# Ariens 8524 - Won't move in first gear, but 2-6 work



## zup28w

Hi all,

I just bought an Ariens 8524 (932104) off craigslist. The price was decent but I'm starting to think the seller wasn't completely upfront about everything. He said he had it serviced every year but the the scraper blade was worn down to almost nothing. I can't imagine a repair shop would let that slide. I didn't notice this until I got it home. Hopefully I won't find too many more surprises..

Here's one I'm hoping isn't too expensive to repair - First gear doesn't propel the snowblower. Put it in 1st, press the handle for drive, and it doesn't move. However, Gears 2-6 work and the two reverse gears appear to work as well. 

I did email him back and asking about the gas in the machine as well as if he's ever replaced the belts. He said no. That was my first thought...

Any ideas what could be causing it? I'm semi-mechanical, but plan on taking it to my local Ariens repair shop for a full once over since the machine is brand new to me.

Thanks in advance,
Greg


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## Shryp

Sounds like it is just an adjustment issue. The way those things work is there is a metal wheel and a rubber wheel that meet at a 90 degree angle. The metal wheel is driven by the engine and the rubber wheel spins the wheels. When you pull the handle down it makes the 2 make contact. When you switch gears it causes the rubber wheel to slide back and forth. The further from the center of the metal disc it is at the faster it goes. If you slide it past center it spins backwards and you have your reverse gears. It is just a simple linkage adjustment and your manual should tell you how to set it.






If you don't have the manual you can download them for free from Ariens.
Support

Owners Manual: http://apache.ariens.com/manuals/03249000B_ENG.pdf
Parts Manual: http://apache.ariens.com/manuals/03248800D.pdf
Service Manual: http://apache.ariens.com/manuals/00438200_ENG.pdf

Most people tend to like to set the adjustment slightly off to the slow end as this gives a slower first gear and a faster reverse gear. Sounds like yours is too far to the slow end. While you are messing with it see the section in the manual about setting the adjustment on the lever. Most Ariens tell you to pick the wheels off the ground, tighten the nut on the back until the wheels start to bind and then back the nut off 3 turns.

You most likely don't need to take it to a dealer if you can do some basic maintenance yourself.


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## zup28w

Hi Shryp

Thank you so much for the detailed info and advice. I've got the manuals downloaded. Hoping to find some time soon to read through them.

Thanks again!

Greg


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## Shryp

That is what we are here for. If you have any more questions or want help fixing something else feel free to ask.


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## zup28w

Thanks Shryp,

I'm gonna pass along the site info to some friends and family as well.

Greg


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## HCBPH

Two things I've seen is the friction wheel being 'junked' up with junk so the friction disc didn't grab well. That was a cleaning.
Another one I had (not on an Ariens) was the bushings between the pulley and friction wheel were worn so it skewed when pressure was applied. If that was your issue though, I'd expect it to be in 1 and less as you get to the higher gears.

Let us know how it turns out.


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## zup28w

UPDATE!

Well… I finally have an update on this thread… And it isn't pretty. I had watched the video on the friction plate and it made sense but since it was a new machine to me, I thought I'd bring it to my local Ariens repair shop and have them do a full tune-up on it. I got a call back today. The drive system is a disaster! Someone replaced the shaft on the friction plate with a piece of copper tubing. The bushing is completely worn out and the whole thing is wobbling around. The shop said they're going to have to replace it and there's no guarantee they won't find anything else that's damaged from it. They won't know until they tear it apart further. I was told it would be an extra $235-310 on top of the tune up assuming there's no other damage. I asked the mechanic about the rest of the machine and he said it seems ok.

So now I'm trying to figure what to do. I have $695 into it without an additional $235-$310+ for the drive shaft repair. There's a side of me that says I should just go ahead with it, but my alternative is to sell it, take a hit, and get something different. I have no clue how much it's worth… I wouldn't put it for sale without making clearly stately the problems with the machine. 

Just curious what some of your thoughts are. I know there's no right or wrong answer. 

Greg


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## sscotsman

hmmm..thats a tough one.
a model 932104 dates from around 2005..
so on the one hand, its fairly new..which is good.

But on the other hand, to get in such sad shape in only 8 years means it probably had ZERO maintenance or care of any kind during those 8 years..

How did you get $695 into it so far? Is that purchase price plus other repairs? or just purchase price alone?

In pristine perfect condition, such a machine (8 years old) is worth about $400 IMO..in the shape its in, its worth about $200..
yes its fairly new, but its also a "smaller" model..not in high demand, (around here anyway)
it was probably about a $700 to $800 machine when new..

So, if you spend another $300, you are up to $1,000..More than it cost new, and well more than double its actual value..

Sorry, but if it were me, I would dump it..
If the machine itself was poorly cared for, so was the engine..
I wouldn't spend additional money on a risky venture..

My advice: take whatever you can get for it, add on the $300 you would have spent, and buy a brand-new Ariens Sno-Tec for $600..a better machine for less money.

Scot


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## sscotsman

Greg,
the values for used machines I stated are for the "snow belts" of Western NY and the Great lakes, where used snowblowers are common and cheap..If you live near Boston, NY City, Philly or D.C., tack on an extra $100 to all those prices..

Any chance you could post some photos?
that is always helpful, and might help us give you a better value estimate.

Scot


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## nt40lanman

Yes, pictures and a location.


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## zup28w

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the reply.



> How did you get $695 into it so far? Is that purchase price plus other repairs? or just purchase price alone?


That's correct. $475 for the snow blower, 220 so far into the tune-up

Yes, the prices in MA are a bit higher than Western NY (I used to live in Rochester). From what I've seen, they were $550-$650 for something like this. I recently sold my late 70's ST504 for $190 (I've included a picture below). If I go craigslist, I see either much older or much newer models. Not many from the 2004-2010. boston farm & garden classifieds "ariens" - craigslist

Unfortunately I only took one pic when I first got it. It's at the shop now. The scraper blade was pretty well worn and inside the auger I was a little surprised at how scraped up it was. Otherwise it appeared to be in pretty good condition. I'm located just North of Boston.

Hope this helps.

Greg


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## micah68kj

As to the repairs to your other one you bought. Man, that's a tough call and I'm sorry it happened. If I were in this situation I'd probably buy another *mechanically sound* used one, get this one from the shop as is and repair it myself. 

$220.00 for the tune up. Did they give you an itemized bill? I don't know but that amount seems incredibly steep but I've only had one item repaired by a shop so I really have no idea of pricing.

It may be a little late but there is a youtube vid (Doneyboy73) that shows what to look for when buying a used snowblower. Very informative.


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## sscotsman

$475 isnt too bad for the initial price..I guessed $400 for my area..add on the extra $100 for Boston, and you have $500..So the price was right..*if* it had been in good condition!  which we know now it wasn't..

Unfortunately not much you can do about that..Im 99% convinced the seller was flat-out lying when he said "serviced every year"..thats almost certainty not true..but you cant prove he is lying, and its not worth the time or effort to try to do anything about it with the seller..

the machine *looks* good! externally..it looks very good...I can see how anyone would assume it's in fine condition..

Now its just a judgment call..
do you pay for more repairs, and hope that nothing else is wrong, and it will go on to be a fine and serviceable snowblower..(which is possible..)
or do you cut your losses now, and not spend any more on it, because its also possible even more issues will crop up? unfortunately its impossible to know for sure either way...it comes down to a "gut check"..whatever feels like the right way to go..

Scot


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## zup28w

@micah68kj - Would love to do this stuff myself but lacking the know-how and a place to do it. For someone who knows what they are doing, the parts are cheap - it's mostly labor. I don't have the itemized bill yet but I've always felt they were good at what they did. They're a certified Ariens repair shop and they've done work on my old Ariens ST504 in the past. Thanks for the info on the youtube video.

@sscotsman - I agree. The guy was changing his story slightly when I had him on the phone yesterday. He disclosed that he wasn't the original owner and that he bought it off some guy a year earlier.

Part of my decision will be based on the feedback of the mechanic working on it. I asked one of them to give me his opinion about the machine and he said it seemed ok outside of the drive train issue, but this wasn't the main tech working on it. I'm going to call that guy today. One thought is that if these guys are very thorough and do a good job fixing any issues, I should be ok. But you never know...

Greg


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## nt40lanman

I'm in Marlborough, MA. and would be willing to give a fellow forumite a hand if you have a way to transport it. $220 sounds like a pretty hefty tune-up bill, considering it's a plug, oil, belts, and check and lube everything.


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## zup28w

Hi nt40lanman,

Thank you very much for the offer. Very generous of you. Unfortunately I don't have a way to transport it. I spoke to my brother earlier and he has a friend/work associate who does small engine repair. I think I'm going to have him do it. He'll come pick it up and I feel it's someone I can trust.

I've wavered back and forth about dumping it, but my feeling is that if it's done right, the machine should be a good machine. I see so many Ariens from the 60's and 70's out there still around. If the engine is solid, which I've been told it is, then hopefully I'm in good shape.

Thanks again for your offer!


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## sscotsman

Let us know how it turns out! 
Scot


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## zup28w

Ugh...More frustrations

On Thursday I called the repair shop and said I don't want to sink anymore money into it. They said they'd deliver back on Fri and the balance was $186.60. Grand total: $249.60

I got it back and rolled into into my shed. My brother came up Sunday to get it. I open the gas cap and notice that it's bone dry. I drained the gas last spring and didn't put any in it yet. I would have expected to see a tiny bit from the tune up. So I pour some gas into it, turn the plastic shut off to on, prime it and start it up. Took me 5 or 6 pulls to get it started. Not only did it run like crap (very rich according to my brother), gas is leaking out of the shut off. I'm starting to wonder if they ever started it. 

It gets better. I then go to move it. I put it into drive and it barely moves. None of the gears work! When I brought it in, gears 2-6 and reverse worked. It is now in worse shape than when I brought it in. I noticed that they changed the Drive Belt (indicated on the receipt). Would they have noticed the hacked-up friction plate when they did this? Or could this have been done prior to them realizing the plate issue.

The other frustrating part is that when I called up to schedule the work, I specifically said I needed a tune up, a new scraper blade, and that gears 2-6 worked and first didn't. I even mentioned that maybe the friction plate needed to be adjusted. The receipt says none of this. It only says Tune Up. If it was documented properly, they would have checked the gear box first before doing a tune up and discovered the problem (versus me being out almost $250).

Very frustrating. They have a 90 day warranty on parts and labor. I will be calling first thing tomorrow and asking to speak to the service manager. I've been going there for years and never had a problem. I hope they make good on this. So for now I'm not sending it to anyone else until I can get this stuff resolved.

Greg


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## zup28w

I spoke to the repair shop this morning. They said they had to remove the brass tube on the gear box as a safety requirement. On their paper work they state they will remove any items which defeat factory safety standards. I told them I understood where they were coming from.

I explained to them about the gas leaking and how the engine was running poorly. I was told that they drive each machine up onto the truck when they deliver so that it was definitely working. I then reminded the gentleman that my gas tank was bone dry. Now that I think about it, you couldn't drive it up because the drive system isn't functioning. 

They agreed to take it back and get the engine straightened out after Thanksgiving.

Greg


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## GustoGuy

micah68kj said:


> As to the repairs to your other one you bought. Man, that's a tough call and I'm sorry it happened. If I were in this situation I'd probably buy another *mechanically sound* used one, get this one from the shop as is and repair it myself.
> 
> $220.00 for the tune up. Did they give you an itemized bill? I don't know but that amount seems incredibly steep but I've only had one item repaired by a shop so I really have no idea of pricing.
> 
> It may be a little late but there is a youtube vid (Doneyboy73) that shows what to look for when buying a used snowblower. Very informative.


Wow. $220.00 for a tune up? I agree that is real steep. I guess that is why they call them Stealers or is that dealers. Even if they were to have put a carburetor kit into it and a new spark plug and oil change with labor about 1 hour for the carburetor kit I doubt if it would be more $150.00 at most. Even if they were to remove the head and clean the valves and check the valve cleareance then maybe pushing that price, but wow. I seldom take my car into a Dealer and instead go to a trusted mechanic like my cousin who has owned his own shop for over 25 years now. He will fix what needs to be fixed and give you a reasonable rate. These guys are giving the name dealer a bad name. I do lots of my own work and all my maintanenece on my power equipment. I used to do maintanence years ago and I learned a thing or two, and If I do not know I use you-tube to find out how.


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## GustoGuy

zup28w said:


> I spoke to the repair shop this morning. They said they had to remove the brass tube on the gear box as a safety requirement. On their paper work they state they will remove any items which defeat factory safety standards. I told them I understood where they were coming from.
> 
> I explained to them about the gas leaking and how the engine was running poorly. I was told that they drive each machine up onto the truck when they deliver so that it was definitely working. I then reminded the gentleman that my gas tank was bone dry. Now that I think about it, you couldn't drive it up because the drive system isn't functioning.
> 
> They agreed to take it back and get the engine straightened out after Thanksgiving.
> 
> Greg


Bone dry gas tank sounds like a leaking float needle valve in the carburetor. Could be a simple as removing the float needle and cleaning with carburetor cleaner and puting back togather and readjusting the float valve at level when you flip the carburetor upside down. Too much fuel will make it run poorly and you could also need to change your oil since gas could have contaminated it due to the flooding. Check your oil level to see if it is overfilled. Make sure that they will not charge you extra for this in advance by asking them since the engine was not flooding before you brought it in.


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## HCBPH

*Another thought*

Here's another idea that might be worth considering. Look for another machine with either a blown engine or a blown auger case but an OK tractor unit.

If it's good other than motor, move your existing motor to it and go. If the tractors are close enough in age, move your auger assembly to it and go.

Just some thoughts - I've done both with some degree of success though you might have to rework some controls etc on some machines.


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## GustoGuy

zup28w said:


> UPDATE!
> 
> Well… I finally have an update on this thread… And it isn't pretty. I had watched the video on the friction plate and it made sense but since it was a new machine to me, I thought I'd bring it to my local Ariens repair shop and have them do a full tune-up on it. I got a call back today. The drive system is a disaster! Someone replaced the shaft on the friction plate with a piece of copper tubing. The bushing is completely worn out and the whole thing is wobbling around. The shop said they're going to have to replace it and there's no guarantee they won't find anything else that's damaged from it. They won't know until they tear it apart further. I was told it would be an extra $235-310 on top of the tune up assuming there's no other damage. I asked the mechanic about the rest of the machine and he said it seems ok.
> 
> So now I'm trying to figure what to do. I have $695 into it without an additional $235-$310+ for the drive shaft repair. There's a side of me that says I should just go ahead with it, but my alternative is to sell it, take a hit, and get something different. I have no clue how much it's worth… I wouldn't put it for sale without making clearly stately the problems with the machine.
> 
> Just curious what some of your thoughts are. I know there's no right or wrong answer.
> 
> Greg


How much was the parts to fix the drive system. As to Bushings by and large they are usually fairly inexpensive. Now replacing the bushings and the one broken part should fix the machine. Did the Shop give you a statement with the dollar amount for the parts needed just to fix it? There are You-tube video's out there that will show you how to fix it. I know that it depends on how comfortable you are with working on your own machine. As to the $220.00 for the tune up. What services were actually preformed on the engine. With small engines today the timing is not adjustable (fixed stator) and the ignition is electronic so a tune often consists of cleaning the carburetor on a non adjustable carburetor and replacing the plug and changing the oil. Did they put in a carburetor kit (new gaskets and emulsion tube or jets into the carburetor?) I say these guys are giving going to a dealer a bad name. How ever I know that what you pay should only be based on the actual parts and service needed. Do they have certain things that they automatically charge for like tune up? If so I would avoid that place from now on because it seems like they are just charging a flat amount for something or replacing parts and providing services and charging for them weather they are needed or not. You said the engine ran fine so why are they charging you for a tune up. I am so glad that I do my own maintenance because stuff like this really ticks me off


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## zup28w

Sorry for the slow response. Was a bit crazy with the holidays. 



> Bone dry gas tank sounds like a leaking float needle valve in the carburetor.


I think they just never put any gas in it to test it. I drained it last Spring and if they put gas in it, they would have noticed the leak.


> Check your oil level to see if it is overfilled.


I did. It was at the full mark. I was outside in my shed and I didn't have a chance to swipe it on a cloth to make sure it looked like fresh oil. It really shouldn't be dirty.. it's only run a few mins.


> Look for another machine with either a blown engine or a blown auger case but an OK tractor unit.


I've been keeping my eyes open. My only problem is I don't have the time, place, or knowledge. If I have to pay someone, it probably won't be worth it.


> What services were actually preformed on the engine.


Parts used in repair: Spark Plug, Drive Belt, Auger Belt, Bowl Nut, Idle Jet, Needle and Seat, Oil Change.
Included skid adjustment and tire pressure
$67 materials, $149 labor (they charge $55 per hour), and $25 pickup/delivery fee.

They did not provide me a detailed quote about what else they would do. Right now I just want them to make right on what I paid for.


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## zup28w

Final Update: The original dealership did take it back and when they gave it back, no leak and it seemed to run as one would expected.

I dropped off the snowblower to my brother's friend in CT who does repair work. He rebuilt the entire transmission (drive shaft, center bushing, center bushing cap, friction disc, shaft bearing, friction washers, roll pins) as well as double-checked the other work that had been done. He said he cleaned out a bunch of gunk in the carb. It now runs like a champ and actually moves. Of course the 3 big snow storms we had all occurred when the snowblower was out of commission. I'm just waiting for a good storm to finally use it.

Thanks everyone for all the input and help. Good luck snow blowing!

Greg


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