# Saving a Toro 724 (38050)



## classiccat

This somehow ended-up in the back of my truck today.

















^ 1980

Another member's brother was giving it away ...a deal too good to refuse...especially for old iron!


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## classiccat

hmmm...wonder what's hiding behind that starter:

















^ definitely a broken connecting rod...but the block is definitely salvageable.

oil level wasn't too low...it does have the consistency of 30w though.









I guess it's also possible that the linkage was binding-up.


















:icon-shrug:


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## classiccat

dismantling the engine

Pre-safety module era:



























something not quite right with this scraper bar...I could be wrong but I believe it's installed incorrectly (hence the excessively tall skid setting)









Yay! Wheels aren't frozen to the axles!


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## GustoGuy

Are you going to repower or repair the original engine?


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## classiccat

and there's your broken connecting rod.


















...and a sheared flywheel key:









The crankshaft, piston & cylinder are in great shape!

shortlist of things to do:

measure ring-gap & bore
clean-up the crank with some emery cloth
install new oil seals
rebuild the carb
valve job
new head gasket
new fuel line

Everything on this machine is original...I'd like to keep it that way!


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## classiccat

GustoGuy said:


> Are you going to repower or repair the original engine?


I think I'll try and save this one Gusto. It's old but I don't think there are a ton of hours on it.


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## GustoGuy

classiccat said:


> I think I'll try and save this one Gusto. It's old but I don't think there are a ton of hours on it.


It's worth a try to see if it can be repaired. Clean up the crank and get a new connectiong rod and braze the crankcase shut and if it is still a total loss then you can always repower it.


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## 524SWE

pretty good shape for a 1981, even the paint looks good, maybe wasn't ever in salt, definite candidate for unrestored original condition equipment honors.


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## classiccat

524SWE said:


> pretty good shape for a 1981, even the paint looks good, maybe wasn't ever in salt, definite candidate for unrestored original condition equipment honors.


No doubt!









My understanding is that she spent her entire 37 years on 1 property.


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## 43128

i have two more buckets and a tractor for a 524 i can give you if you want more parts


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## cpchriste

Regarding the cutter bar; I think that's one of the pivoting Toro special features. Hard to tell from the pics though. Yours might be binding.


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## classiccat

43128 said:


> i have two more buckets and a tractor for a 524 i can give you if you want more parts


Thanks Man! Everything on the tractor is in really good shape. I'll treat the rust on the handlebars & spot-treat the surface body rust. 



cpchriste said:


> Regarding the cutter bar; I think that's one of the pivoting Toro special features. Hard to tell from the pics though. Yours might be binding.


It actually pivots properly... the bucket needs to sit higher than my Toro 824 to provide clearance. It might be missing the spacer that pulls-up the scraper up a bit. We'll see; I'm focused on the engine at the moment.


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## cranman

ClassicCat..I just repaired an 8 hp Tecumseh with JB Weld that was a little worse than yours....three light coats.


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## classiccat

cranman said:


> ClassicCat..I just repaired an 8 hp Tecumseh with JB Weld that was a little worse than yours....three light coats.


Thanks cranman! 

I was thinking of using JBWELD from the beginning...then Gusto mentioned the brazing rods so I'm looking into that as well. 

I use JB for filling top-side holes on aluminum boats...and it sticks to Al surprisingly well if you prep it right.


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## UNDERTAKER

*That scraper might be on there backwards. just tossing that out there. I never really mess with that size machine. anyhoo MAZEL TOV there BROTHER CC. IF the wife has any gripes about that 1 coming home with you. just tell I told you to get it.:icon_whistling::wavetowel2:k:k:k:*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *That scraper might be on there backwards. just tossing that out there. I never really mess with that size machine. anyhoo MAZEL TOV there BROTHER CC. IF the wife has any gripes about that 1 coming home with you. just tell I told you to get it.:icon_whistling::wavetowel2:k:k:k:*


when she pulled-in, she thought that I was summer-izing one of my blowers... unfortunately she tells me this AFTER I've already fallen on the sword! :smiley-confused009:


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> when she pulled-in, she thought that I was summer-izing one of my blowers... unfortunately she tells me this AFTER I've already fallen on the sword! :smiley-confused009:


*Well at least it will keep you in the garage and at arms length from her for awhile.:tongue4::tongue4:*


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## 524SWE

classiccat said:


> when she pulled-in, she thought that I was summer-izing one of my blowers... unfortunately she tells me this AFTER I've already fallen on the sword! :smiley-confused009:


Silence is golden around women, let them do the talking and you'll see which way the wind blows 9 out of 10 times! Prevents the dreaded foot in mouth disease.


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## classiccat

*Saving the block*

*drill crack-stops:*









*Test-fitting the patch with cleco's*


















*Sanded/Abraided the patch & block...then wiped-down with acetone:*


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## classiccat

I picked-up some JB-Weld High-heat in a stick form.

I didn't want to play chicken with the working time...so no step-by-step photos of it being worked 

Embedded the patch in some JB High-heat & bucked a pair of 3/16" solid rivets:


















^^ I'll fill that outside crack later.

I used the pieces of the connecting rod & crank to verify the fit:


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## UNDERTAKER

*I see a you were drinking and welding at the same time. I see a bottle of Beck's Beer in the Background, there BROTHER CC.:eeek::eeek::eeek::eeek::eeek:*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *I see a you were drinking and welding at the same time. I see a bottle of Beck's Beer in the Background, there BROTHER CC.:eeek::eeek::eeek::eeek::eeek:*


:signlol:

That's funny Todd because I haven't had a drop of alcohol in 2 years (_I handle administering medication to a family member throughout the evening...need to be on my toes at all times_)

That's actually Becks Non-alcoholic...I can't work on old Iron without my Barley soda!

No welder was used for that patch. I used my riveting hammer to sandwich high-heat JBWeld between the patch and the cracked block...rock solid!


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> :signlol:
> 
> That's funny Todd because I haven't had a drop of alcohol in 2 years (_I handle administering medication to a family member throughout the evening...need to be on my toes at all times_)
> 
> That's actually Becks Non-alcoholic...I can't work on old Iron without my Barley soda!
> 
> No welder was used for that patch. I used my riveting hammer to sandwich high-heat JBWeld between the patch and the cracked block...rock solid!


*YEAHHHHHH Iam just having some fun with you BROTHER CC. it is only PEPSI real sugar soda or Gatorade ice tea for me these days.:tongue4::tongue4:*


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## drmerdp

Looks like the patch worked out well. JB weld is remarkably strong when the surface is prepped correctly.


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## Grunt

It sure looks like the clearance between the patch and the connecting rod is going to be tight. Very ingenious and good looking repair CC.

:goodjob:


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## classiccat

Grunt said:


> It sure looks like the clearance between the patch and the connecting rod is going to be tight. Very ingenious and good looking repair CC.
> 
> :goodjob:


Thanks Grunt! 

I didn't feel completely comfortable with just the JB. The patch will provide more surface for it to adhere to as well as hold it in place in case it does lose adhesion for whatever reason. 

I'm expecting to have to carve out some of that patch once the connecting rod finally gets here. I didn't account for the dipper...since the original was obliterated :icon_smile_blackeye


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## cranman

Classiccat...I just tapped the aluminum back in shape a little with a ball peen ( gently) then ground all the paint from the outside of the block....mixed up a little JB weld and gave the block three light coats, letting it dry a day between coats. I put a new rod in after blowing out all the junk from the shattered rod...gave it a good torque and reassembled. I ran the motor at various RPM for several hours....then gave a a good test with a 15 in storm we had last month....no problems. Your fix was so much more elegant then mine though! About a $40 fix all parts considered.


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## classiccat

cranman said:


> Classiccat...I just tapped the aluminum back in shape a little with a ball peen ( gently) then ground all the paint from the outside of the block....mixed up a little JB weld and gave the block three light coats, letting it dry a day between coats. I put a new rod in after blowing out all the junk from the shattered rod...gave it a good torque and reassembled. I ran the motor at various RPM for several hours....then gave a a good test with a 15 in storm we had last month....no problems. Your fix was so much more elegant then mine though! About a $40 fix all parts considered.


I would've preferred to patch it from the outside but the starter is in the way on my engine... That starter probably saved the block from completely ventilating & launching the connecting rod pieces across the driveway. :smiley-shocked029:
:3tens:


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## cranman

I left out the starter...didn't come with one.......the coats were really thin, but it may have interfered with the fit.


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## dbert

Cleco's and solid rivets?
I only know of a small group that use those. Are you....certificated?


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## classiccat

dbert said:


> Cleco's and solid rivets?
> I only know of a small group that use those. Are you....certificated?


We in the tin-boat restoration circles like to borrow tools & terminology from aircraft crowd. 

:shipwrecked:


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## UNDERTAKER

dbert said:


> Cleco's and solid rivets?
> I only know of a small group that use those. Are you....certificated?


What in the name of ZEUS is that anyway????????????


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## classiccat

the connecting rod came today...and you can drive a truck through the gap between the patch & rod.









...unfortunately you can also drive a truck through the ring-gap... so a new set of rings are on order. The cylinder bore was in-spec. 

the engine is all cleaned-up ...waiting for that brown truck show-up.

in the meantime, a pair of sockets bolted together work well for replacing oil seals.



























Also, this scotch-weld stuff is nice for sealing welch plugs before you hammer 'em home.









Thanks for stoppin' by!


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## classiccat

I'm in a race against time & mother nature to get this toro together before the hardpack melts...

I need some snow-load to break-in the engine after the rebuild!

New governor (shown in the low cam speed / WOT position):









New piston and rings. Chamfer faces-up on the top compression ring. Notch faces down on the 2nd compression ring:









New connecting rod... Live a long...long life there little buddy!!!









packed-up waiting for the flex hone for cylinder deglazing:


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## classiccat

good time to lap the valves since the block will get getting a thorough cleaning after deglazing:









a few passes in forward/reverse with the flex hone.









cylinder after a good cleaning.


















putting the squeeze on these new rings:









like a glove:


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## classiccat

time to crank this baby.









connecting rod bolted to the crank & torqued to spec:


















cover the piston with plastic & flip the block for inserting the tappets / camshaft:


















verify the timing marks:


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## classiccat

valves installed:









new head gaskset:









I dress the sump cover gasket with gorilla snot and blade-off the excess:


















buttoned-up ready for spark test:


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## RIT333

Awesome job, and documentation.

Let's see a video of it running.


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## tpenfield

I am enjoying watching the restoration of this engine. Looking forward to the updates. :goodjob:


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## UNDERTAKER

*MAZEL TOV there, BROTHER CC. :wavetowel2: Refresh my aging memory, what is that gorilla snot again????????????*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *MAZEL TOV there, BROTHER CC. :wavetowel2: Refresh my aging memory, what is that gorilla snot again????????????*


"It's gasket sealing compound. I use Evinrude (p/n 508235) & Quicksiliver Perfect Seal (92-34227 ? label long gone) interchangeably; they both look/smell the same...like gorilla snot."

<-- Deja Vu there Brutha PS?


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> "It's gasket sealing compound. I use Evinrude (p/n 508235) & Quicksiliver Perfect Seal (92-34227 ? label long gone) interchangeably; they both look/smell the same...like gorilla snot."
> 
> <-- Deja Vu there Brutha PS?


* On the BRIGGS engines the crankshaft endplay is done via the cover gaskets. I always did them dry.*


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## classiccat

Had a chance to put 45min on the machine today after filling her up with conventional 5w30.... much of the time was spent chewing on slushy hard pack.

No fluid leaks & the only smoked on the initial start-up.

She required quite a few tweaks... one of which was the engine speed. I had to back it down a few hundred RPM. 

With these old engines, you bend the actual linkage (green circle) to adjust the spring tension.









I love the creeper-speed on this machine! 

I have some bugs to iron out ...specifically she's tough to start when warmed-up. 

Could be as simple plugged gas-cap vent or ignition tweaks. I also have excessive exhaust valve lash...lapping only closed it up so much. So I'll be changing out the valves when I retorque the head.


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## 43128

cold starting should be improved once you connect the primer. if not, i have had luck backing out the idle jet on most tecumsehs


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## classiccat

43128 said:


> cold starting should be improved once you connect the primer. if not, i have had luck backing out the idle jet on most tecumsehs


It cold starts like a dream. It gets stubborn when it has been run for 10min or so.

I didn't give that ignition any attention when I had it open aside from cleaning the points & connections.


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> It cold starts like a dream. It gets stubborn when it has been run for 10min or so.
> 
> I didn't give that ignition any attention when I had it open aside from cleaning the points & connections.


*Better slap 1 of those HEI Do-hickies in there.k:k:k:k:k:*


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## amuller

I expect repairing that engine will cost more than a clone engine, and more than another machine with a workable engine on it. If you really want to fix it, I would take it all apart and check for additional damage such a broken camshaft, damaged crankpin, flywheel cracked at the keyway, etc. If you can get by with a replacement rod and epoxy repair to the crack, it might make sense if originality is important to you.


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## classiccat

amuller said:


> I expect repairing that engine will cost more than a clone engine, and more than another machine with a workable engine on it. If you really want to fix it, I would take it all apart and check for additional damage such a broken camshaft, damaged crankpin, flywheel cracked at the keyway, etc. If you can get by with a replacement rod and epoxy repair to the crack, it might make sense if originality is important to you.


Thanks for the advice! k:


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## classiccat

here's a pretty boring video ...but it beats sitting there making vroom vroom noises now don't it 






After 1hr of work time on the rebuilt engine, it’s back on the bench...Confirmed… Loss of spark when it’s warm.

Points were set at 0.010". I corrected that (0.020") and still had problems.

I'll be replacing the ignition components and resetting the BTDC timing. Plus...I have one of those NOVAII modules on stand-by


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> here's a pretty boring video ...but it beats sitting there making vroom vroom noises now don't it
> 
> https://youtu.be/aWbAEDD0QSE
> 
> After 1hr of work time on the rebuilt engine, it’s back on the bench...Confirmed… Loss of spark when it’s warm.
> 
> Points were set at 0.010". I corrected that (0.020") and still had problems.
> 
> I'll be replacing the ignition components and resetting the BTDC timing. Plus...I have one of those NOVAII modules on stand-by


*What kind of tach is that, where did you get it?????*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *What kind of tach is that, where did you get it?????*


That's a hardline tach/hr meter that I bolted to one of those 2x4 hangers. I believe I picked this up from amazon.


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> That's a hardline tach/hr meter that I bolted to one of those 2x4 hangers. I believe I picked this up from amazon.


 I really should get 1 of those.:icon_whistling:


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## classiccat

*New isn't always better.*

The ignition was pooping out on me when the engine would get warm...and I immediately blamed the coil &/or condenser.

I ended up swapping out the points, condenser & coil ...and couldn't get a good spark to save my life! 

My test method:
I set my variable-gap spark tester at ~ 0.030" and spin the flywheel by hand. If I get spark at 0.030", I crank it open to 1/4", torque-down the flywheel nut and hit it with the starter for a ~1/4" gap.

If it can't get spark on the 1/4" gap, then I knock-off the flywheel and try again...I bet I had the flywheel off 10 times this weekend.

Long story short, when I was setting the magneto timing (spark advance), the darn points where opening waaay early on me...well before the dwell. 

I started to think that my crankshaft was bent (it wasn't). I was able to square that away...then discovered that the new condenser was garbage! 

In a nutshell, I changed the points (_old ones were a little pitted_), kept the old condenser & coil, then set the BTDC timing (0.080" in my case) and it's running like a scalded ape! I put in a solid hour of throwing slushy hard-pack back-n-forth across the yard. :icon_smile_big:

for you guys interested in some of this old-school technology,
Setting the BTDC is pretty simple with a depth gauge and a multimeter.










I bent the detachable tip to reach the top of the piston:

Disconnect the coil from the points...they're grounded for most of the revolution.









Zero-out when the piston hits TDC...









and watch for those points to open on the multimeter(continuity tester turns off...or your ohmmeter goes to infinite). Adjust the magneto assembly CW or CCW until you hit the spec (in my case, the red 0.080")...close enough!


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## tpenfield

:goodjob:

Working on small engine ignition and timing is one of those things that seems to be more complicated than it needs to be. The whole concept of distance BTDC instead of angular degrees was foreign to me at first.

My outboard boat motors are the same way . . . and as long as the ignition isn't broke, I'm not going to fix it. :biggrin:


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## classiccat

tpenfield said:


> :goodjob:
> 
> Working on small engine ignition and timing is one of those things that seems to be more complicated than it needs to be. The whole concept of of distance BTDC instead of angular degrees was foreign to me at first.
> 
> My outboard boat motors are the same way . . . and as long as the ignition isn't broke, I'm not going to fix it. :biggrin:


I cut my teeth on outboards (_I'm a 'Rude guy myself_) however I find myself drooling whenever I see giant black/chrome ToP!


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## 524SWE

*All that "old school tech"...*

:signlol: makes me feel old! Oh! Yeah, right I am old at 68, over the hill even! Most guys had one of these dwell meters(#1), repair shops had the big red diagnostic center(#2).


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## UNDERTAKER

*I still say put a HEI on it and save yourself any future headaches.:smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001:*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *I still say put a HEI on it and save yourself any future headaches.:smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001::smiley-think001:*


you still have to have the timing set when converting to pointless ignition. 

The plan was to set the timing then throw-in a NOVA however the points were working so well already I forgot ALL about that NOVA module sitting on my workbench :biggrin:


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## dbert

Awesome thread CC
While I've used a dwell meter in my younger years, I've never converted a points type ignition to an electronic (Nova) on a small engine. What is involved in setting timing after converting? Repositioning of the coil? Is it slotted?


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## UNDERTAKER

*You are a better man then me there, BROTHER CC. I would have turned that engine into a boat anchor or door stop.:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:*


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## classiccat

dbert said:


> What is involved in setting timing after converting?


The timing should be set before removing the breaker/points since that tells you where the lobe begins to widen & open the points.



dbert said:


> Repositioning of the coil? Is it slotted?


Yes, the magneto assembly (holds the points, condensor & ignition coil) is slotted so that you can rotate it ~ 20deg.

if the motor was running well with points, I suppose you can "leave well-enough alone" and swap in the electronic module. EDIT: <-- That's what a normal/sane person might do

If you have to remove the magneto assembly, you can also mark the magneto/block with reference marks.

In the case of this H70, I had to remove the magneto (_put in a new seal_) and marked the assembly. It turns out that original position was triggering 0.030" early (0.110" Before Top Dead Center) therefore I incrementally rotated magneto clockwise to hit 0.080" B.T.D.C.


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *You are a better man then me there, BROTHER CC. I would have turned that engine into a boat anchor or door stop.:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:*


We know how much you adore Tecumseh engines. :tongue:

I lost count of how many times I almost called this guy for his 170402.

It's even the right color for a *Toro*


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## tpenfield

I must admit, I was never that fond of Tecumseh engines . . . not sure why, :icon-shrug: except that I always preferred Briggs & Stratton.


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## RIT333

In what year (approximately) did small engines go to electronic ignitions, or, are they still using points ?


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## classiccat

RIT333 said:


> In what year (approximately) did small engines go to electronic ignitions, or, are they still using points ?


I believe B&S switched after 1982... I assume Tecumseh was around the same time.

excerpt from B&S support page:


> Have an older, breaker point ignition system?
> 
> Breaker point ignition systems were common through 1982. You can improve its reliability on a single-cylinder Briggs & Stratton engine equipped with breaker points and a two-leg armature by installing a solid-state ignition conversion kit (service part number 394970) that bypasses the points (conversion kit will not work with a three-legged ignition armature).


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## stromr

tpenfield said:


> I must admit, I was never that fond of Tecumseh engines . . . not sure why, :icon-shrug: except that I always preferred Briggs & Stratton.


I wasn't fond of either, when I was first running lawnmowers, rototillers and snowblowers back in the day, the early 60's everything seemed to have a Clinton engine. They were exported worldwide and it wasn't until the owner Don Thomas sold the company they went downhill due to mismanagement in the late 70's early 80's I think. You still see one for sale from time to time on FleaBay or Gregslist.


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> We know how much you adore Tecumseh engines. :tongue:
> 
> I lost count of how many times I almost called this guy for his 170402.
> 
> It's even the right color for a *Toro*


* That even has the oil bath air filter system on it.*


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## classiccat

Happy Easter Folks!

between fertilizing and getting ready to spray preemergent, the Toro 724 got "summer-ized".

I have over 3hrs of runtime on the rebuild... the 2nd oil change looked much better than the 1st.

It's also running much cleaner...no smoke from the exhaust whatsoever when engaging load. I think the rings are pretty well seated.

My daughter's friend's father took a liking to this machine so I want to make sure it's fully operational/serviceable if/when I hand it over to him.

The drum augers came off without any persuasion! More indication that this machine was well maintained... another indication is that the auger gearbox was packed with Mag-1 grease!

(Another advantage of drums is how much less contact you have with the shaft.)









^^^ took every ounce of restraint not to repaint this bucket... already repainting 1 blower and have waaaay too many spring projects at the moment.


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## classiccat

the reason the scraper bar was sitting so low was the material covering the spacer was worn through (someone used fuel line).









I put a tight coil of wire on there instead.









Cleaned-off all of the surfaces with MMO & emery cloth...then a light coat of marine grease should make it easy for the next guy.









the auger bolt gets anti-seize...and the auger bushings get a light coat of 30W oil.

re-torqued the head-bolts.

entire fuel system is completely drained & rinsed with sea-foam (and sea-foam aerosol into the lines). I dry out the float bowl and treat it to a super-light coat of fogging oil.

The cylinder got fogged with fogging oil and I spray some fogging oil into the intake while turning-over with the starter (I ground the sparkplug-wire whenever doing this.)

Have a great spring/summer!


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## UNDERTAKER

*I Hope you have better luck on your lawn care UNDERTAKING than I will ever have. I have gotten use to crabby living out front now.:behindsofa:*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> *I Hope you have better luck on your lawn care UNDERTAKING than I will ever have. I have gotten use to crabby living out front now.:behindsofa:*


thanks Todd!

Last season was my first full-season on our new property. I made the mistake of doing a major overhaul/reseed of the lawn in the spring...and didn't use any preemergent. which led to a major-league crabgrass and spurge infestation.  

I redid all of my work in the fall...(and then some b/c the grubs also made their mark.) It didn't help that the town had a watering-ban from July through August.

I think we finally are getting it figured-out (I'll report back next spring  ): 

Early Spring: preemergent (Barricade)
Late Spring: more preemergent (Dimension)
Early Summer: Grubs (Merit)
Early Fall: Reseed.

Check this guy out: The Lawncare Nut.


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> thanks Todd!
> 
> Last season was my first full-season on our new property. I made the mistake of doing a major overhaul/reseed of the lawn in the spring...and didn't use any preemergent. which led to a major-league crabgrass and spurge infestation.
> 
> I redid all of my work in the fall...(and then some b/c the grubs also made their mark.) It didn't help that the town had a watering-ban from July through August.
> 
> I think we finally are getting it figured-out (I'll report back next spring  ):
> 
> Early Spring: preemergent (Barricade)
> Late Spring: more preemergent (Dimension)
> Early Summer: Grubs (Merit)
> Early Fall: Reseed.
> 
> Check this guy out: The Lawncare Nut.


 you know that spectracide triazicide is way cheaper than that fancy stuff you buy. and it gets rid of many other things. Home depot or Menards has it. you always want to seed in the fall.


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## UNDERTAKER

*Are you trying to keep up with the rest of the hood in the beauty dept. or does the city have a lawn sherrif dept. they have 1 here but I just throw them the bird on that 1. and let crabby do it's thing out front. a couple of years back I dug up the whole front yard and reseeded it.looked good for a year or two. then winter came that year we got like 100 inches of snow. and the BOZO CITY came by with a winged CAT grader to push everything futher up in the yards. and in the process they ripped up the yards and from then on everything went crapola after that. then the summers got hot and dry fried everything. and that is when I said the ELLL with it. when we first moved here to the Paradise City in 1984. the streets were paved but without curbs and gutters. it had that county urban feel to it. well we get some new BOZO'S in charge and they decide it is high time we get curbs and gutters. well instead of starting in the spring or summer they start the project in mid fall. and mind you that was back when we would or could see snow in October. I don't know the contractor was that did the job, but they were complete and udder morons. they cut everbody's yard 3/4 of the way up. they did not grade anything right and used rocky fill under the black dirt for the yards. and every body knows that rocky fill settles faster that clean fill. so now the yards are no were near level. and the north side of my drive way is sinking. not to mention the crap driveway repair job they did in the replacement. it is a real BLOODY mess. and with that crap fill nothing really grows in it. not grass anyway just every kind of weed you can think of. that is why I have entertained the idea of laying down that turf they use in the football stadiums. in the front of the house, as youse all know my back yard is for my veggie farm. and the BOZO'S that run this town can not do 1 BLOODY FREAKING THING about it. it is your constitutional right to grow your own food. and nobody can ever take that away from you. so like I said I just give them the flying bird and let crabby live on in the front yard. because like BROTHER GRUNT said it is all green from an airplane. so as I live and die a little more here each day in the Paradise City. I am and always will be THE LAST OF THE OLD SCHOOL OUTLAWS. MAHALO!!!!!!!!!!!!*


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## 10953

powershift
your not alone feeling that way. another old school outlaw here.


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## classiccat

I'm still making tweaks to this old machine.

The original H70 motor runs like a Timex. The traction however was slipping due to a friction disc that was on its last leg.

I don't see any cookbook instructions on how to change one of these out so I figure I'd throw something together here in this thread.


Disconnect the plug wire, remove the fuel tank, drain the carb bowl and I usually drain the oil if it's going to be in service position for an extended period of time.
Put the machine into the service position
Disconnect the traction linkage clevis pins (speed & direction).
Remove the Wheels
Unbolt the wheel bushings and remove the entire axle.
I unbolted the speed selection assembly at this point.
Unhook the traction spring from the front of the tractor.
Unbolt the friction wheel pivot shaft from the sides of the tractor (2 shoulder bolts).
Slide-out the friction wheel assembly








Loosen the allen bolts holding the small chain sprocket to the hex-shaft.
Slide the large & small sprocket off of their respective shafts together.








Unbolt the hex-shaft bushing








Slide-out the hex shaft








Unbolt the worn friction wheel
Tip: prior to bolting-on the new friction wheel, I wrapped it with electrical tape...keep the schmutz off of it.








Good time to clean-off all of the old grease and re-lube the components. 








Assemble in reverse order starting hex-shaft then the big-sprocket spacer.








Hook-up the traction spring to the friction wheel assembly.
Work the friction wheel & speed-selection assemblies into the tractor and bolt them in.








Remove the electrical tape if from the friction wheel (_if used_).
Reattach the traction spring to the front of the tractor.








reconnect the traction linkages and test...
The friction wheel should be centered between the forward & reverse plates.
Good time to clean-up and re-lube the wheel axle / gear; oil on the bushings & grease on the gear.








Slide the thrust washers & bushings onto the axle
Bolt the wheel axle to the tractor
Reattach the wheels
Once she's right-side-up, refill with oil & reconnect the fuel tank...go blow snow!

I'm sure I missed something but you should get the gist.

Hopefully that takes some of the mystery out of it for someone about to tackle their old-school Toro's friction drive; it's actually a fairly straightforward procedure.


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## UNDERTAKER

classiccat said:


> I'm still making tweaks to this old machine.
> 
> The original H70 motor runs like a Timex. The traction however was slipping due to a friction disc that was on it's last leg.
> 
> I don't see any cookbook instructions on how to change one of these out so I figure I'd throw something together here in this thread.
> 
> 
> Disconnect the plug wire, remove the fuel tank, drain the carb bowl and I usually drain the oil if it's going to be in service position for an extended period of time.
> Put the machine into the service position
> Disconnect the traction linkage clevis pins (speed & direction).
> Remove the Wheels
> Unbolt the wheel bushings and remove the entire axle.
> I unbolted the speed selection assembly at this point.
> Unhook the traction spring from the front of the tractor.
> Unbolt the friction wheel pivot shaft from the sides of the tractor (2 shoulder bolts).
> Slide-out the friction wheel assembly
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Loosen the allen bolts holding the small chain sprocket to the hex-shaft.
> Slide the large & small sprocket off of their respective shafts together.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unbolt the hex-shaft bushing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slide-out the hex shaft
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Unbolt the worn friction wheel
> Tip: prior to bolting-on the new friction wheel, I wrapped it with electrical tape...keep the schmutz off of it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Good time to clean-off all of the old grease and re-lube the components.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Assemble in reverse order starting hex-shaft then the big-sprocket spacer.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hook-up the traction spring to the friction wheel assembly.
> Work the friction wheel & speed-selection assemblies into the tractor and bolt them in.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Remove the electrical tape if from the friction wheel (_if used_).
> Reattach the traction spring to the front of the tractor.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reconnect the traction linkages and test...
> The friction wheel should be centered between the forward & reverse plates.
> Good time to clean-up and re-lube the wheel axle / gear; oil on the bushings & grease on the gear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Slide the thrust washers & bushings onto the axle
> Bolt the wheel axle to the tractor
> Reattach the wheels
> Once she's right-side-up, refill with oil & reconnect the fuel tank...go blow snow!
> 
> I'm sure I missed something but you should get the gist.
> 
> Hopefully that takes some of the mystery out of it for someone about to tackle their old-school Toro's friction drive; it's actually a fairly straightforward procedure.


* I thought you were going to give that 1 to somebody across the street????????????*


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## classiccat

POWERSHIFT93 said:


> * I thought you were going to give that 1 to somebody across the street????????????*


Ha! No worries Todd... where ever this machine ends-up, I'll make sure it gets registered into the National *Toro *Database. :devil:

I think she's content with me clearing her driveway...plus I have multiple parties interested in it (that's a win-win!). 

However I'm not sure that I'm interested in selling it just yet.


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## classiccat

I recorded a few passes on my driveway before clearing a driveway across the street with it. The remaining passes were made with the '71 Ariens.






The traction was flawless with the new friction disc. 

The impeller-mod never fails. In fact, I'll be upgrading a neighbor's MTD later this week after watching him unclog his machine on every pass. 

Enjoy! 

...and I hope to see other members post some videos of their machines in action during this latest storm! :wink2:


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## classiccat

I sold this machine today.

I took the owner out to the shed where the machine cold-started on 1 pull and was able to demonstrate it on a full-bucket!

No worries, it went to a good home...

... all the way across the street so I can keep close tabs on it!


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## tpenfield

your neighbor must have been eyeing the machine for a while as you restored it 😄


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## Ziggy65

Or watched you blowing snow this week with the other Toro


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## classiccat

tpenfield said:


> your neighbor must have been eyeing the machine for a while as you restored it 😄





Ziggy65 said:


> Or watched you blowing snow this week with the other Toro


It's funny Ted but I picked this machine up with her in mind but she was afraid of it at the time.

@Ziggy65 , you got it! Clearing her EOD with the 826, TORO won her heart! She was over that evening inquiring about what I was willing to part with! 

I'm going to order a set of X-tracs for it. 

It's a sweet little machine...I love those old magneto ignition tecumseh's...Smooth running engines when they're dialed-in.


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## tpenfield

classiccat said:


> It's funny Ted but I picked this machine up with her in mind but she was afraid of it at the time.


I would imagine that 30"+ inches of snow will overcome most fears of snow removal equipment 😀


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## classiccat

Ok...still making updates on this Old Iron survivor!

When I sold the machine to the neighbor, I warned her that the original tires are garbage for traction...may as well be wearing skiis. I offered to give her a set of chains or put on some x-tracs.

After bruising her legs pushing the machine through her back yard making dog paths, she wisely elected to pursue the latter!

Broke out the HF mini tire changer and got to swearin' ....err I mean workin'!










Tire slime or Fix-A-Flat made an absolute mess of these rims.










Wire-wheeled the corrosion away (and sandblaster would be handy here):









primed, sealed the corrosion pits with marine epoxy (Interlux)









sanded the bead area as smooth as possible, primed + a topcoat.









We agreed to leave the well-earned patina on the exterior of the rims.


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## asavage

classiccat said:


> the reason the scraper bar was sitting so low was the material covering the spacer was worn through (someone used fuel line).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I put a tight coil of wire on there instead.












Hmmm. 










Toro 25-5150 SCRAPER STOP CUSHION

It sure looks like a half-inch length of 1/2" ID fuel line, doesn't it?










It looks like its function is to have the scraper make less noise when it reaches the end of its travel?

Mine is missing, both sides:


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## classiccat

asavage said:


> It sure looks like a half-inch length of 1/2" ID fuel line, doesn't it?
> 
> View attachment 185730
> 
> 
> It looks like its function is to have the scraper make less noise when it reaches the end of its travel?
> 
> Mine is missing, both sides:


If 3/8" fits, I've gotta roll of it ...and sitting on a goldmine @$5 for every half inch .


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## asavage

Nah, I calipered the OD of the spacer on that bolt, it's 1/2". But good luck on that gold mine!


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