# storm2410 engine swap



## storm2410

I have a Storm2410 snowblower with a 179cc powermore engine. I'm looking to put on either the Predator 212cc or the LCT Stormforce 208cc. Has anyone mounted either of these engines to their machine?


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## Shryp

Many of us have put Predator engines on our blowers. Worst thing you will run into is having to enlarge the main jet in the carb to allow a little more gas in.

I don't remember hearing of anyone mounting an LCT, but Ariens has been using LCT engines and I don't recall any issues on those.


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## Motor City

I just picked up a older, but similar model, but with a blown Tecumseh. I think I'm going to reto-fit a Predator on it. From what I can figure out so far it doesn't look very hard to do.


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## GustoGuy

Motor City said:


> I just picked up a older, but similar model, but with a blown Tecumseh. I think I'm going to reto-fit a Predator on it. From what I can figure out so far it doesn't look very hard to do.


The 212cc will have more torque than the 179cc engine. There is no replacement for more displacement. My old MTD with the Predator 212cc throws snow farther and higher than my neighbors much newer 8 hp machine


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## Motor City

GustoGuy,

Did yo have to use a different length belt when you did you conversion. And if so how did you figure out the right size? I am going to try and buy pulleys that are the same diameter as what was on my machine. But I anticipate that I will have to get different belt lengths.


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## GustoGuy

Motor City said:


> GustoGuy,
> 
> Did yo have to use a different length belt when you did you conversion. And if so how did you figure out the right size? I am going to try and buy pulleys that are the same diameter as what was on my machine. But I anticipate that I will have to get different belt lengths.


 You can use the rope trick to estimate which size belt you will need. If the pto shaft of the new engine is the same as the old engine you can often use the stock belt.


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## Grunt

Motor City said:


> GustoGuy,
> 
> Did yo have to use a different length belt when you did you conversion. And if so how did you figure out the right size? I am going to try and buy pulleys that are the same diameter as what was on my machine. But I anticipate that I will have to get different belt lengths.


 This may help to get the correct size belt. Just enter the measurement to the center of each shaft and pulley sizes. I'm not sure if using a 3/8" or 1/2" wide belt makes a difference.


V-Belt Length Calculator


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## Motor City

Unfortunately, the Troy Bilt I have uses a wimpy 1/4 in belt for the drive. I think I can fit a 3/8 belt on the lower pulley. So I will be starting from scratch on mine. I may get away with the original auger belt, but I'll have to see.


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## Motor City

Ordered my Pulley, tonight. I did some research and if the friction disc on my machine won't accommodate the 3/8 belt, I think i found another MTD part, friction disc that is for a 3/8 belt. Its a 1/4 wider in diameter. But I think that shouldn't matter much with a more powerful motor. The dis is only $34, with free shipping. So it's not a big expense. I am just going to wait until next weekend to see if Harbor Freight has a labor day special on the Predator's.


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## Shryp

I don't think it is really necessary to go up in size on the drive pulley. With the reduction going through the drive system there isn't a lot of torque on it. Plus the machine is a blower and not a plow so all you should be moving with it is the weight of the machine.


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## Motor City

My concern is that this machine had a 1/4in belt originally And I need to go to a 3/8in belt. And a 3/8 belt might not fit on the reduction pulley. SO I may have to swap it out to a pulley that accepts the 3/8 belt. No wonder the Troy Bilt have the reputation they have. I don't know what they where thinking, using this 1/4in belt. I could probably break it with my hands.


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## Motor City

So my last pulley showed up today. So I mocked up the Predator on the chassis. And measure for the drive belts. Both ended up being 31.5 inches long. I was looking online for belts, and it seems that half inch increment belts are not to common. Should I just round up to 32 inches, and the idler pulleys should take up the slack?


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## storm2410

Motor City

Did the engine just mount in the original bolt holes or did you have to drill new ones? I'm going to be doing this same swap soon. But going to use the stock pulleys from my current engine.


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## Motor City

I mounted to the existing holes. Though I drilled out the 2 front holes on the engine block to 3/8. The could be tapped to a 10mm bolt, but I just drilled them. Unless you original motor used a 3/4 dia. shaft, you won't be able to use the original pulleys, from the motor. Plus, if you machine use the 1/4 in belt for the drive, this is an opportunity to upgrade. A 1/4in belt is a joke. The pulleys ran me around $20, total.


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## storm2410

I'd go with the stock belts. I've had the original belts on it for 6 years and never had any trouble with them. Also just put on a set of new belts. When you get your belts on let me know what length you used to make it work.


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## storm2410

Also what size pulleys did you use? I'm going to get new pulleys but I want the exact same size as what's on the current engine. I don't need larger. I'm also going to use the screw in the front to help hold on the auger pulley


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Also what size pulleys did you use? I'm going to get new pulleys but I want the exact same size as what's on the current engine. I don't need larger. I'm also going to use the screw in the front to help hold on the auger pulley


I used a 2 3/4x 3/4 for the front and the rear. I used a 2.10x3/4, 1/3/4 wasn't easy to find in stock. I am going to use just the set screws on the pulleys. You would have to have custom spacers made, to use the bolt, like the originals.


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## storm2410

where did you order your pulleys from? Also are those steel pulleys? Also what size belts do I need to get to set everything up working? I think you could try the original 31" belts from the machine. I don't have the engine and parts yet to test it out. Let me know what size belts you used to make it work


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Also what size pulleys did you use? I'm going to get new pulleys but I want the exact same size as what's on the current engine. I don't need larger. I'm also going to use the screw in the front to help hold on the auger pulley


I used a 2 3/4x 3/4 for the front and the rear. I used a 2.10x3/4, 1/3/4 wasn't easy to find in stock. I am going to use just the set screws on the pulleys. You would have to have custom spacers made, to use the bolt, like the originals.


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## storm2410

Gustoguy

Did you use the stock size belts or go up a size? I know the standard belt size is 31". Also what size pulleys did you use and where did you order them from?


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## GustoGuy

storm2410 said:


> Gustoguy
> 
> Did you use the stock size belts or go up a size? I know the standard belt size is 31". Also what size pulleys did you use and where did you order them from?


The belts on the MTD is standard size 1/4" wide belt. I noticed that I only get about a season out of the drive belt compared to the old engine when I could get many seasons out of it. The repowered Gilson made Montgomery ward has a much thicker drive belt and seems to be holding up much better than the MTD's drive belt. I believe that I needed to go with slightly longer belt once I repowered with the Predator engine I increased the the size of the lower drive plate to 8 1/2 inch diameter over the stock 6 inch diameter to slow down the machine.


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Gustoguy
> 
> Did you use the stock size belts or go up a size? I know the standard belt size is 31". Also what size pulleys did you use and where did you order them from?


Their on Ebay. I went to a 3/8 belt on the drive pulleys and stayed with the 1/2 on the auger pulleys. I didn't see any pulleys that would accept the 1/4 drive belt, for the 3/4 shaft on the predator. so you need a 1.75X3/4 pulley and a 2.75x3/4 pulley. I bought the 2.10x3/4 on ebay and the 2.75x3/4 ( Part # BK27-C ) on surpluscenter.com You can search on ebay or web for an AK17X3/4, for a exact size replacement pulley for the drive side.


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## Motor City

Found an issue today. You have to stick with the 1-3/4 pulley on the drive belt. I am have clearance issues with the 2.10 pulley and the tensioner. So I've ordered a 1-3/4 pulley to replace the over sized one.


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## storm2410

Motor City said:


> Found an issue today. You have to stick with the 1-3/4 pulley on the drive belt. I am have clearance issues with the 2.10 pulley and the tensioner. So I've ordered a 1-3/4 pulley to replace the over sized one.



Did you have to change the auger and drive pulleys also or are they the stock parts from the machine? I only ask because if they were changed I'd like to know what I need to order in order to complete the project. Also is this the pulley you used for the drive control AK17X3/4? What size pulley do I need for the for the auger control belt?


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## storm2410

Motor City said:


> So my last pulley showed up today. So I mocked up the Predator on the chassis. And measure for the drive belts. Both ended up being 31.5 inches long. I was looking online for belts, and it seems that half inch increment belts are not to common. Should I just round up to 32 inches, and the idler pulleys should take up the slack?


I found 3/8 x 31.5" v-belt for the auger online. 3V315 V-Belts 3V Wedge Drive Belt V Belt Supply = $2.74

Now I'm looking for the 31.5" belt for the drive system. If I find it I'll post a link for it


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> I found 3/8 x 31.5" v-belt for the auger online. 3V315 V-Belts 3V Wedge Drive Belt V Belt Supply = $2.74
> 
> Now I'm looking for the 31.5" belt for the drive system. If I find it I'll post a link for it


 I'm finding that 34in belts are fitting my application.


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## storm2410

Motor City said:


> I'm finding that 34in belts are fitting my application.


Is there alot of excess slack in the belts? Also did you reuse the idler tensioner for the drive system? I've seen alot of guys do this and just use the drive tensioner as an idler pulley.


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## dbert

You can plug in some length and width numbers and get some belt part numbers from this page.
http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...forum/21073-v-belt-cross-reference-chart.html


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Is there alot of excess slack in the belts? Also did you reuse the idler tensioner for the drive system? I've seen alot of guys do this and just use the drive tensioner as an idler pulley.


I'm trying to use both idlers. Thats where I had the problem with the larger dia. pulley, for the drive belt. The idler bracket wouldn't clear the pulley. The auger belt set up is ok. And I found the 34in belt fit. The OEM belt had way too much slack, even with the tensioner.


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## storm2410

Did you use flat belts or v-belts on both pulleys? I know the stock belt for the auger is a v-belt. I just need to know what kinds of belts I need to order to complete my project. Also did you have to change the drive and auger pulleys to fit the new belts?


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Did you use flat belts or v-belts on both pulleys? I know the stock belt for the auger is a v-belt. I just need to know what kinds of belts I need to order to complete my project. Also did you have to change the drive and auger pulleys to fit the new belts?


I used V belts and I did change the Auger pulley as I said in previous posts. The shaft on the Predator is 3/4. and my Tecumseh had a 7/8 shaft, if I recall.


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## storm2410

Also if possible can you give me the part #s for the auger and drive pulleys you put on? I have the part #s for the engines pulleys. I just need the part #s for the auger and drive disc


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> Also if possible can you give me the part #s for the auger and drive pulleys you put on? I have the part #s for the engines pulleys. I just need the part #s for the auger and drive disc


I'm using the original pulleys that were on my machine.


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## storm2410

OK. I didn't think the original drive and auger pulleys could handle the 3/8" belts you are using. So those are the only parts that didn't get upgraded. I just need to get my engine, engine pulleys, and belts now to complete this project. I want to see your finished project when done.


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## storm2410

I'm also looking into using the original spring loaded tensioner mounting parts. From your pictures I see you didn't use the parts to engage the tensioner arm for the drive system. Why not


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## storm2410

picture of my original pulleys and belts. Hope to have the upgrades done soon. That's the powermore engine on my machine. I need to see what the shaft size is so I can see if the original pulleys would fit the predator engine. Belt upgrade would be worth it,but if I can use my original stock pulleys and belts then I might just do that


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## GustoGuy

storm2410 said:


> picture of my original pulleys and belts. Hope to have the upgrades done soon. That's the powermore engine on my machine. I need to see what the shaft size is so I can see if the original pulleys would fit the predator engine. Belt upgrade would be worth it,but if I can use my original stock pulleys and belts then I might just do that


Unless that powermore had a 3/4 inch shaft you won't be able too *plus they are really rusty anyway.* Just get a 3 inch steel pully for the auger and a 2 inch for the drive and you will be done. I did not use hardly anything from either of the old engines and both blowers work great. 

Here is the 2 inch I ordered
V-Groove Drivers : 6120034

and here is the 3 inch. It doesn't get any easier.
V-Groove Drivers : 130034


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## storm2410

gustoguy

what size belts did you have to get?


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## GustoGuy

1/4 inch slightly longer belts for the MTD and I used slightly shorter 3/8 the inch belts for the Montgomery Wards 8/26


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## storm2410

Should I try to find a spacer for the area between the pulleys or just straight mount them?


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## GustoGuy

Just crank down the set screw with the Allen wrench and that's it. No spacer needed at all


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## GustoGuy

Motor City said:


> Ordered my Pulley, tonight. I did some research and if the friction disc on my machine won't accommodate the 3/8 belt, I think i found another MTD part, friction disc that is for a 3/8 belt. Its a 1/4 wider in diameter. But I think that shouldn't matter much with a more powerful motor. The dis is only $34, with free shipping. So it's not a big expense. I am just going to wait until next weekend to see if Harbor Freight has a labor day special on the Predator's.


Do you have the part number for the friction disk for the 3/8th inch belt? I notice that my MTD with the Predator engine tends to wear out it's drive belt much more easily than the old engine did with the stock lower pully. A 3/8th inch stiffer belt could solve that.


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## Motor City

GustoGuy said:


> Do you have the part number for the friction disk for the 3/8th inch belt? I notice that my MTD with the Predator engine tends to wear out it's drive belt much more easily than the old engine did with the stock lower pully. A 3/8th inch stiffer belt could solve that.


The part number of the 3/8 friction disk is 656-04055, its a 1/4 larger in diameter. Theirs a guy on ebay that has them for $33.50, with free shipping.

Cub Cadet MTD Friction Wheel Disc 656 04055 Made in USA | eBay


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## Motor City

I finished my swap today. The only issue I had was that I drilled the jet to large, .034. So I had a Honda jet that I drilled out to .030. And the mis I had at high speed went away.


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## GustoGuy

Motor City said:


> The part number of the 3/8 friction disk is 656-04055, its a 1/4 larger in diameter. Theirs a guy on ebay that has them for $33.50, with free shipping.
> 
> Cub Cadet MTD Friction Wheel Disc 656 04055 Made in USA | eBay


That might work better than the one I am using now. What is the diameter across the plate in inches? My old one was only 5.5 inches and my new one is 8.5. what is this one and does it support the 3/8 inch belt?


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## storm2410

How about a video of this beast running? Its now making me want to get my beast done and running.


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## Motor City

GustoGuy said:


> That might work better than the one I am using now. What is the diameter across the plate in inches? My old one was only 5.5 inches and my new one is 8.5. what is this one and does it support the 3/8 inch belt?


I'ts 8 1/2 in in Diameter. The disc on my Troy Bilt is 8 1/4. The disc looks almost identical to mine, but utilizes the 3/8 belt. An yes its for a 3/8 belt. I check on the machine this part is used on and it uses a 3/8 drive belt, so I made sure it would be correct.


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## storm2410

gustoguy & motor city

did you guys have to change your auger pulley also or did you guys leave the stock pulley on?


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## Motor City

storm2410 said:


> gustoguy & motor city
> 
> did you guys have to change your auger pulley also or did you guys leave the stock pulley on?


 I only change the upper pulley on the engine and used the exsisting lower pulley.


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## GustoGuy

I only changed the drive pulleys first on the engine. Unfortunately the snowblower was too fast and all but very slowest selection were way too fast to blow the driveway with. I ended up replacing the small stock friction plate with a larger one and it slowed the machine down so I now have 2-3 useful speeds to blow my driveway with.


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## Motor City

Had to do some more tweaking with the pulleys. The auger belt was slapping around to much and wearing a grove in the belt cover. So I had to go up in the pulley size,, to take up some slack. I went up to a 3.15x3/4 pulley. I'm trying to stay with standard belt size, so its easy to get a replacement. The belt is going to need to stretch some, as the auger is spinning a little, without engaging the lever.


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## storm2410

Gustoguy and Motor City

What size belts did you guys end up using? I'm getting my engine and pulleys this weekend. Hope to have everything mounted next week.


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## GustoGuy

storm2410 said:


> Gustoguy
> 
> Can you give me the parts numbers for the belts you used? If not at least the sizes I need to order so I can get the machine running


I went to O'reily auto and bought my power rated belts. I measured how long a belt I needed by using a length of rope threaded through the pulleys and went about 1/2 inch longer


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## storm2410

was it two different length belts or were both the same length


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## Motor City

I used a Gates 3/8 X 34in belt for the drive, with a 2.75 Dia pulley. And I used a 1/2 x 34.5in belt for the auger, with a 3.10 dia pulley. I already sold my machine.I'm looking for another machine to do a conversion.


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## storm2410

I need to get belts for my engine swap. The lengths for the original belts are 35" for the auger and 34" for the drive. Anyone think these lenghts should be long enough? I'm going to order the 1/2" belts if these lengths work.


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