# Ground speed



## Stephen0523

Seems rather slow.
I have a 2015 Honda HSS1332ACTD SNOWBLOWER.
I love it and it throws very far.
Just yesterday I noticed it had what seemed to me slower than normal ground speed.
I phoned the dealer and they told me to bring it in as it only has about 16 hours on it.

Has anyone else experienced this, and if so is there a quick fix or adjustment?

Thanks


----------



## SB83

I've noticed this too if I'm forwarding and reversing in short succession, which I have to do in one particular section of my driveway. It returns to normal after running in forward only for a while, maybe 5 minutes. The dealer ran through an air purging process on the transmission fluid and it's better, but still there. I fear that it may be a "feature" of this new transmission. Mine runs at about half the normal speed in both forward and reverse when it's misbehaving. 100% repeatable too.


----------



## Stephen0523

Very scary SB83 since these are very expensive machines!


----------



## SB83

Ya, but these have a 3 year warranty so it should get sorted.


----------



## DriverRider

SB83 said:


> I've noticed this too if I'm forwarding and reversing in short succession, which I have to do in one particular section of my driveway. It returns to normal after running in forward only for a while, maybe 5 minutes. The dealer ran through an air purging process on the transmission fluid and it's better, but still there. I fear that it may be a "feature" of this new transmission. Mine runs at about half the normal speed in both forward and reverse when it's misbehaving. 100% repeatable too.


Does the system generate heat? I would pick a few surfaces of the system components and check with my hand for the good running temperature and then check the surfaces when misbehaving. Steam or melting snow spray from the unit might also be used as an indicator.


----------



## Bjowett

I have also found this with my HSS1332ATD since much forward and reversing is part of my clean up. It's not horrible, but noticeable as my old 828 has almost 20 years on it and never missed a beat under VERY heavy use. Checking the fluid for air mixing is not an easy task.... and It is entirely feasable that air us being drawn into the system since housing has some in it. The old hydro trans had the seperate high mounted reservoir.... Will look further into this.


----------



## JnC

Could it be the lack of HST reservoir? I know that the HSS hydros are sealed but the HS ones are not. While using the HS the HST fluid level goes up as the machine warms up. I dont know fluid dynamics but I bet it has something to do with the slower speeds once the machine warms up. Does the HSS HST have vent hole/s? 

Another option can be to try different HST fluid, one that retains its properties better with hotter working temperatures.


----------



## Stephen0523

Thanks everyone for the positive feedback! I just stopped in at the dealer in hour ago and have an appointment for Monday morning. 
He said they have seen some with low fluid and yes they have to take the top of the engine off but after they upped the fluid, they run great.
I'm going out shortly to blow some snow around back and I will check for heat around the transmission casing if I have any issues.
I think it would be a great idea for someone with some machining skills to find a way to drill a hole and modify the transmission to be able to add fluid (not that Honda should have provided some form of easy inspection like a clear window.) 
They gave us a nice fuel gauge on the fuel tank however!
So a way to check the transmission fluid and add fluid if needed and heated grips would be my only two requests to Honda for this incredible machine!


----------



## Bjowett

Since your dealer has encountered and corrected low fluid levels, that suggests we do have a problem with air mixing.

The HSS has a breather up top.

Hydro Gear builds the transmission, it is their SST model. I do not know what Honda specs for it, but Hydro Gear specs 5W30 engine oil.


----------



## Stephen0523

Well it seems to be moving at normal speed after my blowing just now and temperature temperature of the transmission case seems mildly warm. I will still take it in on Monday and I will ask him if possible take some photos when they have the engine off.


----------



## grabber

*Speed..*

I do have the same blower as yours.... noticed last year that the speed of that machine was not normal... it is not constant... With 4 feets of snow.. i do understand that you dont need much speed... but with 4 inch of snow, i use my old MTD snowblower (15year of age) to do the job... why ? because i dont have 3 hrs to clean the driveway... I will bring them the blower back this winter when time permit.
Please let us know how it ended up for you and good luck








Stephen0523 said:


> Thanks everyone for the positive feedback! I just stopped in at the dealer in hour ago and have an appointment for Monday morning.
> He said they have seen some with low fluid and yes they have to take the top of the engine off but after they upped the fluid, they run great.
> I'm going out shortly to blow some snow around back and I will check for heat around the transmission casing if I have any issues.
> I think it would be a great idea for someone with some machining skills to find a way to drill a hole and modify the transmission to be able to add fluid (not that Honda should have provided some form of easy inspection like a clear window.)
> They gave us a nice fuel gauge on the fuel tank however!
> So a way to check the transmission fluid and add fluid if needed and heated grips would be my only two requests to Honda for this incredible machine!


----------



## drmerdp

I dropped my hss928atd at my dealer today to look into my ground speed issue too. The machine top speed slowed quite a bit after a while. 

[email protected] just posted a TSB for the Lever interlock, good timing to have the dealer resolve that as well.


----------



## jrom

Bjowett said:


> I have also found this with my HSS1332ATD since much forward and reversing is part of my clean up. It's not horrible, but noticeable as my old 828 has almost 20 years on it and never missed a beat under VERY heavy use.... Will look further into this.


I have the same combination of 1332 and 828. I too am getting periodic slow downs with the 1332. I'm starting to keep a log of times. 

So far I'm getting a range of 5m:45s to 9m:20s to go 900' (450' driveway, one pass down and back) with the augers running, full forward speed, after clearing the driveway, so no snow in the way. 

The HS828TAS does the same length at 4m:11s pretty consistently.


----------



## grabber

Hope this is not a design flaw with the new transmission... a friend of mine just got his HSS1332 back from the dealer. They changed the transmission. Same problem. Either it is very complicated to install and the Honda tech didn't do a good job, or those tranny are all defective.


----------



## unvjustintime

nice statistics jrom; it will be interesting to see others perhaps do similar tests and post results. I'm not sure if I want to try.. sort of like avoiding the doctor because you can't face reality


----------



## jrom

_*"...it will be interesting to see others perhaps do similar tests and post results."*_

I'd like to see some others time theirs so I have something to go by instead of just telling my dealer it's slower. I've called twice and two different techs tried to downplay it.

*"I'm not sure if I want to try.. sort of like avoiding the doctor because you can't face reality"* - I don't blame you. I think you'll know if it really slows down, hopefully yours won't.


----------



## Clipperskipper

It seems that the trend here, is with later models with the dealer repaired hydro unit?


----------



## Stephen0523

Hello and Happy Holidays!
I got my Blower back a few days ago and it is faster.
First thing I did was try to find an iPhone app to measure ground speed, but they are not accurate at slower speeds.
I am going to set a distance of 20 or 30 feet and use the iPhone stop watch to calculate the time to cover that distance and keep a log.

The dealer said the forward / reverse cable was out of adjustment which is why it was slow.
I am still concerned as the oil level has not been checked yet.
I told the Dealer I will be coming back if it slows down again.
If the problem continues, I will contact Honda and insist the issue be resolved, via a new Trans or service!


----------



## drmerdp

I haven't got mine back from the dealer yet. I'm having them take care of the control lever interlock TSB too though. 

I was very insistent on the fluid level being checked and system purged because of specific symptoms of aeration. We will see.


----------



## SB83

For the newer people here on the forum, Honda addressed similar symptoms back in late 2015 with a TSB for transmission replacements on some HSS928AT serial number ranges (not sure about HSS1332s). 

That was for reduced transport speeds but I blow snow and reverse at full/transport speed all the time as I'm sure most others do. Based on that history, I'm hoping that they're jump on this soon, although I doubt it's going to be a simple/inexpensive fix for them.


----------



## SB83

Bumping this thread to see if the speed problems have been resolved for those who brought their machines in for service. 

I'm still seeing my speeds dropping off significantly, even after the transmission air purge was done. It's especially noticeable in reverse.

Thanks!


----------



## drmerdp

I'll update this thread once I get my machine back. The holidays has effected the timeliness of repairs.


----------



## grabber

IMO it is a disgrace ... my old MTD can make a run all around my Honda running full speed forward... the speed when wrong simply slow down almost half of what it is running when normal. I have my security camera around the house that can show what I mean. Will make it play on my display and film with my iphone... will put it on youtube for you to see.
Honest, I have a full time job, and when I have to blow on week days (in the morning) I use my old MTD because I don't have 3 hours to blow my driveway. 
Youtube to follow.


----------



## Ariens hydro pro

Bjowett said:


> Hydro Gear specs 5W30 engine oil.


Synthetic oil only.


----------



## grabber

Here you go with my video, blower working full speed forward.








This blower goes as fast as my MTD in 1st gear. Next video, my MTD doing cercle around my Honda running full speed. Need to find an other driver.


----------



## grabber

an other one


----------



## grabber

here you can see me pushing the blower forward when transmission engaged backward... trying to bleed... lol


I do hope Honda works to find the problem with their transmission, because besides this, this is a great blower. I will bring it to Honda eventually. I think they need more time to put the finger on the problem. 


Later.


----------



## Bjowett

Ariens hydro pro said:


> Synthetic oil only.


Are you recommending or have you found Hydro Gear or Honda to spec synthetic? I do use synthetic, especially in things that are difficult to service and relatively expensive to replace... Cheap insurance.


----------



## drmerdp

http://www.hydro-gear.com/77309c4672_sites/hydro-gear.com/files/sst.pdf

Page 8-9. 5w-30 oil specified, but no reference to synthetic. Only says to not use biodegradable oils, as they will wear down quickly in this application.

I can't see why synthetic oil would be harmful.


----------



## drmerdp

So I have an update, I haven't recovered my HSS928 back yet but I received a call from Honda Power Equipment of America. The lady was asking me to detail the condition I'm experiencing and retracing the use the machine has seen. 

She asked me if I had any other concerns I may have, so I detailed "clog-gate." Personally I have not be terribly effected by this but I made mention of the snowblower forum i belong to. I explained the members who are very upset and the bad publicity Honda is getting and that people who visit this forum for its resource of knowledge are being dissuaded from an HSS purchase. 

Gotta see what comes of this.

I think it's worth mentioning that the Honda rep took my issue very seriously and was happy to hear that my dealer didn't simply give it back after making an "adjustment". It's because of my dealers diligence that Honda called me.

Props to Hanover Power Sports in New Jersey.


----------



## georgewny

*thanks for the YouTube post, and be careful at the end of the driveway!*



grabber said:


> IMO it is a disgrace ... my old MTD can make a run all around my Honda running full speed forward... the speed when wrong simply slow down almost half of what it is running when normal. I have my security camera around the house that can show what I mean. Will make it play on my display and film with my iphone... will put it on youtube for you to see.
> Honest, I have a full time job, and when I have to blow on week days (in the morning) I use my old MTD because I don't have 3 hours to blow my driveway.
> Youtube to follow.


Hey Grabber, 
thanks for posting the YouTube vids, impressive machine! and see what you mean about the speed, or lack there of. 

Also, that's one busy street you live on, gotta be scary clearing the end of the driveway with all those cars coming at ya... kinda reminded me of an old game from the '80's called "frogger". 

I really hope Honda gets the transmission issue figured out, plus all the clogging issues I've read about on the HSS928. Am curious on how these issues may get resolved.


----------



## Ariens hydro pro

drmerdp said:


> http://www.hydro-gear.com/77309c4672_sites/hydro-gear.com/files/sst.pdf
> 
> Page 8-9. 5w-30 oil specified, but no reference to synthetic. Only says to not use biodegradable oils, as they will wear down quickly in this application.
> 
> I can't see why synthetic oil would be harmful.


The link went bad.

What Hydro-gear transmission is in the Honda machine?


----------



## JnC

Ariens hydro pro said:


> The link went bad.
> 
> What Hydro-gear transmission is in the Honda machine?


Manufacturer: Hydro-gear
Model: SST

Leading Manufacturer of Precision Drive Solutions - Hydro-Gear - SST™


----------



## Ariens hydro pro

I thought is was that one but was not positive. Thank you

The Ariens uses the RT-310 unit. I don't know the differences, perhaps this is a smaller unit for wheeled blowers? I don't know.
I sure hope Hydro-Gear makes good transmissions as I just dropped a short ton of money for my blower!

edit to add: The Honda unit is bigger I think with 2 output shafts and the axles are 3/4 in diameter compared to 1 5/8 shaft. They are totally different transmissions.


----------



## Bjowett

The Honda Hydro Gear SST is model number 1310-1003. I believe it was originally designed for zero turn walk behind mowers.


----------



## Bjowett

I inspected the fluid level in my machine today, it checked out fine/in spec.


----------



## jrom

Bjowett said:


> I inspected the fluid level in my machine today, it checked out fine/in spec.


Did you dis-assemble to get to the steering arm lever hole (assuming that's where you checked the level), or did you find another way? Very curious.

Thanks.


----------



## Bjowett

No disassembly required, managed to perform the task in machine with some careful finagling. Removed the breather/fill plug, made a small flexible dip stick with a stop that could curve down the fill hole. It's very tight, but the breather can be removed with 11/16" and 18mm open end wrenches. I may install an elbow in place of the breather and run a hose up to an external reservoir.


----------



## jrom

Bjowett said:


> No disassembly required, managed to perform the task in machine with some careful finagling. Removed the breather/fill plug, made a small flexible dip stick with a stop that could curve down the fill hole. It's very tight, but the breather can be removed with 11/16" and 18mm open end wrenches. I may install an elbow in place of the breather and run a hose up to an external reservoir.


Very cool. Good idea on the elbow and extender tube. Thanks for that info.


----------



## jrom

I'm going to adjust my cable first, then do some more timing. If they stay close to what I've been getting, I'm taking her in.

Some times so far:

12/16/16
- HSS1332ATD, 900’: 559 seconds
- HS828TAS, 900’: 355 seconds

12/19/16
- HSS1332ATD, 900’: 319 sec.
- HS828TAS. 900’: 305 sec

12/31/16
- HSS1332ATD, 900’: 470 sec.
- HS828TAS, 900’: 324 sec.

1/5/17
- HSS1332ATD, 900’: 670 sec.
- HS828TAS, 900’: 315 sec.

Shop manual states I should get a max time of 11.4 seconds for 30 ft and 12.5 seconds per 10 m.


----------



## jrom

I probably should use 1,000 ft as my test, but 900' is from my garage to my mailbox, then back towards house, around my circle drive until it meets the main drive, turn around and head back to garage. Basically one pass down, one pass back.

I've been using a digital kitchen timer that checks out with my phone, a wall clock and another windup timer.


----------



## Bjowett

There is a reason the older HS transaxle has a high mounted reservoir. I'll post a parts list for anyone else interested in doing this... At the minimum fluid condition will be easy to check. Hopefully the lip seals for the turning arms can deal with being submerged vs splashed.

I'll try to get to some timed runs in the next week. Any chance you have a temperature gun? It may be beneficial to know if the temperature is changing during the slow and fast runs.


----------



## jrom

No temp gun. Thought about getting one for a wood fired pizza oven that's on my list to build. If I do, might try a harbor freight cheapie.

I did put my hand on the back of the trans a couple of times and didn't notice any abnormal heat, nothing hot to the touch, but maybe it is heating up beyond spec.

I'll see about getting a gun soon.


----------



## grabber

jrom said:


> I probably should use 1,000 ft as my test, but 900' is from my garage to my mailbox, then back towards house, around my circle drive until it meets the main drive, turn around and head back to garage. Basically one pass down, one pass back.
> 
> I've been using a digital kitchen timer that checks out with my phone, a wall clock and another windup timer.



Was the blower engaged or just the transmission ? might make a difference.


----------



## florindi

I am a victim to this ground speed issue as well. This machine is POS!! I can't believe I spent $3200 and literally the first storm in Boston it becomes an issue. The unit slowed down to less than half speed. Also, if you disengaged either track during this slower speed the unit would come to a halt. Just to reiterate, I went out in our first storm and within 20 mins my HSS1332ATD slowed down. I am asking for my money back. My 12 year old TORO that I haven't sold yet never had any issues for half the cost.


----------



## jrom

grabber said:


> Was the blower engaged or just the transmission ? might make a difference.


I've been timing with the blower engaged, but after I cleared a path. I also would run with just the transmission and get the same slow down...didn't time those runs though.


----------



## grabber

Not only the transmission, now the auger lever doesn't stay.... I know there is a recall on this issue. For now, masking tape will do the job. Don't have time to bring the Blower to Honda.


----------



## georgewny

*unbelievable how Honda can put products like this out*



florindi said:


> I am a victim to this ground speed issue as well. This machine is POS!! I can't believe I spent $3200 and literally the first storm in Boston it becomes an issue. The unit slowed down to less than half speed. Also, if you disengaged either track during this slower speed the unit would come to a halt. Just to reiterate, I went out in our first storm and within 20 mins my HSS1332ATD slowed down. I am asking for my money back. My 12 year old TORO that I haven't sold yet never had any issues for half the cost.


Folks,
I find this totally unacceptable and unbelievable, that Honda, which most on this forum have a high regard for can produce and sell at over THREE THOUSAND US DOLLARS machines that do not function as intended!
in another forum "HSS928 Clogged" people are actually removing pieces of their machines, (shroud collar) just to get a 3 grand machine to function like a cheaper make machine at 1/3 the cost... That is such a perverted thought to purchase a brand new 3 grand machine and have to remove parts/modify it in order to get it to work as intended. Its so freaking absurd that it defies any logic at all. 
If I were one of Honda's competitors, I'd have my advertising group buy a HSS11x and HS92X and film a commercial on how their machines compare to Honda's and their machines are 1/3 or 1/2 the cost!

Has any of the poor soles that have purchased these newer model HSS11x and HSS92x tried to engage the dealership they purchased the machines from? Or contacted Honda America customer care?

I just find it unbelievable that Honda would abandon their customer base and leave us out to dry after spending that amount of money on their latest series of machines that have consistently out performed the competition of years.

I may be naive, but I still have a lot of respect and loyalty towards Honda products, but after reading the threads in this forum, its pushing even me, a Honda loyalist to not recommend their products till we see some positive actions on what they will do to correct this situation for its customers.

Please post any responses you may have received from the dealerships or Honda Cooperate, if no one approaches them with these issues, then in Honda's mind, the issue does not exist, and will not be corrected. Kinda like if a Tree falls in the forest and no body hears it...
You need to be vocal to the powers to be within the Honda network to get this resolved.

Or plain and simply, no one else purchase Honda's new HSS line of blowers, best way to deal with a company is to not purchase their products if they will not support its customer base. I am very confident that Honda will address the problem, just a question of when, but they need to know the problem exists.


----------



## Marlow

I have a feeling the dealerships are going to be absolutely bombarded with people bringing their machines in for the various issues that have arisen after the snow goes. Not so many people are going to bring their machine in now as they don't want to be without it for weeks during a time when they need it most. Come spring time, watch out Honda!


----------



## kirky2126

I was out cleaning up from the storm we just got and I noticed my HSS724 ACTD and after a hr or so of use I noticed my blower was slowing down .. not impressed only 25 hrs on machine . Before when in reverse the machine would run you over if you wasn't careful but today it was faster to pull the machine back


----------



## Tomatillo

On what year/model is the auger lever problem?




grabber said:


> Not only the transmission, now the auger lever doesn't stay.... I know there is a recall on this issue. For now, masking tape will do the job. Don't have time to bring the Blower to Honda.


----------



## jrom

Tomatillo said:


> On what year/model is the auger lever problem?


Yours is on the list Tom. My dealer said my 1332 would have to be exhibiting the problem before they would replace it. In other words, It'll have to pop out on them.


----------



## georgewny

Well,
that's somewhat better news.
At least Honda is acknowledging there is a transmission issue and has a solution if it crops up on you.

Are you guys happy with Honda's response?
I know sending the replace kit to add the reservoir like the old HS series had would be expensive.
And the issue how to get those large machines to the dealership and back again, how long before you get the beast back home... stuff like that comes to mind.

I guess there is some good logic in stating that we'll fix it if it happens to you... But what about after 3 years when warranty is over?
will they offer an extension to the warranty?

Wonder if they will do something about the Chute clogging issue or is that still "non existent" in Honda's eyes?


----------



## grabber

Tomatillo said:


> On what year/model is the auger lever problem?



Mine has been bought last year, so its a 2016
Not sure to what model the recall though.


----------



## jrom

grabber said:


> Mine has been bought last year, so its a 2016
> Not sure to what model the recall though.


HSS724, HSS928 & HSS1332

From Robert:
http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...8-hss1332-auger-clutch-lever-not-locking.html


----------



## Tomatillo

Thanks, Joe and grabber. That was very helpful.

Fortunately, it doesn't affect my serial number, so I'm good.

The dealer said this morning that there's a bulletin for a bolt tightening issue, when I can bring it in. Just an inspection, though.

I wonder why I don't see these two issues listed among the TSBs at the Honda site?

Honda Power Equipment: Honda Generators, Lawn Mowers, Snow blowers, Tillers

Maybe I'm looking in the wrong place.


----------



## drmerdp

I think those are only recalls. Pretty sure the technical service bulletins are only available to Honda repair facilities. 

[email protected] posted about the auger and drive handle interlock TSB. Which was nice.


----------



## Tomatillo

You're right. Thanks.




drmerdp said:


> I think those are only recalls. Pretty sure the technical service bulletins are only available to Honda repair facilities.
> 
> [email protected] posted about the auger and drive handle interlock TSB. Which was nice.


----------



## Stephen0523

Hello. 
I brought my machine back in two days ago as it was going slow again.
They just called me this Saturday morning to tell me they are going to install a vent kit on it and it is all under warranty! 
The kit is very expensive they said. I will find out how much when I pick it up. I will send photos if I can of the installed kit. They also told me when going forward I should not immediately pull back to go in reverse but I should release to left lever before going into reverse.

I will keep everyone posted on how I make out and I hope I get it back before Wednesday as we are expecting another big storm!


----------



## drmerdp

The kit is cheap the install is the expensive part.

Removal of engine and engine bed. Install the reservoir and hose fill with fluid. Install bed and engine. Then the purging process, top off reservoir and done.


----------



## Tomatillo

Stephen0523 said:


> They also told me when going forward I should not immediately pull back to go in reverse but I should release to left lever before going into reverse.


THIS IS COMPLETE BS! What kind of eggshell, kid gloves transmission is this!? That approach, if required, would nearly completely devalue the hydrostatic transmission, vs. manual. What do they care if you are inconvenienced, so long as their bubblegum repair doesn't blow up.

To be clear, they want us to release the left drive lever before going into reverse, and then release it again when going into forward. Is THAT what you were told!?

Thanks for the post, Stephen.


----------



## SB83

I can agree that you shouldn't be slamming it into reverse, but smoothly passing through neutral without releasing the lever is probably much easier on the machine. Even if it wasn't, I've been running Honda blowers that way for almost 20 years, do a lot of reversing and have never had an issue other than the now resolved speed issue.


----------



## jrom

SB83 said:


> I can agree that you shouldn't be slamming it into reverse, but smoothly passing through neutral without releasing the lever is probably much easier on the machine. Even if it wasn't, I've been running Honda blowers that way for almost 20 years, do a lot of reversing and have never had an issue other than the now resolved speed issue.


Yep, same here...(except my one-time drive clutch spring snap at 20 years on the 828. I was moving forward to reverse rather aggressively though, and this was after 20 years of hard usage...not mega-usage, cold, hard wet snow usage :smile.


----------



## Lake Effect

Anything new on the ground speed issue? I bought a HSS928AATD in November 2016, which isn't effected by transmission bulletin. It definitely has the top speed issue(about 50%) when shifting back and forth, which eventually recovers.

My local dealer is ordering the bulletin to fix the auger lever issue that I dealt with last season. The service dept told me that my unit isn't effected by the transmission valve s/n batch. That there isn't anything currently available to cure my problem. Since others have the same issue, Honda needs to find a repair, updated transmission resevoir, etc.

I'd like to have everything taken care of at once!


----------



## Stephen0523

Hi Lake Effect.I contacted Honda and they got in touchch with my dealer.
Hopefully I will have an eta when the vent kit will arrive and be installed.

I will update here when things start to move.


----------



## FearlessFront

That is out least the second issue I have heard with these new machine's. For the price these machines cost, issues like this should have been sorted out way ahead of releasing the machine for sale. Obviously they should have taken a lot more time testing these machine's to see what was going on and make sure they worked the kinks out well before release to the public. Their is no excuse, even under warranty that many machines having to go back in for maintenance or new parts is ridiculous. What happens if they determine the part they used was a complete failure and can't be replaced? What happens when these things show up for some people after 3 years or new things pop up after say just 5 years of use? No excuse, not at those prices.


----------



## Lake Effect

Thanks Stephen0523. Mine is scheduled for next Wednesday. I sent an email to Honda, since my dealer doesn't handle many snowblowers.


----------



## Lake Effect

My dealer spoke with Honda techline and they are sending the parts(remote transmission fluid reservoir) to fix the intermittent speed issue in cold temps. The auger interlock bulletin kit has been installed. Having it done now when there's no rush to get it back.


----------



## Marlow

FearlessFront said:


> Obviously they should have taken a lot more time testing these machine's to see what was going on and make sure they worked the kinks out well before release to the public. Their is no excuse, even under warranty that many machines having to go back in for maintenance or new parts is ridiculous. What happens if they determine the part they used was a complete failure and can't be replaced? What happens when these things show up for some people after 3 years or new things pop up after say just 5 years of use? No excuse, not at those prices.


Wow :icon_scratch:. Name me a single manufacturer that has ever released a brand new redesign that never had bugs? There is only so much that can be uncovered in R&D, which they do fix before releasing. But it's inevitable that once a new product is mass released there are bugs that will come up. Everything will be sorted out in the first few years of a redesign. 

Why do you think auto manufacturers always have recalls? Again, doesn't matter how much R&D you do, nothing can come close to simulating a mass release in the real world(though they do their best). 

You can crap on a company for not fixing their problems - that's fine, and make no mistake EVERY manufacturer has problems arise. But the true testament of a good company is not that they never have issues, but how they handle it when they do have issues. And Honda is handling their business. Relax.


----------



## FearlessFront

Marlow said:


> Wow :icon_scratch:. Name me a single manufacturer that has ever released a brand new redesign that never had bugs? There is only so much that can be uncovered in R&D, which they do fix before releasing. But it's inevitable that once a new product is mass released there are bugs that will come up. Everything will be sorted out in the first few years of a redesign.
> 
> Why do you think auto manufacturers always have recalls? Again, doesn't matter how much R&D you do, nothing can come close to simulating a mass release in the real world(though they do their best).
> 
> You can crap on a company for not fixing their problems - that's fine, and make no mistake EVERY manufacturer has problems arise. But the true testament of a good company is not that they never have issues, but how they handle it when they do have issues. And Honda is handling their business. Relax.


Nobody is crapping on anything. I am making a simple observation for that the money you pay for those machines they should have had that issue as well as the clogging issues taken care of before release. Iv'e read about many of these new ones having an issue with snow clogging inside them. That is something that could have most certainly been sorted out before release. Your welcome to your opinion and I'm welcome to mine and I'm sure many would agree with mine. So you relax, because your the one way out on the offense ready to have a fist fight over honda who will gladly take your hard earned money and be happy for you to go out to bat and fight for them for free with free publicity, that's clear with the guy from honda rooting you on.. Chill, it will be cold soon enough! :grin::grin::grin::smile2:
Wrahhhhh Honda is the best, every manufacture always has recalls, its perfectly fine to pay $3000 for issues that were not ironed out by the engineers, you wanna talk c..p about honda, lets go outside now!!! 
Take a chill pill.

The snappers they built for 30 years came out and had no recalls over time they did make things better like taller chutes and tires with better treads, but they had a 30 year run with no recalls and they are half as much as a honda was/is. I use it commercially year after year after year and honestly, I would not give it up for anything, not even a honda... Theres one example how many more can we pull up? Honda, there the best, don't dare talk any negative about them!!! 
Okay bud, hang up the boxing gloves, you love your honda, we got it, and I love my snapper, want to go toe to toe machine vs. machine this winter lets see what happens, that will be interesting, rather than talking smack and wasting time, 2002 Snapper 8246 vs. Honda lets do this!

...From now on when someone comes out ready to pick a fight, no more wasting time with words and aggression, this is how we are going to do this, the machine's will do the talking, someone has an issue, put your money where your mouth is, machine vs machine is a snow removal contest, the operator that wins, takes the other guys machine home with them. Will make an elaborate course with heavy snow, light snow, wet snow and which ever machine clears their half first wins the round and gets bragging right's, wins the argument that started on here and takes the looser's machine home with them, that is how we will settle these disagreements from now on. Who wants to be the judge during the competition, to make sure it stays fair and the looser relinquishes their machine? We can have different classes too. Single stage, intermediate, heavy duty, professional, tractor mounted and commercial big machine's. Lets make this interesting. So round 1 Snapper vs. Honda lets do this! :snow48:


----------



## Stephen0523

Well Honda and the dealer called. The vent kit is in! I am bringing the unit in the beginning of September to have it installed.
Hopefully we have a hard winter to put it to the test LOL!
I will keep everyone posted.


----------



## Stephen0523

Brought the blower in yesterday. I will keep everyone posted.


----------



## Stephen0523

Just got the blower home just now. Speed forward and reverse are great! The true test will be through the winter and I will post again in the spring to let everyone know how it went.


----------



## unknown1

For the people impacted by transmission slow-downs on this thread, you may be interested in my post #17 on this other thread and any responses from Robert
http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...on/118721-purchased-new-blower-am-i-nuts.html

I couldn't find Robert here so I couldn't give him that summary here. Just a "like" from Robert somewhere

I tried to summarize everything I saw in this "Ground Speed" thread and bring it to Robert's attention.
In the meantime I need to get out of the loop and I hope you all get some answers and resolution.

At a minimum, if I were in your shoes, I would send a certified-delivery letter outlining your concerns to Honda and make sure that the date of that letter is inside the warranty period.
If it takes some time for the issue to percolate through the Honda support chain, it will help to have documentation of the issue that falls inside the warranty period.
If you leave it until Spring 2018, some of the 2015 machines will be at the warranty limit.


----------



## unknown1

stuart80112 said:


> For the people impacted by transmission slow-downs on this thread, you may be interested in my post #17 on this other thread and any responses from Robert
> http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...on/118721-purchased-new-blower-am-i-nuts.html
> 
> I tried to summarize everything I saw in this "Ground Speed" thread and bring it to Robert's attention.
> In the meantime I need to get out of the loop and I hope you all get some answers and resolution.
> 
> At a minimum, if I were in your shoes, I would send a certified-delivery letter outlining your concerns to Honda and make sure that the date of that letter is inside the warranty period.
> If it takes some time for the issue to percolate through the Honda support chain, it will help to have documentation of the issue that falls inside the warranty period.
> If you leave it until Spring 2018, some of the 2015 machines will be at the warranty limit.


You might want to read post #20 on that thread too. Only you guys know which transmissions are involved.


----------



## grump99

We are looking to buy a Honda HSS1332. It looks like a fantastic machine and would meet our needs. 

However, these transmission issues are troubling. Has this problem been widespread, or more isolated in nature?

Does anyone know if Honda has sorted this out with the newly manufactured units? 

I'm thinking that hopefully they have looked at how they have been manufacturing/filling the transmissions or have been installing vents into their newer units?

We will still likely buy since the warranty will cover any issues, but it would be nice to know they have sorted this out.

Thanks!


----------



## rbhayes

Bump - was there ever a closure on the ground speed issue?




grump99 said:


> We are looking to buy a Honda HSS1332. It looks like a fantastic machine and would meet our needs.
> 
> However, these transmission issues are troubling. Has this problem been widespread, or more isolated in nature?
> 
> Does anyone know if Honda has sorted this out with the newly manufactured units?
> 
> I'm thinking that hopefully they have looked at how they have been manufacturing/filling the transmissions or have been installing vents into their newer units?
> 
> We will still likely buy since the warranty will cover any issues, but it would be nice to know they have sorted this out.
> 
> Thanks!


----------



## Stephen0523

No closure yet as I have not had any snow yet, thankfully! I am hoping to get it out soon in the years to run it for a bit to see.
Will keep all posted.


----------



## Stephen0523

Good morning. About 3 weeks since I got the machine back from having the vent kit installed at the dealer's.
I had the machine out yesterday in the back yard and it was sunny and warm at around 70° and drove it around going forward and backwards for around an hour with no issues.

Note: I always hold the drive clutch lever (machine in neutral) for about 30 seconds to warm the trans oil.

I tried going forward, brought the drive shift stick back to the middle, then released the left clutch lever and went into reverse. I did this several times and then also tried going into reverse, but not releasing the left clutch lever and the speed stayed fast/normal.

I am not quite sure if it makes a difference releasing the left clutch lever or not, but there is nothing in the user manual suggesting otherwise (pg 36 attached is all I had in the manual).
Well that is it for now. 

I also contacted Honda (Jane was the lady there and she was very kind and helpful). I told her that I will send a letter to Honda with my issues and she said even after the warranty, that if I have any further issues Honda will take care of me especially since all of this has been so well documented in their system!

Some snow coming tonight and the worst is yet to come I am sure, so I will keep the progress reports coming.


----------



## grabber

Hi there, 
Anyway you can have a picture of the vents or modification they did on your tranny to fix the ground issue.
I about to bring my blower to Honda to fix this problem also. I noticed this problem since the first year when i bought the blower but did not bring to honda... wanted them to get some experience on those new tranny before i have them work on mine... my driveway is 300ft and to be honnest, i use my Mastercraft one when only 6 inch of snow... cannot tolerate the speed of my honda



Stephen0523 said:


> Good morning. About 3 weeks since I got the machine back from having the vent kit installed at the dealer's.
> I had the machine out yesterday in the back yard and it was sunny and warm at around 70° and drove it around going forward and backwards for around an hour with no issues.
> 
> Note: I always hold the drive clutch lever (machine in neutral) for about 30 seconds to warm the trans oil.
> 
> I tried going forward, brought the drive shift stick back to the middle, then released the left clutch lever and went into reverse. I did this several times and then also tried going into reverse, but not releasing the left clutch lever and the speed stayed fast/normal.
> 
> I am not quite sure if it makes a difference releasing the left clutch lever or not, but there is nothing in the user manual suggesting otherwise (pg 36 attached is all I had in the manual).
> Well that is it for now.
> 
> I also contacted Honda (Jane was the lady there and she was very kind and helpful). I told her that I will send a letter to Honda with my issues and she said even after the warranty, that if I have any further issues Honda will take care of me especially since all of this has been so well documented in their system!
> 
> Some snow coming tonight and the worst is yet to come I am sure, so I will keep the progress reports coming.


----------



## Stephen0523

Hi Grabber, I do not see any evidence of where it is, so it may be internal. Perhaps someone on the forum can help me as the where to look.


----------



## grabber

Hi Stephen,
Hope this post will post... .hehe.. just arriving from blowing and decided to drink a GOOD christmas drink... now i have hard time to post !!! hehe...
Anyway, i am curius to know how satisfied you are since the time honda played with your tranny... do you have acceptable speed now ?
I decided to test my blower today.. and i am surprised that the speed is consistent now... the temperature outside now is -2 which is warm... and i do recall reading somewhere that the ground speed was more evident when the temperature was cold.... any way the speed is consistent now. I will test when the weather will be colder to see any changed.
I do have the problem with the auger lever not keeping engaged... and this is really annoying. I do fix this with a string to fix the lever to the bar.

Happy Holliday to you 



Stephen0523 said:


> Hi Grabber, I do not see any evidence of where it is, so it may be internal. Perhaps someone on the forum can help me as the where to look.


----------



## Stephen0523

So Far So Good! Not enough use to really tell yet though.
Will keep you posted.

Happy Holidays!


----------



## Lake Effect

Here's a few shots of the added hydraulic resevoir(looking between the tracks from the rear). It's plumbed into the top of the transmission, in place of the plug. So far the intermittent speed has been resolved.

Also, the auger interlock replacement kit took care of that annoying problem.

All in all, I'm satisfied, Honda is standing behind their product.


----------



## grabber

Hi and thanks for your post.
How should we understand this.... the external reservoir is allowing oil to get out of the tranny while warming ? Could the issue with speed caused by too much oil pressure in the tranny ?
Last year i could replicate the speed issue anytime i wanted... but this year so far i couldnt replicate it. the speed is consistent. The weather outside is not that cold though.... -2 to -8 so maybe the problem is occuring only during cold weather ?
December here has been very busy month as far as snow storm... again, no speed issue.
But even if i didnt experience any speed issue this winter, i know i have this problem. 





Lake Effect said:


> Here's a few shots of the added hydraulic resevoir(looking between the tracks from the rear). It's plumbed into the top of the transmission, in place of the plug. So far the intermittent speed has been resolved.
> 
> Also, the auger interlock replacement kit took care of that annoying problem.
> 
> All in all, I'm satisfied, Honda is standing behind their product.


----------



## Lake Effect

I believe the problem was as the temps dropped, the fluid contracted and created a slightly low fluid level possibly introducing air into the system. This caused the loss in speed. The reservoir allows for temp changes and keeps it topped off all the time. That plug where the it's plumbed into now, may have been a small vented orifice. My last snowblower was a HS724TA and had a small reservoir like a master cylinder housing. Never had that issue. Engineering probably factored it into the design on the HSS units but it wasn't enough.

Grabber, get the auger latching bulletin done for a more positive engagement.


----------



## Stephen0523

Thanks lake effect for the photos. I see on my machine the tank also and so far the speed is still good.


----------



## drmerdp

Lake Effect said:


> I believe the problem was as the temps dropped, the fluid contracted and created a slightly low fluid level possibly introducing air into the system. This caused the loss in speed. The reservoir allows for temp changes and keeps it topped off all the time.


Exactly, I had this reservoir kit installed as well and I have not experienced a problem since. I’m not sure what hydrogear has changed since, but it appears new HSS machines do not have this installed from the factory and do not have any issues.


----------



## grabber

Sorry but English is not my best speaking language... 
When you says
get the auger latching bulletin done for a more positive engagement

Are you referring to the auger lever (right hand side) that doesnt keep pressed by itself while running the blower?



Lake Effect said:


> I believe the problem was as the temps dropped, the fluid contracted and created a slightly low fluid level possibly introducing air into the system. This caused the loss in speed. The reservoir allows for temp changes and keeps it topped off all the time. That plug where the it's plumbed into now, may have been a small vented orifice. My last snowblower was a HS724TA and had a small reservoir like a master cylinder housing. Never had that issue. Engineering probably factored it into the design on the HSS units but it wasn't enough.
> 
> Grabber, get the auger latching bulletin done for a more positive engagement.


----------



## grabber

now if this external reservoir is the fix, how come they are not doing a recall... the way i am using my blower, with lots of forward and backward because i have a driveway with lots of cars, maybe i am more at risk to have this issue, but it doesnt mean that you dont have the problem with your blower (since you might not do lots of backward and forward like i do), but still your tranny could be defective.


----------



## cranman

This thread make me glad that all of my go to blowers are 30 plus years old and have no issues.....the more bells and whistles we get.....the more breakdowns...Keep it simple stupid!


----------



## JimmyD

grabber said:


> now if this external reservoir is the fix, how come they are not doing a recall...


They have a TSB for the reservoir fix, which applies to certain serial number ranges. All units aren't affected so it's not a blanket bulletin. The most likely explanation for this is that Honda fixed the problem at some point during the production line. 

Unlike TSBs that typically are only performed during the warranty period for eligible customers only, recalls are issued due to safety concerns, are federally mandated, and never expire.


----------



## Stephen0523

Hey Grabber. If I were you and your blower is still under warranty I would definitely go have the vent kit installed. I also noticed just yesterday after rotating my skid shoes and adjusting the blade another dipstick! There are also scuff marks below it and I am not sure where they came from!


----------



## Lake Effect

grabber said:


> Sorry but English is not my best speaking language...
> When you says
> get the auger latching bulletin done for a more positive engagement
> 
> Are you referring to the auger lever (right hand side) that doesnt keep pressed by itself while running the blower?


Yes, it's an improved part that keeps the auger lever engaged while holding just the drive lever. Your dealer can contact Honda and they will send the repair kit. I'll bet it is a production improvement, newer units will have from this point forward.


----------



## Lake Effect

Stephen0523 said:


> Hey Grabber. If I were you and your blower is still under warranty I would definitely go have the vent kit installed. I also noticed just yesterday after rotating my skid shoes and adjusting the blade another dipstick! There are also scuff marks below it and I am not sure where they came from!


Those scuff marks are from cleaning(grinding) off the cast flashing of that piece during production. Normal process of making cast parts.


----------



## Stephen0523

Thanks Lake Effect for the fast reply on the scuffs!


----------



## grabber

Thanks for the reply
Do you have an idea where we can have info on what TSB number point to this problem ?

thanks again.



JimmyD said:


> They have a TSB for the reservoir fix, which applies to certain serial number ranges. All units aren't affected so it's not a blanket bulletin. The most likely explanation for this is that Honda fixed the problem at some point during the production line.
> 
> Unlike TSBs that typically are only performed during the warranty period for eligible customers only, recalls are issued due to safety concerns, are federally mandated, and never expire.


----------



## Lake Effect

grabber said:


> Thanks for the reply
> Do you have an idea where we can have info on what TSB number point to this problem ?
> 
> thanks again.


Talk to your local dealer and they can call Honda tech line for the kit. They're wasn't a bulletin # listed on the repair order.


----------



## jrom

grabber said:


> ...But even if i didnt experience any speed issue this winter, i know i have this problem.


Grabber, I would get your machine into the dealer before your warranty is up, but my suggestion is for you to write down some speed times. Your 300 foot driveway is great for noticing any slow-downs.

Honda replaced my transmission, even though my dealer could not replicate the slow-down problem. Luckily, I had (still have) a 26 year old HS828 (tracked) to check speed against and I wrote down times...and they varied.

Get that lever problem fixed too.

I have this winter left for any warranty fixes that could pop-up. So far everything has been great. Honda is a good company.


----------



## jrom

And by the way, my HSS1332ATD is a great machine. The more I get to know it, the better it gets. 

– 18°F (18 below) out today, cleared about 7" of lightweight snow, end of driveway (EOD) packed solid – almost like concrete and the 13 (as I call her) was a champ.


----------



## grabber

did what you suggested and my times are :

forward :
160ft = 1min 35sec
30ft = 19 sec

Backward:
30ft = 25.08

Im sure yours is way faster than mine... i even took video on my Iphone, showing the full throttle and the transmission stick, full forward. All these results are filmed with iphone. At worst if the dealer cannot replicate and dont want to do anything, i will send my video to Honda Canada with my complaint.




jrom said:


> Grabber, I would get your machine into the dealer before your warranty is up, but my suggestion is for you to write down some speed times. Your 300 foot driveway is great for noticing any slow-downs.
> 
> Honda replaced my transmission, even though my dealer could not replicate the slow-down problem. Luckily, I had (still have) a 26 year old HS828 (tracked) to check speed against and I wrote down times...and they varied.
> 
> Get that lever problem fixed too.
> 
> I have this winter left for any warranty fixes that could pop-up. So far everything has been great. Honda is a good company.


----------



## Stephen0523

Hey grabber, can you upload the videos here?


----------



## jrom

I did 4 separate time trials based on a 900' run, so after dividing my times, they come out (roughly) to these:

HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 93sec
HS828TAS - 150ft = 59sec

HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 53sec
HS828TAS - 150ft = 51sec

HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 79sec
HS828TAS - 150ft = 54sec

HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 112sec
HS828TAS - 150ft = 52sec

I did not do any reverse times.

My 828 was 25 years old at the time.

Machines were running at full speed forward, auger engaged, but not blowing any snow.

I supplied these stats to Honda on the phone and to my dealer on paper.





grabber said:


> did what you suggested and my times are :
> 
> forward :
> 160ft = 1min 35sec
> 30ft = 19 sec
> 
> Backward:
> 30ft = 25.08
> 
> Im sure yours is way faster than mine... i even took video on my Iphone, showing the full throttle and the transmission stick, full forward. All these results are filmed with iphone. At worst if the dealer cannot replicate and dont want to do anything, i will send my video to Honda Canada with my complaint.


----------



## grabber

OF course, 
I did put 3 stick to mesure the speed. 1 at the start. the other one at 30ft, and the other one at 160ft.

I will put the video on youtube and post here... sorry for the video quality.... doing my best here.  



Stephen0523 said:


> Hey grabber, can you upload the videos here?


----------



## grabber

Sorry to tell you this but your specs are worse than mine... you definitely have something with your tranny. now way you should have differents results like the one you stated here.

Based on Honda shop manual :
Ground speed should be somewhere between :
2.6 - 3.3 ft per second, forward.

1.6 - 2.3 speed reverse.

Based on your first reading, you are doing 1.6 ft per second.


Your old HS828TAS is running fine.



jrom said:


> I did 4 separate time trials based on a 900' run, so after dividing my times, they come out (roughly) to these:
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 93sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 59sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 53sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 51sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 79sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 54sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 112sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 52sec
> 
> I did not do any reverse times.
> 
> My 828 was 25 years old at the time.
> 
> Machines were running at full speed forward, auger engaged, but not blowing any snow.
> 
> I supplied these stats to Honda on the phone and to my dealer on paper.


----------



## grabber

Here is the link on Youtube... hope it will work.
You see 1 stick at start, one stick (wood stick ) at 30 ft, and the other one at 160ft. You can also mesure the time with the time on the video. I pass the first stick at 0.01 sec, and i cross the 30ft one at 0.21 sec, meaning 0.20 seconds for a length of 30ft. In Honda specs, it should be no more than 11.4 second for 30ft.


----------



## grabber

You should not accept anything higher than 57 second for 150ft lenght. Your blower is new... what will it be in 5 years from now ? You paid high buck to buy the cream of the crop, dont forget this... your blower has to work perfectly.



jrom said:


> I did 4 separate time trials based on a 900' run, so after dividing my times, they come out (roughly) to these:
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 93sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 59sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 53sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 51sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 79sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 54sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 112sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 52sec
> 
> I did not do any reverse times.
> 
> My 828 was 25 years old at the time.
> 
> Machines were running at full speed forward, auger engaged, but not blowing any snow.
> 
> I supplied these stats to Honda on the phone and to my dealer on paper.


----------



## grabber

Hi Jrom,
the results you have here, were this the results you had prior your transmission replacement ? Or are these mesurements the current ones with the new tranny ?

Looks like based on your specs, you are still building air into the system...

On mine, it seems like the more you use the steering wheel (left and right turn) the worse it gets.

If i use my blower in straight line... with almost no turns, the speed is good and consistent. the 160 feet is done in 60seconds. but if i start to play with the steering, stop, reverse, forward and play a little, the speed is simply ****** up. 

then, if i leave it forward, with the bucket down.. in a way to put some resistence... eventually the speed will come ok, after 2 or 3 driveway. So to me the transmission is building air in it.. and by running straight and the bucket down.. its bleed slowly.

THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE. Im at the point, with 6 inch of snow, i use my old 15years Motocraft from Canadian tire to do the job, since i dont have all day to blow my driveway.



jrom said:


> I did 4 separate time trials based on a 900' run, so after dividing my times, they come out (roughly) to these:
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 93sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 59sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 53sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 51sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 79sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 54sec
> 
> HSS1332ATD - 150ft = 112sec
> HS828TAS - 150ft = 52sec
> 
> I did not do any reverse times.
> 
> My 828 was 25 years old at the time.
> 
> Machines were running at full speed forward, auger engaged, but not blowing any snow.
> 
> I supplied these stats to Honda on the phone and to my dealer on paper.


----------



## jrom

Yes, those were before. It helped me to get a replacement. No problems now, about right at the speed of the 828. 

I was just trying to get you to document so Honda has something to work with other than us customers saying it's slower.

I just got done clearing the end of a 30" storm...We hit 10' for December. The 1332 is doing great.



grabber said:


> Hi Jrom,
> the results you have here, were this the results you had prior your transmission replacement ?


----------



## grabber

Thanks Jrom,

Do you think i should send an Email to Honda ? Or just contact my dealer ?
If i need to contact Honda, can you provide the Email address ?



jrom said:


> Yes, those were before. It helped me to get a replacement. No problems now, about right at the speed of the 828.
> 
> I was just trying to get you to document so Honda has something to work with other than us customers saying it's slower.
> 
> I just got done clearing the end of a 30" storm...We hit 10' for December. The 1332 is doing great.


----------



## jrom

I went through my dealer, then Honda contacted me by phone.

Good luck. I'm sure you'll get things worked out.



grabber said:


> Thanks Jrom,
> 
> Do you think i should send an Email to Honda ? Or just contact my dealer ?
> If i need to contact Honda, can you provide the Email address ?


----------



## Marlow

grabber said:


> Hi Jrom,
> THIS IS NOT ACCEPTABLE. .


Do not let your emotions get the best of you. Remember, these are newly re-designed machines. Problems unseen in typical R&D are bound to come up once new designs are mass released. Just be patient, present your proof and give them the opportunity to rectify it just as they have with others.

Even manufactures reputed in the absolute highest regards have will have issues, nothing/nobody is perfect. But, how well they treat you when you do have issues(within reason) is what truly separates the good from the bad. Be patient, if it needs fixing they'll fix it.


----------



## Stephen0523

Just letting everyone know the speed is still very good on my machine! Just pop some very wet heavy snow this evening and it went right through it no problem and no clogging!


----------

