# Hydrostatic Fluid Black and Crusty



## PMP (Jan 31, 2016)

Hello all

I almost hijacked Jmc's thread but figured it was probably not the way to start posting as a new member. 

On to my problem: I changed the oil in my Honda 928 TCD today on my 20 hr mark. While I was looking the the blower over I noticed my hydrostatic transmission fluid was black with junk in the bottom of the reservoir. I did a bunch of google searches and always landed on this site which is why I joined. In all the reading I did I came away with the fact that I should not tackle this problem. Taking the transmission apart is ahead my skills mechanically. 

This is a new blower purchased last year as mentioned it only has 20hrs on it so there is all kinds of warrantee left. 

My question is this: what do you think is going on with the thing? It seems to be running fine other then I did notice a bit of noise when shifting from forward to reverse and now the fluid colour. I'm definitely bringing it to my dealer for service but would appreciate any insight from the gurus of this site. 

Thank you.


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## JnC (Feb 21, 2014)

Welcome to SBF, PMP. 

In all my time on SBF I have never seen or heard anyone having issues with their HST. The fluid is recommended not to be changed as per honda its good for the life of the blower, but that doesnt sit well with owners like you and I as dirty fluid means time to change it. 

On honda H3013 lawn mower, which uses a bigger version of this HST, the fluid is recommended to be changed at 500 hours or every 5 years. The machine takes about 5 liters of HST fluid, I should know as I changed it on mine a few months ago. Non the less, Honda predicts that a lawn mower would see 100 hours worth of use a year on the other hand I am thinking that they anticipated the snowblowers to be used way less than that a year. 


Also, it doesnt help the fact that to change the fluid and bleed the transmission you have to pretty much take the whole blower apart to have the HST on the bench to do the procedure. 

What I'd recommend is to undo the bolt that holds the HST reservoir in its place, tilt it down and empty its content into a cup along with the fluid in the pipe making sure that you dont take anything out of the HST itself. Then bolt the tank back onto its place and filling it with fresh HST fluid. 

This may not be a complete fluid change but it would get rid of a good few ounces thats in the pipe and tank plus all the sediments that you see shown in the picture.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

:welcome: to the forum PMP


I don't know Honda hydro's but I have two used hydro lawn tractors. First thing I did with them was to change the fluid. On my Sears draining really isn't an option so I actually used a hand held vac pump to suck it out. The stuff in each was really nasty and likely due to the same "lifetime" recommendation.
I'd have to say that it can't be good for the trans once it starts looking like that and as cheap as fluid is compared to tearing a unit down and replacing the hydro I'm happy changing the fluid every two years on the Sears I use for lawn cutting and running around doing chores and the other when it starts to get dark.

The priming procedure for Honda sounds like a massive pain in the rear and being under warranty maybe just doing the partial change as outlined above might be the way to go.


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## jrom (Jan 10, 2014)

JnC said:


> ...What I'd recommend is to undo the bolt that holds the HST reservoir in its place, tilt it down and empty its content into a cup along with the fluid in the pipe making sure that you dont take anything out of the HST itself. Then bolt the tank back onto its place and filling it with fresh HST fluid.
> 
> This may not be a complete fluid change but it would get rid of a good few ounces thats in the pipe and tank plus all the sediments that you see shown in the picture.


I did something similar, only I used a turkey baster to get out as much dark fluid as I could. Repeated that twice for three times total. My fluid is now almost clear and I haven't had any problems. My 828 was hard to stay in neutral, or to find neutral. It's much better now. I bet some seals got compromised in my case.

I like this idea better than the baster idea and I'll probably do the JnC "Servicing the right and hydrostatic transmission " procedures this coming Summer.


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## jrom (Jan 10, 2014)

Kiss4aFrog said:


> The priming procedure for Honda sounds like a massive pain in the rear and being under warranty maybe just doing the partial change as outlined above might be the way to go.


Hear, hear.


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## JnC (Feb 21, 2014)

^^ The hardest part is removing the transmission and putting it back on and reassembling everything. The fluid change and bleeding the system takes about 10 minutes at most. 

I just did one a few days ago, may be next time I'll make a video showing the procedure as nothing beats a video .


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## PMP (Jan 31, 2016)

Thank you very much guys for the replies. Much appreciated. 

Update: I went to my local Honda dealer that was recently sold to a complete tool and it now shows throughout the dealership but, that's another topic on its own. I showed them the picture of the reservoir and they suggested I wipe the reservoir out with a rag and fill it back up to spec. I have a problem with that suggestion. It does not address what's going on. There's a reason why the fluid is like that. I at least know that much. I own three street bikes two quads and a side by side. And have had reservoir problems and there was always a reason. 

I'm lucky enough to have another Honda dealer about a half hour away and called them. They gave me the answers I was looking for. They want the machine to check what the sentiment is rubber or metal and said there is a problem and it must be addressed. 

20 hrs on a brand new machine suggests a problem when the fluid is that back and filled with sediment in my opinion. 

I'm bringing it in late this week because we are expecting a major storm up here tomorrow. I'll update as I go. 

Thanks


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## mikeinri (Mar 16, 2015)

:welcome:

I think you're doing everything right:

...Asking for advice here.

...Not touching it yourself while this new and under warranty.

...Staying away from the bad dealer, even if that means going out of your way for a better one.

Good luck, looking forward to your final resolution.

Mike


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## db9938 (Nov 17, 2013)

Good call, on the second call.


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## jrom (Jan 10, 2014)

- "I think you're doing everything right: ...Not touching it yourself while this new and under warranty."

- "Good call, on the second call."

For sure the best advice under warranty. There is so little good, verified information on DIY Honda Hydro drive fixes (Like JnCs) that some of us just want to jump in with a potential fix right away.


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## PMP (Jan 31, 2016)

Once again thank you for the replies. Much appreciated. 

As you may be able to tell I have been down the repair road before. I've done all wrong things in my past but learned from my mistakes. 

I agree that there is little information about the drives but the advice that is out is unanimous: don't touch it. 

The dealer called Honda about my problem and I'm kinda pissed about what they said. They seem to think that it was likely sabotage or I did something like pour something in the reservoir. When I heard that I was like ***!! I told the dealer to have that person call me and I would provide cctv footage of my property that included all entrances of my shop and inside the shop where the snowblower sits with their over priced $150 cover. I'm pissed. If they continue down this road I will put that thing in a trailer and bring it to that persons office and drive right to his desk and drop the key on his desk that mf. 

The dealer did ask what's with all the oil on it. I said I oil the **** out of it so it won't rust. He said I figured and went on to say it's obviously well taken care of. He has no idea the steps I do take with my toys. I'm very particular. Almost to a fault. The dealer is going to call honda again Monday morning and let me know if they will cover the drain and replacement of fluid. My opinion of that was it had to be done to find the problem. This does not happen without a reason. Period. And it's not Hondas irrational reason. 

I'll post Monday. And will provide the YouTube video link if the answer stays the same for the above scenario. 

I expected more out of honda. Maybe I chose the wrong brand???!!!


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