# New Toro 724 (1981) - service



## AnimalHungry

First post, so hi everyone! My newest member of the family is a Toro 724, model #38050, serial #1003765, which I think makes it born in 1981. I’m new to snowblowers but I’ve worked on a bunch of motorcycle and car engines so I feel pretty confident working on the snowblower once I get set in the right direction. 

It starts OK from cold and will run for a while and then cuts out, even when warm. Given that I don’t really know it’s history and it won’t run continuously, I wanted to give it a good service. I’ve found the technician’s manual on the forum which will help with a tear down and the carb manual, but any idea what I should be doing to it by way of a service? I was thinking that because it won’t run continuously it may be sucking air into the carb? Oh, I'm at 10,000ft in Colorado, butI bought it from a guy who lived at altitude as well, but in any event I'm thinking that once I service an adjust the fuel/air mixture it should be good. 

It has a Tecumseh H70 engine and I think a Tecumseh 631920 carb, but how do I find out what series # the carb is? The carb maintenance manual seems to speak in terms of series # rather than model #?

It has a small split in the seam of the plastic gas tank (see photo). Is there a reliable way of fixing the hole, or do I need to just buy a new gas tank?

You can see from the photos that there appears to be an oil leak at the base of the engine. I can’t see a gasket there by looking at the parts catalog. Any idea what the problem might be?

Finally, when it’s running it doesn’t throw snow very far at all. In fact, it just kinda dribbles snow out of the chute. Is there something I need to adjust or service in order to get it throwing properly?

All ideas greatly appreciated!

Cheers
Simon


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## HCBPH

*NTY blower*

First off: welcome to the forum. Second is congrats on the New-to-You blower. On your carb question, there should be 2 sets of numbers on the flywheel cover. First is size and model, and the other may be what you're looking for (don't have any Toro's so can't be sure on that).

I tried fixing a cracked tank a while back for a friend. I picked up something like a small soldering iron and some material similar to hotglue sticks. This was designed for fixing small tears in car bumper covers. I drained it, put some water in it so the repair spot was on top and melted some of the sticks into the crack. I haven't heard back on any problems with it so I'm guessing it's held. Big thing is to be careful around any fumes with anything hot.

Most all engines with a breather show a little oil film on the motor over time. if there's no puddles then it's likely not an issue but you could clean it off with some solvent and see if it comes back. 

Your dying issue might be something as simple as a plugged gas cap. If it happens again, loosen the cap and see if you can hear any suction of air and try restarting after a few moment. 

Hope that helps. Let us know how it turns out.


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## bwdbrn1

Hi AnimalHungry, welcome to SBF, glad you joined us, and thanks for your questions. Looks like you picked up a pretty darn nice Toro. 

Try the trick HCBPH suggested, or maybe try loosening the cap before you start it the next time and see if it still does it. Could be as simple as getting a new cap, or shooting some cleaner through the one you've got.


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## detdrbuzzard

hello animalhungry, welcome to SBF. the model and serial number dhould be on the cover or frame down near where the handlebars attach. has the fuel filter been changed? is the petcock fully open? jb weld should seal the tank. as for not blowing snow very well it could be the belts and it could be the amount of snow or lack of snow in the case of a two stage snowblower


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## Shryp

I would say it is probably "series 3". I think pretty much all snowblowers carbs are like that.

Have a look here. This guy has lots of Tecumseh and snowblower videos.
The Small Engine Doctor - YouTube

Call me crazy, but I would think if the tank is leaking you won't have an gas cap vacuum, but who knows. While on the subject, I am going to assume that since the tank leaks you aren't filling it very far. These old Tecumseh engines don't run very well when you have "just enough" gas in the tank. I think they need at least a 1/4 tank to be happy. You can try fixing it or just look for a used one on a broken engine. I bet any small engine repair shop will have a supply of old ones sitting out back.

The oil leak looks more like dirt and possibly some spillage from old oil changes. To me it doesn't look like a concern.

The poor performance could be related to a slipping belt as was stated. Also, snow blowers work best with more snow and not less snow. If you barely have any snow on the ground and are just trying to play with your new toy you will be disappointed by the performance. You could also try investigating the "impeller modification" that people do. A search on here, google or youtube will yield lots of hits. The type of snow matters too as slushy snow tends to not throw much.


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## AnimalHungry

HCBPH said:


> First off: welcome to the forum. Second is congrats on the New-to-You blower. On your carb question, there should be 2 sets of numbers on the flywheel cover. First is size and model, and the other may be what you're looking for (don't have any Toro's so can't be sure on that).
> 
> I tried fixing a cracked tank a while back for a friend. I picked up something like a small soldering iron and some material similar to hotglue sticks. This was designed for fixing small tears in car bumper covers. I drained it, put some water in it so the repair spot was on top and melted some of the sticks into the crack. I haven't heard back on any problems with it so I'm guessing it's held. Big thing is to be careful around any fumes with anything hot.
> 
> Most all engines with a breather show a little oil film on the motor over time. if there's no puddles then it's likely not an issue but you could clean it off with some solvent and see if it comes back.
> 
> Your dying issue might be something as simple as a plugged gas cap. If it happens again, loosen the cap and see if you can hear any suction of air and try restarting after a few moment.
> 
> Hope that helps. Let us know how it turns out.


Many thanks. I have a soldering iron so I'll have a crack at 'welding' the tank first. It's only a small crack. I'll look into the gas cap but like Shryp said, since I have a hole in the tank this may not be the issue. I'll test it and find out tho.


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## AnimalHungry

bwdbrn1 said:


> Hi AnimalHungry, welcome to SBF, glad you joined us, and thanks for your questions. Looks like you picked up a pretty darn nice Toro.
> 
> Try the trick HCBPH suggested, or maybe try loosening the cap before you start it the next time and see if it still does it. Could be as simple as getting a new cap, or shooting some cleaner through the one you've got.


Yeah I think it's a real nice one. The auger mech and housing barely has a spot of rust on it. When it runs it sounds smooth and throaty, like a 7hp motor should. There's some surface rust around the control panel, and I want to fix the ignition switch and connect an interlock level (currently missing), but other than that it's all good.


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## AnimalHungry

detdrbuzzard said:


> hello animalhungry, welcome to SBF. the model and serial number dhould be on the cover or frame down near where the handlebars attach. has the fuel filter been changed? is the petcock fully open? jb weld should seal the tank. as for not blowing snow very well it could be the belts and it could be the amount of snow or lack of snow in the case of a two stage snowblower


Thanks! The petcock fully opens but I'm gonna check the fuel filter. I also want to service the carb cos I'm pretty sure it's not as clean in there as it should be. I'll try and weld the tank and if that fails I'll try some JB Weld.

It's snowing right now and we have a winter advisory so we might see 6-18" which would be a great test for the blower. I didn't realise that 2 stage blowers struggle with less snow.


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> I would say it is probably "series 3". I think pretty much all snowblowers carbs are like that.
> 
> Have a look here. This guy has lots of Tecumseh and snowblower videos.
> The Small Engine Doctor - YouTube
> 
> Call me crazy, but I would think if the tank is leaking you won't have an gas cap vacuum, but who knows. While on the subject, I am going to assume that since the tank leaks you aren't filling it very far. These old Tecumseh engines don't run very well when you have "just enough" gas in the tank. I think they need at least a 1/4 tank to be happy. You can try fixing it or just look for a used one on a broken engine. I bet any small engine repair shop will have a supply of old ones sitting out back.
> 
> The oil leak looks more like dirt and possibly some spillage from old oil changes. To me it doesn't look like a concern.
> 
> The poor performance could be related to a slipping belt as was stated. Also, snow blowers work best with more snow and not less snow. If you barely have any snow on the ground and are just trying to play with your new toy you will be disappointed by the performance. You could also try investigating the "impeller modification" that people do. A search on here, google or youtube will yield lots of hits. The type of snow matters too as slushy snow tends to not throw much.


Thanks Shryp. I've found a carb identification guide so I'll go straight to the Series 3 first and see if it matches mine. 

The split in the tank is halfway down so I have about 1/4 tank of gas in it. I'll fix/replace the tank and then fill 'er up and see if that makes a difference. It doesn't like it when I rock it backwards when I turn it around, so I was thinking it could be junk in the carb swilling around or plain old lack of gas. I'll test it when I fix the tank. 

I'm gonna service it, so I'll check the belts for wear and adjustment so that might answer the blowing issue - or it could just be not enough snow for the stage 2 blower to munch through. 

I found the small engine doctor vids and I'll use them to help me service the carb. I plan on buying a carb service kit with the gaskets, needle and o-rings etc so that should put me on the right road. 

Thanks for the impeller mod tip. I'll check that out when I get him running good in standard trim. 

Cheers
Simon


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## Shryp

AnimalHungry said:


> It doesn't like it when I rock it backwards when I turn it around, so I was thinking it could be junk in the carb swilling around or plain old lack of gas. I'll test it when I fix the tank


Some of those tanks are installed with the fuel line connected to the front and some with the fuel line connected to the back. If the fuel outlet is at the front and you tip it back you will be sucking air through the fuel line. A short time shouldn't make a big issue though, since the carb bowl is what the engine runs on.

Also, most blower don't sit with the tank perfectly flat, so if the tank naturally leans away from the outlet you have a lot of gas in the tank, but not so much by the outlet.


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> Some of those tanks are installed with the fuel line connected to the front and some with the fuel line connected to the back. If the fuel outlet is at the front and you tip it back you will be sucking air through the fuel line. A short time shouldn't make a big issue though, since the carb bowl is what the engine runs on.
> 
> Also, most blower don't sit with the tank perfectly flat, so if the tank naturally leans away from the outlet you have a lot of gas in the tank, but not so much by the outlet.


I getcha, thanks. This one has the fuel line at the front of the gas tank which would starve the carb a bit when tipped back. I'm gonna fix the tank and fill 'er up then see if I still get the issue. 

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*Update*

So I pull the carb cover off and see that fuel has been escaping out the float bowl gasket, which won't help it run smooth LOL! I'll order a carb service kit today, strip it down and reassemble with new gaskets etc

I took a look at the belts and the auger belt was all rather flopsy with a couple cracks in it (surprise it threw any snow anywhere!), and the traction belt was tight but in a similar state, so I'll be replacing them both.

I flipped it upside down to inspect the friction disc/drive wheel assembly and tested the gap between the rubber drive wheel and the friction disc and the gap between the drive wheel and the front pulley (which looks like a small friction disc). It was much closer to the rear friction disc, so I adjusted it so it was in the middle (while in neutral) - see photo. The manual then says to put it in first gear and test the gaps again making sure there’s an equal gap either side of the rubber wheel – see second photo. Again, it needed a little tweak. What I don’t understand is how it can drive the wheel in first gear (or any gear) if the rubber wheel isn’t engaged with the rear friction disc? Also, I haven’t been able to test it because I have the gas tank off, but my concern is that the rubber wheel has worn which is why it was adjusted too close to the friction wheel. Does anyone know what the serviceable tolerances are for the rubber wheel i.e. how worn down can it be before it needs replacement?

I also noticed that only half of the friction disc is being used by the rubber wheel. I assume in third gear it should be all the way to the left on the bigger circumference part of the friction disc?

I managed to weld the plastic gas tank. I filled it with water and ******* pressure tested it (blew into it ha ha) and it’s been a few hours now filled with water and hasn’t leaked, which bodes well. 

I’m going to order the belts and carb service kit, but any idea where I can order them from online? I see a bunch of different parts sellers when I Google for them, but are any better than others?

Cheers
Simon


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## Shryp

Glad everything seems to be working well. I have no idea how that friction disc setup works as all the ones I have seen only have one metal disc. As long as there is still rubber on the wheel it should be fine. Generally center of the metal disc is neutral, one side is forward and the other is reverse. I would also think the fastest forward speed should be at the outer edge as that is how all of the ones I have seen worked. Again, not familiar with your specific one though.

As for parts sources:
If you want OEM parts I have ordered from here. Their shipping seems a bit slow, and if something is backorderd they will delay your whole order. I believe it is $9.99 flat rate for shipping.
Lawn Mower Parts

If you don't mind aftermarket parts and are looking to save a bit of money I have also ordered from here. They will ship the rest of your order if something is backordered so you don't have to wait for everything else. $6.99 flat rate shipping.
Snowmobile Parts, Go Kart Parts, Lawnmower Parts, ATV Parts, and more | MFG Supply

Also, ebay and amazon are good places to look as well. If you have a small engine ship nearby you can probably get most of your parts there. They might be slightly more expensive, but usually the shipping cost will even it out. I had a hardware store down the street before I moved that was real helpful and actually a lot cheaper than I was expecting.


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> Glad everything seems to be working well. I have no idea how that friction disc setup works as all the ones I have seen only have one metal disc. As long as there is still rubber on the wheel it should be fine. Generally center of the metal disc is neutral, one side is forward and the other is reverse. I would also think the fastest forward speed should be at the outer edge as that is how all of the ones I have seen worked. Again, not familiar with your specific one though.
> 
> As for parts sources:
> If you want OEM parts I have ordered from here. Their shipping seems a bit slow, and if something is backorderd they will delay your whole order. I believe it is $9.99 flat rate for shipping.
> Lawn Mower Parts
> 
> If you don't mind aftermarket parts and are looking to save a bit of money I have also ordered from here. They will ship the rest of your order if something is backordered so you don't have to wait for everything else. $6.99 flat rate shipping.
> Snowmobile Parts, Go Kart Parts, Lawnmower Parts, ATV Parts, and more | MFG Supply
> 
> Also, ebay and amazon are good places to look as well. If you have a small engine ship nearby you can probably get most of your parts there. They might be slightly more expensive, but usually the shipping cost will even it out. I had a hardware store down the street before I moved that was real helpful and actually a lot cheaper than I was expecting.



Thanks, that's great! Afraid I live in the mountains and don't have a small engine shop near me (that I know of), but I'm happy enough ordering stuff online. I'll check out those websites.

There's still plenty of rubber on the friction disc, so when I've installed the new belts and have tension on the whole assembly and can run the engine again I'll check out the friction disc adjustment. The gear shifter is very stiff left to right, so I think I'll strip down the mechanism and clean it up to try and get rid of that stiffness first.

Cheers
Simon


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## Rolf Zetterberg

Hi-first post here too!
What you have is a two disc drive system.The lower(in the picture) is for drive forward and the upper for reverse.Study the pictures and you'll soon understand how it works.Imagine that the rubber wheel is spinning and pushed down-then it drives the disc in a certain direction,but when it is pushed up it drives the smaller disc in the opposite direction-we've got reverse.
(the two discs are on the same drive shaft).
Now,being somewhat familiar with older Toro drive systems-I have a 826 from around 1978 myself-it usually works in forward by a spring forcing the rubber wheel towards the disc.That's what happens when you put the lever in forward.It's only this quite small force from the spring that's needed,actually.
In reverse the rubber wheel is pushed against the other disc by hand force only.No spring here.This is to ensure your safety.It is designed like this to stop the machine if your hand looses it's grip.
The rubber wheel should be adjusted to equal distances when in neutral-nothing else.
If the linkage doesn't create enough force to create friction towards any of the discs,check and lubricate all moving parts.There is probably something sticking.


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## AnimalHungry

Rolf Zetterberg said:


> Hi-first post here too!
> What you have is a two disc drive system.The lower(in the picture) is for drive forward and the upper for reverse.Study the pictures and you'll soon understand how it works.Imagine that the rubber wheel is spinning and pushed down-then it drives the disc in a certain direction,but when it is pushed up it drives the smaller disc in the opposite direction-we've got reverse.
> (the two discs are on the same drive shaft).
> Now,being somewhat familiar with older Toro drive systems-I have a 826 from around 1978 myself-it usually works in forward by a spring forcing the rubber wheel towards the disc.That's what happens when you put the lever in forward.It's only this quite small force from the spring that's needed,actually.
> In reverse the rubber wheel is pushed against the other disc by hand force only.No spring here.This is to ensure your safety.It is designed like this to stop the machine if your hand looses it's grip.
> The rubber wheel should be adjusted to equal distances when in neutral-nothing else.
> If the linkage doesn't create enough force to create friction towards any of the discs,check and lubricate all moving parts.There is probably something sticking.


Thanks Rolf. That's really helpful. The shifter is very stiff so I'm going to strip it all down, clean and grease it and see if that makes any difference. And what you say about centering the friction wheel between the reverse and forward discs ONLY when in neutral makes total sense to me. When in first gear, or any other gear, you need the friction wheel to be making good contact with one of the drive discs. I'll clean it all up and let you know how it goes. Thanks again!

Cheers
Simon


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## Simplicity Solid 22

Animal hungry....Make sure not to get any grease or lubricant on friction disc or Drive disc...Cover them with rags or something when greasing and lubricating anything near them. If you do pour a "little" gas(disclaimer:away from any ignition source of course and a cool engine) on a rag and wipe clean after wiping with clean rag first. Good Luck with the new TORO!!!!!!!!


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## AnimalHungry

Simplicity Solid 22 said:


> Animal hungry....Make sure not to get any grease or lubricant on friction disc or Drive disc...Cover them with rags or something when greasing and lubricating anything near them. If you do pour a "little" gas(disclaimer:away from any ignition source of course and a cool engine) on a rag and wipe clean after wiping with clean rag first. Good Luck with the new TORO!!!!!!!!


Thanks SS. I'm trying to be careful, but I was going to spray the friction plates up with contact cleaner when I'm done just to make sure there's no residual grease/WD-40 spray etc.


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## AnimalHungry

*Update #2*

So I started stripping the Toro down tonight and discovered a few things...

I removed the friction wheel and spindle, cleaned it up and put it back on. This was the cause of the very stiff shifter - it now slides easily between gears 1, 2, and 3.

The forward drive wheel wasn't aligned properly (see photo) which meant it was running at an angle, off center. So when I put it back together I finangled it a bit by levering it into center at the same time as tightening its bracket bolts and that seemed to straighten it up a bit, at least enough so I think it's serviceable.

That's the end of the good news lol. After cleaning and reassembling the friction wheel assembly even without the long gear selector connected (i.e. with the spring pulling the friction wheel as far as it can towards the forward drive disc) the friction wheel doesn't touch the forward drive disc. I think it must have been adjusted so that it would hit the forward, but not hit the reverse disc. So I’m thinking that the rubber on the friction wheel is too worn. Does anyone know the service tolerances for these friction wheels? Or could measure the rubber on one that’s working? 

I pulled the head off the engine to see if the valves looked like they were seating well. They look OK (I don't have a pressure tester) and are adjusted to the correct tolerances - 0.008" for intake and 0.012" for exhaust at TDC (assuming exhaust on the left as you look straight at the valves because the muffler is connected to the left side?). However, I had to tip the machine forward to work on the drive system and I noticed that some crankcase oil had seeped past the piston when it was upside down. Is this normal? Or should I be looking to change the piston ring?

I really struggled to get the drive belt off because it has to squeeze past the auger drive control shaft. Is it supposed to be difficult? I think when I get the new drive belt I’ll install it when the friction disc assembly it loose to give it more room and less risk of damaging the new belt.

Finally, the carb doesn’t have an air filter (see photo). And I can’t see one on the parts list. Is that correct?

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

So I've found a photo of a new friction wheel and it doesn't look like it has much more rubber on it than mine: Toro Drive Disc No. 40-8170 | Toro Drive Parts | Snowblower Parts | Discount Online Parts

Very odd. If that's the case then something must be out of whack because without the long shifter rod connected I'd have thought that the tension on the spring should pull the friction wheel down so it connects with the forward drive wheel. But on mine there's a gap. Will need to have another look at it all tomorrow.

Cheers
Simon


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## Shryp

Snowblowers don't have air filters so no worries there.

Any chance one or both of the drive discs is adjustable and can slide bad and forth on the shaft to take up the space the rubber seems to be missing?


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## Rolf Zetterberg

I used a different method when replacing belts a few years ago.First I removed the chute rod front end,then I removed almost all bolts as if I were to separate the machine from the auger housing,but by NOT removing the two lower bolts, just loosening them,I was able to sort of lift and open the two halves into a narrow "V" and that gives you ample space to replace the belts.Quite simple actually.
I also would like to applaud Toro for a very durable machine.I bought it when it was around 4-5 years old(his wife didn't like it...) and have only replaced the belts.Nothing else.That's all for 30 years!Oh yeah,a small weld on one of the shoes.But I'm still impressed.
On the other hand I have recently looked at the new Toros.Too much plastic...


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## Simplicity Solid 22

I just got a brand new Stens 240-394(fits many models) and it has about .5mm of rubber or maybe 3/8 of an inch of rubber which includes the thin raised ridge of rubber in the middle. The rubber looks convex and does not have the flattened look of my current one or shoud I say Flat top/Plateau look of my current one. 
Which makes me wonder if that is why My first gear is so weak as compared to every other gear.


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## AnimalHungry

Simplicity Solid 22 said:


> I just got a brand new Stens 240-394(fits many models) and it has about .5mm of rubber or maybe 3/8 of an inch of rubber which includes the thin raised ridge of rubber in the middle. The rubber looks convex and does not have the flattened look of my current one or shoud I say Flat top/Plateau look of my current one.
> Which makes me wonder if that is why My first gear is so weak as compared to every other gear.


Thanks SS. That's helpful. I think I've discovered the problem with my drive system...

The forward drive disc is warped a little. I took it off an beat it but there's still a wobble in it. I also measured the friction disc, which I think is supposed to be 6" in diameter, and mine is a shade off 6" but still very serviceable. The other thing I noticed is a problem with the sideways tracking arm (the arm that makes it change gear) - if you tighten it up all the way because of the angle of the tracking arm it lifts the friction wheel ever so slightly. So, when you combine this little lift with the little warp in the forward drive disc you get partial contact between the friction wheel and the forward drive disc at the low point of the drive disc rotation. 

Solution: my fix is to leave the tracking arm nut loose - I'll loctite it or get a nyloc nut - so the tracking arm can move around and doesn't pull the friction wheel up. Rather than buy a new forward drive wheel and shaft (muchos dinero!) I'll grind a bit off the spacers that set the position of the shaft, thereby lifting it a quarter inch or so. This should be just enough to enable continual contact between the friction disc and the forward drive disc. 

Picture explains it all.

I may lose some reverse drive, but that's fine as long as it goes forward properly in all 3 gears. If I find a cheap forward drive disc/shaft down the line then I can always swap it out and shim the ground down spacers 

Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*Update: tires*

Just noticed that the tires don't hold pressure, so I'm going to install inner tubes. I posted in the main problems forum about the size inner tubes I need (13-4-6 tires). Have also ordered a gasket set so everything's nice and airtight when I put the carb and engine back together.


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> Snowblowers don't have air filters so no worries there.
> 
> Any chance one or both of the drive discs is adjustable and can slide bad and forth on the shaft to take up the space the rubber seems to be missing?


Good news on the lack of air filter then! 

Afraid there's no adjustment to be had except for grinding the spacers down as I described above. It's a shame because being able to adjust the distance between the forward and reverse plates would have made for a nice feature.


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## AnimalHungry

Rolf Zetterberg said:


> I used a different method when replacing belts a few years ago.First I removed the chute rod front end,then I removed almost all bolts as if I were to separate the machine from the auger housing,but by NOT removing the two lower bolts, just loosening them,I was able to sort of lift and open the two halves into a narrow "V" and that gives you ample space to replace the belts.Quite simple actually.
> I also would like to applaud Toro for a very durable machine.I bought it when it was around 4-5 years old(his wife didn't like it...) and have only replaced the belts.Nothing else.That's all for 30 years!Oh yeah,a small weld on one of the shoes.But I'm still impressed.
> On the other hand I have recently looked at the new Toros.Too much plastic...


Thanks Rolf, nice workaround. Glad your Toro's still going strong. I think I'll install the belts when I have the drive mech apart so as to make it easy on myself.

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*Update: drive system*

So I ground off the two spacers where the drive shaft meets the casing, left the sideways tracking arm loose with the nut covered in blue loctite and now it all seems to line up (see photo). It changes gear smoothly and hits all the gears while maintaining a good connection between the friction wheel and the drive wheels despite the warp in the forward drive disc. Will be interesting to see how it holds up under load.

Waiting for the carb service kit, gasket kit, drive belts and new inner tubes to arrive now then I'll really be in business. Hope it all gets here before Friday or it looks like I'll be shoveling again 

Cheers
Simon


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## Simplicity Solid 22

Animal hungry......Ohhhh ho ho....Give these a look...good price too...I have searched and have found these two to be best priced..

Carlisle Snow Hog Tires 5170061 - SummitRacing.com


Carlisle Snow Hog 13x5.00-6 A/2PR - tires-easy.com


ohhhh ho ho more power!!!! Snow wolfs are cool but $$$


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## Simplicity Solid 22

Simon AKA AH,

Do those augers have shear pin/bolts through the holes on the edge of the augers??

Man now that is an auger....

SS22


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## Simplicity Solid 22

Found some xtracs at a great price and a size match not as wide although you could run 13x5x6's easy...

Outdoor Distributors - Lawn Mower Parts


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## AnimalHungry

Simplicity Solid 22 said:


> Animal hungry......Ohhhh ho ho....Give these a look...good price too...I have searched and have found these two to be best priced..
> 
> Carlisle Snow Hog Tires 5170061 - SummitRacing.com
> 
> 
> Carlisle Snow Hog 13x5.00-6 A/2PR - tires-easy.com
> 
> 
> ohhhh ho ho more power!!!! Snow wolfs are cool but $$$


Thanks for the links. I stumbled across Summit Racing when I was searching for inner tubes. My tires still have plenty of tread left on them so I'm gonna start out inserting tubes in them and take it from there. I like the look of those Snow Hogs if I have to replace the tires.

I think my Toro has 2 shear pins on the main auger drive shaft from the engine (see #5 and #14 on the attached). I can't see any shear pins on the ends of the other auger shaft though. What were u thinking? Should I be servicing the shear pins somehow?

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

Simplicity Solid 22 said:


> Found some xtracs at a great price and a size match not as wide although you could run 13x5x6's easy...
> 
> Outdoor Distributors - Lawn Mower Parts


Those Xtracs look nice. Great price too. Will bear them in mind if I need tires.

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*Update: almost there*

So the parts came and I've replaced the auger and drive belts, serviced the carb, replaced the relevant gaskets, installed inner tubes, cleaned and lubed the drive train and the chute mechanism, as well as having welded the hole in the gas tank, fixed the warped drive disc issue and generally given the beast a hard looking at.

So I get to the end of the job and I'm looking for the 2 bolts that hold the flywheel/starter pull cord assembly to the engine (see photos showing the threaded holes) and all I find are two seemingly bigger bolts with shoulders on them (see photo). I tried to screw them in by hand but the threads feel different (didn’t wanna force them). Presumably I’ve used the 2 bolts I’m looking for somewhere else so I’m left with these two. I’ve looked thru the parts catalogue but can’t find any bolts that look like the two I’m left with. Does anyone know where they might go?

I’ve also managed to crack the clevis at the end of the auger clutch rod. I tried to fix it but it’s just crappy plastic and won’t hold the rod in place, so I’m gonna have to buy a replacement. I look up the part number and it’s about $25!!! Can’t believe it. Anyhow, I’ll get it and get this beast back on the road/driveway.

Cheers
Simon


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## Shryp

The 2 bolts on the bottom of the recoil had the philips heads in them. See the pictures in your first post. 

As for the shoulder bolts, no idea. They look like they are for something that is suppose to be adjustable. Maybe for the idler pulleys? Though they do look like self tappers. Did you take more pictures that could clue you in?


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> The 2 bolts on the bottom of the recoil had the philips heads in them. See the pictures in your first post.
> 
> As for the shoulder bolts, no idea. They look like they are for something that is suppose to be adjustable. Maybe for the idler pulleys? Though they do look like self tappers. Did you take more pictures that could clue you in?


Ah yes, thanks for pointing that out - hadn't looked thru my old posts. Will try and find these two phillips head bolts. Looking at the two larger bolts I have left over, I'm thinking they may not be for the blower at all. Will keep hunting.

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*He's alive!*

I couldn't find the missing bolts, so I bought new ones 5/8"-24. I'm still waiting for the auger rod clevis to arrive, but I wanted to get it running. Filled it with gas and fired it right up. Warmed it up then adjusted the carb to get it running nicely at full throttle and then idle. The two reverse gears and the first two forward gears are great, but third gear slips. It's because the warp on the forward drive disc must be too much for even my tightened friction disc assembly to make contact with properly. I'll just look out on eBay for a secondhand one and use it in the first 2 gears for now. Great to have it running though, and no smoke at all from the exhaust after I adjusted the carb 

Simon


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## Shryp

That does look like the bolt has some Toro paint flakes in the threads though. You could always sell it and get yourself an Ariens.


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## AnimalHungry

Shryp said:


> That does look like the bolt has some Toro paint flakes in the threads though. You could always sell it and get yourself an Ariens.


Ha ha! Once I'm done fixing up this Toro it'll be bulletproof so I'll be keeping it for life. I'm still waiting for the auger clevis to arrive, but in the meantime I found a straight replacement driveshaft/drive disc assembly on eBay for a decent price so when that's here the Toro will be rocking!


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## AnimalHungry

*'ave it!!!*

So the broken auger clevis came and I bolted it back together, wheeled her out into the driveway and powered her up. Started second pull, waited for warm-up then started chomping through the snow. I'd left about 8" on part of the driveway to test the Toro and it pounded through it throwing it in a giant arc over my snowbank- it definitely loves deep snow more than the 1-2".

I have a replacement driveshaft/disc assembly on the way so when I change that out I'll have all three forward gears (right now only have 1, 2 and the 2 reverse gears because of the warp in the forward drive disc).

I just wanted to say a huuuuuuge thanks to Shryp, SS22 and all those who contributed this thread and helped me get my 32 year old Toro fully serviced and back up and running. I bought it for $160 and spend about $100 on parts and now I have a blower that will last me a lifetime if I look after it. Thanks guys!

Cheers
Simon


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## AnimalHungry

*Update*

So I had it running for a couple weeks then decided to do the impeller mod and also noticed that it wouldn't start from hot and was running a bit lumpy. So I changed the points and condenser then stripped the engine down to check out the piston, bore and valves. 

The bore didn't look worn and doesn't have a ridge at the top where the piston runs, so I just removed the carbon deposits from the head and valves and then lapped the valves in. I replaced the gaskets and used some gasket seal compound on them and put it all back together. 

I also did the impeller mod using the side wall of an old tire cut into impeller blade-sized strips and bolted them to the impeller blades to remove the clearance between the blades and housing.

It fired up first pull from cold, I warmed it up then setup the carb. It runs much more smoothly now, but it still really doesn't like to start from hot. It's like it has to cool down for a couple minutes before it will start again. I was thinking that maybe the valves/seats are shot and when it heats up there isn't enough valve clearance, so it loses compression as the valves don't close properly on the compression stroke? Just an idea. 

Any other ideas greatly appreciated!

BTW, it now throws snow 20-30 feet with the impeller mod!! 

Cheers
Simon


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## rapscallion

I







realize this is an old thread, however I have the same model. My 2 reverse gears work fine, however no traction/wheel movement in any of the 3 forward gears.

I've adjusted the rod so that there is equal distance between the 2 discs with same results.

Additionally, I have no tension in the gear handle. It just kind of flops around. I notice there is a coiled spring beneath the gear plate but suspect it might be the tension spring, #11 in the diagram ?:


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

Prob right on with the spring if you have no tension at the handle, but check the friction disk as well. Mine (1979) is pretty worn down and my reverse gears are fine too, but in fwd I have no 3 gear and 1 and 2 can be touchy. New disk is due in this week....Can let you know if that fixed it.


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## rapscallion

Thanks for the response Ray. I did notice, when I did the equal space adjustment that when I put the gear in to any of the forward gears that there was no contact. But, of course, if the spring is broken, or somehow popped off, there would be no tension against the disc. (I wasn't looking for the spring at that point)

P.S....BTW, sick of this winter and more snow tomorrow ?? Exit 50 of the L.I.E.


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## rapscallion

Sure enough, spring is broken. In fact it's broken on the unattached end in the above diagram. It attaches to one of two holes in the frame below it, but I can't tell which.?? Gotta check the service manual.


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

Not sure if this will help...there is a hole with a little indent next to it in the housing that one end if the spring hooks onto. The indent is for the spring loop to sit in so it rests flat, with the end going through the hole obviously. (I can put up a pix if you need) The other end goes in the hole in the disk carrier assy as in the diagram. I had to flip the machine up on end and take the belly pan off to get the carrier side of the spring on, then bring it back down to get the other side on, it's a pain. That alone may solve you problem. My new disk just arrived today so hopefully will get my 3rd gear back by the weekend. And yes! I am tired of the $&@" snow. Never though I would say that but it's been non stop this year. I'm a exit 68 LIE, wading river. Let me know if the spring fixes you issues...


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## AnimalHungry

Glad you found out what's wrong with yours. FWIW, I've noticed that the tolerances on mine are not exactly factory tight, if ya know what I mean. The result is that my discs have a slight wobble in them, so if any moisture sneaks in there even the slightest resistance from the wheel will prevent it moving forward. It seems to burn off pretty fast though and usually isn't an issue. If you can upgrade the spring somehow then I would do it. Your friction disc will wear slightly faster, but it'll make for a better contact between the friction disc and the steel disc for forward motion.

My engine finally gave up and I installed a Harbor Freight $120 special and the thing rips now. I modded the impeller with car tire sidewall and the thing now throws snow 30 plus feet. I have tree trunks covered in snow 20 ft up 

Cheers
Simon


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## rapscallion

@Ray, I think I know the hole you're talking about. It has a U shaped cutout in the frame, right ahead of it. My disc looks like it has a lot of rubber on it and I'll post a pic shortly for comparison to yours.

_Edit _:Ok, pic of rubber wheel attached.

_Edit 2:_ Is this the right hole for the spring, circled?

@Simon, wow that blower has been some project for you. More power is always better as Tim the Toolman Taylor used to say. "*uh ah* ah *ah* ou"


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

Yes, that's the right hole. The "loop" rests in the cutout. And your disk look a lot better than mine! Mine is bald in comparison, very thin amount of rubber left.


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## rapscallion

Ray, you beat me to it. I posted another pic, above, with the hole circled.
That spring looks like a tough install, as it was a pain to get off. And, that was only one end without any tension on it. Thankfully it's still available.

BTW, the service manual was a little vague on reattaching it, not specifying the location. I guess they assume if you took it off, you know where it goes


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## Grunt

It sure looks like a lot of metal filings on the chain and sprocket? I would clean and lube both before more wear occurs.


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

rapscallion said:


> Ray, you beat me to it. I posted another pic, above, with the hole circled.
> That spring looks like a tough install, as it was a pain to get off. And, that was only one end without any tension on it. Thankfully it's still available.
> 
> BTW, the service manual was a little vague on reattaching it, not specifying the location. I guess they assume if you took it off, you know where it goes


It is definitely a little tough. You almost have to bend the long end that goes in the disk carrier part to get it in there. Do that side first. A pair of bent nose needlenose pliers is a must. I'm sure that spring is put on the disk carrier assy with it out of the housing at the factory. May be easier to pull the couple of bolts and pull the carrier to put it on. I don't have that lower hole that your has under the cutout, only one on the side of it, but I think either one will work fine to hook into. Looks like you have the belt cover on still? Pull that off, definitely helps.


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## 43128

i have an 824, basically the same machine with a bigger engine, what grease do i use in the auger gearbox?


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## rapscallion

@Grunt, it does need a lot of cleaning (which I'll do + lube) however what you see is not metal filings, but auger belt wear residue.

@Ray, thanks, that hole I circled is definitely further away from the cutout than the other one. Yes, cover is still on. I'll definitely pull it. Good week to work on it with the milder temps the next few days.

@43128. According to the manual, gearbox oil is 3 oz (or fill to the point of overflow) SAE 90 EP transmission oil.


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## rapscallion

@Ray, I just noticed that I have "play" in the pulley shaft that may be the cause of my no traction in forward gears. I just don't know if this play is normal. (machine is in the raised position so the top would be the rear)

Photo #1 is with the shaft at rest. Notice the shiny gap at the bottom of the clamp. 

Photo #2 is with the shaft raised and the shiny gap is now above the clamp. That wear caused by the movement of the shaft.

Photo #3 is the top of the drive shaft. The bearing (broken piece off) is the same one as used by the wheels, and a spacer (now discontinued). The retaining pin in the shaft appears to have worn down the spacer causing the "play". In any event, I'm going to add washers to take up the slack.

Do you have this on your machine? Btw, have you installed the drive wheel yet?


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## Ray 1962 10ML60

Hey Frank, the disk did not immediately fix the issue with no third gear (I think...). Prior to changing he disk I tried to adjust the shift rods to get third gear back to no avail. After I put the disk in I still had no third, but played with the shift rods again and now I have third. So I guess it's a combo of the disk and proper adjustment??
As for the play at the bearing, mine does not appear to have that issue, only slight frt to back movement on the shaft. I brought it over to my brother in laws to use for the rest of the winter, so I don't have it in front of me to take a look, but I did try to move the driveshaft back and forth when I was doing the disk and it had maybe 1/8 inch of play frt to back. I will take another look at it in the next week or so when I go pick it up because I wanted to put new belts on it. Thanks, Ray.


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## rapscallion

Thanks Ray. I'm glad that the disc, and a few adjustments, solved your problem.


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## rapscallion

@AnimalHungry....hopefully you're still following this thread. If so, if you look at the third photo in my post #55 above, that "spacer" has one flat side and one side the edge concaves (ie inward curving).

Do you remember which side faces the bearig? On mine, the concave side faced the roll pin which seems a little strange to me. I bought the machine used 30 yrs ago and I can see by the 2 mounting bolts that it had been previously removed. Believe it or not I can't find a single picture of that spacer anywhere on the net, probably because it's discontinued.

Additionally, there is a little bit of play/wobble in the reverse disc. Is that normal?


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## UNDERTAKER

43128 said:


> i have an 824, basically the same machine with a bigger engine, what grease do i use in the auger gearbox?


 use 80-90 weight non synthetic gear oil. the seals will not hold the syn stuff..


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## Indi-Pred

On those two screws with the shoulder on them, they go on the end of the pivot shaft where the Friction wheel goes on. The bolts goes on the outside of the frame on each side. On my diagram its bolt number 41 that goes on part number 13 pivot shaft.


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