# Ariens 921046 oil leak- oil everywhere- any idea why? - 254" engine, 28" Deluxe model



## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

*Ariens 921046 oil leak- oil everywhere- any idea why? - 254" engine, 28" Deluxe model*

Just bought this in November new at HDepot, used about 4 times. 254CC engine. 28" Deluxe model.

See photo. Where is all this oil coming from?

I did do an oil change today, and I tipped the machine to get the oil out, though I tipped it no further then I normally tip when snowblowing and turning around. It looks like there was oil dripping before the oil change, there is oil on the mat in the garage under the machine. As its frozen in water, I thought it was just dirt until today (gravel driveway)

Can someone shed some light on this for me? I did upload photos to my account at Ariens (I opened a case).

the oil is NOT from the oil drain tube. NOT. that part is dry and I am mechanically inclined and did not rotate the drain tube w/ a wrench when draining.

Pretty frustrated for what this machine costs. Its beyond 30 days so cannot return to HDepot which sucks.
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## Bassguitarist1985 (Aug 22, 2016)

Can you take a wider picture? Is the area below the valve cover?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Bassguitarist1985 said:


> Can you take a wider picture? Is the area below the valve cover?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Thanks for reply.

Cant take one now unfortunately, dark out and not tons of light in garage. Can tomorrow. This is where all the oil is at, all over the left side. I bought an Ariens so I wouldn't have to work on it! :/

i am not sure where to go with this


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## Bassguitarist1985 (Aug 22, 2016)

WIHD said:


> Thanks for reply.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Alrighty, my guess is that it is coming from the vent breather on the valve cover. Take a picture when you can. A tiny bit of oil mist is normal. A lot indicates an overfilled crankcase, or potentially a blown head gasket. Just guessing as mentioned.



Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Bassguitarist1985 said:


> Alrighty, my guess is that it is coming from the vent breather on the valve cover. Take a picture when you can. A tiny bit of oil mist is normal. A lot indicates an overfilled crankcase, or potentially a blown head gasket. Just guessing as mentioned.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk



Thanks, if I had a schematic I could check that breather, but I am not sure the PDFs I have outline where that breather is at. I haven't poked around on the engine much, will have to look closely tomorrow.

This occurred before I changed the oil so if it was overfilled (?) it would have to be from the factory that way?

blown head gasket on a new machine....wondering how normal that would be for an Ariens. I have only used it 4 times or so. One reason I bought it was to avoid issues like this.

I will get a bigger pic tomorrow. Appreciate the insight.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

here are more photos. Its freezing/frosty outside here today so photos have some glare. I did not fire it up prior to taking these today. rocker cover = valve cover
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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Bassguitarist1985 said:


> Alrighty....


bump. Thanks


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

You are going to have to take the engine off of the frame and clean all of it off or it will be seeping out for quite some time when the engine is hot. Oil between engine and frame.
When you have the engine out, check all of the case cover bolts to make sure they are tight, I have seen them loosen up already.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

If you can not locate the leak, I would well imagine you are still in the Ariens Warranty, just bring it to the local repair center under your Ariens warranty.

It is rare, but I have seen aluminum casings come out like cheesecloth, weeps right through the casing. I had a brand new LHS years ago that Chrysler bought back after 1 1/2 years for bad engine casting. Ford had a batch of Lincolns years ago with aluminum transmission casings doing the same thing.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

The aluminum becomes "Porous" almost like a sponge and oil leaks through it very slowly. I have seen that many times on a lot of different things.
Like oneacer mentioned, if its still under warranty, take it to a good repair center.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

breather has oil on it but its near the rear of the engine, at that, machine was not overfull from factory or since the oil change so blowby makes little sense (?)

oil is accumulating near the front engine base on BOTH sides as well, not just on the breather side.

Its freezing out here. Removing an engine from a machine, when the machine is not even 40 days old and has been used 4 times (?) in a 10 below pole barn makes little sense to me especially when under warranty. At that, removing an engine doesn't pinpoint a problem.

All said, for $1200, I find myself wishing I had gone a different route completely.


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## Motor City (Jan 6, 2014)

Was there a crush washer on the oil drain bolt when you removed it?


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

More importantly, is the oil level in the engine dropping?

Might also (if you have not already) want to pull the belt cover and make sure that you don't have a bad crankshaft oil seal (at least the easy one to look at . . .).

Another thought would be to buy a $5 UV flashlight, clean the machine up the best you can, and put in a tad of UV visible leak tracer in the oil, and then run for brief intervals until you just find the leak source.

All assuming that you want to deal with this, and not just let the warranty make it someone else's problem . . .


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## rod330 (Oct 9, 2015)

WIHD said:


> All said, for $1200, I find myself wishing I had gone a different route completely.


That's very understandable. Ariens didn't build the engine but they are certainly responsible for making this right. I hope HD is responsive and resolves this quickly with a local dealer or just replaces it....please keep us updated.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

WIHD said:


> Just bought this in November new at HDepot, used about 4 times. 254CC engine. 28" Deluxe model.
> 
> See photo. Where is all this oil coming from?
> 
> ...



If it's just outside the 30 day's, it's worth it to try and return it to HD. These stores want satisfied customers and good reviews. If you're just over, I'd go speak with a manager. I've returned stuff outside the window many times after speaking with a manager. You've got absolutely nothing to lose accept some time and gas.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Either the store or Ariens Warranty, get it resolved soon, and don't wait.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Motor City said:


> Was there a crush washer on the oil drain bolt when you removed it?


you mean the nut at the end of the oil drain? no. But there's also no oil residue on that region. Though it seems like that region would be the issue, its not.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

tadawson said:


> More importantly, is the oil level in the engine dropping?
> 
> Might also (if you have not already) want to pull the belt cover and make sure that you don't have a bad crankshaft oil seal (at least the easy one to look at . . .).
> 
> ...


unclear what you mean 'make it someone elses problem'? Someone spends $1000+ on a piece of equipment that is failing/damaged within 4 uses....I'd say someone else made it my problem.

Also, tearing it apart in my barn may very well void the warranty (?) making the situation worse. 

Thanks.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

rod330 said:


> That's very understandable. Ariens didn't build the engine but they are certainly responsible for making this right. I hope HD is responsive and resolves this quickly with a local dealer or just replaces it....please keep us updated.


HD stated its out of the 30 day window so its an Ariens issue. I may call and lean again. If they would take it back/swap it out at least, it could go back to Ariens (or whoever) for repair or whatever they do w/ it.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

oneacer said:


> Either the store or Ariens Warranty, get it resolved soon, and don't wait.


I already created a 'case' on Ariens site, uploaded pics etc (clearly they are closed Sat/Sun), also contacted a local powersports preferred Ariens dealer (not HDepot). I sent them an email w/ pics and explained etc (they too are closed today). So will know more tomorrow. First call Monday will be to Ariens.

What has me more worried is if this takes X weeks to resolve, and in the meantime we get bombed w/ snow and I have to then purchase a 2nd machine while 'this' is being resolved. Even an autobody gives one a loaner car, I do not know how Ariens works in this regard. Its not like a lawnmower that breaks. Letting my grass get long, the world wouldn't end, but getting a foot of snow and not clearing it, you cannot even leave for work etc. cannot get truck/car out of garage that kind of thing.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

I am pretty sure the manufacture date on the box stated 12/18. I find myself wondering if a seal dried out or something sitting on a shelf for a year until I purchased.

Per the comment above on is the oil level dropping (with usage). It did not appear to, tough when slowblowing when one is done the machine (as you know) is covered w/ snow/ice etc so unless you're digging around on the machine one would not see leaking oil at least until the machine sat inside and snow melted off of it (like my scenario).

Hopefully a resolution tomorrow. TBD


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## all3939 (Dec 21, 2014)

Maybe a nice ariens dealer will give you something to use in the meantime even if it's older and smaller, try going that route. The dealer will do well on this repair so possibly a loaner can work here.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

got a truck or trailer? if so take it to a car was and spend $5 washing all the oil off it with soapy water and give it a good rinse. this is the best place to start. when doing an oil change on those style machines i usually cut a oil container so i can slide part of the container under the engine so that you don't end up having issues like you are when changing the oil. once the oil is under the engine it is hard to get out but the hot soap water at the car wash would be a good place to start.


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## all3939 (Dec 21, 2014)

I use this for all my OPE oil changes. They come in different sizes. Have two of them. Very handy indeed. https://www.amazon.com/Form-Funnel-...words=pig+form-a-funnel&qid=1576468329&sr=8-1


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

WIHD said:


> unclear what you mean 'make it someone elses problem'? Someone spends $1000+ on a piece of equipment that is failing/damaged within 4 uses....I'd say someone else made it my problem.
> 
> Also, tearing it apart in my barn may very well void the warranty (?) making the situation worse.
> 
> Thanks.


"Make it someone else's problem": Warranty, plain and simple. Someone else has to figure out what's wrong with it and make it right, not you. You also paid for that to be done as well as part of the $1000 you spent . . . so, other than possibly taking it somewhere, this really *isn't* your problem at all . . .

Still curious as to how fast the case level is dropping, to get a feel for the magnitude of the leak.

I am also unclear if this was happening before you did the oil change, or just after. If after, might some have spilled and gotten under the engine? If the level isn't dropping, might this be possible? Seems like a little oil often looks like a lot, especially if mixed with other stuff . . . beyond that, it's drain plug, case gasket, valve cover, shaft seals, or block casting defect . . . not much else left . . .


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## all3939 (Dec 21, 2014)

That's why I like purchasing from a dealer as they're more eager to resolve it quickly as not to tarnish their image and to keep you as a future customer.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

WIHD said:


> rod330 said:
> 
> 
> > That's very understandable. Ariens didn't build the engine but they are certainly responsible for making this right. I hope HD is responsive and resolves this quickly with a local dealer or just replaces it....please keep us updated.
> ...


What date did you purchase it at HD (just curious how close it is to 30 days) ??? If it's close, I'm telling you, I'd go back and raise ****. I'd demand to speak with the store manager. Explain that you cannot be without a machine, nor should have to deal with the BS on a (30 something days ??) purchase. You won't get anywhere with just the customer service person at the front desk. You're going to have to speak to a store manager. I'm betting if you try hard enough, you'll get the result you're wanting. Now if it's 60, 90 days, etc.....that's entirely different. I'd raise ****.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

Depending upon your outcome, you might want to consider spending the $99.00 and buy the promotional extended warranty that covers your machine out to five year's. I never buy these, as in the majority of case's, you rarely use um and they're a money maker for the manufacturer. But the extended warranty for my Pro is $345.00. With this promotion, it's $99.00, and I bought it. Just something to think about if you end up keeping this machine.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@all3939,

I use a cut up plastic milk jug .... shame, I should have patented it, I could have made some good money ... lol


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## all3939 (Dec 21, 2014)

I use them too when the right stuff is else where.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

PLEASE do not turn this into an OIL THREAD with best oils and techniques etc etc etc

That happens on too many tech forums and the thread gets completely derailed.

Thanks.

___

Talked to Ariens today and my uploads to their site and case # have been sent to their 'team'. I should hear from them in 24-48. As I am at work I have not recalled HDepot again yet. TBD


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

no one is talking about the oil. we were discussing funnels. if you had used a funnel that slipped under the engine you would have just had to lift the 1 side of the machine a little and all oil would have have ended up in a container and not under the engine. i would still recommend taking the machine to a carwash and giving it a nice warm soapy bath. i have done it to a few machines. if you continue to see oil leaking after that and oil level dropping then i would be worried but if it did't leak before the oil change but seams like it is leaking after i doubt it is a seal or gasket. might even be worth investing in the tube to extend the oil drain so next time no oil ends up on the machine in the future.


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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

.

Since everything seems to be "good", it is now entirely possible the case has been cracked due to the oil plug being overtightened

like this: 





.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

BNSFguy said:


> What date did you purchase it at HD (just curious how close it is to 30 days) ??? If it's close, I'm telling you, I'd go back and raise ****. I'd demand to speak with the store manager. Explain that you cannot be without a machine, nor should have to deal with the BS on a (30 something days ??) purchase. You won't get anywhere with just the customer service person at the front desk. You're going to have to speak to a store manager. I'm betting if you try hard enough, you'll get the result you're wanting. Now if it's 60, 90 days, etc.....that's entirely different. I'd raise ****.


I think he is referring to Home Depots 30 day no questions asked money back guarantee. You just take it back and get your money back. The manufacturer should have their own guarantee that should be longer than 30 days, but sometimes items sold through Home Depot get different levels of guarantees with them that might not be as long as it would be if purchased from an independent dealership, I.E. an authorized Ariens dealership.
I know that was a case with John Deere products years ago.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

crazzywolfie said:


> no one is talking about the oil. we were discussing funnels. if you had used a funnel that slipped under the engine you would have just had to lift the 1 side of the machine a little and all oil would have have ended up in a container and not under the engine. i would still recommend taking the machine to a carwash and giving it a nice warm soapy bath. i have done it to a few machines. if you continue to see oil leaking after that and oil level dropping then i would be worried but if it did't leak before the oil change but seams like it is leaking after i doubt it is a seal or gasket. might even be worth investing in the tube to extend the oil drain so next time no oil ends up on the machine in the future.


?? I didnt spill any oil. Did you read prior posts? The oil isn't coming from the oil drain area this has been stated prior in this thread. There has been oil on the ground before any oil change.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Have you checked the oil fill spout, the black tube with yellow cap. There is a thin O ring sealing the tube at its base that is secured with a tab and bolt. I think the engine oil slinger is located near that fill tube (maybe 2 or 3 inches) so if the o ring is not perfect then the slinger will power oil past that O ring and out over the forward part of engine.

It happened on my machine (oil fill tube mounted on valve cover side of engine) but the tube just needed to be pressed back in place. No need to take it back to dealer under warranty.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Here is a pic of oil tube on my machine.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> BNSFguy said:
> 
> 
> > What date did you purchase it at HD (just curious how close it is to 30 days) ??? If it's close, I'm telling you, I'd go back and raise ****. I'd demand to speak with the store manager. Explain that you cannot be without a machine, nor should have to deal with the BS on a (30 something days ??) purchase. You won't get anywhere with just the customer service person at the front desk. You're going to have to speak to a store manager. I'm betting if you try hard enough, you'll get the result you're wanting. Now if it's 60, 90 days, etc.....that's entirely different. I'd raise ****.
> ...


Yes. That's what I was getting it: he should go back to HD and raise ****. Talk to a store manager. If it's just over HD's 30 day return period, manager's have some discretion. Their job is "customer service" which means keeping customers happy and coming back. If he purchased this at HD, say 35 day's ago (or so), I'd immediately go back and explain that you want a new machine or full refund. Period. Make it HD's problem. Not yours. If you're persistent and don't give an inch, I'm betting you get what you want. I've returned plenty of stuff at these large stores, many times beyond their return period. It's all in how you handle yourself.
RUN TO HD TODAY !!!!! Don't allow another day to pass.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

WIHD said:


> ?? I didnt spill any oil. Did you read prior posts? The oil isn't coming from the oil drain area this has been stated prior in this thread. There has been oil on the ground before any oil change.


if it was leaking oil before the oil change then you should have contacted the manufacture before doing the oil change to see what they would want to do. only using it 4 times seems like such a short amount of time for the first oil change anyways.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

crazzywolfie said:


> WIHD said:
> 
> 
> > ?? I didnt spill any oil. Did you read prior posts? The oil isn't coming from the oil drain area this has been stated prior in this thread. There has been oil on the ground before any oil change.
> ...


Alot of guys, myself included, will run the motor to break it in and/or use it a few times, and do an oil change. It's probably not necessary, but a lot of guys will do it figuring any slight metal breakdown or "wear in" is best to remove after break in and replace with fresh oil. I'll do it myself on my new blower after using it a few hours.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

BNSFguy said:


> Yes. That's what I was getting it: he should go back to HD and raise ****. Talk to a store manager. If it's just over HD's 30 day return period, manager's have some discretion. Their job is "customer service" which means keeping customers happy and coming back. If he purchased this at HD, say 35 day's ago (or so), I'd immediately go back and explain that you want a new machine or full refund. Period. Make it HD's problem. Not yours. If you're persistent and don't give an inch, I'm betting you get what you want. I've returned plenty of stuff at these large stores, many times beyond their return period. It's all in how you handle yourself.
> RUN TO HD TODAY !!!!! Don't allow another day to pass.


Bnsf, a lot of times the 30 day is 30 business days, that doesn't include weekends or holidays, so that would give around 40 days in total for a return. Usually they would make good on a return if its not too long after the return time alotted.
Is that a G.E. or an EMD SD70AC in your pic?


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> BNSFguy said:
> 
> 
> > Yes. That's what I was getting it: he should go back to HD and raise ****. Talk to a store manager. If it's just over HD's 30 day return period, manager's have some discretion. Their job is "customer service" which means keeping customers happy and coming back. If he purchased this at HD, say 35 day's ago (or so), I'd immediately go back and explain that you want a new machine or full refund. Period. Make it HD's problem. Not yours. If you're persistent and don't give an inch, I'm betting you get what you want. I've returned plenty of stuff at these large stores, many times beyond their return period. It's all in how you handle yourself.
> ...


Yea, if they go by "business day's", that'd probably work out great for him. I hope he's able to swap this particular blower out with a new one from HD. 

That particular engine is GE power. One of the newer Tier 4's, BNSF 3806. I'm an engineer for BNSF Railway going from Minneapolis, MN to Fargo, ND.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

BNSFguy said:


> Yea, if they go by "business day's", that'd probably work out great for him. I hope he's able to swap this particular blower out with a new one from HD.
> 
> That particular engine is GE power. One of the newer Tier 4's, BNSF 3806. I'm an engineer for BNSF Railway going from Minneapolis, MN to Fargo, ND.


Pretty neat job, keeps you on the run with all that H.P. under the hood and the A.C. traction I would imagine.
I hope it works out for the man with the problem machine.
I know around me, if you take it back to HD, they send it to THEIR service department somewhere and they are not the greatest around here. I used to get equipment that they sent back to the customer and told them to find an authorized dealer and take it to them because they couldn't find a problem or fix it. We could either take the job or refuse it because we didn't sell it, that was in our contract with American Honda and H.D. didn't pay us as much as Honda would have so a lot of times we would refuse the work. I don't know how they are with Ariens.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@ST11,

You mean you worked for an authorized Ariens Repair shop and could refuse to do Ariens Warranty work … interesting?


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## Brent Holm (Oct 22, 2019)

I worked for the Depot years ago. They don't fix anything. You get a new one, they scrap the old one, no matter what it was. I watched them crush and dispose of millions in inventory over the year I worked there. Perfectly good appliances and tools, tossed into the dumpster daily. They outsource everything including blower assembly to people who in my opinion should have their tools taken away. That is likely the root cause of the problem, poor handling and assembly at HD. 

This is precisely why I just sent friends to their local hardware store and Ariens selling/servicing dealer for a new Deluxe 24 the other day. Most people need the support system, there isn't one when you try to save money shopping at the big box...


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

lowes is no better, a few days back i was looking at a log spliter ,self threading bolts were not even threaded in , i mean so loose a 5 year old could have removed them with their fingers, 

this wasn't a troy built one of the ones like tsc sells a good one


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

As mentioned, and widely known, big box stores are not the best at assembling there equipment for sure. Anyone who does not have a mechanical skillset, as most of us here do, should certainly pay the extra, and go to a dealer, and get it assembled by them. They also can give the buyer a walk through on its operation.


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

oneacer said:


> @ST11,
> 
> You mean you worked for an authorized Ariens Repair shop and could refuse to do Ariens Warranty work … interesting?



Sounds like he was talking about Honda: 



"We could either take the job or refuse it because we didn't sell it, that was in our contract with American Honda"


and 



"I don't know how they are with Ariens."


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## BazookaJoe (Oct 6, 2019)

The OP states that there is oil on the floor and it appears the engine was leaking oil before the oil change. And, it appears the oil is coming from the output shaft end side of the engine. This probably indicates a defective gasket/sealant on the engine output side cover. Not a big deal to repair yourself if you have tools & skills, but since the engine is on warranty, then there's that. 

Complicating this, is that Home Depot will send the machine away for repairs and who knows how long before you'll see it back at your house. Plus, most likely at this time of the year, the local small engine shops are likely very backed up. 

If this were my machine... If the backlog is too long at the local shops, then I'd probably just fix it myself and be done with it. 

Or, if a person is not comfortable with the engine work, then they could remove the engine from the machine to at least locate the source of the oil leak. It might be something simple, such as a missing or loose fastener.


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## TooTall999 (Nov 19, 2015)

From Ariens website


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## MOW&BLOW (Dec 17, 2019)

all3939 said:


> that's why i like purchasing from a dealer as they're more eager to resolve it quickly as not to tarnish their image and to keep you as a future customer.


exactly!


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@tadawson,

I see, so he worked for a Honda Authorized Dealer and refused Honda Warranty work if they so choose … interesting.

I am going to surmise then he was not an Authorized Honda Repair shop, but just a normal small engine repair shop, as a Honda Authorized Repair shop is just that, a shop that does there warranty work, otherwise not an Authorized Repair Shop …. JMHO


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

oneacer said:


> @tadawson,
> 
> I see, so he worked for a Honda Authorized Dealer and refused Honda Warranty work if they so choose … interesting.
> 
> I am going to surmise then he was not an Authorized Honda Repair shop, but just a normal small engine repair shop, as a Honda Authorized Repair shop is just that, a shop that does there warranty work, otherwise not an Authorized Repair Shop …. JMHO


Authorized Full Service Honda Dealership, both selling new product and service/repair, that case happened in '05 with a snowblower sold from Home Depot. That Honda dealership was first opened in 1963. Dealer# 101889 Motorcycle, ATV, Scooter, Outdoor Power Equipment, Marine.
We were allowed to REFUSE warranty work if the item was sold from a Big Box Store, that was in our contract with Honda.
We were NOT allowed to sell anything still "in the box". Everything we sold had to be fully assembled and running, and give the customer full operating instructions on the item, we were not allowed to disassemble it and put it back into the box again. The customer then had to "Sign Off" on it before they took delivery on said item. That was in the contract with Honda.
Dealership is now combined with a 5 Star John Deere Full Service Dealership and the John Deere end is allowed to NOT work on anything sold from the Big Box Stores, that is in their Contract with John Deere. They can REFUSE any warranty work if the item was originally sold from any of the Big Box Stores.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

The Big Box Stores have their own centralized repair facilities that they send their products to for repair work, they do not use independent privately owned repair shops.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

oneacer said:


> As mentioned, and widely known, big box stores are not the best at assembling there equipment for sure. Anyone who does not have a mechanical skillset, as most of us here do, should certainly pay the extra, and go to a dealer, and get it assembled by them. They also can give the buyer a walk through on its operation.


If you purchase from HD or Lowes, just pick it up in the crate and assemble it yourself. That's what I did. Ordered my Pro 28" RapidTrac from Lowes and picked it up in the box on the skid. I told them I'd assemble it. These machines are practically assembled from the factory in the crate. You can see all the "QC" marks across every single part on the machine. You remove the box and just need to bolt down the handlebars, attach cables and chute, and adjust all the cables. I understand the average homeowner might not be interested or capable of assembling a machine, but for most, it's really quite simple if your the least bit mechanically inclined and have a socket set.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@BNSF,

While most here in this forum are more than capable of assembling a unit, the average person will not be capable of undergoing this, nor do they want to bother. They just want it delivered and run it. Most will not even maintain it, or store it properly out of the elements.

JMHO from what I have seen ….


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## enigma-2 (Feb 11, 2014)

WIHD, is the oil level in the engine going down? And if so, about how much was required to bring up to full?


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## TooTall999 (Nov 19, 2015)

I have to ask the obvious: Is there a plug missing?


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

LOL ….. you mean he never put the lower oil cap back on the unit … now that would be really funny …… pour it through the top fill /check tube, and let it run out the bottom oil fil/check plug …. 


That would be another reason why some people should let a dealer do the assembly and give them a complete walk through on the machine and its proper operation and maintenance.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

TooTall999 said:


> I have to ask the obvious: Is there a plug missing?


NO that one isn't bored though and threaded for the plug.

ope engines are more or less universal most have 3 bore areas for the oil levels, normally one or more lower areas on the block are not machined when a dip stick is used, in this case you see what you pointed out a blank not fully machined


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## TooTall999 (Nov 19, 2015)

87powershiftx2 said:


> NO that one isn't bored though and threaded for the plug.
> 
> ope engines are more or less universal most have 3 bore areas for the oil levels, normally one or more lower areas on the block are not machined when a dip stick is used, in this case you see what you pointed out a blank not fully machined


The Loncin engine on my blower has two lower fill plugs and the dipstick tube, which is why I asked.


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## lefty (Feb 1, 2014)

WIHD said:


> PLEASE do not turn this into an OIL THREAD with best oils and techniques etc etc etc
> 
> That happens on too many tech forums and the thread gets completely derailed.
> 
> ...



If you really want to learn, you're going to have to be willing to listen to some people wax philosophical. It's a small price to pay for the knowledge you are seeking. Some of these guys are geniuses and this is how they work. They're taking the time to offer help to strangers, and they're always patient. I've gone from knowing nothing about equipment to knowing enough to repair anything with the help of these fine people on this and other forums. Some of the most important stuff I've learned was from these small little detours into related topics.


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## BazookaJoe (Oct 6, 2019)

BNSFguy, 

I see you now have a Pro 28" Rapidtrak- nice rig. 

I was wondering- what did you ever figure out with the leaking oil on the Deluxe 28? Or did you take the easy repair method of leaving it in front of the Home Depot store?


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

BazookaJoe said:


> BNSFguy,
> 
> I see you now have a Pro 28" Rapidtrak- nice rig.
> 
> I was wondering- what did you ever figure out with the leaking oil on the Deluxe 28? Or did you take the easy repair method of leaving it in front of the Home Depot store?


I believe user "WHID" was the original poster with the oil leak issue and started this thread. My only other Ariens snowblower is about 45 years old and still going strong, remarkably. I just needed something more powerful and updated. The old 24" Ariens didn't do so well in the wet, slushy stuff. I keep watching the forecast and hoping for a monster snow storm here in Minnesota (lol).


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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

.

Hopefully the OP reports back what he did to fix this problem and isnt the "One and Done" type 

.


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

Looks like oil ran down the side of the plug hole to me

Sent from my LM-Q710.FG using Tapatalk


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Shovel said:


> Looks like oil ran down the side of the plug hole to me
> 
> Sent from my LM-Q710.FG using Tapatalk


That's what it looked like to me, especially if it was bought and prepped at a Big Box Store. The owner could have done that also, and not realized what happened and figured they would just wipe up any little bit of spilled oil. They could have spilled some oil and wiped it off, but there was oil down under the engine where it mounts to the frame, and it took a while for it to finally start weeping itself out from under the engine and making a mess.
Once the engine gets hot, and makes the spilled oil hot, it will make an ounce of oil look like 8 ounces of oil after it gets hot and spreads out, causing it to look like a major leak.


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

ST1100A said:


> That's what it looked like to me, especially if it was bought and prepped at a Big Box Store. The owner could have done that also, and not realized what happened and figured they would just wipe up any little bit of spilled oil. They could have spilled some oil and wiped it off, but there was oil down under the engine where it mounts to the frame, and it took a while for it to finally start weeping itself out from under the engine and making a mess.
> Once the engine gets hot, and makes the spilled oil hot, it will make an ounce of oil look like 8 ounces of oil after it gets hot and spreads out, causing it to look like a major leak.


It's very easy to do as it just travels down the engine...like trying to pour a glass of tea from a full pitcher.. it's just going to run down the side.
I would just clean up the mess then keep an eye on it...if it is actually leaking its easier to find the source if it's not soaked in oil.
I would have already had that belt cover off and checked the seal on that end.
Swabbed the other end .
If it has a dipstick...could be leaking there.
Valve cover.
With a clean engine and fresh oil..it can kinda be hard to see..the paper towel won't lie though it's easy to see when it has hit oil



Sent from my LM-Q710.FG using Tapatalk


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

TooTall999 said:


> The Loncin engine on my blower has two lower fill plugs and the dipstick tube, which is why I asked.


universal motor fits all motor !! 

how about putting this one to sleep and wait for the op to come back with what was done,


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## BazookaJoe (Oct 6, 2019)

BNSFguy said:


> I believe user "WHID" was the original poster with the oil leak issue and started this thread. My only other Ariens snowblower is about 45 years old and still going strong, remarkably. I just needed something more powerful and updated. The old 24" Ariens didn't do so well in the wet, slushy stuff. I keep watching the forecast and hoping for a monster snow storm here in Minnesota (lol).


Oop-sorry (MN speak), wrong guy. 

I am also looking for some big snowfall to put the new Ariens to the test out here in Fergus Falls MN. My initial testing of my Deluxe 28 is that it's a bit low on beans when the going gets tough, but seems to get the job done if a person isn't too impatient. The Deluxe 28 is sort of like buying a 3/4 ton HD pickup with a six cylinder engine.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

BazookaJoe said:


> BNSFguy said:
> 
> 
> > I believe user "WHID" was the original poster with the oil leak issue and started this thread. My only other Ariens snowblower is about 45 years old and still going strong, remarkably. I just needed something more powerful and updated. The old 24" Ariens didn't do so well in the wet, slushy stuff. I keep watching the forecast and hoping for a monster snow storm here in Minnesota (lol).
> ...


Fergus Falls. Yup go thru there a lot deadheading to and from Fargo, ND. Hope we both get lots of snow this winter and warmer than minus 20 - 30 temps (lol).


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

update- so after calling the local dealer (who gave tons of stories last week about how 'backlogged' they were and may not get to it soon etc etc etc) - I looked at picking up the machine at their shop (been there a week) and taking to a different shop. 

But, guy told me today 12/26 they are waiting on an 'oil seal'.
I pressed for further details but I don't think he knew deeper details about it, something about an oil seal on the impeller side. That, and now they have to 'wait for the part' to arrive from Ariens. 
I know about Harley engines but not Ariens engines/products. 
Can anyone shed further light on this issue?

Has an issue like this thus starved part of the engine or assembly of oil, creating further internal damage that may show up in X years?

For what this machine cost, relative to Ariens reputation for 'quality', this is leaving a very sour taste.


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## Bassguitarist1985 (Aug 22, 2016)

WIHD said:


> update- so after calling the local dealer (who gave tons of stories last week about how 'backlogged' they were and may not get to it soon etc etc etc) - I looked at picking up the machine at their shop (been there a week) and taking to a different shop.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The oil seal he might be talking about is on the engine, on the output shaft side. Its a very small an inexpensive part. If it was not pressed in properly it can leak if the lip is "rolled."

It can happen, but if caught early enough and the oil level did not drop dangerously low during operation, no harm to the engine would have occurred, except the oil mess like you showed.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Bassguitarist1985 said:


> The oil seal he might be talking about is on the engine, on the output shaft side. Its a very small an inexpensive part. If it was not pressed in properly it can leak if the lip is "rolled."
> 
> It can happen, but if caught early enough and the oil level did not drop dangerously low during operation, no harm to the engine would have occurred, except the oil mess like you showed.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Thanks. Harley has an inner primary oil seal prone to leakage, I have replaced a few. This sounds similar in flavor. It is double lipped and did need proper pressing as well.

Will have to see specifics on the invoice or the Ariens rep who emailed me maybe could provide further detail once this wraps up. The guy on the phone this AM didn't seem to know a ton.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Email w/ dealer, I asked about details he stated "Yes, output on the crankshaft. Only one seal."


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## Bassguitarist1985 (Aug 22, 2016)

WIHD said:


> Email w/ dealer, I asked about details he stated "Yes, output on the crankshaft. Only one seal."


Okay, so not the end of the world. One bolt holding the pulley on the crankshaft, remove old seal with screwdriver, coat new seal and shaft with lube, and using a proper sized PVC pipe to press the seal into the seat should fix your issue.

I get what you been saying shouldnt have to deal with these problems on a new machine etc. I'd be pissed too. I'd be even more pissed if it was a bigger problem like a crankcase pan seal or some other internal issue requiring major engine repair/replace. 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## notabiker (Dec 14, 2018)

BazookaJoe said:


> Oop-sorry (MN speak), wrong guy.
> 
> I am also looking for some big snowfall to put the new Ariens to the test out here in Fergus Falls MN. My initial testing of my Deluxe 28 is that it's a bit low on beans when the going gets tough, but seems to get the job done if a person isn't too impatient. The Deluxe 28 is sort of like buying a 3/4 ton HD pickup with a six cylinder engine.



That 3/4 ton truck analogy would work if it was a gasser, now if it was diesels then the I'd hands down take a 6 cylinder Cummins beastie over any of the v8 diesels for sound as well as power


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## notabiker (Dec 14, 2018)

Glad it was just an output shaft seal. I was looking at the pictures and it seems you might have the old school fill plug underneath the starter...? Might want to just make sure that's tight when you get the machine back for the next time.


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## cranman (Jan 23, 2016)

Glad you found the problem....it will be as good as new, no worries.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

WIHD said:


> Thanks. Harley has an inner primary oil seal prone to leakage, I have replaced a few. This sounds similar in flavor. It is double lipped and did need proper pressing as well.
> 
> Will have to see specifics on the invoice or the Ariens rep who emailed me maybe could provide further detail once this wraps up. The guy on the phone this AM didn't seem to know a ton.


only a single lip, most likely the spring popped off on installation of the side cover on assembly


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

Sadly, I think that we had suggested this on the second page (post #13) . . . Why it got this far, I have no idea . . . Glad it was trivial, though . . .


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## Clutch Cargo (Dec 27, 2015)

tadawson said:


> Sadly, I think that we had suggested this on the second page (post #13) . . . Why it got this far, I have no idea . . . Glad it was trivial, though . . .


Agreed and another reason to support your local independent OPE dealer.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

So, unexpectedly today I get a call from the shop and the machine is fixed. There were leaking oil seals on the shaft.....

So, was talking to the mechanic about the issue and he states "by the way, this is a 3 year old machine". I'm like, what do you mean? I just bought it in November at HDepot.
He said he ran the serial # (for the warranty and such) and the machine is a 2016-17 year model. 

I'm like w*th? 

So this machine was sitting somewhere for 3+ full years until I got it. Most mechanicals need to be run occasionally so seals and the like don't dry out. And, Home Depot was selling this as a 'new' machine?

Can anyone shed light on this? is that normal at a HDepot or Lowes or other retailor IRT a snowblower?

And, this is significant as I also asked the lady at the front desk the possibility of trading it in (on bigger model) and she looked up its value as a _2016 _model year which immediately diminished its value to about $500 as it is 'a few years old' despite that I bought it in November 2019.


??

Edit to clarify, the indie shop looked up the machine for the warranty work, this is where they found the manufacture date. Machine was not purchased at this shop. It was purchased at HD. HD does not service Ariens machines.


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## Rooskie (Feb 12, 2015)

Wow. That's Outrageous! 'No, lady, I bought this unit here, at full price, last month.' It is NOT a 2016.
Try doing that at a car dealership, sell you a 2016 car as a 2019 and tell you you have no recourse.....
Did the unit have a 3-year warranty? Or did the dealer do you a solid favor?
Honest to Goodness, I'd contact the Better Business Bureau and if you have an 'investigative team' at your local TV station, I'd contact them, as well.
It's amazing how helpful folks become when staring into a TV camera floodlight while having a microphone stuck in their face.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

Something sounds strange on you paying full price on a unit manufactured 3-4 years ago … ????? Just sayin …


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## dcinma (Dec 13, 2017)

Maybe because the "big box stores" buy in quantity for a discount and last in, last out means a back log of date of manufacture?


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

oneacer said:


> Something sounds strange on you paying full price on a unit manufactured 3-4 years ago … ????? Just sayin …


yea it is strange as the unit does not have the manufacture date ON IT, it needs to be looked up by a dealer. The indie shop told me the manufacture date, not HD where it was purchased.

may be worth reading the entire thread.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Rooskie said:


> Wow. That's Outrageous! 'No, lady, I bought this unit here, at full price, last month.' It is NOT a 2016.
> Try doing that at a car dealership, sell you a 2016 car as a 2019 and tell you you have no recourse.....
> Did the unit have a 3-year warranty? Or did the dealer do you a solid favor?
> Honest to Goodness, I'd contact the Better Business Bureau and if you have an 'investigative team' at your local TV station, I'd contact them, as well.
> It's amazing how helpful folks become when staring into a TV camera floodlight while having a microphone stuck in their face.


its not her fault, they base trade-ins on their version of KBB for snowblowers, whatever that may be.

to restate, the machine was not purchased at the indie shop where the warranty work was done (the shop where this lady was), it was purchased at HDepot. Thanks.


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

deleted


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

tadawson said:


> Sadly, I think that we had suggested this on the second page (post #13) . . . Why it got this far, I have no idea . . . Glad it was trivial, though . . .


I'm not quite sure I understand your post. 

what do you mean "why it got this far"?


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## nafterclifen (Oct 14, 2015)

If you bought a new snowblower in 2019 but it was made in 2016, I don't see a problem assuming the 2016-built machine is still being made the same in 2019. This scenario is possible but not likely.

Of course if the 2019-built snowblower is different than the 2016 one then I would not be happy. Only exception would be if the motor was larger in 2016 than 2019.

Lastly, comparing a snowblower or any OPE (outdoor power equipment) for that matter to a car in terms of re-sale or trade-in values is absurd. The two are nothing alike.


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

WIHD said:


> So, unexpectedly today I get a call from the shop and the machine is fixed. There were leaking oil seals on the shaft.....
> 
> So, was talking to the mechanic about the issue and he states "by the way, this is a 3 year old machine". I'm like, what do you mean? I just bought it in November at HDepot.
> He said he ran the serial # (for the warranty and such) and the machine is a 2016-17 year model.
> ...


My new machine that I purchased April 2019 was manufactured in 2014
It was new in box complete with plastic and all the warning labels..it had never been touched
Gives the paint plenty of time to cure...lol


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

WIHD said:


> I'm not quite sure I understand your post.
> 
> what do you mean "why it got this far"?


Over two weeks and 90 posts, could have been done with it weeks ago. Oil seals are easy, and should have had zero effect on the warranty had you done it yourself (well, unless you buggered up something else in the process . . .). No evidence that you even looked at the seal, despite it being an obvious leak candidate . . .

FWIW, warranty should start on date of first sale, so build date should not be a factor. Perhaps not the current model year, but if never run or used, thats still new in my book . . . *BUT* basically "New Old Stock" (NOS) - should have been identified as such with at least a minor price adjustment . . .

You *DID* register the warranty with Ariens, right? That will establish warranty start dte in thier records based on purchase date.


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## BNSFguy (Nov 2, 2019)

As long as Warranty starts from purchase date, not manufactured date, than obviously there's no problem there. I'm kind of surprised HD would have a 3 year old machine sitting around or amongst new machines, and not have it slightly discounted as NOS. But than again, Ariens has both the 2018 B & S motored pro machines and the 2019 LCT motored pro machines on their website and are selling them without discount or stating any "year" difference. If someone goes and buys the 2018 version, pays the full price and it's not disclosed to the buyer that there's a new motor, warrantied in house by Ariens, I could see a buyer possibly being upset. Not great business if it's not disclosed.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

Not stating model years is both traditional and common practice in the small equipment industry. Ariens is not direct selling anything on their website. The prices shown are MSRP which Ariens has the right to set and show on their website. Toro on their website still has the Power Max® HD 1028 OHXE (38802) which is the plastic chute and is discontinued at MSRP of $1899.99 and the Power Max® HD 1028 OHXE (38806) plastic chute at $2099.99. Both MSRP's are the original MSRP's before they were discontinued. If you go to the Toro direct selling site neither of these models are listed for sale. Toro keeps these on their informational site because dealers still have them. 
Ariens factory warranty begins on the date of sale. The machine, once registered on their site is also eligible for Ariens extended warranty if the buyer wishes to purchase it.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

i have to agree with the op here, hd. lowes, snow blowers direct and many others fail to state age of any item they sell, we can't see the VIN nor have the ability to go online and check the real age, than we get slapped in the face when we need a item warranted. 

are most items they have in stock nos over builds? sold in bulk to get them out of factory stock?? 

2009 after a long 6 day power outage, i went to lowes and special ordered a generac 16kw whole house, comes in it's a 08 made in march of 08.not a 09 model with updated controllers as i was lead to believe i would get and had ordered .
2018 from snow blowers direct i ordered a toro 38801 power max get it, again it's a older model a 2016/2017 plus they had sent in the date of sale to toro 3 months before it was sold, 
this year when i came back to nj from sc i was in need of a walk behind mower, grab one made by toro at the local lowes, already 3 years old
it's simply not fair that box stores and online sellers dump nos at us as new models,


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## Clutch Cargo (Dec 27, 2015)

Zavie said:


> Ariens factory warranty begins on the date of sale. The machine, once registered on their site is also eligible for Ariens extended warranty if the buyer wishes to purchase it.


This is absolutely correct. The common term is the In-Service Date (DIS) and it is not connected to when it was manufactured. Even though I purchased my Deluxe 28 used, I still went to the Ariens website and got the DOM (date of manufacture) and the DIS. I also requested that my name be put in the owner information even though the factory warranty had expired. This is so that in case there are any TSBs, recalls etc., I am the owner of record.


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## tj1 (Dec 28, 2019)

Maybe totally off with this comment but did it leak after you started it and was the governor changed?


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

tadawson said:


> Over two weeks and 90 posts, could have been done with it weeks ago. Oil seals are easy, and should have had zero effect on the warranty had you done it yourself (well, unless you buggered up something else in the process . . .). No evidence that you even looked at the seal, despite it being an obvious leak candidate . . .
> 
> FWIW, warranty should start on date of first sale, so build date should not be a factor. Perhaps not the current model year, but if never run or used, thats still new in my book . . . *BUT* basically "New Old Stock" (NOS) - should have been identified as such with at least a minor price adjustment . . .
> 
> You *DID* register the warranty with Ariens, right? That will establish warranty start dte in thier records based on purchase date.


your reply comes across as really condescending.



> You *DID* register the warranty with Ariens, right?


Um....as there was warranty work performed (which has been mentioned in this thread), why would you even ask this question?

You *DID* read the thread right?



> No evidence that you even looked at the seal, despite it being an obvious leak candidate . . .


obvious to whom?

If I said to you _check to see if the shifter shaft seal is leaking on your Harley_, would you know where to look or what to dissemble to find it or even fix it? I am guessing not, esp w/out a manual or torque specs. So your comment is really shortsighted.

If you had really read and processed this thread you'd find the leaking was occurring in sub-zero temperatures and my barns are not heated. Few if anyone I know would tear apart any equipment in those conditions as its easy to FUBAR something....which brings the 2nd point that the machine was literally new (to me) and working on it may void any factory warranty. 

I work on HDs and this is one reason that beyond simple cosmetic items that do not affect engine performance, many wait until the factory warranty is up before doing engine mods or tearing into an engine. (many, not all)

That said....how my post got this far, I have no idea . . . Glad it was trivial, though . . .


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## WIHD (Dec 15, 2019)

Shovel said:


> My new machine that I purchased April 2019 was manufactured in 2014
> It was new in box complete with plastic and all the warning labels..it had never been touched
> Gives the paint plenty of time to cure...lol
> 
> ...


from what I've read on this forum, some machines have underwent design changes (improvements), so you may be missing those improvements in your machine. One example..
Regardless, hope it runs fine for you.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

Closed at OPs request

.


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