# Brand New Yard Machine idle issue



## greg4111

Bought a new 2018 Yard Machine model 31AH54TG500 28” 277cc Powermore engine snowblower. Put in new 91 octane gas with a mix of sea foam. It came with oil already mixed. Engine idles fine on full and half choke but when choke is off it is not a smooth idle. It runs semi rough without load. With load it runs fine on no choke but as soon as there is no load it goes back to the semi rough idle. Not sure what the issue can be? I’ve used it 3 times already. No problem starting it. Seems that it needs some fine tweaking to get the idle just right on full speed with no choke. 

Any suggestions?


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## nwcove

sounds like another case of " epa lean".


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## RedOctobyr

Welcome to the forum! 

What does this mean? "It came with oil already mixed." Oil already mixed with what? 

When you say idle, does the engine have an adjustable throttle, so you can speed it up and slow it down? Some snowblowers now run at a fixed RPM, without a throttle lever. 

Either way, it sounds like a carburetor issue, like running lean on the idle jet, when the throttle plate is mostly closed (running with no load, even at high speed). 

That seems weird for a brand-new machine, though. If it was older, I'd say you'd need to clean the carb, but that shouldn't be the case here. Did you just buy it recently? Or was it bought at the end of last season, and has sat with gas in the carb since then? That could make at least more sense for a dirty carb.


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## greg4111

Sorry oil was in the engine when I bought it. Bought on Dec 2nd 2018 from Lowe’s.. Oil was not mixed with anything.


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## greg4111

Yes engine has adjustable throttle.


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## 132619

not to knock your choice,but the problem starts with the word LOWES, unqualified people assemble the ope ,nothing is test run to catch any production line issues, before them being sold,

breaks down to your having to lug the machine to a mtd listed shop and have it set up properly, and to me that's a major shame for anyone to have to go threw, wish you lots of luck,


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## tdipaul

My old troy bilt Squall did the same thing

After living with it set at half choke for a while it came time to to do some experimenting

If you are handy, obtain a K&L Carb Jet Cleaning Tool and take out the pilot/idle jet and _*lightly*_ ream it out with the smallest serrated rod that will fit through the jet's orifice. 

Lightly meaning 2-4 passes and then reinstall and test. You want to feel the serrations grinding away at the inside of the jet. 

Doing this will open up the hole and allow more fuel in and, hopefully, stop the surging. 

It did the trick for the Squall. 

https://www.ebay.com/i/163443446835?chn=ps

.


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## JLawrence08648

tdipaul said:


> If you are handy, obtain a K&L Carb Jet Cleaning Tool and take out the pilot/idle jet and _*lightly*_ ream it out with the smallest serrated rod that will fit through the jet's orifice.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/i/163443446835?chn=ps
> .


For $10.59, same as a welding tip cleaner for $2 but has more wires.


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## greg4111

Not to mention that the bozos at Lowe’s assembled the chute incorrectly... the chute would not rotate left or right... they did not put the washer and locknut on the bottom side of the chute assembly to properly secure it... they put it above the assembly so the chute was not properly secured. I fixed that already. 

https://youtu.be/yUf35qBsp-U

Should I just follow the above video to clean the jets?


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## RedOctobyr

JLawrence08648 said:


> For $10.59, same as a welding tip cleaner for $2 but has more wires.


It sounded like you're saying the $10.59 cleaner has more wires, but I suspect I'm misinterpreting what you wrote. 

At any rate, as you said, here's a welder tip cleaner for $2, which will do much the same thing, but helps keep your investment even lower, if that's useful. 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/13-Welding-Tip-Cleaner-with-Stainless-Steel-Reamers-4-Welder-Soldering/311413289559?hash=item4881adb257:g:e~IAAOSwhCBbV8BK:rk:1f:0


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## jsup

Take it back, raise ****, and tell them you want the machine replaced. No reason you should have to work on a brand new machine. Lowes is pretty good about this stuff.


And yes, the assembly people in lowes aren't the sharpest knives in the drawer. I've seen a number of machines with Lowes stickers assembled incorrectly. They all must be trained by the same person.


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## RedOctobyr

Seems reasonable to me, like jsup said, you shouldn't need to be doing this to a brand-new machine. It's at least worth a call, if you'd rather not mess with it yourself.


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## greg4111

Makes sense. I will call them and see what they say. Will report back once I get an answer. Thanks for the assistance.


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## jsup

RedOctobyr said:


> Seems reasonable to me, like jsup said, you shouldn't need to be doing this to a brand-new machine. It's at least worth a call, if you'd rather not mess with it yourself.



For the record, this isn't a reflection on MTD, the manufacturer, I believe it's far more the fault of Lowes. Nothing was test run before leaving the store. They never went through the machine. When I got my machine, the dealer went through every little detail, whether I wanted to hear it or not.


He started it and let it warm up, tried every aspect of it. Lowes said "here's your machine, give me your money"... It's just what you get today, no expertise.


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## RedOctobyr

It starts, it runs. You could plausibly say that Lowes may have started it. But needing partial choke to smooth out a cold engine isn't unreasonable, so maybe they ignored the surging, if they only ran it briefly. 

Of course, if they're going to sell with a chute that won't actually turn, then clearly they weren't super-diligent about the assembly & inspection process. I can understand people that would rather buy a machine as it shipped from the factory, and do the final assembly themselves.


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## jsup

RedOctobyr said:


> It starts, it runs. You could plausibly say that Lowes may have started it. But needing partial choke to smooth out a cold engine isn't unreasonable, so maybe they ignored the surging, if they only ran it briefly.
> 
> Of course, if they're going to sell with a chute that won't actually turn, then clearly they weren't super-diligent about the assembly & inspection process. I can understand people that would rather buy a machine as it shipped from the factory, and do the final assembly themselves.



The more of this I do, the more I realize that there are people who own machines that are totally incapable to do any of the mechanical support required, never mind doing their own assembly. 



Totally foreign to me, but it's a reality.


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## greg4111

It’s a matter of principle... quality control to an extent has gone down the tube over the years... products are not made the same like they use to back in the day... the last thing I want to do is to haul the snowblower back to the store to get a replacement... and who knows if that one will work just fine. I’ve read enough articles and watched enough YouTube videos to potentially fix an idle problem but thats not the point... it’s a brand new product less than 30 days old sitting in my shed and it’s not working properly... as it is under manufacturers warranty you would think that the local MTD repair shop would send someone over to have a look at it... I would suspect that i would have to bring it to them. 

Dilemma.....


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## jsup

greg4111 said:


> It’s a matter of principle... quality control to an extent has gone down the tube over the years... products are not made the same like they use to back in the day... the last thing I want to do is to haul the snowblower back to the store to get a replacement... and who knows if that one will work just fine. I’ve read enough articles and watched enough YouTube videos to potentially fix an idle problem but thats not the point... it’s a brand new product less than 30 days old sitting in my shed and it’s not working properly... as it is under manufacturers warranty you would think that the local MTD repair shop would send someone over to have a look at it... I would suspect that i would have to bring it to them.
> 
> Dilemma.....



I have to be defensive of the "local MTD repair shop". These guys didn't sell you the machine, you are not their customer, they really owe you nothing. If you go to them for the repair, you're at the end of the list. All you represent is an expense to them. 



This is a good reason/example why buying from the local shop is important. Had you done that, I don't think you'd be having these problems, they would have taken care of it, or it wouldn't have happened at all. 



Same thing happens to people who buy on line.




There's a price, and a cost, to everything.


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## RedOctobyr

Sadly, I suspect you're right, on needing to bring it to them. One way to find out, of course. If you have a pickup, that sort of thing isn't necessarily a big deal. But if you have to rent a truck, etc, then clearly that's a much bigger hassle (and cost). 

There are different ways to handle the problem, you'll have to figure out what works best for you. You might be able to remove the idle jet and clean it (just to start easy), then open it up slightly. Or you could look up the cost of a replacement carb, if you wanted an approach that didn't require disassembling the carb and fiddling with it.


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## 132619

from what i understand from the local fire inspector. the local box stores can not store any machine with gasoline in it for fire prevention reasons . as to assembly i have yet to see a HD or lowes machine properly assembled, 

as to pick up and delivery, we get paid to pick up and return within 15 miles under warranty,


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## RedOctobyr

Can they have them stored outside with gas in them? Around here, you'll usually see mowers/blowers sitting outside the big box stores. I assume that they stay out overnight, though I don't actually know. 

Now that I think about it, though, our local hardware store seems to store them inside overnight, so presumably they aren't gassed-up. If they can't have *ever* had gas in them if they're going to be stored indoors, that would seem iffy. You've got a machine, ready to be sold, but you don't know yet if the engine actually runs. And gassing & starting it in front of the customer holding their credit card might result in an unpleasant surprise if there's a problem.


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## tdipaul

JLawrence08648 said:


> For $10.59, same as a welding tip cleaner for $2 but has more wires.


Please send me the link to a $2 welding tip cleaner JLawrence

.


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## cranman

Go to any welding supply store......they all carry torch tip cleaners....that is all I use...


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## RedOctobyr

RedOctobyr said:


> It sounded like you're saying the $10.59 cleaner has more wires, but I suspect I'm misinterpreting what you wrote.
> 
> At any rate, as you said, here's a welder tip cleaner for $2, which will do much the same thing, but helps keep your investment even lower, if that's useful.
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/13-Welding...h=item4881adb257:g:e~IAAOSwhCBbV8BK:rk:1:pf:0





tdipaul said:


> Please send me the link to a $2 welding tip cleaner JLawrence
> 
> .


Well, I don't know which he had found, but I posted a link to a $2 one.


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## tdipaul

Thanks, just bought 2 of them


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## WVguy

jsup said:


> The more of this I do, the more I realize that there are people who own machines that are totally incapable to do any of the mechanical support required, never mind doing their own assembly.


It's just what people learn to do with the talents they were born with. My wife's father was a great guy, steady as a rock, but if he couldn't fix something with a hammer or scotch tape, he had to call somebody. It was kinda weird though, I'd never met anyone like that.

At the other extreme I have a good friend who is a mechanical genius but has some "quirks" that make him hard to take for some people. Just different people have different talents/abilities.


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## greg4111

Does it hurt the engine at all having it run with half choke under load?


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## cranman

I don't think it would hurt to run the engine on partial choke as long as it was running smoothly...that's what I do with Predators if I didn't re jet them


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## tpenfield

I too bought a Troy-bilt (MTD) snow blower at Lowes about 5 years ago. It was assembled correctly . . . I felt like I had won the lottery that day :smile2: Maybe all the bozos had called in sick that day or something.


Anyway, the engine ran fine for the first season. Maybe once in a while it would do the 'hunting' thing, which I think you are describing. During the second season, it did the hunting thing a lot more. As mentioned, per the EPA, these engines are set on the hairy edge of lean with no ability to adjust. So, I just ran about 1/2 choke to get the engine to run well.


You could certainly run with a bit of choke, not a problem. Just make sure you are getting your full throttle.



As for the seafoam, keep in mind that it is not going to help the fuel or the normal operating performance of the engine. It is basically a solvent and some oil with a bit of IPA to keep everything in solution. See if the thing will run OK with regular gas. Use the seafoam or other fuel additives (actually I think fuel injector cleaner is better) during end of season layup or for the first tank of a new season. 



After 10 years or so, when the engine is getting full of carbon, then break out the seafoam and have at it.


When you bought the machine, did it have any evidence of gasoline in the tank. If so, then the gasoline could have been sitting in the carb for a while and gummed it up a bit, making it run lean. Use some fuel injector cleaner for a tank to see if that improves things.


You could go back to the store (Lowes), but I do not see how they could service or fix a machine.


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## RedOctobyr

Just make sure it isn't surging under a load. If it is, it's running too lean, which can be bad for the engine (makes it run too hot).


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## greg4111

No I do not believe the tank had gas in it prior to me picking it up. Here’s another question... I ran the machine for about 4 hours over the course of 3 days... one of the days we had 30cm of snow... and it drank all the gas out of the tank haha... is that a normal amount of time to refill? Just making sure it’s not using more gas because it’s running lean?


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## 132619

when i can't get AVGAS i keep motormedic lead substitute mixed in the can, sure helps make the machines run better and smoother.1 bottle is good for 20 gallons best price is on amazon by the case otherwise TSC has them single .


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## RedOctobyr

greg4111 said:


> No I do not believe the tank had gas in it prior to me picking it up. Here’s another question... I ran the machine for about 4 hours over the course of 3 days... one of the days we had 30cm of snow... and it drank all the gas out of the tank haha... is that a normal amount of time to refill? Just making sure it’s not using more gas because it’s running lean?


 That sounds like reasonable usage to me. It certainly doesn't sound like it's using too much gas, at least. 



Running lean will make it use less gas, if anything, rather than more. A lean condition is when there isn't enough fuel in the mix, vs the amount of air being drawn into the engine.


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## greg4111

Here’s a video of the machine https://youtu.be/9olvMnKxhvk


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