen125:

:blowerhug:


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Hi O.P.
That was back in the 90's we had a service bulletin that had the kit number for the shaft.
All the new shafts are now with the smaller hole in them.
It was an "Update Kit" back then. If we had a unit with a broken shaft they told us to use that kit and if we wanted to change any good shafts, we were supposed to use that kit.
I remembered it had the shaft, the gearbox seals, a gasket, the 2 smaller diameter pins with 2 cotter pins and 2 mount blocks.
I don't remember the price, that was a few years ago when we installed them. It was very rare to see that shaft broken unless somebody used the wrong "Shear bolt", then instead of the bolt breaking, it could have broke the shaft. The gears were pretty strong in those boxes then.
I will have to dig through a room full of,year/decades of old bulletins and paperwork to see if I can find the bulletin.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> Hi,
> 
> Here to ask if I can just throw some 75w-90 gear oil in the auger gearbox? If there's a specific one I should be using, please let me know asap, I would like to get it for this weekend. Snow is coming soon to the northeast, and my auger is completely out as I had to get the rust welded auger shaft out. I'll try to get some pics up.
> 
> ...


I like the use of your houses' 4x4 to hold the auger so you could get that shaft out.

I'm working on a 828 as well and had to get a rusted Auger off - highly recommend getting a Tie rod separator from harbor freight pictured below. Worked perfectly for me. Just soak in PB or whatever your preference is, use a hammer to get this in-between the case and auger, then a couple taps and you should see movement. Did slight damage to the auger case cap, but took less than 10 minutes to get the auger free, and i'll just replace the cap for $5 (although it would still be fine). 

Picture attached of when I got the auger free. Also a picture of the transmission case, one side of the auger shaft is cleaned up, the other still needs a little more work. 

Anyway to answer your question, I did a craftsman last year and used marine grease on the auger shafts with no problem, its actually still on there now, I didn't need to add any this year. I know Lucas makes a "red and tacky" that has anti seize in it but I haven't tried it before.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> i went on boats and couldn't find the kit. just the main shaft for $71 and everything else is separate . do you happen toknow which model Honda on boats has the whole kit?


The kit was for the 624 and 828 models built back in the 90's. It was the early models before a certain serial number.
If you order a shaft for one of those models today, you will get the new style shaft. Even if you order the gearbox housing, you will get the new style gearbox housing with the bolt tabs for mounting the support bracket. They don't have anymore "Old Style" parts left in stock anymore.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> Hi O.P.
> That was back in the 90's we had a service bulletin that had the kit number for the shaft.
> All the new shafts are now with the smaller hole in them.
> It was an "Update Kit" back then. If we had a unit with a broken shaft they told us to use that kit and if we wanted to change any good shafts, we were supposed to use that kit.
> ...


Thanks for the information and no rush, I'm going to run the blower this winter and next as is and maybe after that I can look at either upgrading or buying new. If you do find it, I know I (and others on this forum) would greatly appreciate any information.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

2muchsnow said:


> I like the use of your houses' 4x4 to hold the auger so you could get that shaft out.
> 
> I'm working on a 828 as well and had to get a rusted Auger off - highly recommend getting a Tie rod separator from harbor freight pictured below. Worked perfectly for me. Just soak in PB or whatever your preference is, use a hammer to get this in-between the case and auger, then a couple taps and you should see movement. Did slight damage to the auger case cap, but took less than 10 minutes to get the auger free, and i'll just replace the cap for $5 (although it would still be fine).
> 
> ...


I only have a C-clamp, no vise, so I had to make it work! I don't think the tie rod separator would have worked for my situation since the auger shaft was snapped at the shear bolt hole, but I will keep that in mind in the future if it happens to me.

Good to hear on the marine grease, I Will proceed forward with that.

Thank you for sharing the pictures, it's always good to see how people get stuck parts unstuck! :smile2:


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

SilentHatch said:


> I only have a C-clamp, no vise, so I had to make it work! I don't think the tie rod separator would have worked for my situation since the auger shaft was snapped at the shear bolt hole, but I will keep that in mind in the future if it happens to me.
> 
> Good to hear on the marine grease, I Will proceed forward with that.
> 
> Thank you for sharing the pictures, it's always good to see how people get stuck parts unstuck! :smile2:


That's not the shear bolt hole, that is the drive pin hole.
That kind of damage to the shaft can happen if you don't use the PROPER SHEAR BOLT that bolts the auger to the auger drive hub.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> The kit was for the 624 and 828 models built back in the 90's. It was the early models before a certain serial number.
> If you order a shaft for one of those models today, you will get the new style shaft. Even if you order the gearbox housing, you will get the new style gearbox housing with the bolt tabs for mounting the support bracket. They don't have anymore "Old Style" parts left in stock anymore.



In case it helps anyone searching these forums later, my model number is SZAK 2013xx...


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

SilentHatch said:


> Thanks for the information and no rush, I'm going to run the blower this winter and next as is and maybe after that I can look at either upgrading or buying new. If you do find it, I know I (and others on this forum) would greatly appreciate any information.


You are welcome Silenthatch.
Remember, it is a Honda. If it was a Toro or Ariens, it would probably have been either in the scrap yard or sent back to China and melted down into another one by now.
Those older Honda's were built to last. I have many of the older ones, 25-30 years old and still run like new, probably better than the new ones today, and they NEVER CLOGGED like the new ones did.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> That's not the shear bolt hole, that is the drive pin hole.
> That kind of damage to the shaft can happen if you don't use the PROPER SHEAR BOLT that bolts the auger to the auger drive hub.


I did notice that Honda has a unique setup for driving the augers. I have to ask what is the reason for this is? Most other snowblower I see have Shear Bolts that go directly through the Auger and into the shaft. Obviously Honda did this for a reason but I'm not sure why..could someone enlighten me? Was it to help add additional protection to the auger transmission?


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> That's not the shear bolt hole, that is the drive pin hole.
> That kind of damage to the shaft can happen if you don't use the PROPER SHEAR BOLT that bolts the auger to the auger drive hub.


Guess it's a good thing I got the parts diagrams and the right bolts from boats.net


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

2muchsnow said:


> I did notice that Honda has a unique setup for driving the augers. I have to ask what is the reason for this is? Most other snowblower I see have Shear Bolts that go directly through the Auger and into the shaft. Obviously Honda did this for a reason but I'm not sure why..could someone enlighten me? Was it to help add additional protection to the auger transmission?


They were easier to replace. A lot of times when you had the long pin through the shaft, it would get twisted and stuck in the shaft and could be hard to remove.
They would shear off at the tube of the auger and part of it remained in the shaft, and sometimes people didn't see where they were located or it could jam the auger to the shaft, making it hard to turn and line up the hole to insert the new pin.
Honda did theirs differently by using an attachment bolt that was a softer weaker bolt that would break off easier. The metal edge of the auger where it mounts would "Cut" the bolt like a scissors cutting paper.
That way the bolt would break away and be much easier to replace. Otherwise if the pin was stuck in the shaft, you had to get a tool to punch out the remaining part of the pin that was stuck in it, as long as the pin wasn't seized in the hole, like an auger can do on the shaft if they aren't greased. Then you'd have to drill out the pin if you couldn't punch it out, plus if you slipped with the punch, you could injure your hand cutting it on the auger teeth.
Back then Honda's slogan was "We Make It Simple".


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> They were easier to replace. A lot of times when you had the long pin through the shaft, it would get twisted and stuck in the shaft and could be hard to remove.
> They would shear off at the tube of the auger and part of it remained in the shaft, and sometimes people didn't see where they were located or it could jam the auger to the shaft, making it hard to turn and line up the hole to insert the new pin.
> Honda did theirs differently by using an attachment bolt that was a softer weaker bolt that would break off easier. The metal edge of the auger where it mounts would "Cut" the bolt like a scissors cutting paper.
> That way the bolt would break away and be much easier to replace. Otherwise if the pin was stuck in the shaft, you had to get a tool to punch out the remaining part of the pin that was stuck in it, as long as the pin wasn't seized in the hole, like an auger can do on the shaft if they aren't greased. Then you'd have to drill out the pin if you couldn't punch it out, plus if you slipped with the punch, you could injure your hand cutting it on the auger teeth.
> Back then Honda's slogan was "We Make It Simple".


Makes sense. I did the same and just ordered all the parts from Boats.net so I know I have the right one. Interesting design tho - do they still use the same system on the HSS models?


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

2muchsnow said:


> Makes sense. I did the same and just ordered all the parts from Boats.net so I know I have the right one. Interesting design tho - do they still use the same system on the HSS models?


Yes they do.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> You are welcome Silenthatch.
> Remember, it is a Honda. If it was a Toro or Ariens, it would probably have been either in the scrap yard or sent back to China and melted down into another one by now.
> Those older Honda's were built to last. I have many of the older ones, 25-30 years old and still run like new, probably better than the new ones today, and they NEVER CLOGGED like the new ones did.


Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!

Best,
James


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

SilentHatch said:


> Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> 
> Best,
> James


Best time to do that now while you have it apart. It will be much easier.
I never did that to any of mine yet, I never had a problem with it throwing or clogging. I have tight impeller paddle to housing clearance now as it is, probably because its an older model and they were built better than the new ones.
But go ahead and do it while its apart, then at least its done and will improve it a little more than it is now.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> i went on boats and couldn't find the kit. just the main shaft for $71 and everything else is separate . do you happen toknow which model Honda on boats has the whole kit?


O.P.
I don't know if they would have any of those kits available anymore, they were available 20 plus years ago.
Honda probably figures there aren't that many older machines out there anymore that would use them or that everyone already replaced the shafts on them by now. I never replaced a lot of them on my equipment, they never failed.
Honda built them much better back then than some of the new models they have today. Once they started selling everything at the Big Box stores, their quality really went downhill. We saw that happening when they first started selling the lawnmowers at the box stores and noticed they really started getting cheap with everything they were making from motorcycles to power equipment. Ask any Old-Timer, they will tell you the same thing.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> 
> Best,
> James


What do you use to do this? 

Also - I too am a James, with a 828 in about the same stage as your rebuild - weird coincidence.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> SilentHatch said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> ...


I can fit my finger between the impeller and the housing, and it made a vast improvement on my dad's Craftsman 928 a few years ago.. couldn't throw over his car before, could throw over his garage after.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

2muchsnow said:


> SilentHatch said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> ...


What a coincidence! Cool! 

This is the rubber replacement paddle that I ordered and will cut up to size and use some self tapping screws to get in there and hold it.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0018TY80A

I could use some machine bolts and nylock nuts but I only have one set of drill bits right now..


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> O.P.
> I don't know if they would have any of those kits available anymore, they were available 20 plus years ago.
> Honda probably figures there aren't that many older machines out there anymore that would use them or that everyone already replaced the shafts on them by now. I never replaced a lot of them on my equipment, they never failed.
> Honda built them much better back then than some of the new models they have today. Once they started selling everything at the Big Box stores, their quality really went downhill. We saw that happening when they first started selling the lawnmowers at the box stores and noticed they really started getting cheap with everything they were making from motorcycles to power equipment. Ask any Old-Timer, they will tell you the same thing.


the new shafts on the auger gearboxes are smaller diameter. i'll look thru all the old models on boats or call them. the kit should be cheaper than buying each individual part. i know donyboy73 has a pretty good video on rebuilding these ( in case anyone else needs to know how )


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> 
> Best,
> James


I use an old mudflap. and you have to use a quality drill bit to drill holes in an impeller. i bought a KnKut drill bit but it wasn't as good as my Grill Hog drill bits.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> SilentHatch said:
> 
> 
> > Speaking of not clogging.. while I have the impeller out, I will be adding some rubber strips to make that complete seal. Thanks for the reminder @ST1100A!
> ...


^^^ my own understanding and reasoning for why I would use a self tapper vice breaking my bits


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> ^^^ my own understanding and reasoning for why I would use a self tapper vice breaking my bits


wait for the fun you are about to have......


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> SilentHatch said:
> 
> 
> > ^^^ my own understanding and reasoning for why I would use a self tapper vice breaking my bits
> ...


I can almost feel the sarcasm... Should I not be using self tappers?


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> I can almost feel the sarcasm... Should I not be using self tappers?


first time i did it it took forever. took chute off and tried to do it that way like the famous you-tube videos.

maybe that works for some but i wanna do it right so now I take augers and impeller out to do it. this gives you the op to service the augers also.cleaning the auger tranny shafts and applying anti-seize grease or marine grease as some people mentioned.

you can drill small pilot holes for the self tappers. I use #10 size self tapping screw .. If I am installing an impeller kit for someone else I drill holes and use SS nuts and bolts and punch out elongated holes in the rubber so that the rubber can be adjusted after you install the impeller .

i also spray some lubricant into impeller part of housing before running it as it is not a perfect circle and the rubber will rub and melt otherwise as the rubber fins are breaking in. 

you tube makes everything look quick and easy but if you wanna do it right it takes more time. I have done about only 10 and it usually takes me a couple hours. but then again I'm in my 60's and take a bunch of breaks . ( i do not drink beer until I am done in shop for the day ) I ain't a fool.

there are members here with much more experience than I when it comes to impeller kits. do a search.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> the new shafts on the auger gearboxes are smaller diameter. i'll look thru all the old models on boats or call them. the kit should be cheaper than buying each individual part. i know donyboy73 has a pretty good video on rebuilding these ( in case anyone else needs to know how )


O.P. on those shafts that came with the kits, the shafts were the same diameter, the only difference was the hole drilled in them where the pin goes through was a smaller diameter hole and a smaller diameter pin.
Those kits came with everything needed to replace the shaft with the newer part and the seal and matching parts designed for the smaller pin diameter.
If I can find the old bulletin, it had the kit number and also listed each part individually with part numbers. I also had it in one of the Dealership Technical Bulletins we got every month. The publication was called "The Wrench", that only Authorized Honda Dealers got.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> O.P. on those shafts that came with the kits, the shafts were the same diameter, the only difference was the hole drilled in them where the pin goes through was a smaller diameter hole and a smaller diameter pin.
> Those kits came with everything needed to replace the shaft with the newer part and the seal and matching parts designed for the smaller pin diameter.
> If I can find the old bulletin, it had the kit number and also listed each part individually with part numbers. I also had it in one of the Dealership Technical Bulletins we got every month. The publication was called "The Wrench", that only Authorized Honda Dealers got.


you don't have to try to find the kit number. I have about 7-8 old auger gearboxes. 2 are bad and I just wanted to take them apart and make one good one out of the 2 . I was thinking of buying a kit if I had to rebuild one for a neighbor or whatnot. In the last couple years have sold 2 used gearboxes to people and installed for them. It's easier just have used gearboxes available than rebuild them but I just want to do it to learn how.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> you don't have to try to find the kit number. I have about 7-8 old auger gearboxes. 2 are bad and I just wanted to take them apart and make one good one out of the 2 . I was thinking of buying a kit if I had to rebuild one for a neighbor or whatnot. In the last couple years have sold 2 used gearboxes to people and installed for them. It's easier just have used gearboxes available than rebuild them but I just want to do it to learn how.


Its always good to have "Spares" because you never know when you might need one, that way you just have to change it out.
I have seen people take them apart and put them back together without ever replacing any seals and they never had a problem with them.
Honda built them good back then with good quality parts.


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## JnC (Feb 21, 2014)

Ahhh the dreaded broken shaft, even though you can get killer deals here NE on the hondas with broken shafts its a pain every time trying to fix the machine.


Since the shaft needs to be replaced I usually use oxy-acetylene to free it up, this because the seals need to be replaced anyway. 



If the shaft is still in tact and needs to be freed from the augers then I use MAP gas and kroil to free up the augers, usually work with a lot of force and patience. 



For replacement gear oil I use synthetic Mobil 1. 



If I am working with older style driveshafts then I notch the ends that go inside the augers and impeller, those slight notches usually hold plenty of anti-seize within to avoid this from happening again. A good amount of anti-seize has never hurt anyone. 



The shown auger in OPs picture also seem to be kinked/bend due to the impact, I'd use some map gas or oxy-acytelene to bend it back into shape.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

JnC said:


> Ahhh the dreaded broken shaft, even though you can get killer deals here NE on the hondas with broken shafts its a pain every time trying to fix the machine.
> 
> 
> Since the shaft needs to be replaced I usually use oxy-acetylene to free it up, this because the seals need to be replaced anyway.
> ...



I'll be using marine grease instead of anti-seize, but one of the other posts said they did not have seizing with that, either.

Do you mean my picture, or orangputeh's pic?

I'll try to find a picture of the normal auger and then use my map gas to try to bend back if I can.

Got to say, I appreciate all of the information and pictures shared here; I wish I had the foresight to make small videos about this as I was going through.. no one needs to hear me swearing, though. I may make a quick video on my re-assembly process once the parts get here on Monday.

If you or anyone else has tips on re-assembly, I'd appreciate if you shared!


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> I'll be using marine grease instead of anti-seize, but one of the other posts said they did not have seizing with that, either.
> 
> Do you mean my picture, or orangputeh's pic?
> 
> ...


check out donyboy73 video on this. it's 3 parts and the second part shows reassembling of the gearbox. title is something like Honda gearbox rebuild in 3 parts. also the first part shows how he separated the augers from auger gearbox with heat.

he makes it look so easy.I took my gearbox front cover off but can not get the top drive shaft out so i can get the main gear out. I have a broke main shaft as well.

you don't have to use heat to bend back your bent over auger. I use big locking pliers and just bend back into place. I use a measuring tape to make sure to make the rakes are equal distant to one another and use the other good auger as a reference. You may not get it perfect but you can come close.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> check out donyboy73 video on this. it's 3 parts and the second part shows reassembling of the gearbox. title is something like Honda gearbox rebuild in 3 parts. also the first part shows how he separated the augers from auger gearbox with heat.
> 
> he makes it look so easy.I took my gearbox front cover off but can not get the top drive shaft out so i can get the main gear out. I have a broke main shaft as well.
> 
> you don't have to use heat to bend back your bent over auger. I use big locking pliers and just bend back into place. I use a measuring tape to make sure to make the rakes are equal distant to one another and use the other good auger as a reference. You may not get it perfect but you can come close.



Here is the video - part two. Part three link is in the description of the video.


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## notabiker (Dec 14, 2018)

SilentHatch said:


> ^^^ my own understanding and reasoning for why I would use a self tapper vice breaking my bits



If your drill bits break then that's just a sign that you need some better quality ones and AVOID harbor freight drill bits, most are like drilling with cooked spaghetti as they flex soo much!




orangputeh said:


> first time i did it it took forever. took chute off and tried to do it that way like the famous you-tube videos.
> 
> maybe that works for some but i wanna do it right so now I take augers and impeller out to do it. this gives you the op to service the augers also.cleaning the auger tranny shafts and applying anti-seize grease or marine grease as some people mentioned.
> 
> ...



I just took my chute off and used an F clamp (used for welding usually, picked up at a tractor supply but homedepot carries them too IIRC and a quick clamp like you'd use for wood might work but the F clamp has more clearance) to clamp inside the chute hole and had it positioned to keep the impeller from rotating backwards while I applied drilling pressure. Also if you don't have one yet, get an automatic center punch to make a divot for the drill bit to start without walking. And of course some drill/tapping oil to keep the drill lubed up. If you can't sharpen drill bits on a grinding wheel then a drill doctor doesn't work half bad. I prefer a grinder but then I was a machinist in a past life (decades ago) and got plenty of practice sharpening anything from 1/8" to 1-1/2" drill bits on a bench grinder so I find it easy.


I have a $100 set of Irwin 1/16" to 1/2" in 1/64" steps drill bit set that works really well, but any decent set from DeWalt or Milwaukee should work fine. Just use oil and keep the drill rpms around 500 or so, well don't have the drill screaming at >1000 rpm as you'd destroy a drill bit in a hurry.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Use a "Split point" bit. It cuts in much better and faster than a standard point bit. Make sure you oil it to help keep it cool and run it at a lower speed like others posted.
If you run it too fast, you will burn the bit out in a hurry and wont cut/drill properly.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

2muchsnow said:


> orangputeh said:
> 
> 
> > check out donyboy73 video on this. it's 3 parts and the second part shows reassembling of the gearbox. title is something like Honda gearbox rebuild in 3 parts. also the first part shows how he separated the augers from auger gearbox with heat.
> ...





ST1100A said:


> Use a "Split point" bit. It cuts in much better and faster than a standard point bit. Make sure you oil it to help keep it cool and run it at a lower speed like others posted.
> If you run it too fast, you will burn the bit out in a hurry and wont cut/drill properly.


I did have some DeWalt black split point bits - add cutting oil, set on 1 (not 2) and that's all she wrote.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

I would still like to know how to get the drive and main shafts out of my auger gearbox. they are in tight not like donyboy's video when they practically fell out.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> I would still like to know how to get the drive and main shafts out of my auger gearbox. they are in tight not like donyboy's video when they practically fell out.


There is 1 big black shear bolt that holds the impeller paddle to the drive shaft. Remove that bolt and as long as the impeller in not frozen to the drive shaft that connects it to the drive pulley, it should just pull out after you unbolt the side bearings on the auger shafts to the housing. Then you can remove the whole assembly as one piece.
That big black shear bolt is one of the shear bolts they give you in the tool kit as a spare besides the smaller silver bolts and nuts for the augers themselves that are the ones that usually break.
That big black shear bolt is for the impeller paddle.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> I would still like to know how to get the drive and main shafts out of my auger gearbox. they are in tight not like donyboy's video when they practically fell out.


You have to get the mainshaft out first to remove the big gear before you can get the main driveshaft or "Wormgear" shaft out. You can get the wormgear shaft out without taking the gear off though.
They are not that hard to take apart. I took a few of them apart just to see how they were built. Fortunately we had very very few that were ever broken. Honda made good tough strong gearboxes years ago.
You just punch out the auger shaft after you take the dust seal off, then remove the big gear to remove the circlip that holds the bearing in place. Then behind the bearings are the oil seals. 
The oil seals are mounted internally.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> You have to get the mainshaft out first to remove the big gear before you can get the main driveshaft or "Wormgear" shaft out. You can get the wormgear shaft out without taking the gear off though.
> They are not that hard to take apart. I took a few of them apart just to see how they were built. Fortunately we had very very few that were ever broken. Honda made good tough strong gearboxes years ago.
> You just punch out the auger shaft after you take the dust seal off, then remove the big gear to remove the circlip that holds the bearing in place. Then behind the bearings are the oil seals.
> The oil seals are mounted internally.


 @orangputeh
If you're looking at the (snowblower) auger setup from the front, the auger shaft removes to the left. But there's a snap ring on the right that holds it in place, like ST said. Order from right to left is dust cap, oil seal, bearing, big center gear, bearing, oil seal.
I still have mine apart so let me see if I can get it assembled with the old parts for you.
@ST1100A, got any tips on how to get the oil seal out without drilling through it like I did?


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> You have to get the mainshaft out first to remove the big gear before you can get the main driveshaft or "Wormgear" shaft out. You can get the wormgear shaft out without taking the gear off though.
> They are not that hard to take apart. I took a few of them apart just to see how they were built. Fortunately we had very very few that were ever broken. Honda made good tough strong gearboxes years ago.
> You just punch out the auger shaft after you take the dust seal off, then remove the big gear to remove the circlip that holds the bearing in place. Then behind the bearings are the oil seals.
> The oil seals are mounted internally.


okay. do you have to remove oil seal before punching the main shaft out? I took the dust cap off . How do you remove oil seal? is there a special tool or do you just pry and destroy to take out? 

I already have the gearbox out and the front cover off.


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## blue dragon (Mar 11, 2019)

How does that happen? :surprise: Do the augers not spin freely on the shaft without the shear bolt?


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

okay, i am pretty sure have to remove the oil seal to remove the clip. went and looked at the manual , duh....should have done that in the first place.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

SilentHatch said:


> @orangputeh
> If you're looking at the (snowblower) auger setup from the front, the auger shaft removes to the left. But there's a snap ring on the right that holds it in place, like ST said. Order from right to left is dust cap, oil seal, bearing, big center gear, bearing, oil seal.
> I still have mine apart so let me see if I can get it assembled with the old parts for you.
> 
> @ST1100A, got any tips on how to get the oil seal out without drilling through it like I did?


Sometimes you drill it and install a self tapping screw and pull it out like that.
I have already got lucky and removed the oil fill bolt and took a blow gun with a rubber tip and pressurized the box and let the pressure blow or push the seal out as long as it had enough oil in it and no other seals were leaking. If you do it that way, be careful because you could have a mess with the oil spraying out. That is how you do it "Hydraulically". It works sometimes and if it does, sometimes you can re-use the seal. I have a friend who made a fitting to screw into the fill bolt hole and he attached a grease gun and pumped it full of grease to force out the seal, almost like removing a clutch pilot bushing in a flywheel of a car.
I have seen people re-use the seal after they drilled a tiny hole in it for the self tapping screw and they re-sealed the drill hole up with RTV gasket sealer or even J.B. Weld on the little hole, but it would be better to replace that one seal.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> I would still like to know how to get the drive and main shafts out of my auger gearbox. they are in tight not like donyboy's video when they practically fell out.


The main shaft comes out the one side with the big dust cover on it. Remove the dust cover, then the oil seal and after that, remove the circlip, then tap out the shaft, it will push out the bearing when the shaft comes out usually from the gear splines on the shaft hitting the bearing.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Donnyboys video shows a gearbox that is already part way apart, he is basically showing how to put it back together. 
It would be good if he could show a complete gear box rebuild from start to finish to show people how to get the one grease seal out easier to get to the bearing retainer C clip so the shaft can be removed.
There are tricks to remove the oil seal with a self tapping screw and drilling it, install the screw and use that to pull out the seal.
Another way is to pressurize the box with air to try and blow out the seal, but be careful, you could have an oil mess. Another way is to pump the box full of grease and force it out hydraulically. 
Then you have to clean out all of the grease.
I have seen people seal up the tiny drill hole in the oil seal with RTV sealer or JB Weld and it worked, but you are better off with installing a new seal if you have one and didn't damage the seal removing it.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> Donnyboys video shows a gearbox that is already part way apart, he is basically showing how to put it back together.
> It would be good if he could show a complete gear box rebuild from start to finish to show people how to get the one grease seal out easier to get to the bearing retainer C clip so the shaft can be removed.
> There are tricks to remove the oil seal with a self tapping screw and drilling it, install the screw and use that to pull out the seal.
> Another way is to pressurize the box with air to try and blow out the seal, but be careful, you could have an oil mess. Another way is to pump the box full of grease and force it out hydraulically.
> ...


It's funny some of the problems you run into that has fairly simple solutions and you think "why didn't I think of that?"

There are some things that puzzled the heck out of me a couple years ago that are so easy now I have to laugh at my old ignorant self. Now when someone else has that problem and I show them how to do that they think I'm some kind of magic man. That's funny.if only they knew.......


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> okay, i am pretty sure have to remove the oil seal to remove the clip. went and looked at the manual , duh....should have done that in the first place.


 @orangputeh
Sorry I didn't get back to you yesterday, I was sealing up the garage so it's not so cold in there this winter.

Here's the parts diagram for my HS828 auger gearbox, that should help. My serial is SZAK2013xxx (boats.net has requirements to know your serial when searching for parts)

Yes, you have to get the oil seal out first. I had to drill mine out as I didn't have any hooks. However there's space to fit a small hook in next to the shaft if you have those. It will still take some force.

I don't know why that parts diagram uploaded without part numbers... Here's attempt 2 with the page.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

blue dragon said:


> How does that happen? :surprise: Do the augers not spin freely on the shaft without the shear bolt?



For my auger shaft; someone had a stronger bolt in the auger/auger shaft than necessary and must have driven it into a tree, as they bent the auger and sheared the shaft.

Then, just put another strong bolt in and continued using it with it sheared.

No grease on the auger shaft and ta-da, it rust welded on both sides.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> I did have some DeWalt black split point bits - add cutting oil, set on 1 (not 2) and that's all she wrote.


Have any other pictures of this? My rubber paddle is coming today - so its back to work!


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

2muchsnow said:


> Have any other pictures of this? My rubber paddle is coming today - so its back to work!


Hi,

Tried to attach some pictures; I'm not sure if it will come through or if you'll be able to see my punch locations. Tried to leave about 1/4" to 3/8" hangover to close the gap. Then for the bolt closest to the center, I tried to set it about 1.5" in from the edge of impeller. The other bolt I tried to set somewhere between 3/4" to 1" from the edge, and then at least 1" from the other hole.

I had bought some washers for a different purpose, so I only had 10, but it should be okay without washers on the metal side.

Tonight, I will be heating and unbending the fins on my impeller blower with an adjustable wrench and then will be putting the rubber on the bottom of the impeller as opposed to the top, so the rubber can bow downwards in case the gap is not the same all the way around.

Let me know if you're not able to see clearly and I'll see if I have any better pictures. They are still uploading upside down, so you may need to turn yourself around.

I'm also back to work tonight, gearbox oil seals and bearings show up today!!!

Best,
James


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

orangputeh said:


> It's funny some of the problems you run into that has fairly simple solutions and you think "why didn't I think of that?"
> 
> There are some things that puzzled the heck out of me a couple years ago that are so easy now I have to laugh at my old ignorant self. Now when someone else has that problem and I show them how to do that they think I'm some kind of magic man. That's funny.if only they knew.......


That's true O.P.
We learn from Experience. But we have to get the experience first somehow.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

got the gearbox apart after removing seal and clip with my Dad's old 70 year old snap ring pliers.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

unfortunately the gap will not be the same all around. not from experience anyway


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

@orangputeh @ST1100A @tabora

I can't get the right hand side bearing in far enough for the clip to go in. I do not have a vise and the only pole I have is the rod for my roof rake so I can't hammer on that too hard.

Any tips on what I can pick up to help me get that in? I think I'm only about a sixteenth to an eighth away from the gap. 

Watched dony's part 2 video and I wish it was as easy as he made it look.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Sometimes you can use a piece of PVC pipe. You can usually get that at a hardware store and its not too expensive. It might work if you don't have to hammer it in too hard.
Another thing to check for is if you replaced a bearing, make sure it is the same width as the one you just removed.
I have seen bearings that were off by a little bit, that usually comes from a different bearing manufacturer. Also temperature change can cause dimensions to change a little bit but that shouldn't make enough of a difference.
Check to make sure there is nothing obstructing the path of the bearing where it sets into the case that would block it from going in far enough to get the clip on, like a tiny burr in the metal. And if you replaced an oil seal, check the thickness of that to make sure it is not too thick and then you will crush it a bit to install the bearing, that can cause an interference problem with thickness.
I would try a piece of PVC pipe though, you can grind it down easier to make it fit if you have to, a lot easier than grinding a piece of metal, or you can go and buy a bearing driver tool set, but not all of those fit properly.
Honda had special tools for a lot of their products that the dealerships had to buy, and they were not cheap so we made some of our own with the help of our friends at the machine shop.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

SilentHatch said:


> I can't get the right hand side bearing in far enough for the clip to go in. I do not have a vise and the only pole I have is the rod for my roof rake so I can't hammer on that too hard.
> 
> Any tips on what I can pick up to help me get that in? I think I'm only about a sixteenth to an eighth away from the gap.


I never feel comfortable beating on a bearing to seat it. I have several mechanical and hydraulic presses for that process. If you have a car jack, you can usually cobble up a press by placing the bearing and casing between the jack and a flat surface on the underside of a car. With the auger gear case, I'd use a piece of PVC pipe the diameter of the outer race on top, then the bearing, then the casing with a flat plate inserted through the front to provide a bearing surface, then another, smaller piece of PVC pipe coming up through the opposite side of the case against the plate, and finally the jack on the bottom.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

tabora said:


> I never feel comfortable beating on a bearing to seat it. I have several mechanical and hydraulic presses for that process. If you have a car jack, you can usually cobble up a press by placing the bearing and casing between the jack and a flat surface on the underside of a car. With the auger gear case, I'd use a piece of PVC pipe the diameter of the outer race on top, then the bearing, then the casing with a flat plate inserted through the front to provide a bearing surface, then another, smaller piece of PVC pipe coming up through the opposite side of the case against the plate, and finally the jack on the bottom.


Good idea Tabora.
Those bearings usually install pretty easy and just have to be tapped lightly into place, they are not a tight interference fit normally.
If he had a small toaster oven he could heat up the case to make it go in easier, and chill the bearing in the freezer for a little while, then it should go in real smoothly.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> Sometimes you can use a piece of PVC pipe. You can usually get that at a hardware store and its not too expensive. It might work if you don't have to hammer it in too hard.
> Another thing to check for is if you replaced a bearing, make sure it is the same width as the one you just removed.
> I have seen bearings that were off by a little bit, that usually comes from a different bearing manufacturer. Also temperature change can cause dimensions to change a little bit but that shouldn't make enough of a difference.
> Check to make sure there is nothing obstructing the path of the bearing where it sets into the case that would block it from going in far enough to get the clip on, like a tiny burr in the metal. And if you replaced an oil seal, check the thickness of that to make sure it is not too thick and then you will crush it a bit to install the bearing, that can cause an interference problem with thickness.
> ...





tabora said:


> I never feel comfortable beating on a bearing to seat it. I have several mechanical and hydraulic presses for that process. If you have a car jack, you can usually cobble up a press by placing the bearing and casing between the jack and a flat surface on the underside of a car. With the auger gear case, I'd use a piece of PVC pipe the diameter of the outer race on top, then the bearing, then the casing with a flat plate inserted through the front to provide a bearing surface, then another, smaller piece of PVC pipe coming up through the opposite side of the case against the plate, and finally the jack on the bottom.





ST1100A said:


> Good idea Tabora.
> Those bearings usually install pretty easy and just have to be tapped lightly into place, they are not a tight interference fit normally.
> If he had a small toaster oven he could heat up the case to make it go in easier, and chill the bearing in the freezer for a little while, then it should go in real smoothly.


I may try taking it all apart including removing the shaft again to try to re-seat everything. I put a thin film of grease on outside of bearing and sanded the inside of the seat. I used some 220 grit sandpaper.

Used the two old bearings to try to hammer down and get the new one to seat.

I'll try to start from the beginning again and push out the oil seal and bearing from the left side. Donyboy73 used a 31/32 socket to seat that, which I'm fine picking up at the store, its just that I don't have a vise to stick it in, and when I hammer against my concrete floor.. The floor gives way, so I've got to find a better solution.

I may have an old brake rotor sitting around that I could use to hammer against.

Thanks for the tips and if you have any ideas on what size pvc I should get, please let me know. I guess I could stop at home to grab one of the bearings before popping over to the store.

My issue is when trying to get the second bearing in, the shaft has to be in and that makes it super awkward for separating from the floor.

Will keep you updated. May not be able to get as deep into it tonight due to previous plans.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> I may try taking it all apart including removing the shaft again to try to re-seat everything. I put a thin film of grease on outside of bearing and sanded the inside of the seat. I used some 220 grit sandpaper.
> 
> Used the two old bearings to try to hammer down and get the new one to seat.
> 
> ...



some really good ideas here. it seems on what you did should work. i use penetrating oil instead of grease. I don't have much experience in this . looking forward to your results as I am doing the same thing. have one gearbox with a broke shaft and one with a broke main case so I am using both to get one good one.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> some really good ideas here. it seems on what you did should work. i use penetrating oil instead of grease. I don't have much experience in this . looking forward to your results as I am doing the same thing. have one gearbox with a broke shaft and one with a broke main case so I am using both to get one good one.


I did video most of it last night, thinking that I might be done in an hour or less. Not a smart move on my part. I'll need some time to edit the video and take out the parts that are not relevant, but I can post that up eventually.

Thing is I don't have a tripod so you can't see everything I was doing as well as I would have liked.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> I did video most of it last night, thinking that I might be done in an hour or less. Not a smart move on my part. I'll need some time to edit the video and take out the parts that are not relevant, but I can post that up eventually.
> 
> Thing is I don't have a tripod so you can't see everything I was doing as well as I would have liked.


 @orangputeh @tabora @ST1100A

Sorry for the late update, just got home.
So I disassembled and started from the beginning.
Problem 1, left-most oil seal was not flush against case.
Problem 2, I couldn't get left bearing seated 100% flush, only 98% flush. Using my rubber mallet on the end of the shaft helped get it closer.

Problem 3: still can't get that right bearing 100% seated, even with the 8 inches of inch and a half pvc pipe that I bought for 58 cents. But I can just see the tip of the snap ring hole. Tomorrow, I will try Andy's suggestion on my car with the jack. Hard part is finding a flat part on the car that has a hole for the shaft to fit through.

No pictures tonight, but I did stack two old brake rotors on top of each other as a harder surface, and there was enough clearance for the shaft to be in there and not hit the floor.

Again, any other tips appreciated.

I did try the old bearing and it gave me a harder time about going in...


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Check your oil seal thickness just in case the seal is thicker than the old one. If you have the old seal, use a micrometer to measure the thickness and compare it to the new seal just in case it might be thicker, also measure the old and new bearings, just in case.
If the oil seal is thicker, that could be your problem with getting the clearance to the groove for the retainer clip.
I wonder if the bearing may have been cocked a little bit when you tried to drive it into the case and that may have deformed the metal a little bit to cause some of the problems you are having, a possibility.
If that would be the cause, then you would have to take it to a machine shop and have it milled out a little bit to get the clearance back and get the bearing and seal in better.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

SilentHatch said:


> Problem 2, I couldn't get left bearing seated 100% flush, only 98% flush. Using my rubber mallet on the end of the shaft helped get it closer.
> 
> Problem 3: still can't get that right bearing 100% seated, even with the 8 inches of inch and a half pvc pipe that I bought for 58 cents. But I can just see the tip of the snap ring hole.


If you can't get it sorted out, send me a PM and you can bring the components up to Cape Elizabeth this weekend. I have an arbor press that should make short work of the bearing seating.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> @orangputeh
> @tabora
> @ST1100A
> 
> ...




If I were you I would seriously consider putting the bearings in the freezer for a while before you try to put it together. It might give you just enough to shrinkage to get them in there -and if it doesn't your no worse off. I also wouldn't use grease to try to get them in - either use the oil you are going to fill the auger box with (can't hurt) or some type of penetrating oil. That being said, IF the oil seals are made of rubber (I don't know what they are made of), do not freeze them, Rubber expands in cold and shrinks with heat.


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## notabiker (Dec 14, 2018)

I'd do the freezer and gently warm the case with a hair dryer, that should open that hole up a little and make the bearing a little smaller. If you can't get the bearing out then pick up a can of CRC Freeze Off (white and blue can and doesn't smell too bad either!) and heat up the case with the hair dryer or heck even a Mr Buddy style heater would work great as long as you watch the temp of the case. Spray the freeze off on the bearing and tap it in quickly before it heats up again.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

I'm wondering if the gear case is damaged or the new bearings and oil seals are a little bit thicker than the original ones that were removed. You'd have to get them measured with a micrometer and compare the two of them just in case one is thicker than the other.
Another possibility is if the case was squeezed together if it was mounted in a vise and that could cause a problem by warping the case inwards if it was squeezed too much, causing it to flex and not crack and break.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

notabiker said:


> I'd do the freezer and gently warm the case with a hair dryer, that should open that hole up a little and make the bearing a little smaller. If you can't get the bearing out then pick up a can of CRC Freeze Off (white and blue can and doesn't smell too bad either!) and heat up the case with the hair dryer or heck even a Mr Buddy style heater would work great as long as you watch the temp of the case. Spray the freeze off on the bearing and tap it in quickly before it heats up again.





ST1100A said:


> I'm wondering if the gear case is damaged or the new bearings and oil seals are a little bit thicker than the original ones that were removed. You'd have to get them measured with a micrometer and compare the two of them just in case one is thicker than the other.
> Another possibility is if the case was squeezed together if it was mounted in a vise and that could cause a problem by warping the case inwards if it was squeezed too much, causing it to flex and not crack and break.


I stopped by my cousin's house real quick yesterday as he has more tools.
It's super easy to disassemble now as I've done it so much now. Got the oil seal completely seated; still the same issue with the bearings.

Looking at potentially reusing the old bearings.

All 4 bearings (old and new sets) for the auger shaft are in the freezer. Tonight I will try to heat the case and see if the bearings drop in or if they are stuck again.

I checked the oil seal thickness and they were the same. Same for the bearings.

If no dice on this working tonight, it looks like I may ask family for a snowblower that has been sitting for a few years (not that I want another project and another snowblower to store...) as an alternative.


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## notabiker (Dec 14, 2018)

Didn't you say the old bearings were really tight too? I suppose you can check to see if there's any wobble and slop in the old ones. I'd hold the inner race and then push axially (finger in the bearing hole and push on the top race along the length of the finger, basically a side to side push) on the outer race and see if there's any movement. Also do the same with the new ones and compare outcomes. I do not think there should be any movement. You can also do an up and down check by putting a finger in the hole (no not that one! j/k) and basically try squeezing the outer race into the inner race and alternate pushing on the other side quickly to see if you can determine any wear that way.


Also look at the balls... on the bearing and look for any pitting or anything which would determine if there was ever damage or rust pitted them after sitting for a while.


If they are tight and have nice smooth balls (gah!!) and if they fit back into the housing easier than the new ones then I'd just reuse them and toss the new ones back in the box and return them or hold onto them for another summer project.






If you have access to a micrometer (very very precise measuring device not to be confused with a less accurate caliper, though a caliper will work in a pinch if you're careful) then you can measure the O.D. of both old and new to determine if the diameters are exactly the same.


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## 2muchsnow (Oct 22, 2019)

SilentHatch said:


> I stopped by my cousin's house real quick yesterday as he has more tools.
> It's super easy to disassemble now as I've done it so much now. Got the oil seal completely seated; still the same issue with the bearings.
> 
> Looking at potentially reusing the old bearings.
> ...



I would take Tabora up on his offer if you cant get it. Your also welcome to use my press but its a much, much farther drive down to me.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

2muchsnow said:


> I would take Tabora up on his offer if you cant get it. Your also welcome to use my press but its a much, much farther drive down to me.


Just getting home and seeing what he wrote - I may lean towards that depending on how tonight goes - a kind offer from both of you.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

Just an update to let you all know I had no luck with the frozen bearings and heated case.

This weekend is my next opportunity to get it fixed - will reach out to @tabora.

I used the gear oil as lubricant and one slid in (left side) but kept popping out when I would pull shaft out.
Right side one I heated case and then dropped the bearing in, but it wouldn't budge any further in.

Here's hoping we get no snow on Sunday, just rain!

The wife is getting nervous about it not fixed yet..


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

SilentHatch said:


> Just an update to let you all know I had no luck with the frozen bearings and heated case.
> 
> This weekend is my next opportunity to get it fixed - will reach out to tabora.
> 
> ...


may have to shovel.......


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> may have to shovel.......


Family says they are bringing down both old snowblowers on Saturday... But I only bought one new carb.. not that I need another project right now hahahaha


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

notabiker said:


> Didn't you say the old bearings were really tight too? I suppose you can check to see if there's any wobble and slop in the old ones. I'd hold the inner race and then push axially (finger in the bearing hole and push on the top race along the length of the finger, basically a side to side push) on the outer race and see if there's any movement. Also do the same with the new ones and compare outcomes. I do not think there should be any movement. You can also do an up and down check by putting a finger in the hole (no not that one! j/k) and basically try squeezing the outer race into the inner race and alternate pushing on the other side quickly to see if you can determine any wear that way.
> 
> 
> Also look at the balls... on the bearing and look for any pitting or anything which would determine if there was ever damage or rust pitted them after sitting for a while.
> ...



Appreciate the insight and will keep that in mind, here's hoping I'm able to meet up with tabora and get these seated.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

SilentHatch said:


> Appreciate the insight and will keep that in mind, here's hoping I'm able to meet up with tabora and get these seated.


So, turned out that the problem was the new auger shaft 23377-767-030. The correct shaft must be a different part number, maybe 06233-767-305 or 23377-767-000 or 23377-767-010? As you can see in the attached comparison, the old shaft's splined section is much shorter than the replacement. The new shaft's splines were flush against the inner bearing races on both sides, preventing the bearings from seating. Chucked the shaft in the middle-sized lathe and removed the splines shown in the asymmetric red tinted areas down to the shaft diameter. @*SilentHatch* has a photo of the result - bearings seated easily once the shaft was altered to match the old one.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Wow, I'd say that is the wrong shaft there. But it looks like that's what is called for by the part number listings. Honda doesn't have the "Old" number listings available anymore unless you have the old microfiche.
The new part number Tabora listed in his post also fits the 1332 models besides the smaller models, so you would think it is a heavier shaft.
He has the "Early" style case with the "Old" style shaft originally.
Honda came out with an updated shaft that came as a kit back in the 90's. The kit came with all kinds of parts besides just the shaft. It had bearings, seals, pins, cotter pins, gasket and the lock bolt boss.
I don't think those kits are available anymore. Honda probably figures there aren't enough of the older 828 and 624 models left anymore that needed the kit, so Honda did away with them.
Honda also changed the gearbox from back then. He has the "Old" style gearbox without the bolt tabs for the gearbox support bracket. The "New" style gearbox has the bolt tabs for that bracket, so the gearbox is a little bit different and it looks like it was designed heavier, so that could have been the problem right there. Honda doesn't have the "Old Style" gearboxes anymore either.
His 828 is around 25 years old by now.
Honda used to be very good with their parts for older machines, but that all stopped after Mr Honda died, and they no longer kept New Old Stock parts in their warehouses anymore because it cost money to store all of the old parts. Honda did that with power equipment and motorcycle parts around 15 years ago.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

Hi all,

Sorry for the delay in posting - wanted to get it all back together, and test it out.

Attached is the picture of the snap ring that easily seated after @tabora nicely ground down the splines (sneaky over the shoulder picture attached as well). Make sure you check that on yours, @orangputeh.

Got it all back together and tested, engine runs great (with the new LED lights I wired in) but now I have a new problem. I will make a new thread for that.

To anyone reading this thread down the road, if you are fortunate enough to have the old shaft, double check the measurements of the splines before you go beating on them like I did.

To everyone that replied in helping me, thank you so much.
I'll conclude this thread and start up a new one for the newest issue as it does not pertain to the auger gearbox. This issue is solved.

Adding a pic of it all back together for you all


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

so @tabora had to ground down the splines to match the old one? and how was that done? what was wrong with the old shaft? were the splines damaged?


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

orangputeh said:


> so @*tabora* had to ground down the splines to match the old one? and how was that done? what was wrong with the old shaft? were the splines damaged?


Used my middle-size lathe (a 44142 combo lathe/milling machine/drill press from Harbor Freight about 20 years ago) and just turned off the ends of the splines as shown in post number 83. That composite picture shows the old shaft, too. It was sheared at the pin hole.

I also have a Unimat miniature combo lathe/milling machine for very small work that I inherited and a large Jet lathe and Bridgeport milling machine that I purchased from Konica Minolta when the photo labs shut down in 2006, but the big guys are overkill for a little job like this.


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## SilentHatch (Aug 23, 2019)

orangputeh said:


> so @tabora had to ground down the splines to match the old one? and how was that done? what was wrong with the old shaft? were the splines damaged?




The old shaft was original to the machine, and the new one was same length and dimensions with longer splines as @ST1100A mentioned how they switched gearboxes at some point in the last 25 years.

I think @tabora took 1/8" to 1/4" off either side, at least.


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