# Would like to get a 2 cycle Toro.....best model before prodution stopped?



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

I guess the Lawn-Boy is strong with me...LOL I'd like to get about the last Toro model with the R-tek engine that was part of the Toro/L-B family.
Since I have the old Snow-Boy having the last would sort of be having the Alpha-Omega of the 2.
Suggestions ?


----------



## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

Toro 221QZ is the last 2-stroke engine 21" with the current paddle design. It also has the convenient quick chute feature.

The other one is a Lawnboy Insight, green cowl, mechanically identical to red Toro without quick chute control.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

Thanks , I googled that Toro model , no info on it .?
Some on the LB model tho but I'm not sure if those made it to Canada.


----------



## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

Sorry, the correct model is 221Q.

The Lawnboy Insight differ from the Toro by the adjustable handle design, some vibration absorbing overmold.


----------



## GKK (Apr 29, 2021)

The Toro CCR2450 and 3250 were solid 2 stroke machines with minimal problems. I've had my 2450 since 2007 and it's been very reliable. I attribute this to the people who sold me the machine and suggested that running a 40 to 1 mixture vs 50 to 1 for improved internal longevity. It seems to have worked.


----------



## GKK (Apr 29, 2021)

GKK said:


> The Toro CCR2450 and 3250 were solid 2 stroke machines with minimal problems. I've had my 2450 since 2007 and it's been very reliable. I attribute this to the people who sold me the machine and suggested that running a 40 to 1 mixture vs 50 to 1 for improved internal longevity. It seems to have worked.


Correction...... should have said 3650 instead of 3250


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

For certain it is best to use 40:1 for machines under heavy load , 50:1 is fine for grass trimmers , hand held blowers and the like with small cc displacement , they need to run very clean.

I have located a 3650 but it has the plastic carb on it , should that be a real concern ?


----------



## JLawrence08648 (Jan 15, 2017)

I have a 2450, 3650, and I think a 510? The latter I'm keeping, the others I'm selling.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

JLawrence08648 said:


> I have a 2450, 3650, and I think a 510? The latter I'm keeping, the others I'm selling.


Have your carbs been upgraded or still the original plastic type ?

So you are keeping the 510 ? Any reason over the others ??


----------



## LouC (Dec 5, 2016)

If you can find a 3000 GTS with the Suzuki 2 stroke they are excellent. The parts are expensive (carbs and ignition coils) but the engine itself is a commercial grade engine that’s probable the best one they ever used. I’ve owned mine since new…


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

Thanks , I shall keep an eye for one.


----------



## LouC (Dec 5, 2016)

These were on the 3000 series 1997,1998 and 1999. After that they went to the Briggs R-Tek 2 stroke. So they aren’t really common.
The Suzuki was used extensively on Toro rotary mowers where they were highly sought after by landscapers. 

The nice thing about these machines is the low weight (72 lbs) much lighter than the later 4 strokes of the same power; and very low maintenance. I use fresh gas and full syn 2 stroke oil for clean running. 
Maintenance is a spark plug every few years and new paddles/scraper when needed. That’s about it!


----------



## oneboltshort (Dec 16, 2019)

nitehawk55 said:


> Have your carbs been upgraded or still the original plastic type ?
> 
> So you are keeping the 510 ? Any reason over the others ??


The plastic carb can be fine if it doesn't leak. most people have issues with surging because they don't know it has a pilot jet hidden in the side of the carb body behind a model label. (2450/3650)
Jlawrence I believe is referring to Toro 518 not 510, and it's a 4 stroke


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

I just purchased a 3650 from a senior fellow today who purchased it new in 2010 (he thinks) and always had it serviced at the dealer who I know as well. He did start using a snow removal service 3 years ago so it has sat unused in his garage since He thinks it may need some attention with the carb but that's no problem . Looks in clean condition , I'll know more when I pick it up Weds. afternoon.
Now if he had the dealer looking after it I wonder if the carb was replaced ? Was that not a recall of sorts ??


----------



## JLawrence08648 (Jan 15, 2017)

Toros use TC-W3 2 cycle oil


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

And one other know issue is the electric start isn't working , he says it makes a grinding noise so it sounds like a started drive . I'll have to find one but i'm sure it's easy to start.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

JLawrence08648 said:


> Toros use TC-W3 2 cycle oil


Same as Lawn-Boys are supposed to , but I guess the R-tec is from a LB design built by B&S?
I've always used a good synthetic oil in my LB's , never had an issue with carbon plugging the exhaust ports. Run them at 40:1 and they run very clean.


----------



## LouC (Dec 5, 2016)

Yes Toro did spec TCW3 which is an outboard motor oil because it’s ashless vs the more common 2 stroke oils which are low ash. The reason for this is because the ash is beneficial in high revving 2 strokes like blowers and trimmers. But in a low revving cool running snow blower engine the ash can cause deposits. You can use the more usual 2 stroke oil for air cooled 2 strokes but the TCW3 will result in less deposits.


----------



## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

nitehawk55 said:


> I just purchased a 3650 from a senior fellow today who purchased it new in 2010 (he thinks) and always had it serviced at the dealer who I know as well. He did start using a snow removal service 3 years ago so it has sat unused in his garage since He thinks it may need some attention with the carb but that's no problem . Looks in clean condition , I'll know more when I pick it up Weds. afternoon.
> Now if he had the dealer looking after it I wonder if the carb was replaced ? Was that not a recall of sorts ??


The 3650 is the precursor to the 221Q model. The auger design and engine is essentially the same for both models. The 221Q introduces the Quick Chute feature and the new cowl design. I personally like the 3650 but haven't come across one that was in the condition that I want at a good price.

I believe the 3650 was in production until 2007. There maybe left over stock that was not sold until 2008-2009. For snowblowers, the exact year isn't so important as much as how much it was used, how it was stored, and how it was maintained.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

aa335 said:


> The 3650 is the precursor to the 221Q model. The auger design and engine is essentially the same for both models. The 221Q introduces the Quick Chute feature and the new cowl design. I personally like the 3650 but haven't come across one that was in the condition that I want at a good price.
> 
> I believe the 3650 was in production until 2007. There maybe left over stock that was not sold until 2008-2009. For snowblowers, the exact year isn't so important as much as how much it was used, how it was stored, and how it was maintained.


He wasn't 100% sure which year he bought it , he was going to have a look and see if he could find the manual and paper work but yes it's likely some stock around for a time after production ended.
Since he is the original owner and it hasn't been used for 3 years should have some bearing on condition but his mentioning of the electric start not working would indicate it was used a lot for starting it since he is a senior . I hope the ring gear isn't wipped like some are , I don't need the E-start but having it in working condition would be a plus . I'll be going over it when I get it to see what's good and bad.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

Got the 3650 home (no pics yet) and gave it a quick going over . It will not run , has 3 year old gas in it and smells like it too so I'll have to flush the fuel system . The carb on it is a metal one.
He said the starter doesn't work and it barely cranks it over , motor has no power but engaging OK . Motor is bad likely. Otherwise in good shape.


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

Feel like I'm talking to myself here but I guess that's better than doing it at home 

Anyway , since this machine had sat for 3 years and wouldn't start naturally you drain the old fuel , pull the bowl off the carb and clean the jets . I use carb cleaner and a dentist tool and it forks fine . Got the varnish all cleaned up and she started first pull with a cloud of smoke . Easy fix and should be a good machine.


----------



## sledman8002002 (Jan 20, 2021)

nitehawk55 said:


> Feel like I'm talking to myself here but I guess that's better than doing it at home


No worries, I'm glad I'm not the only one 
I've been following along nitehawk, nothing to add is all.


----------



## KJSeller (Nov 3, 2021)

Nice to hear you got it running. I've never had to clean the carb on my OPE. Always use fuel stabilizer and at the end of season use fogging oil and run the tank dry. I guess I should learn how to clean them soon


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

KJSeller said:


> Nice to hear you got it running. I've never had to clean the carb on my OPE. Always use fuel stabilizer and at the end of season use fogging oil and run the tank dry. I guess I should learn how to clean them soon


Yes it had sat a good 3 years and the gas smelled like it ! Cleaning them is not hard to do and YT has a lot of DIY vids for reference .
It had some real tough varnish like crud in the main jet and some of the holes in the tube were blocked too . Some carb cleaner , wires and patience was all that was required


----------



## nitehawk55 (Sep 9, 2021)

20211003_141549
Damn I have trouble downloading pics !!


----------



## LouC (Dec 5, 2016)

I’ve heard that a lot of mechanics are using ultrasonic cleaners to clean carbs now. With a clean carb and tank it should run fine. I’m a big fan of Toro 2 stroke single stages; they do a good job in moderate snow conditions and the light weight and very low maintenance are big advantages to me. I liked mine so much I’ve collected spare parts to keep it going forever….I have a spare Suzuki 2 stroke motor, electric start kit & flywheel, carb, ignition coil, muffler etc. 
Good luck and enjoy yours!


----------

