# Honda 720 or Arien’s Professional 21”



## Jccabin (Sep 15, 2018)

Hi everyone. Thinking snow even though it is a ways off and thinking about a single stage snow thrower. Have it narrowed down to the Honda 720 and the Arien’s 21” Professional. Have found few reviews of the Arien’s. Many for the Honda. The Arien’s is attractive because of the open design; no plastic shroud to remove for maintenance, all metal construction except for the chute and appears to have pretty good specs. I realize that it uses a Chinese LTC engine which is its downside. The Honda engine is manufactured here in the States by Honda which is pretty nice and the Honda is considered pretty reliable with easy starting. Cost is the same. Any thoughts especially about the Arien’s? Also have been considering the Arien’s compact 20” though it is a lot more money. Be interested in what you folks think of these units in comparison.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

:welcome: to SBF Jccabin

How big of an area do you need to clear, what kind of surface ??

.


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## Jccabin (Sep 15, 2018)

Hi! Surface: Pavement and cement 
Space: a sidewalk, short driveway (five cars or so ) and two walks.


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## Jccabin (Sep 15, 2018)

The main use is in a city in western MA where we get anywhere from a dusting to 9-10 inches of wet snow in a Nor’easter. I have also thought of using it to cut paths at my vacation rental cabins in VT. Driveways there are plowed out. That surface is gravel and grass. But the real interest is for the City use. Shoulders aren’t what they use to be, so figure I should invest in a SB.


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## cuz (Mar 19, 2018)

All my research said when it comes to single stage blowers get the Honda, so that’s what I did. Picked mine up this morning, let it snow, let it snow, let it snow!!!


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

a 720 won't cut it for the occasional storms in western mass. which has not been so occasional in recent years. just my worthless 2 cents.


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## Jccabin (Sep 15, 2018)

Won’t cut it because it isn’t strong enough?


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## cuz (Mar 19, 2018)

orangputeh said:


> a 720 won't cut it for the occasional storms in western mass. which has not been so occasional in recent years. just my worthless 2 cents.




No, it won’t work for the big storms, but I decided to opt for the dual blower solution. I’ll use the Honda 720 for most of the storms we get in Eastern MA and I’ll enjoy its light weight and maneuverability a lot. 

But I’ll also keep my Ariens 27” blower for the big stuff. Heck, I may even upgrade the Ariens to a Platinum 30” and then have both ends of the spectrum fully covered. Gotta have the right tool for the job...


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## Jccabin (Sep 15, 2018)

Any thoughts on the Arien’s 21” Professional model? Looks like it debuted a year ago, but there are few reviews for it.


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## Motor City (Jan 6, 2014)

Get the Honda. I have one for my wife and kids to use. When the big storms come, I have my Ariens 11528. I would compare the Honda to a 2 stage 5hp MTD, but easier to maneuver and lighter.


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## RattlerGUNZ (Nov 3, 2013)

Good thinking for both. That's what I got an Ariens Deluxe 28+ for the big heavy storms and the Toro 621 QZE for light duty.


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## 69ariens (Jan 29, 2011)

I would look at the Toro snowmasters


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## vmaxed (Feb 23, 2014)

I just picked up a Arien's Professional 21 inch for the light stuff and deck,haven't tried it yet :wink2:


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## Rml63 (Sep 2, 2020)

That is the machine I would like to get . V-maxed how are you liking the Professional 21?

Mike


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

why do they have to primer bulbs when honda doesn't? BTW I love my single stage Hondas and use them about 90% of the time. Only need the 2 stage when over 10 inches and berms. (EOD )


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

Small engines have either primer bulb or choke for easier cold start.

However, this engine have both choke and primer. Don't know why that is? Maybe there is valve that allows the fuel to return to the tank when the engine is not running to protect the carburetor from gumming.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

aa335 said:


> Small engines have either primer bulb or choke for easier cold start.
> 
> However, this engine have both choke and primer. Don't know why that is?



Maybe for summer use (mower, etc). But I think all my snow equipment has had both a choke and primer. Rather than one or the other. This is both for 4-strokes on 2-stage machines, as well as 2-stroke single stages.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

As I mentioned in another thread, the only 4-stroke I've ever owned (however briefly) that had a primer bulb was the Troy-Bilt StormTracker I gave to my son as a housewarming gift. Manual or auto chokes on every other one... 20ish and counting. 

"Primers? Primers? We don't need no steenking Primers! Primers are for 2-strokes!"


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

I am surprised the EPA has not clamped down yet. Dumping unburned fuel into the air. Either choke or primer, not both.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Most Canadian snowblowers (don't know about Honda) have primer and choke. The primer is required for the very cold temperatures but I use the primer for every cold start. As far back as 70's (when I changed from shovel to blower) snowblowers here have had primers and chokes.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Town said:


> Most Canadian snowblowers (don't know about Honda) have primer and choke.


Honda has no primers on their GX Snow engines, or on any of their other engines that I have owned. Hence @orangputeh's question: "why do they have to [have] primer bulbs when honda doesn't?" The choke has always been enough for 1-2 pull starts.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

tabora said:


> Honda has no primers on their GX Snow engines, or on any of their other engines that I have owned. Hence @orangputeh's question: "why do they have to [have] primer bulbs when honda doesn't?" The choke has always been enough for 1-2 pull starts.


Why do some snowblowers have primer bulbs? Honda trimmers do but it also has a choke. I have a Toro single stage 2 cycle that has a primer bulb but it also have a choke.


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

Both Toro snowblowers have choke and primer, one is 2 stroke, the other is 4 stroke. The Toros require prime and choke to start. Otherwise, there's a lot of pulling.

Both of Honda snowblowers have choke only. Starts within 2 pulls.

The only thing I can think of is that the Honda have short fuel line from tank to carb. The Honda tanks are just right above the carb.
The Toros fuel line is longer. The tank is located above but to the side of the carb. The longer fuel line may require priming.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

aa335 said:


> Both Toro snowblowers have choke and primer, one is 2 stroke, the other is 4 stroke. The Toros require prime and choke to start. Otherwise, there's a lot of pulling.
> 
> Both of Honda snowblowers have choke only. Starts within 2 pulls.
> 
> ...


For 4 stroke engines the length of the fuel line on a snowblower has nothing to do with priming. Fuel lines deliver fuel to the carb and that just requires the tank outlet being higher than the carb for gravity feed. For 2 strokes the fuel to the carb is usually obtained by a pumping mechanism with the carb and engine, which then allows all position operation.

There are 2 common types of primer on 4 strokes. The current one is a single small hose from the push bulb to the carb float bowl, where pressing the bulb causes air to pressurise the carb and raise the fuel level in the jets, and richening the mixture for quick starts. The second type has the primer bulb with 2 lines, one allows fuel from the supply line into the bulb and the second supplies pressurised raw fuel to the carb above the jets or intake manifold. Both are very effective in the very cold winter weather. Primer and choke work together.

Modern 2 strokes primers that I have used work similarly to the fuel bowl pressurisation type. The all position carb precludes a simple float bowl so the pressurisation is in the pumping diaphragm chamber leading to the metering diaphragm chamber, with any excess fuel returned to the fuel tank. Coupled with a choke it is quite effective.

I don't know how the Honda engines work in the very cold weather, some owners on here have reported poor starting in very cold temperatures, with no resolution forthcoming (start a conversation but not follow through with the solution). But the primer allows Tecumseh, B&S and LCT engines to fire up on first pull at -35C usually.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

I did not mean to hijack the thread. just curious about primers. I really dont like them especially when bulb breaks.

anyway, about the original posters question. I only know about Honda single stages. LOVE them. Have 2 521's and a 621 and they are my main thrower for anything about 8 inches . Then bring out the old HS80 for anything over that and EOD berm.

I'm so sold on the 4 stroke single stage Hondas that i recommend them highly to friends who have snow removal businesses. A friend of mine just bought 4 of the HS720A from Home depot for $609 a piece. well below the Honda dealers but he's also a very good mechanic so will be handling all the maintenance and repairs.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

I haven't tried the newer machines, but I'm a big fan of my 8-10 year old Toro single stage. Little storms, like 3-4", are almost fun. Like clearing as fast as I can safely walk (with Yaktrax), that's way faster than my 2-stage can do it. 

And we have to clear even the little storms, otherwise they ice up, and we won't get up the driveway. 

It would be nice to try a good Honda, a 621 was among the candidates when I was shopping.


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

I'm liking this new Ariens Professional 21. The frame looks strong and will last a long time. It's going to be hard to sneak this snowblower in the garage without the wife noticing. I've already got 4, all red and black. This shiny orange Ariens is not like the others. It doesn't blend in with my snowblowers and lawnmower. 

Maybe if I park the Ariens next to the Stihl pressure washer, the wife may not notice. Pale orange, bright orange.

I need a shed in the back of the house for these extra things. Unfortunately, HOA doesn't allow.


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

orangputeh said:


> I only know about Honda single stages. LOVE them. Have 2 521's and a 621 and they are my main thrower for anything about 8 inches . Then bring out the old HS80 for anything over that and EOD berm.


Did you write a review on the 621? Just curious what your thoughts are compared to the newer 520.


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

RedOctobyr said:


> It would be nice to try a good Honda, a 621 was among the candidates when I was shopping.


I have one. They are good machines. Parts are getting expensive. I still keep mine around for sentimental reasons. I gently use it so I don't break anything. The engine should last forever, but the bucket sides and the metal auger don't.


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## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

My old Toro 2450 2-strokes has a gravity feed carburetor instead. The pumping action style that Town mentioned is only necessary on String trimmer/weed wacker, since they can be used upside down. They have moving parts that wear out, so they aren't as reliable as gravity feed.

Primmer bulb is necessary to deliver fuel to the engine right away. There are times when you get vapor lock and things like that, so it will take forever to pull.

Having the primmer bulb is a benefit, but people can flood the engine with it. I think that is why Honda engines don't have one. They are good with building engine, so you can trust them with no primmer bulb.


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## dman2 (Sep 22, 2019)

Just grab a Toro 2450, or 3650. They run forever. R-Tek 2-cycle engines are screamer and sound like no body.


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## aa335 (Jan 21, 2020)

Yeah. The Toro 221 is a good one. My neighbor trade it in for a craftsman 2 stage. If I had known he was getting rid of it, I would buy it from him.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

I definitely like mine. I wouldn't mind a little more power, it feels like a power boost would make it even more capable. Then it could practically handle deeper storms. 

I've used it up to around 10". Starting at probably 12-14", the 2-stage probably makes more sense. But I now prefer using the single-stage whenever I can. I've realized that, for me, the combination of a good 2-stage and good single-stage is probably a better setup than a single really-nice 2-stage. The single-stage did most of the clearing last year.


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