# bottom of housing bent up



## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

My neighbor asked me to look at his Ariens Compact 24. He doesn't know the exact history, other than the PO broke it then let it sit for a few years. Once I get the motor checked out, I need to work on the auger housing. It looks like the machine was run for a while without skid shoes, and the bottom of the bucket, including the scraper bar, bent up a bit, causing the auger to hit the bucket and blow out the shear pin. My question is how to bend the bucket lip back down again? Should I pound on it, or try to bend it back a bit? The picture kind of shows how the left auger (right in this pic) comes in contact with the scraper bar screw head, and the other auger does a bit too.

Thanks
.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

In the center pic the scraper looks fairly level so there should be lots of clearance. I wonder if the auger assembly has dropped. Perhaps lift up on the auger near the side bearings and check for play. The gear box does not have a brace and should not move up and down since it looks like a long auger shaft. Perhaps it needs a brace if there is up and down movement with the gearbox.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

thanks Town for the reply. There is no noticeable play in the auger assembly itself. Further info: I removed the shear pin from the right side auger (it was bent and tough to remove) and now the 2 augers can freely spin on the shaft. But the impeller is difficult to spin. I have the belt off of the engine, but still on the impeller pulley, and even using the belt by hand it is tough to rotate. I assume there is a problem in the impeller bearing? The blades themselves are not rubbing the housing. I've not yet worked on Ariens auger assemblies. 

thanks


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

There is a brake shoe that touches the impeller pulley. If you press the impeller clutch lever you will release the brake and since the crank impeller pulley does not have the belt(s) attached the impeller should spin unless the bearing is seized or the gearbox has failed. I use a cable tie to keep the clutch applied to use for this purpose and impeller operation with engine running for whatever reason I want to see the impeller or auger operation. 

Those impeller bearings can fail and seize so no movement in shaft, or they can wear and get loose to allow sideways impeller shaft movement. Also check the oil level in the gearbox. You cannot see the proper level so you need a dipstick to measure oil level from top of gearbox under fill plug and gasket. Your owner manual will give the distance, mine is between 2.38" and 2.63" from the top of plug opening. The thin red L3 oil can leak from the impeller seal on the rear of gearbox and could seize the gearbox.

Good luck.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Here is a pic of the trans of my machine showing the brake at the very bottom of the pic. The brake is actively pressing against the impeller pulley in this pic. You will see the two rivets that hold the friction material to the brake housing, and just above is the white roller that moves toward the brake when impeller clutch is applied to release the brake.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

thanks Town, I had forgot about the brake until I went back out. Duh. So I removed the auger housing from the main housing, and then the auger assembly from its housing. Even with the impact wrench on low pressure, I broke 2 of the 4 screws holding the housings together (or they were already broke), and 3 of the 6 screws attaching the housing to the 2 auger shaft (rake shaft) bushings. The impeller bearing seems good, and the impeller shaft seems straight still. Then I finally got a good look at the scraper bar, ugh. Someone had used the machine without a bar for quite some time, then with the bar but without the skid shoes (I think) for a while as well. Anyways, I bent and pounded the bottom of the housing, with the scraper bar attached, to a point where I will test fit the auger assembly again. We'll see how much of a difference I made. The attached pics are before bending.

Couple of questions, how are the auger shaft bushings attached to the shaft, I just see a plastic sleeve and the bushing. Also, I am doing this on the cheap for a neighbor, so should I replace the impeller and auger bearings, or try to reuse? I know if it were my machine, I would replace (and also blast and paint everything). Also, does anyone have a used recoil starter assembly for sale, there was none on this machine, and I hate using the electric starter during maintenance. 

Thanks


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

Which engine does it have ? Can’t tell from the pics, is it Tecumseh, Briggs it the AX which is made by LCT


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@PAUL,


I have one of those Workmate tables ... They are the greatest, .. I just used mine today for welding on, as well as grinding on.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

Daunte: it has the B&S 205cc engine, see pic. Let me know if you need other pics or info.

Oneacer: yep, I love my WorkMate tables. I have 2 full size tables, and 2 table top versions, all bought for $10 or less each.


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

I have a blower with that same engine, I’ll see if I can find a part number and see if eBay has one, B&S unfortunately rivets a lot of there starters on so to change the pull cord you need to remove the housing which apparently your buddy did NOT want to do, May have to pop rivet the new one on.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

paulm12 said:


> .......
> 
> Couple of questions, how are the auger shaft bushings attached to the shaft, I just see a plastic sleeve and the bushing. Also, I am doing this on the cheap for a neighbor, so should I replace the impeller and auger bearings, or try to reuse? I know if it were my machine, I would replace (and also blast and paint everything). Also, does anyone have a used recoil starter assembly for sale, there was none on this machine, and I hate using the electric starter during maintenance.
> 
> Thanks


The plastic bushings are the wear item so if there is no wear (no movement) then no need to replace. Since they are cheap then your call. On my machine with short auger inside shaft the auger assembly is installed with the plastic bushing inside the outer auger shaft and then the bushing housing installed. The auger assembly is then pushed into the bucket and aligned with the impeller housing noting the bearing impeller side cup is in place with the screw threads fully engaged in the impeller housing. Then loosely attach the auger bushing assembly. Then attach the impeller bearing to the shaft and secure the outer housing to the impeller side housing. You should be able to secure the auger bushing housing and the impeller bearing housing in alignment. Looking at the parts for the full width auger shaft (Pro model) they appear to be very similar to my short auger shaft bushings, so your probable long auger inner shaft would use the same process.

The impeller bearing is very expensive. I have replaced 2 (on my 3rd) on my machine. The first was good after 2 years but I replaced it since the machine was apart. The new bearing from Ariens lasted 2 years and was not smooth running, a notchy feel, so it was replaced and the new one is still working fine after 1 year. So if your bearing is smooth running then I would re-use it since a new one may be short lived. Ensure there is no free play between bearing and shaft. A lot of salt and water buildup at EOD in my area causes snowblower to become a water pump sometimes so likely a reason for bearing failure.

Good luck.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

thanks again Town. As I mentioned, this is my first Ariens 2 stage disassembly, so I appreciate the tips. The impeller bearing seems ok, so I will re-use. I (lightly) pounded off the auger shaft bushings, one came off real easy. I think I will replace the plastic bushings, and maybe the metal bushings too. One of the metal end bushings has 2 broken screws in it, and now 1 broken easy out too. And I know that sometimes the easy out can mess up threads, and I don't want that. I need to ask my neighbor if he is willing to spend $40 on these items.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

So as I am looking over the disassembled parts of the auger assembly, I noticed that the auger shaft appears not-centered relative to the gearbox. The left side shaft (this was the side that sheared the pin) has 1-1/2" exposed beyond the auger, and the right side only 3/4". Did something slip when the pins were sheared, or when I was removing the auger end bushings? Maybe when I was pounding on the bushing to remove it?

Do I need to take apart the gearbox now? and did I potentially damage anything or just slid the shaft on its key?

Thanks.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

paulm12 said:


> So as I am looking over the disassembled parts of the auger assembly, I noticed that the auger shaft appears not-centered relative to the gearbox. The left side shaft (this was the side that sheared the pin) has 1-1/2" exposed beyond the auger, and the right side only 3/4". Did something slip when the pins were sheared, or when I was removing the auger end bushings? Maybe when I was pounding on the bushing to remove it?
> 
> Do I need to take apart the gearbox now? and did I potentially damage anything or just slid the shaft on its key?
> 
> Thanks.


The inner auger shaft has a semi circular keyway that the key fits into so the shaft movement is limited to the width of the wheel gear keyway since there are fittings between the wheel gear and the seals. There should be a little movement of the shaft sideways but very small and not 3/4" or more. I think the gearbox has a problem so remove the two outer auger shafts as a first step. Likely you will see the problem then. Good opportunity to take the gearbox apart to get a good look at any internal damage. New front metal seal, two side seals and impeller shaft seal would be required as well as top cover gasket and some L3 oil. Plus any damaged parts. 

The damage was likely done when the shear pin encountered something solid so it broke to save the gearbox. I don't think it would be anything you did.

Good luck.


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## rod330 (Oct 9, 2015)

Rather than trying to pound the scraper bar and auger shell back into alignment, try using a larger adjustable wrench. Open the jaws of the adjustable wrench just enough to slip into place and bend the metal back into shape. It will take a little time since you're bending a small area but this technique will give you much more control over trial and error hammer blows.

Some prior owner failed to properly maintain this machine (no skid snows and auger shell wear) so you're wise to carefully check all other major components.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

Rod: thanks, I was able to most bend the housing back to level, with a little local pounding around the bumps. It seemed to work, we'll see during assembly. And yes, the machine was run improperly and not maintained. Always a shame. 

Town: thanks, I actually was able to very lightly pound the shaft back into place, 3/8" movement which split the difference. I barely tapped on the shaft end, propping the gearbox stationary. From the drawings it appears that this unit has 1 long auger shaft, and the worm wheel (circular gear) is keyed into it. So I think the shaft can slide left and right along the length of the key a bit. Of course the resistance to this movement is that gear against the stationary worm gear from the impeller shaft. Does this make sense?

I drained the gearbox, and from what I can tell everything looks ok. I may still take the gearbox apart if it is easy just to see everything. Thanks again for the replies. Now I know a little bit about Ariems 2 stage auger systems.
.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

paulm12 said:


> Rod: thanks, I was able to most bend the housing back to level, with a little local pounding around the bumps. It seemed to work, we'll see during assembly. And yes, the machine was run improperly and not maintained. Always a shame.
> 
> Town: thanks, I actually was able to very lightly pound the shaft back into place, 3/8" movement which split the difference. I barely tapped on the shaft end, propping the gearbox stationary. From the drawings it appears that this unit has 1 long auger shaft, and the worm wheel (circular gear) is keyed into it. So I think the shaft can slide left and right along the length of the key a bit. Of course the resistance to this movement is that gear against the stationary worm gear from the impeller shaft. Does this make sense?
> 
> ...


To make sense there would need to be a long keyway cut into the inner auger shaft. That is not typically the case. There is usually a half moon key and keyway in the auger shaft which limits side movement to the width of the worm gear up to the washer and bushing on each side of the worm gear. I don't think there can be an allowance of 3/8" movement of the auger shaft left and right for 3/4" total movement. To get that excess movement I would think the shaft with half moon key would push the washer and bushing and the seal outward. You would see this because the seal should fit snugly into the gearbox. 

I would remove the outer auger to get a better look at the inner auger shaft and the gear case seals. Something is not correct there, but I am not experienced enough to know what caused the problem.

Just my opinion.


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

I'm confused by your terms "outer" and "inner" auger shafts. I generally reference the shafts as an impeller shaft and an auger shaft. I think the 24" auger shaft slipped a bit left to right, similar to the motion when removing or installing its worm gear on it. See item #21 on this diagram: https://www.jackssmallengines.com/j...5000-074999-compact-24/gear-case-and-impeller

thanks again.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

paulm12 said:


> I'm confused by your terms "outer" and "inner" auger shafts. I generally reference the shafts as an impeller shaft and an auger shaft. I think the 24" auger shaft slipped a bit left to right, similar to the motion when removing or installing its worm gear on it. See item #21 on this diagram: https://www.jackssmallengines.com/j...5000-074999-compact-24/gear-case-and-impeller
> 
> thanks again.


I referenced the part 21 as the inner auger shaft to distinguish from the outer auger shaft which has the strakes and ribbon to move snow from sides to the middle. This was due to me referencing both parts and did not want to confuse. Wrong strategy obviously.


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

paulm12 said:


> Daunte: it has the B&S 205cc engine, see pic. Let me know if you need other pics or info.
> 
> Oneacer: yep, I love my WorkMate tables. I have 2 full size tables, and 2 table top versions, all bought for $10 or less each.


could not find much used but there is a new one on ebay although not as cheap as I hoped to find but none the less you can get one.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pull-Start...248606&hash=item3fb076dbb8:g:63YAAOSw07lbiB4I


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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

yeah, thanks Dauntae. I saw a few on EBay. 

I talked to the owner, and he does not want to spend the money on this machine. I am glad, since he really doesn't have the time or desire to maintain it, and it would probably sit outside. I really don't want to start another project, especially an Ariens (good machines, but I am used to Toro). So I will probably part this one out. Anyone need any thing from it?

Thanks all for the help.


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## AnOldGearhead (Nov 18, 2017)

paulm12 said:


> So I will probably part this one out. Anyone need any thing from it?



Sure, I'd be interested in the discharge chute and all of the related chute control stuff. If the price is right I'd be interested in the whole machine. Shoot me a private message and also mention what town (or nearby town) you live in. Thanks!


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## Peet (Dec 21, 2020)

I have a 9 or 10 year old Poulan Pro 30 inch with a bent hopper bottom. (Where the scraper connects). It is just slightly bowed toward the center. Before replacing the scraper do I simply bend this back? Any tips for not wrecking it and controlling the bend? The bottom of the bow is about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch from aligned. Thanks for your help!














the scraper can I simply bend this back? Any tips for not wrecking it and controlling the bend?


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Peet said:


> the scraper can I simply bend this back? Any tips for not wrecking it and controlling the bend?


Take off the scraper bar first. Use a long lever and gentle force. I would use my largest set of channel-lock pliers that are about 2 feet long, with a small metal plate to spread the force. Looks like the bottom of the impeller housing is kinked, too? A very large adjustable wrench would also work.

Harbor Freight has 20" Groove Joint Pliers: 20 in. High Performance Groove Joint Pliers








24 in. Adjustable Jumbo Wrench


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## Johnny G1 (Jan 28, 2020)

I would use a piece of angle iron 1x2 and that would get everything straight again and not bend in future, Just my thought's.


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## Peet (Dec 21, 2020)

Excellent! Thanks!


tabora said:


> Take off the scraper bar first. Use a long lever and gentle force. I would use my largest set of channel-lock pliers that are about 2 feet long, with a small metal plate to spread the force. Looks like the bottom of the impeller housing is kinked, too? A very large adjustable wrench would also work.
> 
> Harbor Freight has 20" Groove Joint Pliers: 20 in. High Performance Groove Joint Pliers
> 
> ...


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## Peet (Dec 21, 2020)

Johnny G1 said:


> I would use a piece of angle iron 1x2 and that would get everything straight again and not bend in future, Just my thought's.


I can’t picture how this might go or how I might do that. I do like the idea of making it better than it was new. Any videos or sites I might visit?


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@Peet,

He is referring to welding/bolting on a piece of angle iron across the back side of the bucket, just above the cutting edge, for strength and to prevent future flex in the bucket once you get it back into alignment.


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## Peet (Dec 21, 2020)

oneacer said:


> @Peet,
> 
> He is referring to welding/bolting on a piece of angle iron across the back side of the bucket, just above the cutting edge, for strength and to prevent future flex in the bucket once you get it back into alignment.


Ok. Got it. Any photos of previous support like that? I did find a guy on youtube who took some angle iron and fashioned himself a really nice/ strong scraper. I don't really have a drill press, welder, cutting table or expertise for that. I've purchased a new OEM husqvarna scraper and should be able to straighten out the bottom of the bucket with Tabora's suggestions above in post #24. When replacing scraper do I automatically use a drill brush to clean up any paint chipping and spray paint? I think I can prevent future bends by reducing my speed and taking more care as I'm becoming a better driver! The 30 inch Poulan Pro has been a beast for me save that minor bowing that has occurred. Thanks again!


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@Peet,

For the average homeowner, once you straighten out the bucket and install the new scraper bar, and adjust the skid shoes properly, you should be all set.

FWIW, I have switched all my blowers, and the ones I repair, to the Arnold Poly Roller Skids (on sale for 22.50 at Amazon and Home Depot) .... and the way I adjust my bucket is:: .... on a level surface, place a wooden yardstick or some wooden paint stirrers under the scraper bar/cutting edge, then loosen the side skids, bring them down flush to the ground and tighten them.


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## Peet (Dec 21, 2020)

oneacer said:


> @Peet,
> 
> For the average homeowner, once you straighten out the bucket and install the new scraper bar, and adjust the skid shoes properly, you should be all set.
> 
> ...


Thanks for recommendation. Seems like the wheels freeze for some folks on amazon and then then they can wear quickly. I have the other Arnold Poly ones as you can see in the photo. Heavy and thick. I will review after a couple seasons.

Final question - why does my snow blower have a gas valve? Is that so that I can tilt it etc without it leaking while working on it? Thanks again!


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

I haver never had those wheels freeze up ... always work flawless and effortlessly, roll right along smoothly.

That is a gas shut off ... keeps gas from flowing into the engine if something fails in your carburetor. Some use it to shut off the fuel, and run the machine till it quits, but that has the possibility of crusting any residual fuel left in the carb ... JMHO


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## Fat City (Feb 11, 2017)

paulm12 said:


> Rod: thanks, I was able to most bend the housing back to level, with a little local pounding around the bumps. It seemed to work, we'll see during assembly. And yes, the machine was run improperly and not maintained. Always a shame.
> 
> Town: thanks, I actually was able to very lightly pound the shaft back into place, 3/8" movement which split the difference. I barely tapped on the shaft end, propping the gearbox stationary. From the drawings it appears that this unit has 1 long auger shaft, and the worm wheel (circular gear) is keyed into it. So I think the shaft can slide left and right along the length of the key a bit. Of course the resistance to this movement is that gear against the stationary worm gear from the impeller shaft. Does this make sense?
> 
> ...


 To bend metal, use a Cresent Wrench set to almost closed . Anyone remember ' Frame Wrenches ' ? They looked like almost closed Cresent Wrenches . Used to bend Automotive Frames . A skillled worker could do wonders with these .


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## Fat City (Feb 11, 2017)

oneacer said:


> I haver never had those wheels freeze up ... always work flawless and effortlessly, roll right along smoothly.
> 
> That is a gas shut off ... keeps gas from flowing into the engine if something fails in your carburetor. Some use it to shut off the fuel, and run the machine till it quits, but that has the possibility of crusting any residual fuel left in the carb ... JMHO


 Use the shut off valve when transporting machine . Bouncing fuel can create hydrallic pressure, which can unseat carb needle .


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Never heard that one .....


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Peet said:


> Thanks for recommendation. Seems like the wheels freeze for some folks on amazon and then then they can wear quickly. I have the other Arnold Poly ones as you can see in the photo. Heavy and thick. I will review after a couple seasons.


Full disclosure... I screwed up last year and didn't check the port-side skid wheel before heading out of the garage. It was entirely encrusted in melt ice that ran down off the auger housing. One pass down the driveway and back up and I noticed it was dragging. Ground a flat on the wheel, but it was easy to repair with some JB Weld Plastic Repair. Still going strong...

















Peet said:


> Final question - why does my snow blower have a gas valve? Is that so that I can tilt it etc without it leaking while working on it? Thanks again!


Turn it off every time you park your snowblower. It will keep the fuel from flowing where it doesn't belong if your float valve sticks.


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