# Toro CCR2450 vs. CCR3650



## TOROCCR2000 (May 6, 2017)

Hi Guys,

since these two Toros have the same engine and the same plastic carburetor but, different HP (5 vs. 6.5), I was just wondering if anybody here knows the real difference between those two models.

The only difference I noticed on the manual was the Max RPM:

3550-4050 for the 2450

3750-4250 for the 3650

Any info would be much appreciated,

Thank you in advance


P.S.: Same question for CCR2500


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## db130 (Feb 16, 2013)

The 3650 has the chute crank.


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## Snowbelt_subie (Dec 20, 2016)

TOROCCR2000 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> since these two Toros have the same engine and the same plastic carburetor but, different HP (5 vs. 6.5), I was just wondering if anybody here knows the real difference between those two models.
> 
> ...



i am not quite sure but the 3650 has more grunt in the deeper snow. it cant be much maybe a little more free flowing exhaust. it doesnt take much with 2 strokes.


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## bkwudz (Jan 14, 2013)

are u sure they are the same engine, i had both at one time, and the 3650 was noticeably bigger and heavier.


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## TOROCCR2000 (May 6, 2017)

Thanks for replies, the engine is 141 cc. for both machines.

Snowbelt_subie and bkwudz, if you found a difference then there has to be a difference, so at least we know that both machines are not the same.


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## SnoThro (Feb 20, 2016)

The engines are 100% identical. Same carb, same piston, same connecting rod, same engine block. Difference was a small RPM tweak.

The only 2-stroke engines that differed were in the Snow Commander and the short lived Power Max 726. Both of those had a longer stroke.


This is all related to that horsepower lawsuit from years ago. They'd make 3 of the same engines and stick 3 different horsepower ratings on them.


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## aldfam4 (Dec 25, 2016)

I have a CCR-2000 and the CCR-3650. There is a considerable difference in power and snow throwing with the CCR-3650 being more powerful, just my two cents.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

I just got a machine with a 141cc R-Tek, so this is useful &interesting timing, thanks. Along with what was mentioned, the Toro R-Tek E Engine Service Manual lists Governed Engine Speeds of: 

"4HP runs at 3700 + 300
CCR 2400 - 3700
5HP runs at 3800 + 300 rpm
CCR 2450 & 2500 - 3800 rpm
CCR 3600 - 3900 rpm
CCR 3650 - 4000 rpm
Snow Commander - 4000 rpm
All snow engines are + 300 rpm"

To me, that doesn't 100% state that there are no other engine differences. It's conceivable that other stuff is going on too, like maybe with a carb, or muffler. But it's certainly interesting that the higher-power-rated engines are also spinning faster. 

My thought is, if you want the most output, maybe set it to the very-top speed, just shy of 4300? So the 4000 + 300 RPM tolerance. If you had a 3650, you're still within the stated specs for the engine. And with the same 141cc displacement, I'm *guessing* that the crankshafts, connecting rods, and pistons are all the same. Which would minimize the risk of a 3700 RPM engine blowing apart if you set it >4000 RPM. 

R-Tek, E Engine Service manual: 
https://www.toro.com/getpub/13300


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## gibbs296 (Jun 22, 2014)

RedOctobyr said:


> I just got a machine with a 141cc R-Tek, so this is useful &interesting timing, thanks. Along with what was mentioned, the Toro R-Tek E Engine Service Manual lists Governed Engine Speeds of:
> 
> "4HP runs at 3700 + 300
> CCR 2400 - 3700
> ...


I see you run a 221qr, in your opinion is that pretty close to the best there is for a single stage?


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

I don't know, I just got it yesterday  

I was trying to find a Toro 721, the 7hp 4-stroke 21" combo sounded good to me. But the price on this machine was too good to pass up. And it has the Quick Shoot control, which many of the basic 721 machines on Craigslist around here don't, you have to aim their chutes manually (grab the chute and turn it). 

At least the 2-stroke should be low-maintenance. No oil changes to worry about. Hopefully using good oil, at the suggested 50:1, will minimize the oil smoke smell.


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## Cinci5 (Jan 18, 2016)

CCR2000 is Suzuki I think
CCR2450 and CCR3650 new are Briggs R Tek’s
The weight difference might also be electric start on 3650 if it has it.
Newer 2450 and 3650 engines are the same except RPM


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