# Three Stage Snowblowers?



## ztnoo (Nov 26, 2015)

I saw my first three stage blower at a Big R (farm supply, outdoor equipment, and household/hardware retailer in Indiana and Illinois) store just before Christmas while shopping. It was a Cadet Cub. I see Sears is also selling these.

I know nothing about these newer machine and have read nothing about them.
Are they more effective in blowing snow than familiar two stage blowers, or are they just mechanical novelties and a marketing tangent?

Post your opinions, pro and con.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

I know *ZERO* about these machines but I'll happily stick with my ss and two stage blowers. There are a few guys here that have them and seem satisfied with them but I jiust know I'll not own one unless someone gives me one of them. I honestly don't see the point of this design.


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## ztnoo (Nov 26, 2015)

How new is the idea?
Did they just begin manufacturing them this year???


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

ztnoo said:


> How new is the idea?
> Did they just begin manufacturing them this year???


There've been 3 stage blowers around for a while but I've not seen this particular design until the past couple years. I believe Sears had a three stage design that had a smaller auger above the primary auger. It was and still is a pretty good blower. There are a couple other brands that I can't recall at the moment and they also had a 2nd auger above the main auger. If I think of them I'll post again.


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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

lots of info already in the forums. the "search" feature will find them


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Snowblower Forum : Snow Blower Forums - Waterlooboy2hp's Album: My Jakes Plus - Picture


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...-beast-snowblower-advice-comments-please.html


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

I'm still skeptical if there is any advantage but the owners of this kind of 3 stage say there is and so far haven't come across anyone with one saying they regretted the purchase.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

ztnoo said:


> I saw my first three stage blower at a Big R (farm supply, outdoor equipment, and household/hardware retailer in Indiana and Illinois) store just before Christmas while shopping. It was a Cadet Cub. I see Sears is also selling these.
> 
> I know nothing about these newer machine and have read nothing about them.
> Are they more effective in blowing snow than familiar two stage blowers, or are they just mechanical novelties and a marketing tangent?
> ...



MTD manufactures these so called 3 stage machines they may be under the Cub Cadet, Troy Built or Craftsman names. From my research on these they are very good for deeper snows but tend to get sloppy with the 3-4 inch storms (scattering snow around, instead of cleanly throwing it out the chute). Additionally the owner's manual refers you to the dealer for belt changes not sure why, maybe for profits, perhaps it is a bear to change.

I personally would prefer an Ariens Deluxe 28 SHO or something similar. If you get a lot of deep snows the 3 stage machines may be a good option for you, I have read that they are quite effective on deep EOD plow piles.

Best of luck with whichever machine you choose!


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## ztnoo (Nov 26, 2015)

Well, I'm not in the market for a snowblower as I have two already which fulfill my needs.
I'm just curious as to what forum member's thoughts and opinions are on these.
Is it a worthwhile and useful new concept, or just a way to mesmerize the public into thinking this is the greatest thing since slice bread?


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Have a 3 stage Cub. Just bought it this year. Haven't had a lot of snow here yet but I don't find it sloppy in lesser snows. Anxious to try it out in 12-24 inches of snow. So far very happy with it. I wouldn't say it's any better or any worse than 2 stage machines I've had but like I said , I haven't had an opportunity to really test it yet in deep snow


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## Spectrum (Jan 6, 2013)

ztnoo said:


> How new is the idea?
> Did they just begin manufacturing them this year???


This incarnation of the center screw is new to my knowledge so I need to give them points for creativity. I haven't ever considered getting sow to the impeller as a primary limiting factor. When you can;t make headway it's usually for lack of traction to push the 2 dead side plates into a bank so the augers can digest.

Prior attempts at 3 stage machines generally focused on dealing with higher banks / deeper snow. If you browse here you can see this done with stacked auger screws or rotating overhead rakes that moved snow downward. These features were offered in the 70's, usually on the borderline brands and then they faded away for decades. In this regard these new machines have pitifully small diameter augers that in themselves should promise the impeller easy work give adequate HP.

By my recollection this is season 3 for this concept.

Pete


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## bad69cat (Nov 30, 2015)

I can't imagine that being vastly better than a 2 stage? Maybe eating up the chunky EOD stuff? It looks like the gearbox is being asked to do a lot more work without being much beefier.... I would be concerned about that


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## Landngroove (Oct 12, 2015)

Not having tried one, but living in Vermont, where we do have at times 1'-3' snowstorms, my 40 + year old Ariens 2 stage, has no problems, even at the end of the drive, where the town plows leave deep packed snow. IMHO the 3 stage is a gimmick that will eventually fade away.


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## happycamper (Jan 3, 2015)

From reviews and looking at these in person, the auger is very high on these blowers. Because of this, they are worthless in light snowfalls and basically just push the snow instead of blowing it.


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

I've never owned one but they did very well in consumer reports testing. The cub cadet 3 stage machines rank very high on the CR list. In fact the 3X 30HD is ranked NUMBER 1 on consumer reports list of snow blowers. Highlights include snow removal speed, plow pile removal, throwing distance, surface cleaning and handling. 

Not a gimmick. Apparently that 3rd stage is very useful for snow removal.

The CR list is not what I expected to see at all, the first Honda comes in at number 14, the first Toro comes in at numer 18. There are 4 Troy Built models in the top 10! There are 2 Ariens in the top 10. 2 Craftsman models make the top 10 also.

I know you can't believe CR for everything and I take their rankings with a grain of salt, but the 'list' definitely has an impact on blower sales numbers. 
Supposedly they do infact really test the machines.


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## jermar (Dec 10, 2014)

I also saw the review in Consumer Reports. They said the Cub line is among the most reliable, yet the MTDs had the poorest reliability. I'm confused because the Cub is made by MTD.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

ztnoo said:


> Is it a worthwhile and useful new concept, or just a way to mesmerize the public into thinking this is the greatest thing since slice bread?


Speaking of sliced bread, this is supposed to help keep the front end from rising. Not sure if this qualifies for 3X or not :huh:










And that quality issue with consumer reports is a hard one to figure out. You have to wonder how impartial they are or if MTD really is building to a better specification when they make a unit for Cub. I know the Troys by MTD don't feel any different than an MTD and don't seem to be anything special. They're just living off the reputation the old Troy Horse tillers had for being nearly indestructible. That was earned and deserved. I'd almost rather have them just retire the names of the old brands when the companies are sold and a new cheesy product is substituted.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

i have an old two stage cub cadet that is 30+ years old with 16" augers and a 14" impeller on a 26" 11hp (repower) machine and it works equally well in 3" and 23" and has never been a problem with EOD even a day after the plow put it there. I just don't think there is room for much improvement in the clearing ability of a normal two stage blower. The old powershift which could shift the bucket weight is probably more useful at EOD then a third auger could ever be. 

My solution to the bucket riding up and still not over work myself was the addition of home made roller skids (made from uhmw)which have almost no wear after 4 years of hard use and the addition of 20lbs of nose weight to this already heavy 225lb snowblower topping it out at 245lbs. Also having a real differential helps a lot.

I will just stick with what i know works and will take a well maintained 30 40 or even 50 year old machine over a new any day.

Just my 2 cents

Carl


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

They are not worthless in light snowfalls. I have used mine in light snowfalls and it works just fine.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

I wouldn't say the 3 stage is a gimmick. They have been on the market for a few years now and score very high in consumer reviews and opinions (for anyone who actually has tried one and has an opinion to offer). But I guess time will tell. They are a bit more expensive than 2 stage models from the same brand but still less expensive than 2 stage models from some other brands. I guess it all depends what one's preference might be.
I am very happy with mine. I think with care and maintenance , as with any piece of equipment , it will give me many years of good use and satisfaction


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## skutflut (Oct 16, 2015)

Kiss4aFrog said:


> Speaking of sliced bread, this is supposed to help keep the front end from rising. Not sure if this qualifies for 3X or not :huh:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks like lots of places for potential problems on that arrangement.


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

Kiss4aFrog said:


> Speaking of sliced bread, this is supposed to help keep the front end from rising. Not sure if this qualifies for 3X or not :huh:


Not to go too far OT here but I've always found the tendency of the front end of blowers to ride up to be a big issue. Not just with EOD but all the time... I find I'm pretty much constantly having to lift upward on the handles to keep the front down. Which is darn tiring when you're doing a 300' driveway!

Which begs the question: why not just have the augers rotate the other way so they'd tend to pull the front down instead of up? It obviously wouldn't work on a single stage, but it seems doable on a 2-stage machine.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

ELaw said:


> Which begs the question: why not just have the augers rotate the other way so they'd tend to pull the front down instead of up? It obviously wouldn't work on a single stage, but it seems doable on a 2-stage machine.


Because if they did that, the augers would be spiraling snow to the outside edges of the bucket, instead of toward the center and the impeller..it basically wouldnt work as a snowblower if the augers spun in the opposite direction.

Scot


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## Snowhawg (Feb 20, 2015)

According to my dealer who used to sell them they are a complete gimmick intended for the mass market to make uneducated consumers think they are getting a better machine. 3 stage must be better than 2 stage, right? There's a reason you don't find them in any of the "high end" machines.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

I knew if i went to youtube and searched for "slow motion snowblower", someone would have a video! 






Check out the rotation of the augers..on both sides, the spirals move from the outside edge toward the center, to force the snow to the center where the imepller can pick it up and shoot it out..

If you reversed the auger rotation, they would be spiraling outward, forcing snow away from the center and toward the outside edges of the bucket, where the snow would just exit the side of the bucket and not be forced out the chute.

And I dont see how the augers rotation is forcing the bucket upward, or how reversing it would force it downward..im not sure that is a thing.. if a bucket is riding up, it probably just needs more weight on the front end.

Scot


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

sscotsman said:


> Because if they did that, the augers would be spiraling snow to the outside edges of the bucket, instead of toward the center and the impeller..it basically wouldnt work as a snowblower if the augers spun in the opposite direction.
> 
> Scot


_*No*_ and _*yes*_. 
I _*will not*_ work if you left the augers the way they currently are (it would push snow to the sides of the auger housing).
If you swapped the augers than it _*will*_ work as they will be pulling snow towards the center.


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

Yeah I didn't mean to reverse the rotation without changing the auger configuration! Of course you want them to move snow toward the center.

The upward-moving tendency comes from the fact that the "front" of the augers (yeah I know a circle can't really have a "front" but you know what I mean) is moving downward, and when reacted against stationary snow that motion tends to force the bucket upward.

The traditional fix for that, which works, is to add weight to the front. But that increases stress on the handles and on the operator when you want to lift the bucket as when turning. It seems to me that reversing the augers could provide downward force when you want it, and no force when you don't want it.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Snowhawg said:


> According to my dealer who used to sell them they are a complete gimmick intended for the mass market to make uneducated consumers think they are getting a better machine. 3 stage must be better than 2 stage, right? There's a reason you don't find them in any of the "high end" machines.


I would not consider myself uneducated in the least. No one ever made the claim that 3 stage is better than 2 stage. Cub Cadet has simply stated that *their* 3 stage snowblower removes snow up to 50 % faster than *their* 2 stage snowblower. 
A local dealer here that sold only 2 stage blowers last year is now carrying a line of 3 stage blowers ? Why ? Because they are a good product that sells. I suppose if another "high end" company had come up with the 3 stage system it would be heralded as the best thing since the industrial revolution.
Again , people who have not actually used one , should not be offering their opinion on the product. I have never used an Ariens but I don't say they are good , bad or in between. How could I ? I do see a lot of problems posted on here with Ariens blowers. Should I therefore offer an opinion that they are no good ? I only offer opinions on what I have used. And I don't think that everyone who buys a 3 stage is uneducated in their decision or otherwise


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

Your point is well taken Canadagoose. 

From doing some reading it seems there are some pluses and minuses. The pluses are well discussed here. However some say the downside is that on light levels of snow they tend to make a mess. How is your experience with small snow falls. i.e. under 4 inches.


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## 1894 (Dec 16, 2014)

Don't get too flustered there Goose , it's all good IMHO Nothing more than folks posting their opinions and why they feel the way they do. I don't see anyone disrespecting anyone else s reasons or choices . 
I'm sure some folks opinions might be changed if a 3X was alongside their favorite machines in conditions like these : 





Yes that is a basketball in her mouth


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

Snowhawg said:


> According to my dealer who used to sell them they are a complete gimmick intended for the mass market to make uneducated consumers think they are getting a better machine. 3 stage must be better than 2 stage, right? There's a reason you don't find them in any of the "high end" machines.


I'm not so sure. Why are they ranked so high by the consumer groups who actually test them. Highly regarded by folks here that own them. Your dealer doesn't sell them so of course he'll discredit them. He wants you to buy one of his 2 stage machines. 

Maybe the high end companies are kicking themselves for not coming out with this. Adding new excitement to spark sales. I'm sure this cork screw design is patented and protected by MTD now. Hat's off to them for offering something different that not only works, but works well enough to get noticed AND recommended by the number 1 consumer resource agency.

Like I said, I don't own one and am perfectly happy with my Ariens 2 stage but I'd love to try one of these 3 stagers out!

Gimmick or not, CR likes them enough to make them #1 on the list. That alone will generate many sales.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Toro-8-2-4 said:


> Your point is well taken Canadagoose.
> 
> From doing some reading it seems there are some pluses and minuses. The pluses are well discussed here. However some say the downside is that on light levels of snow they tend to make a mess. How is your experience with small snow falls. i.e. under 4 inches.


Hi Toro 8-2-4
I have used it with 4 inch snowfalls. I have not noticed it leaving trails of snow. I know I have read that some where but I have not had the problem. No shear pins breaking either. I can honestly say my only complaint is that reverse is too slow. I guess that is a complaint on many of the newer machines. A safety issue perhaps ?


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

1894 said:


> Don't get too flustered there Goose , it's all good IMHO Nothing more than folks posting their opinions and why they feel the way they do. I don't see anyone disrespecting anyone else s reasons or choices .
> I'm sure some folks opinions might be changed if a 3X was alongside their favorite machines in conditions like these :


Hey there 1894. I'm not flustered. I'm simply pointing out that to say "make uneducated consumers think they are getting a better machine. " is no different than me saying people who blindly follow a company simply because of it's color are simple-minded. That's a generalized and untrue statement. All dealers are going to say their product is better. Until I have the opportunity to test every product under the same conditions (which obviously will never happen) I can never truly say which product I think is better. I like what I have and I don't knock what I don't have (or the people that buy them).:icon_whistling:
BTW , that's the kind of snow I'm waiting for ! And that is a nice looking pooch you have there !


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## clphillips72 (Jan 4, 2016)

ztnoo said:


>


I just bought the Craftsman Pro series one that's pictured. I'm assuming it's the 28" one and not the 24".

Haven't needed to use it yet, but I'm excited for our next big snow


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## Snowhawg (Feb 20, 2015)

canadagoose said:


> I would not consider myself uneducated in the least.


Not going to touch this one with a ten foot pole. Don't quit your day job.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

ELaw said:


> Which begs the question: why not just have the augers rotate the other way so they'd tend to pull the front down instead of up? It obviously wouldn't work on a single stage, but it seems doable on a 2-stage machine.





sscotsman said:


> Because if they did that, the augers would be spiraling snow to the outside edges of the bucket, instead of toward the center and the impeller..it basically wouldnt work as a snowblower if the augers spun in the opposite direction.
> 
> Scot


I too have noticed on a regular 2 stage it will try to climb up when driven into hard packed snow. 

Like the Honda I posted (#22) the video of with counter rotating augers, the augers would be designed to rotate backwards to the way they presently rotate so they drag the snow to the middle.
The down side is if the whole auger was doing that then it would likely have a small pile of snow out in from of the augers as that's where the augers would pull it and the impeller wouldn't have enough suction to pull it in over the auger. Once enough snow did build up it would surely feed the impeller but it'd likely IMO never clean that small pile out in front.

I think the Honda idea is more than a gimmick but I'd sure like to hear from some users.

Or the Honda counter rotating outer augers feeding a center MTD 3d stage ??


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Snowhawg said:


> Not going to touch this one with a ten foot pole.
> 
> That's probably a good idea


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

clphillips72 said:


> I just bought the Craftsman Pro series one that's pictured. I'm assuming it's the 28" one and not the 24".
> 
> Haven't needed to use it yet, but I'm excited for our next big snow


Congrats on the nice new machine!


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## Marty013 (Mar 14, 2014)

i think its time a prospective buyer chimes in.. ive been looking at modifying my existing 1984 columbia (MTD) 33in blower... it badly needs a resto mod... the more i look at it.. the less i feel like all the headaches its going to cause.. and in the end WHAT IF i break another axle shaft?? am i going to be abe to find one in 5 years?? probably not! so lets be smart and renew the blower... what are my options??? i narrowed it down to three.. and the first 2 dont matter..

Ariens Deluxe 28SHO.. here it means a mid-framed machine (14in augers and impellers) 306cc engine.. 15ft-lbs.. this would do.. decently.. i should(??) be able to keep the times under 2.5 hours MAX (talking 18plus inches here)
at 1826$ plus taxes of course hmm ok..

Columbia 30in LARGE frame (16in augers and impeller) this is basically my blower.. cut 3 inches narrower.. 420cc engine 21ft-lbs.. this.. i know will handle whatever snow we get and clear the drive under 2 hours MAX (talking 18plus inches here)
at 2150$ plus taxes hmm.. its a little pricier.. but remember that thing about the first 2 dont count??

Columbia (cub cadets are a carbon copy so why bother right?) 3stage 28in HD machine (these are just as hefty as a large frame but are actualy based on small framed models so its less work to handle em around, remember i may only be 35.. but if i keep this for say 20 years that means im 55.. hardly a spring chicken out to fight every storm) 12in augers, and impeller, 420cc engine 21 ft-lbs hey this sounds farmilliar.. now is this going to save me any time over my current machine? the sales staff at CC sez yes 30% (vs a large frame that i already have hmm not sure..) the mechanic on duty was in a simmilliar boat.. 33in arge frame down to a .. gasp 28in HD 3 stager.. HE tells me he saves about 15mins on the larger snows(18in plus) we get.. hardly 30% for what took 2 hours for him before.. but hey.. its still a gain! and even if i break even

the price?? 1800$ plus taxes.. thats riight. its cheaper that a large frame blower 

guess where im buying my next machine...


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## 762mm (Dec 22, 2014)

This 3-stage idea is interesting, but I'd still stick with a basic 2-stage myself simply because more moving parts and more gimmicks = more problems down the line.


It's like cars... in the old days, you could easily get 10+ years out of a car or truck before any major expenses were encountered, such as engine or transmission work... simply because there wasn't much to break on them. It was all pretty straight forward and novelties were kept to a minimum.

Today, because of all the gimmicks they're putting in cars, electric and electronic problems will get you LONG before the engine or tranny give out. At work, we have a fleet of the newer so-called trucks (front wheel drive SUV's and vans) that have had their share of shop down time and are a cause major expenses on stupid electrical stuff, mostly related to the memorizing amount of electronic garbage the manufacturers put in them these days. Every time they come back after the fix, the bill is in the hundreds or even thousands. Before you ask, the warranty for fleet vehicles is shorter than for a consumer vehicles, at lest in our experience.

Me, on the other hand, I like simplicity. I have a late 1990's, body of frame RWD Ford truck with just the basic electronics in it, the most advanced of all that electronic b.s. being the radio (it's all old-school knobs, relays and basic switches, essentially)... and I've yet to have an electrical problem on it! (knock on wood, lol!). In essence, my truck's simplicity has saved me thousands of dollars in repairs over the last 15 years or so.


Simplicity for the Win!


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## lillbear (Jan 5, 2016)

Hey guys
My take on this from the local mechanic at the cadet dealer is they work fine just don't hit anything with that front impeller or it will cost you $$$. The mechanic is a friend of mine. We get an average of 140inch of snow in winter and by February they like to try and widen the roads, that puts chunks of ice pretty big in your driveway sometimes. That is there weak point according to him. 
Just my 2 cent


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## Marty013 (Mar 14, 2014)

lillbear said:


> Hey guys
> My take on this from the local mechanic at the cadet dealer is they work fine just don't hit anything with that front impeller or it will cost you $$$. The mechanic is a friend of mine. We get an average of 140inch of snow in winter and by February they like to try and widen the roads, that puts chunks of ice pretty big in your driveway sometimes. That is there weak point according to him.
> Just my 2 cent


lillbear i couldnt agree more!! both the CC and Columbia dealers told me as of yet no failurs there... time will tell of course.. remember none of these are 5 years old i dont think... 4 maybe.. 5.. duno yet

then again... how many 2 stage augers get bent BACK into sgape right??.. impeller too though hopefully less common a ... i hesitate to use fix here...


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Loco-diablo said:


> I'm not so sure. Why are they ranked so high by the consumer groups who actually test them. Highly regarded by folks here that own them. Your dealer doesn't sell them so of course he'll discredit them. He wants you to buy one of his 2 stage machines.
> 
> Maybe the high end companies are kicking themselves for not coming out with this. Adding new excitement to spark sales. I'm sure this cork screw design is patented and protected by MTD now. Hat's off to them for offering something different that not only works, but works well enough to get noticed AND recommended by the number 1 consumer resource agency.
> 
> ...


Well put


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

clphillips72 said:


> I just bought the Craftsman Pro series one that's pictured. I'm assuming it's the 28" one and not the 24".
> 
> Haven't needed to use it yet, but I'm excited for our next big snow


Looks like an awesome machine ! Enjoy!


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Marty013 said:


> i think its time a prospective buyer chimes in.. ive been looking at modifying my existing 1984 columbia (MTD) 33in blower... it badly needs a resto mod... the more i look at it.. the less i feel like all the headaches its going to cause.. and in the end WHAT IF i break another axle shaft?? am i going to be abe to find one in 5 years?? probably not! so lets be smart and renew the blower... what are my options??? i narrowed it down to three.. and the first 2 dont matter..
> 
> Ariens Deluxe 28SHO.. here it means a mid-framed machine (14in augers and impellers) 306cc engine.. 15ft-lbs.. this would do.. decently.. i should(??) be able to keep the times under 2.5 hours MAX (talking 18plus inches here)
> at 1826$ plus taxes of course hmm ok..
> ...


The local Husqvarna dealer here didn't have much good to say about the 3 stage machines last year but guess what he is carrying this year ? The Columbia 3 stage machines. Let us know how you get along with it.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

lillbear said:


> Hey guys
> My take on this from the local mechanic at the cadet dealer is they work fine just don't hit anything with that front impeller or it will cost you $$$. The mechanic is a friend of mine. We get an average of 140inch of snow in winter and by February they like to try and widen the roads, that puts chunks of ice pretty big in your driveway sometimes. That is there weak point according to him.
> Just my 2 cent


Yes I see what you are saying. However , if you hit a block of ice regardless if it's a 3 stage or a 2 stage , there could be damage. I guess time will tell. 2 stage machines have been around for decades. 3 stage , in it's current form , is relatively new. I hope to get many good years from my Cub and I am happy I bought it.
thanks for the input !


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

canadagoose said:


> Yes I see what you are saying. However , if you hit a block of ice regardless if it's a 3 stage or a 2 stage , there could be damage. I guess time will tell. 2 stage machines have been around for decades. 3 stage , in it's current form , is relatively new. I hope to get many good years from my Cub and I am happy I bought it.
> thanks for the input !


I believe the 3rd stage is not protected by shear pins as the auger are.
If this is not true please correct me.


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

I was wondering the same thing. I was poking through an owners manual that I found online and yes, it looks like the 3rd stage does in fact have a shear pin


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## MagnumB (Oct 1, 2014)

Loco-diablo said:


> I've never owned one but they did very well in consumer reports testing. The cub cadet 3 stage machines rank very high on the CR list. In fact the 3X 30HD is ranked NUMBER 1 on consumer reports list of snow blowers. Highlights include snow removal speed, plow pile removal, throwing distance, surface cleaning and handling.
> 
> Not a gimmick. Apparently that 3rd stage is very useful for snow removal.
> 
> ...


Moving snow.com seems in my opinion, one of the better sites out there to offer solid opinion on all types of units. 

IMHO, while I think the 3 stage idea is sexy, it's a solution to a problem that just doesn't exist today. I think within the MTD lineup it represents the pinnacle of engineering for them (an under engineered brand in the sight of many) and compared to their own two stage units, this is a step up. But in all honesty, I wouldn't hesitate to say there isn't an Ariens/Toro/Honda/Yamaha that hasn't been doing the two stage thing better vs an MTD unit (including EOD). I'm not trying to be negative about MTD, but this is the fruit of their business model. Undersized smooth edge augers, a million shear pins, in some cases massive heavy and powerful engines with not the engineering to take advantage of it. 

So the 3x is a cool design and a great bet in the MTD lineup...but I'd sure look hard at other brands as well depending in your end goals. I will say this, I've seen videos and reports of people with pre impeller stage clogs (close behind the third stage ahead of the main impeller) in wet snow. It's an odd vagary of the three stage, usually in older units a clog happens post impeller...in reality no machine does well in slush, so don't weigh that as too significant, but be aware of it. 

If MTD could engineer a REALLY good chute control, I would move the 3X models up my list of must haves...however the design is a weak point and that's a problem when we absolutely rely on that one feature to work flawlessly. 

Food for thought

A surprising EOD beast is the Ariens 24" SHO. Crushes EOD...neat little machine.


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## MagnumB (Oct 1, 2014)

Loco-diablo said:


> I was wondering the same thing. I was poking through an owners manual that I found online and yes, it looks like the 3rd stage does in fact have a shear pin


For every individual stamped auger piece, there are sheer pins...As mentioned in my previous post, they sheer pin the crap out of their machines. This is...unfortunate. It's like looking at the X-ray of a veteran NFL players knee/leg...pins everywhere. 

...it's like a goth teen on a piercing binge! 

...it's like pin collection on the vest of a model train enthusiast at a train convention!

...it's like the sheer pins have sheer pins...(**too much :wavetowel2


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## happycamper (Jan 3, 2015)

The shear pins also seem to be a weak point. Many of the negative reviews on Home Depot mention that the machine is constantly going through shear pins. One guy had to replace 7 shear pins for a 9" snow.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

happycamper said:


> The shear pins also seem to be a weak point. Many of the negative reviews on Home Depot mention that the machine is constantly going through shear pins. One guy had to replace 7 shear pins for a 9" snow.


Hi HappyCamper

Yes I read that review also. Not sure what the guy was blowing but I haven't had any issues with shear pins breaking. I have read a number of reviews that also specifically make mention of no troubles with shear pins. If it is used to blow snow (hence the name snowblower) I can't see how it would be any worse than any other machine that uses shear pins. I have owned a couple of other brands before I bought my Cub Cadet and had the occasional shear pin break like anyone would but I don't expect the Cub to be any different.
Just my 2 cents based on experience


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Toro-8-2-4 said:


> I believe the 3rd stage is not protected by shear pins as the auger are.
> If this is not true please correct me.


Hi Toro 8-2-4
Yes the third stage is also shear pin protected. I did read one review where the guy claims to have done through many shear pins in one outing. People seem to have pounced on that although many reviews specifically point out no trouble with excessive shear pin breakage. I have owned 2 other brands prior to buying the Cub Cadet and had the occasional shear pin break. I don't expect any thing different with the Cub Cadet and have had no shear pin issues yet. If it does in fact turn out to be a problem , I will definitely post that info as well


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

MagnumB said:


> Moving snow.com seems in my opinion, one of the better sites out there to offer solid opinion on all types of units.
> 
> IMHO, while I think the 3 stage idea is sexy, it's a solution to a problem that just doesn't exist today. I think within the MTD lineup it represents the pinnacle of engineering for them (an under engineered brand in the sight of many) and compared to their own two stage units, this is a step up. But in all honesty, I wouldn't hesitate to say there isn't an Ariens/Toro/Honda/Yamaha that hasn't been doing the two stage thing better vs an MTD unit (including EOD). I'm not trying to be negative about MTD, but this is the fruit of their business model. Undersized smooth edge augers, a million shear pins, in some cases massive heavy and powerful engines with not the engineering to take advantage of it.
> 
> ...



Hi Magnum B
I follow Moving Snow as well. It is one man's opinion that I also take into consideration when reading through reviews.
I don't know what kind of snow you get out there in Alberta but here on PEI we get 4 or 5 foot banks of hard packed heavy snow. I have owned two 2-stage blowers and for smaller snows (18-24 inches) they do the job well. But for the kind of drifting we get here , I do find the 3 stage really chomps through those drifts better. Now this is just based on my experience with 3 different snowblowers. I did look at Ariens , Honda and Yamaha but the extra $$$$$ to me was just not worth it. I didn't see any benefit to those over what I bought . I have never tried one of these machines so I can't comment on how I think they perform. I know the Cub Cadet has a higher intake than either the Yamaha or Honda and that is very helpful to me and something I also weighed when looking at various models. 
Is Cub Cadet considered a top model with orange red and blue ? No it isn't. Should it be ? Maybe . Has anyone ever tried an Ariens , Honda , Yamaha , Toro and Cub Cadet in the same snow on the same day ? Not that I'm aware of although I would really love to have that opportunity myself . I know owners swear by what they own. I have had no problems with my Cub and no regrets. If I had to make the decision again , I'd still get the Cub.
And I'm not aware of any problems with the chute control. It's comparable to everyone else's . Mine actually has the turn crank for moving it side to side (which I prefer to the joystick) and the lever for up and down.
And my augers are not smooth edged . Just my observations from my experiences with snowblowers and snow !


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## SNOWJOB1125 (Apr 4, 2015)

doesnt seem like they have much of an auger to them....'maybe for breaking up chunky icy snow...ive heard mixed reviews...a guy i work with just sold his CC 3 stage last year...he said it didnt perform the way he thought it would....to each his own...ive heard they do good in deep stuff....they look neat, but looks dont really matter when it comes to getting the snow moved...


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## mikeinri (Mar 16, 2015)

Trust me, the worst thing that can happen when you hit something with a snowblower is for a shear pin to NOT break. Replacing pins is a nuisance, but bent/mangled augers and impellers are expensive nightmares.

Mike


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

mikeinri said:


> Trust me, the worst thing that can happen when you hit something with a snowblower is for a shear pin to NOT break. Replacing pins is a nuisance, but bent/mangled augers and impellers are expensive nightmares.
> 
> Mike


Exactly
:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:


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## cansnow1 (Jan 6, 2016)

A neighbor of mine swears by his 3stage that is 3 years old. I saw him use it once and it worked great. He says it's the best ... but everything he owns is the best according to him , so ... 
My 2 stage worked great that day too. I could not see a difference that day.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

SNOWJOB1125 said:


> doesnt seem like they have much of an auger to them....'maybe for breaking up chunky icy snow...ive heard mixed reviews...a guy i work with just sold his CC 3 stage last year...he said it didnt perform the way he thought it would....to each his own...ive heard they do good in deep stuff....they look neat, but looks dont really matter when it comes to getting the snow moved...


Auger is 12 inches which is sufficient for residential use. Don't really need anything larger unless you are using it (and paying for) professional use. Toro's are from 11-14 inches . Yamaha 12.2-13.8 inches. Husqvarna Homeowner series 12 inches and Landowner series 14 inches . Ariens 11-14 inches . Cub Cadets' 2X series actually has an auger as large as 16 inches but again this would be overkill for residential use ; more for the professional . Maybe Cub Cadet's 3X auger looks smaller because they have the largest intake height ? :icon-shrug:


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

Um... I'm not quite getting the distinction between residential and commercial?

To me it's about how much snow you get, how much area you need to clear, and how fast you want to get it done.

According to a neat little online area calculator I found (Area Calculator - Outline a property on a google map and find its area), my driveway and parking area and the area I need to clear in the front yard because our micro-dogs can't tolerate snow is about 8300 square feet or about 2/10 of an acre. If there's more than about 8" of snow that can take several hours to clear with my ST824, and if it's snowing heavily you can only take about an hour break before you have to go out and start again! And believe me I'm not getting paid for that... it's my house. So in my very residential situation, a snowblower that can move the white stuff from point A to point B faster has a lot of value.


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## GMH (Dec 31, 2013)

I have never used a 3 stage but I noticed one thing that Marty013 said. The 3 stage had a 12" auger and impeller and a 420 cc engine. That's the same size engine as the 2 stage with 16" auger and impeller, and bigger than the one with the 14"auger and impeller. That's a good power to size ratio, and for less money. That might allow you to speed up a notch or two and get the job done faster.


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

Ill be interested to hear reviews from member owners here once they get a full season behind them with a 3X. On another note, I believe these machines have 5 year warranties? 
Is that true?


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

ELaw said:


> Um... I'm not quite getting the distinction between residential and commercial?
> 
> To me it's about how much snow you get, how much area you need to clear, and how fast you want to get it done.
> 
> According to a neat little online area calculator I found (Area Calculator - Outline a property on a google map and find its area), my driveway and parking area and the area I need to clear in the front yard because our micro-dogs can't tolerate snow is about 8300 square feet or about 2/10 of an acre. If there's more than about 8" of snow that can take several hours to clear with my ST824, and if it's snowing heavily you can only take about an hour break before you have to go out and start again! And believe me I'm not getting paid for that... it's my house. So in my very residential situation, a snowblower that can move the white stuff from point A to point B faster has a lot of value.


I say residential vs commercial as different websites specify whether their product is intended for residential i.e. a single homestead vs. commercial i.e. several homesteads , apartment buildings , anyone who uses their machine for more than personal use as this puts many more hours and much more wear and tear on the machine. I think some manufacturers (Husqvarna being one if I remember correctly) has a different length of warranty for residential vs.commercial use. If you have a large area to clear and want a commercial grade blower then by all means buy one. I'm not making up the distinctions between the 2 , just pointing out that they exist


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Loco-diablo said:


> Ill be interested to hear reviews from member owners here once they get a full season behind them with a 3X. On another note, I believe these machines have 5 year warranties?
> Is that true?


My Cub Cadet 3X 30 HDT has a 3 year warranty. Husqvarna has a 5 year on their 300 series I believe (although this is a 2 stage). Not sure about the Husqvarna 200 series .
Don't know about Craftsman


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## ELaw (Feb 4, 2015)

canadagoose said:


> I say residential vs commercial as different websites specify...


Ah, okay! I've mostly owned older machines so I haven't paid much attention to what's on the manufacturers' websites.

This reminds me a little of the days when Radio Shack used to sell "regular" and "heavy duty" tuner cleaner for TV sets. I guess the idea was if you watched TV really hard you needed the heavy duty type, otherwise the regular. :smiley-confused009:


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

ELaw said:


> Ah, okay! I've mostly owned older machines so I haven't paid much attention to what's on the manufacturers' websites.
> 
> This reminds me a little of the days when Radio Shack used to sell "regular" and "heavy duty" tuner cleaner for TV sets. I guess the idea was if you watched TV really hard you needed the heavy duty type, otherwise the regular. :smiley-confused009:


hahahaha good one !:signlol:


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

The 3 stage is just a marketing thing guys. They actually work less efficiently in some conditions. The 3rd stage auger throws chunks of snow everywhere in a lot of conditions and gets snow all over the area you have already cleared. Just watch some youtube videos to see what I am talking about. They are especially troublesome in chunky(partially frozen) snow conditions. Some of the shops in my area wont even stock them due to their poor performance in some conditions. I personally want the snow funneled into the impeller, not half thrown out of the auger housing when I'm snowblowing. You dont need to fix what isnt broken, dont fall for marketing gimmicks guys.


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## Marty013 (Mar 14, 2014)

Loco-diablo said:


> Ill be interested to hear reviews from member owners here once they get a full season behind them with a 3X. On another note, I believe these machines have 5 year warranties?
> Is that true?


i think its 5 year on the auger gearbox.. and 3 years on the rest of the machine.. still amongst the best lasting warrantees on market.. like say Ariens.. which everyone here seems to favor... gees from some folks oppinnion they dont need warrantees on the gearboxes dem dar things be bombproof they be! lol


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Tachead said:


> The 3 stage is just a marketing thing guys. They actually work less efficiently in some conditions. The 3rd stage auger throws chunks of snow everywhere in a lot of conditions and gets snow all over the area you have already cleared. Just watch some youtube videos to see what I am talking about. They are especially troublesome in chunky(partially frozen) snow conditions. Some of the shops in my area wont even stock them due to their poor performance in some conditions. I personally want the snow funneled into the impeller, not half thrown out of the auger housing when I'm snowblowing. You dont need to fix what isnt broken, dont fall for marketing gimmicks guys.


Based on your detailed description of how a 3 stage works , are we to conclude that you own one ? I actually do own one and none of the things that you speak of happen . I really wish that people would not post comments about machines they don't own as it is confusing and misleading to people who might be looking for honest reviews . One of my local dealers carries Cub Cadet , Toro and Ariens. There are no issues with "_their poor performance in some conditions_."
I'm afraid your little story doesn't hold any water


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

Tachead said:


> The 3 stage is just a marketing thing guys. The 3rd stage auger throws chunks of snow everywhere in a lot of conditions and gets snow all over the area you have already cleared. Just watch some youtube videos to see what I am talking about.


I tend to agree but I'm the first to say I don't own one and all my "experience" has been from videos.

The big thing that keeps me and should keep you from stating how poorly they do is that so far owners of the 3X machines have only good stuff to say about them and their opinion is way more valuable than our remote video impressions, IMHO that is :icon_whistling:


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

canadagoose said:


> Based on your detailed description of how a 3 stage works , are we to conclude that you own one ? I actually do own one and none of the things that you speak of happen . I really wish that people would not post comments about machines they don't own as it is confusing and misleading to people who might be looking for honest reviews . One of my local dealers carries Cub Cadet , Toro and Ariens. There are no issues with "_their poor performance in some conditions_."
> I'm afraid your little story doesn't hold any water


No, I do not own one because I did my research and am more then happy with the performance of the many 2-stage machines I have used over the years. Your local dealer is unlikely to tell you about an issue when they are trying to sell you a product lol. I worked at a dealership and dealt with many others for parts exc. so, I was told things normal customers are not. I was also a professional mechanic for many years and have worked on hundreds of snowblowers just so you know. All you have to do is watch one of the many youtube videos to see the perpendicular design of the third stage is flawed because it causes snow to be thrown in a perpendicular direction to the auger housing and is further exaggerated by its high rotational speed. In some conditions, this throws snow away from the impeller and even into the areas you have already cleared.






This is an advertising video for one of the 3-stage designs. You can clearly see it throwing snow all over the place from the auger housing. Much more then a 2 stage in which the augers spin much slower and parallel to the auger housing funneling the snow to the impeller.

Another thing to consider is how fast the 3rd stage spins(10x as fast on the above model). This greatly increases both the danger and the chance of damage occurring to the drivetrain. This will cause easier shearing of the shear pins and more damage to the augers themselves when a foreign object is ingested or struck(rock, curb, door mat exc.). It will also increase the risk of differential/gearbox damage.

Now are they terrible? No, they work ok. But, in my opinion they are a fix to a problem that does not exist and introduce other issues/deficiencies that older 2-stage designs don't have.


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

Kiss4aFrog said:


> I tend to agree but I'm the first to say I don't own one and all my "experience" has been from videos.
> 
> The big thing that keeps me and should keep you from stating how poorly they do is that so far owners of the 3X machines have only good stuff to say about them and their opinion is way more valuable than our remote video impressions, IMHO that is :icon_whistling:


I agree that first hand experience is always more valuable. But, owners opinions are often not that valuable either. Look up the term "post-purchase rationalization". I prefer to go on my own education/knowledge/wisdom combined with the personal opinions of the mechanics that work on and test these units. They tend to have a much less biased opinion then the salesman and get to see, first hand, the side by side performance of each.


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## Dryden29 (Jan 10, 2016)

Here’s my experience with a Cub Cadet 3X 26” HD with the 357cc engine (U.S.A. version, the Canadian 420cc were sold out). It worked like a champ, I used it for the 2013-14 Winter in Southwestern Ontario, used it around 12 times in many conditions. The only condition that it struggled a bit was with small amounts though using a faster gear was the solution. The augers being a little higher in the housing than a 2 stage is likely the reason it doesn’t like small amounts. In anything greater than 4” it was unbelievable, you could go at full speed and it wouldn’t bog down ever. And I recall we got a few 12-16” storms and one close to 24”. My only negative is the placement of the back shear pin, it broke once and was quite difficult to change. Pin was stuck and the cover over the middle auger is in the way of trying to tap it out. Overall I really enjoyed using this machine, however, in the following season with the sudden declining health of my shoulders, it was getting more and more difficult to turn the machine even with the triggers. My shoulders were half decent when I was first looking at snow blowers and thought the triggers would be enough of an aid. I was sad that I had to find something else so soon. I believe the Cub 3X HD models are quality machines and should last a long time if maintained properly. 


Anyway, I shopped around for something lighter but the only ones that didn’t affect the shoulders much were the one stage machines. Not a great option for some of the storms we get. Doing more research, including here (Thanks!), came across the auto-turn feature from Ariens so had to check it out at a local dealer, wow I was amazed. It barely takes any effort. Sold the Cub for a very small loss and picked up a 2014 Ariens 24” Deluxe, while not as powerful as the Cub it gets the job done just as well and the auto turn is great for my bad shoulders.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Tachead said:


> No, I do not own one because I did my research and am more then happy with the performance of the many 2-stage machines I have used over the years. Your local dealer is unlikely to tell you about an issue when they are trying to sell you a product lol. I worked at a dealership and dealt with many others for parts exc. so, I was told things normal customers are not. I was also a professional mechanic for many years and have worked on hundreds of snowblowers just so you know. All you have to do is watch one of the many youtube videos to see the perpendicular design of the third stage is flawed because it causes snow to be thrown in a perpendicular direction to the auger housing and is further exaggerated by its high rotational speed. In some conditions, this throws snow away from the impeller and even into the areas you have already cleared.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hu3uNnrKXlk
> 
> ...


All I can say is that my experience using a 3 stage blower , it does not throw snow all over the place , it does not leave a mess behind and it does a terrific job blowing snow . It loves to work .
And my local dealer could have steered me toward an Ariens or a Toro but he didn't. He actually said he initially had reservations about the Cub Cadet 3X but it has proven itself to be a great machine and he can't keep them in stock.


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## Bob Cat (Jul 15, 2014)

It seems like a gimmick to me. Up there with heated handle grips .


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## greatwhitebuffalo (Feb 11, 2014)

the new snowblowers better be good, and all that they're talked up to be...
they should be, considering the last Husky I saw at Lowe's as $1199
with tax out the door, that is $1271
I only paid $1200 for my '82 Ford F-150 4x4, and that was 13 years ago...
can drive it all year long, and it's way more useful than a snowblower
and it's still running to this day
if we did a cost/benefit analysis on these new snowblowers, they fail poorly- this year we got ZERO SNOW ?
now imagine if you had just plopped down $1200 for a new one ?
they lose 50% value the day you buy them, on resale
by contrast, I got my Gilson hydro tractor w/plow for free
and 9 old vintage snowblowers for $50-$75 each.
I don't have $1200 into all 9 of them put together
if you like taking money, setting it on fire, and watching it burn...
yeh, sure...buy new.
but it sure as heck is not the smart thing to do anymore...
especially since most of them are made in CHINA ?
since when is Chinese goods a smart way to spend your money ?
if you sit down and do the numbers, the new machines are WAYYYYY overpriced....
for a machine that hardly gets used.


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## canadagoose (Dec 5, 2014)

Bob Cat said:


> It seems like a gimmick to me. Up there with heated handle grips .


Oh mon Dieu ! :facepalm_zpsdj194qh
Why does the phrase "Don't knock it til you've tried it" come to mind ?

Garages could be gimmicks too but I am sure glad to have one. Just like garages , the heated handle grips and 3rd stage may not be necessities but I sure am glad to have them ! :wavetowel2:

Goose


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## S_trangeBrew (Jan 12, 2016)

mikeinri said:


> Trust me, the worst thing that can happen when you hit something with a snowblower is for a shear pin to NOT break. Replacing pins is a nuisance, but bent/mangled augers and impellers are expensive nightmares.
> 
> Mike


Shear pins suck. The automatic Auger Protection System on the Honda HSS1332ATD has prevented me from having to replace any, even with a massive tree root jammed in there. It just shuts off the engine and a red light flashes on the dash telling you what happened. Remove the obstruction, restart and off you go.

They only offer this on this one high end machine right now, hopefully it becomes available on more snowblowers. Worth it's weight in gold, in my opinion.


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## 2point2 (Sep 20, 2014)

the biggest issue with 3x is that you wish you could turn 180deg easier in 6th speed. I run down my driveway!


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## Marty013 (Mar 14, 2014)

ok sii. baught a 3stage machine.. no real snow to test it out except for whats stil on the ground.. soo melting away.. starting to get grainy.. wet .. u know the stuff..

and in that.. well im not gonna tell you its head and shoulders over that i had before (33in large frame 10HP...) but i do feel it cuts a trench ( full width, 28in.. and however deep there is.. ranges from 15-20 inches roughly ) easier than the old machine did.. wear and tear?? a 5hp increase?? the 3rd stage?? pick your excuse.. or reassoning.. but it tosses this stuff a good 30-40 feet away... and heck.. old machine 1st is almost too fast... new machine.. 1st isnt quite fast enough it feel since the engine isnt really seeing much load... i havent tried 2nd because well.. come on!! ist god knows what snow thats ben there all winter... sure its warmer out now so prolly no ice chunks. but why take the chance right??.. ill know more once snow re-flies


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## Quickrick (May 2, 2011)

Wow, at first I read " 3 Stooges Snowblower" and wondered how messed up that may have been!

QR


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