# How To Remove Seized On Augers Typical For HS80 HS55



## Dodge (Sep 13, 2014)

This is a discussion about pullers and mechanical advantage as it is applied to the general problem of removing seized on augers. The example is an HS55 but this can be applied across brands. The number of Honda HS80s out there is shrinking and one of the end of life scenarios is a broken auger gearbox case due to the auger being seized on the shaft. This is written for the ones who want to keep the older machines going. I am sure others have solutions for this issue as well this is really just a summary of a method that has worked for me and a bit of discussion to go along with it.

I have seen some of the results of a badly set up "pull" and it can result in a parts machine if you are not careful. Mushroomed bearing journals and bent auger shafts are things that can be avoided. 

Every mechanic has a drawer full of pullers and various set up pieces. Different augers will require adaptation. 

What does a puller do exactly? It is a force multiplier or lever which gives mechanical advantage to move two objects in opposite directions along an axis common to both of the objects. One of the objects may remain fixed while the other moves but the forces are the same.

Let's look at a simple puller most of us are familiar with, the wine bottle geared cork puller. A rack and gear lever system pushes against the bottle while pulling the cork towards the puller. Note one important thing, it is not necessary to hold the wine bottle while accomplishing this. You can set it on a table, drop it on the floor or whatever, the "pull" is accomplished without holding the bottle by using the cork puller to generate those two opposing forces. I will refer back to this.

Now let's look at a mechanic's puller which typically has a loading arm, a forcing screw and a method of attachment such as studs, hooked arms, jointed hooked arms or threaded rod. Whatever it looks like it still has to generate those same two opposing forces along an axis or as we say with a shaft, "in an axial direction". The mechanical advantage comes to us from the forcing screw. The thread acts like a ramp as we turn the screw. Think of yourself moving a 5 ton block of stone on rollers up a very low incline ramp rather than lifting it vertically. That is how the forcing screw thread gives us leverage.

But what happens if you try to move that same 5 ton block without rollers up that ramp? Now the forces of friction come in to play and you cannot move that stone. In just the same way there are no rollers on the forcing screw thread and the forces of friction on that thread will transfer your applied turning force on the screw to radial motion around the axis.

Try this with a puller setup on your auger and if the auger or puller rotates rather than pushing the stuck shaft out, this would be an example of friction on the forcing screw thread upsetting your pull. Things go out of alignment and that can cause damage.
What can you do? Can you get two friends to hold the auger while a third holds the puller in alignment as you turn the screw? Can you clamp the auger to a table? Can you use a torch to heat the daylights out of it? Two torches at the same time? Possibly someone else with a large hammer? All of this has been tried and you might get it apart without damage but you would need some luck. The solution lies in a design that will offset and reduce those frictional forces. 

A word about heat. Heat makes steel weak and very elastic. After long experience I can say that heat and pullers should not be used together. Something always goes egg shaped and sometimes something breaks. Please don't ask me how I know this. There is an exception for shrinking steel as a method of fixing parts together but that is not what the subject is here.

We have to look to the wine cork example to design our set up so that we need not "hold" the auger to prevent rotation

What we are aiming for is to apply a hundred or more foot pounds of force and with leverage from our forcing screw to get a result of a ton or even many tons force in an axial direction. We want it all directed in an axial pull.

Enough theory.

Here are the parts that I use for the set up. There are two large adjustables and a 3/4 socket on a breaker bar. The puller crossarm is a Proto J4226CA with a 3/4 - 12 Acme thread. The forcing screw is a Proto J4225S. This screw has a recess for a replaceable tip which we can use. If you want to learn more about Acme thread I suggest looking up a Wiki on it.








The puller arms are made from 1 1/2 x 1/2 cold rolled steel starting with a piece 10 inches long. Bend a couple degrees past 90 with a tight bend.
The return measures 1 1/2 inches on the inside. The slot on the arm is 1/2 by 1 5/8 and is 7/8 inches in from the end of the long arm.








You will need a socket head cap screw 5/16 x 3/4 inch long and a suitable washer as pictured for the end of the forcing screw. Chamfer but do not round the cap screw to fit in the end of the bearing retaining cap screw which is placed back in the auger shaft without the washer that is normally on it.















Now take a 6 inch set of bearing shells and mount it just behind the joint in the auger shaft where the shear bolt goes. Set up and align the rest of the puller pieces. This size of shell may seem a bit of overkill but it is not. 
























Have a friend hold one of the adjustables while you hold the other arranged as shown in the pictures. Lubricate the forcing screw thread with EP gear oil. I use ACDelco 75W-90 synthetic GL-5 for the auger gearbox and have some on hand for the forcing screw thread. Turn the forcing screw. Tap the puller arms into position 180 degrees apart as you apply force. You can apply several tons of force this way and the auger should give up it's hold. 

This is a mock up for the pictures. The pictures are from an HS55 which had already had the augers pulled. Look carefully and you will see anti seize on the shaft.

Do use penetrating oil at each end and put a paper towel bung in the shear pin hole and top it up. It cannot hurt.

In spite of what I said heating is an option but a last resort. I will add a bit on heating later.
Edit to follow in a few days.


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## db9938 (Nov 17, 2013)

Another method could be electrolytic rust removal. 

I removed my HS 622 augers and impeller that way.


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## Dodge (Sep 13, 2014)

If one had a container to suit an auger it looks like an easy way remove rust. I have noticed that inside a seized auger tube there are places even penetrating oil will not reach. With this method the wet area inside the tube must expand as the hours tick by. I will have to try it when I get a chance. I think there are salts left in the pores of the metal surface that promote rusting after this process is finished. They can probably be neutralized in another type of rinse. Otherwise the surface rusts (oxidizes) fairly quickly.


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## db9938 (Nov 17, 2013)

I used a five-gallon bucket, and did one side at a time, supporting it with 2x2 boards. And I was also careful, so as to not allow the aluminum to touch the solution. I am not sure what the process would do, or not do the the case, but I did not what to take a chance.

I set the auger in dry, supported it, then filled with water accordingly. Easy, peasy.

I even was able to focus the current to just the internal surfaces of the augers and impellers, by using a section of fuel line as insulators. I found that two, placed about an inch from the ends, worked well. And, for the impeller, used a 3/4" long pieced, slit so that it would slip onto the end of the re-bar I used.


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

_*Dodge*_, 
That is an excellent write up. 

_*db*_.
How do you dispose of the water after the process?
I have what I need to do the process to try and free up the siezed augers on my HS55 (I actually cut the shaft off leaving the gear box with short ends, sort of like an HSXXX series gear box-it will be sort of upgaded to "like an HSXXX series augers/gearbox with a center support" once it is fixed) but do not know what to do with the water after.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

Great thread, love seeing this type of stuff.


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## db9938 (Nov 17, 2013)

hsblowersfan said:


> _*Dodge*_,
> That is an excellent write up.
> 
> _*db*_.
> ...


The water solution is nothing more than the soap, rust, and water. So as far as the risk of doing anything harmful, well I don't think that it's there. It's a good question, but the only risk that I see here are the gasses that are put off, the arc risk, and making sure that you do not use anything but iron with iron. 

There are some folks out there that will suggest using a stainless piece as the sacrificial rod. And in further reading, by doing so you risk in the process of making the same stuff that the Erin Brockovich movie, that made folks sick. I'm not a chemist, but I am aware that there is some element of chrome in stainless, and the last thing I want to do, is create a toxic soup in the garage. 

That all said, I let the residue naturally dry out, and all that was left was the rust.


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Thanks _*db*_


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