# Piston seized in block.??



## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Machine sat outside and has had water in it. What is best way to get it loose? I have loads of time to get it free. Just want to know the best method. It's an Italian made BCS tiller engine.
Thanks fellas!
This is something I have never had to deal with and all new to me.


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## Vermont007 (Mar 29, 2015)

Aluminum Block, hopefully without a Cast Iron Sleeve ?


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## nwcove (Mar 2, 2015)

I would remove the head and go with the tried and true 50/50 mix of acetone and atf.


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## Snowbelt_subie (Dec 20, 2016)

ive heard people taking the spark plug out and using different things and letting them sit. 

diesel fuel and mystery oil mix in the spark plug hole or just spray alot of pb blaster in the spark plug hole let it sit for a day or 2 then try to break loose with the crank bolt.


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## Elt31987 (Sep 6, 2015)

Marvel Mystery Oil in the plug hole


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## skutflut (Oct 16, 2015)

micah68kj said:


> Machine sat outside and has had water in it. What is best way to get it loose? I have loads of time to get it free. Just want to know the best method. It's an Italian made BCS tiller engine.
> Thanks fellas!
> This is something I have never had to deal with and all new to me.


Is it a two stroke or a 4 stroke?


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## drmerdp (Feb 9, 2014)

nwcove said:


> I would remove the head and go with the tried and true 50/50 mix of acetone and atf.


I never tried marvel mixed with diesel but ATF and acetone is very effective.


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## motorhead64 (Dec 15, 2013)

Marvel in the plug hole for 72 hours should free it up. MH


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## JayzAuto1 (Jul 25, 2016)

GAfternoon, When you say "Get it Free", are you trying to save this engine and parts? If not, an air hammer with a chisel bit is pretty effective. If you are, taking the cylinder head off and using the acetone/ATF mixture may be the best bet. Fill the cylinder and let it set up for a few days. Then try tapping the piston with a block of wood, while trying to turn the crankshaft. GLuck, J


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## YSHSfan (Jun 25, 2014)

Acetone and ATF or Marvel mystery oil, fill the cylinder and let it sit for a few days before trying to free it up.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Trying to save the engine. It's a good one. 
Stay tuned for further developments...


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## dbert (Aug 25, 2013)

You got a BCS Joe?
Sweet.
Any blower attachment?
I hope you get it running?


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## dbert (Aug 25, 2013)

From earthtoolsbcs.com
Most BCS Machines sold in America between 1975 and 1990 came with an Italian built ACME engine. (Exception: Pre-1992 200 Series BCS machines [models 201, 203, 204 & 205] came with a BCS gas engine, which is identified by the oil fill being on the same side of the engine as the carburetor and muffler. We have parts for these, too!) The ACME engine brand was purchased by Lombardini in 1997, and then Lombardini was purchased by Kohler in 2007.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

dbert said:


> You got a BCS Joe?
> Sweet.
> Any blower attachment?
> I hope you get it running?


That isn't the best part Del. I'm getting ready to pay the guy and he told me to just take it. 
No attachments. Just tiller, which is what I was ISO. Need to till the back yard where the construction materials were laying and equipment damage from building our addition. If I get it back in good shape I may look for a blower for it. It 's a smaller machone, not one of the big ones. Thanks for the info.
I won't have much time to fool with it for a few days but I did remove the plug and dump about half a can of PB Blaster in there. Going to just let it sit and soak till I get to it but I'll more than likely pull the head. It's a pretty nice machine. Looks a little rough but it has a ton of potential. Seems there was a guy on here a couple years back, who got a nice machine that needed a bit of TLC. As I recall he did a marvelous job resurrecting it. :icon_smile_wink:


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## Jackmels (Feb 18, 2013)

Put a Pipe Wrench on the Crank, and slowly move it back and forth. It'll break Free. Done Quite a few....


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

i have also had a lot of success with acetone and atf mix. I would do as suggested and put atf and acetone down the plug hole and wait a few days and see if it frees up. don't try to use the recoil starter put a wrench on the output shaft and work it back and forth slowly. if it doesn't budge let it sit for a bit longer. Worst comes to worst take the head off and use a wooden block and hammer to try to break it free. Just don't go all gorilla on it.

I really like the bcs tiller. I got a Honda FRC 800 (in trade for a old snow blower) that was in pretty good shape just didn't run and restored it several years and it has been working great since.


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## Vermont007 (Mar 29, 2015)

I'm still curious as to whether this engine has a Cast Iron sleeve . . . . and how long was it left outside in the weather ?

Weeks, months . . . . or years ?


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Vermont007 said:


> I'm still curious as to whether this engine has a Cast Iron sleeve . . . . and how long was it left outside in the weather ?
> 
> Weeks, months . . . . or years ?


Probably is sleeved. Not sure though. Been sitting for a few months with the air cleaner ccover off.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

When (if) all of that doesn't work: blow it clear then dump in some Coca-Cola (spark plug hole). Wait a day. Dump in some more. Wait a day. Dump in some more. Wait a day. Engine will then break free.

Should take about one can total.

One reason I quit drinking the stuff...


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## dr bob (Dec 12, 2015)

The deal with the ATF and acetone mix is that the acetone thins the atf and lets it get into a lot of tigt places, like the ring lands and the piston-to-cylinder gaps. The acetone evaporates and leaves the high-detergent ATF to lubricate things.

Marvel Mystery Oil is a functional equivalent to ATF for this kind of task. MMO is mineral oil based though.

The quality of the ATF needed is not significant. I use whatever I happen to have. I usually keep a pump oiler on the side of a rollaway cabinet with ATF in it. I add acetone when I need to free something up. Then I can pump it in through spark plug holes.

Getting the piston free in the cylinder is a good first step. But, if water was in the cylinder long enough to rust the bore, a lot more will be needed before it's back to good condition. Any in service 'wear-in' is accelerated 'wear-out'.

If you have a borescope, even one of those cheapy Harbor Freight video inspection cameras, drop the camera in through the spark plug hole and look around at the bore condition after you can get the piston down enough.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> When (if) all of that doesn't work: blow it clear then dump in some Coca-Cola (spark plug hole). Wait a day. Dump in some more. Wait a day. Dump in some more. Wait a day. Engine will then break free.
> 
> Should take about one can total.
> 
> One reason I quit drinking the stuff...


Coca Cola was actually my very first thought but I never touch the stuff either so don't have any. I'm a little concerned about this engine.... I sprayed the cylinder full of PB Blaster and is slowly disappeared in about 30 sec. Broken rings? Heavily scored wall? Open valve?


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

dbert said:


> You got a BCS Joe?
> Sweet.
> Any blower attachment?
> I hope you get it running?


Going to PM you, Del.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

micah68kj said:


> I sprayed the cylinder full of PB Blaster and is slowly disappeared in about 30 sec. Broken rings? Heavily scored wall? Open valve?


Good sign, probably means it's not sooper rusted.

What did the guy you got it from have to say? Ran when parked/other?


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

micah68kj said:


> Coca Cola was actually my very first thought but I never touch the stuff either so don't have any. I'm a little concerned about this engine.... I sprayed the cylinder full of PB Blaster and is slowly disappeared in about 30 sec. Broken rings? Heavily scored wall? Open valve?


Joe, If a head gasket is still available for this engine I would remove the head and take a look. Hopefully the cylinder bore will be in good shape.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Yanmar Ronin said:


> Good sign, probably means it's not sooper rusted.
> 
> What did the guy you got it from have to say? Ran when parked/other?


He said not only did it run but it ran very well. He said it was one of the stongest pieces of OPE he'd ever used.


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

GustoGuy said:


> Joe, If a head gasket is still available for this engine I would remove the head and take a look. Hopefully the cylinder bore will be in good shape.


Mark,
I do believe parts are available for this tiller.... If you have the$$. If worse comes to worst I'll very carefully remove the gasket and reuse it. I have sealed a few head gaskets and other gaskets as well, using the old Permatex gasket maker. I'm sure there are much better products available now. Back in the day when I was a starving wrench bender I would take the old gasket and smear both sides with that old, smelly, sticky Permatex and the machine would be good as new. It's way too nice a machine to scrap. All the controls are still free. The locking hubs are functional. The tines are in good shape. It has a couple leaky seals but all in good time. Going to get the engine functioning then sweat the other stuff. 
Ijust wwon't be able to tinker with it for a week. Other obligations.
Stay tuned....:icon_whistling:.


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