# New model Honda snowblower HS720CC ?



## lyle

Hello, I was at my local Honda dealer up here in Canada on the weekend and noticed they have a brand new model, the HS720CC. It has a new engine designation, not the GC, not the GX, but a GS engine. They call it the GS190 and it has a 187cc engine. It is a 7hp single stage "commercial model" and looks to be a step up from the Hs520 and Hs621 models. Unfortunately it being so new, my Honda dealer didn't know much about it. I don't understand why it is actually cheaper to buy than a Hs621 even though it is supposed to be a more "commercial" oriented engine (more durable) and it has more HP? Any thoughts from you folks?


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## [email protected]

The Honda GSV190 engine is similar to the GCV-series (they both ahve a diagonal split-block design) but has some beefed up commercial-grade items, including a cast-iron cylinder sleeve, ball-bearing supported crankshaft, 2-stage air cleaner (for mower applications), etc. Really, think of the GSV as a true commercial version of the GCV, for a lot less cost than the traditional GXV, see?


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## lyle

Hello Robert, thank you for explanations on the different engines. I am still a 
little unclear though? Are you saying the newer GS engine is "better" or an
"upgrade' from the GX series of engines? Thank you for your help.


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## [email protected]

lyle said:


> Hello Robert, thank you for explanations on the different engines. I am still a
> little unclear though? Are you saying the newer GS engine is "better" or an
> "upgrade' from the GX series of engines? Thank you for your help.


GX was, and remains Honda's top-of-the-line engine. It's used on all commercial-grade equipment, including all Honda generators, tillers, trimmers, and 2-stage snowblowers. Like most OHV (overhead valve) designs, it uses a traditional cylinder head, block, and pushrods to drive the valves. With a cast-iron cylinder sleeve, the GX (horizontal shaft) and GXV (vertical shaft) have been a staple of Honda's core engine business for decades.

In the early 90s, Honda realized they could make a less costly engine by having both the vertical and horizontal types share more parts. Thus, the GC/GCV series was born. Still OHV, but also overhead cam that was driven by an automotive-style timing belt. This new design would have the cylinder head and block combined, and uses a split-block shape to allow for easier assembly with more shared parts. Unlike the GX-series, the GC-series would be targeted for residential and non-commericial customers, e.g., mostly premium residential lawn mowers. The GC-series have been in steady production for almost 20 years now. 

Lastly, a beefed-up version of the GC engine was created to offer a lower-cost but still commercial-grade engine. The new GS series would be modeled on the GC, but have a ball-bearing supported crankshaft, cast-iron cylinder sleeve, and 2-stage air cleaner/filter. Currently, the GSV engine is offered on Honda's HRC commercial mower, and now on Honda (Canada's) HS720 single-stage snowblower.

So:
GC = premium residential
GX = commercial
GS = commercial-grade GC


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## lyle

Robert, thank you very much for taking the time to answer my question. You are an absolute wealth of information. Honda USA is very fortunate to have such a knowledgeable gentleman working for them. I can go back to my local Honda dealer and pretend that I know more than them.....


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## superedge88

[email protected] said:


> GX was, and remains Honda's top-of-the-line engine. It's used on all commercial-grade equipment, including all Honda generators, tillers, trimmers, and 2-stage snowblowers. Like most OHV (overhead valve) designs, it uses a traditional cylinder head, block, and pushrods to drive the valves. With a cast-iron cylinder sleeve, the GX (horizontal shaft) and GXV (vertical shaft) have been a staple of Honda's core engine business for decades.
> 
> In the early 90s, Honda realized they could make a less costly engine by having both the vertical and horizontal types share more parts. Thus, the GC/GCV series was born. Still OHV, but also overhead cam that was driven by an automotive-style timing belt. This new design would have the cylinder head and block combined, and uses a split-block shape to allow for easier assembly with more shared parts. Unlike the GX-series, the GC-series would be targeted for residential and non-commericial customers, e.g., mostly premium residential lawn mowers. The GC-series have been in steady production for almost 20 years now.
> 
> Lastly, a beefed-up version of the GC engine was created to offer a lower-cost but still commercial-grade engine. The new GS series would be modeled on the GC, but have a ball-bearing supported crankshaft, cast-iron cylinder sleeve, and 2-stage air cleaner/filter. Currently, the GSV engine is offered on Honda's HRC commercial mower, and now on Honda (Canada's) HS720 single-stage snowblower.
> 
> So:
> GC = premium residential
> GX = commercial
> GS = commercial-grade GC


I found this thread doing a quick search, I am assuming that this model will be similar to the upcoming US model that is coming soon. Adding the chute trajectory control is a premium feature on a single stage!


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## [email protected]

superedge88 said:


> I found this thread doing a quick search, I am assuming that this model will be similar to the upcoming US model that is coming soon. Adding the chute trajectory control is a premium feature on a single stage!


The Honda plant in Swepsonville, NC is currently producing a new single-stage model, the HS720. It has remote controls for chute rotation and discharge angle (see the gray knobs):


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## macky

*GC190 for US market??*



superedge88 said:


> I found this thread doing a quick search, I am assuming that this model will be similar to the upcoming US model that is coming soon. Adding the chute trajectory control is a premium feature on a single stage!


Hi guys, new member here. I'm in the US and looking to buy my first snowblower and am leaning toward the HS720, and also stumbled on this thread (which is awesome by the way). According to Honda's website, the HS720 has the GC190 engine. Is this for the US market only?

Also, looking at the the datasheet for the GC190 (here) and the GS190 (here) they do appear to make the same power.

Any of this data look wrong?


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## [email protected]

macky said:


> Is this for the US market only?
> 
> Also, looking at the the datasheet for the GC190 (here) and the GS190 (here) they do appear to make the same power.
> 
> Any of this data look wrong?


Multiple models/features of the HS720 are available in both Canada and USA. The power/torque ratings on the GC190 and GS190 engines are the same. Proudly cast, machined, and fully assembled in Swepsonville, NC.


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## BobCat520

Robert, thanks for all of the pro info on the Honda. You mentioned a belt driven cam, what is the cam belt replacement interval recommendation for the U.S. sold machines.
Is the belt located where it can be easily serviced ? What type of belt tensioner is used?
(set and lock, hydraulic,etc)
Thanks


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## KpaxFAQ

It's not meant to ever be replaced. Good for life of engine. The GCV is a nice engine for consumer grade stuff but is disposable IMO. I have one on my HRX217 mower and love it but I wouldn't plan on doing anything more then oil changes and the very rare valve clearance inspection/adjustment. I expect a couple decades of service from it in my residential application. Like any small engine any issues with these motors are related to dirty carb, bad gas, etc. They've been around for 20 years as robert pointed out and they just plain work....made in USA as well 

One trick I've always done with my small engines is to dose my gas cans with a little bit of marvel mystery oil before I fill them up every time. I just use the recommended ratio on the MMO container. I've really never had a carb issue ever because it's a great cleaner and upper cylinder lubricant. My auto choke Honda starts first pull every time. 

There's videos on youtube showing you the goods under the valve cover of a gcv engine.


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## [email protected]

BobCat520 said:


> What is the cam belt replacement interval recommendation for the U.S. sold machines.
> Is the belt located where it can be easily serviced ? What type of belt tensioner is used?


The timing belt on the GC/GS (horizontal shaft) engines (as well as the verticals, GCV/GSV) is there for the life of the engine, and does not have a service / replacement interval. 

There is no tensioner; the belt is retained on the crankshaft gear by a thrust washer, and on the camshaft pulley by the narrow passageway through the (diagonally-split) block.


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## BobCat520

Thanks for the reply folks. Robert, after re-reading your earlier posts if I am understanding correctly that the 720 series machined that are sold in the U.S. market do NOT get the beefed up GCV version motor, but rather they are equipped with the residential GC motor?


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## [email protected]

BobCat520 said:


> Thanks for the reply folks. Robert, after re-reading your earlier posts if I am understanding correctly that the 720 series machined that are sold in the U.S. market do NOT get the beefed up GCV version motor, but rather they are equipped with the residential GC motor?


That is correct. The Canada-market models get the commercial GS190, while the USA-market models get the residential GC190. 

FYI Part I: GS/GC are horizontal shaft (snowblowers, tillers, pressure washers, etc.), while GS*V*/GC*V* are the vertical shaft (nearly all lawn mowers). 

FYI Part II: All GC/GS/GCV/GSV engines share about 70% of the same parts (this was Honda's plan when they were launched almost 20 years ago). 

FYI Part III: Verticals outsell horizontals by a _wide_ margin. LOTS of lawn mowers out there!


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## superedge88

[email protected] said:


> That is correct. The Canada-market models get the commercial GS190, while the USA-market models get the residential GC190.
> 
> FYI Part I: GS/GC are horizontal shaft (snowblowers, tillers, pressure washers, etc.), while GS*V*/GC*V* are the vertical shaft (nearly all lawn mowers).
> 
> FYI Part II: All GC/GS/GCV/GSV engines share about 70% of the same parts (this was Honda's plan when they were launched almost 20 years ago).
> 
> FYI Part III: Verticals outsell horizontals by a _wide_ margin. LOTS of lawn mowers out there!


Oh WOW, i misunderstood earlier. I thought that we suddenly were able to buy a Honda commercial single stage in the stores again. This is a terrible outcome for us in the US!! I will not be buying one. I'm not trying to make this personal with you Robert (you seem like a great guy, and I love my Honda blowers!) but Honda is falling on its face (in my opinion) with this new single stage. First the terrible stiff chute control, and now the continued ignoring of the US single stage Snowblower market by not topping the market with a commercial engine when it is offered a stones throw away from us northern states. Honda makes money by being the "obvious" choice for longevity, which is why they should offer the commercial engine in the US, but instead they leave the educated consumer to do compelling spec comparisons with Toro and the like, and is missing on key specs. Bad move Honda. Rant over.


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## KpaxFAQ

I am in part agreement with you but I bet the engine is one of the last things that eventually sidelines one of these blowers. The gcv on my mower is the easiest starting, smoothest small engine Ive ever had. I know a guy who uses a gcv190 in a commercial setting and it has close to 1000 hrs on it with normal maintenance. Id bet that its near the end but thats a ton in residential use...

The stiff chute control....dont get it. I wonder if some grease would help it? My 928 was stiff out of the box and 30 seconds with a can of white lithium grease made a significant different. Its like butter now.


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## [email protected]

First, let me correct my previous posting stating _all_ Canada-market HS720 get the commercial GS190 engine. That's not right.

American Honda is offering three consumer versions of the HS720:
HS720AM: GC190 engine, $699
HS720AA: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, $749
HS720AS: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, electric start, $799

Honda Canada is offering three models, two consumer, one commercial. 
HS720C: GC190 engine, $749
HS720CS: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, $899
HS720CC: GS190 engine (no Snow Director), $999

Next, the engineer tells me the Honda is fully aware of the "showroom stiffness" of the Snow Director control. The fit of the chute-to-auger is tight to ensure a complete seal, and has been typically resolved with application of some lubricant. Whatever countermeasure is applied will probably be implemented at the factory, since the HS720 is to be frequently sold "in the box" to a customer and should not require anything more than some basic assembly of the handlebar.


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## KpaxFAQ

[email protected] said:


> First, let me correct my previous posting stating _all_ Canada-market HS720 get the commercial GS190 engine. That's not right.
> 
> American Honda is offering three consumer versions of the HS720:
> HS720AM: GC190 engine, $699
> HS720AA: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, $749
> HS720AS: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, electric start, $799
> 
> Honda Canada is offering three models, two consumer, one commercial.
> HS720C: GC190 engine, $749
> HS720CS: GC190 engine, Snow Director chute control, $899
> HS720CC: GS190 engine (no Snow Director), $999
> 
> Next, the engineer tells me the Honda is fully aware of the "showroom stiffness" of the Snow Director control. The fit of the chute-to-auger is tight to ensure a complete seal, and has been typically resolved with application of some lubricant. Whatever countermeasure is applied will probably be implemented at the factory, since the HS720 is to be frequently sold "in the box" to a customer and should not require anything more than some basic assembly of the handlebar.


Sounds about right


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## rg0r

After reading all these great posts, it appears to me the Canadian version of 720CC is the one to get? is the 720CC a newly released model? will there be any changes in the near future? or is it a safe purchase?

Thank you ;-)


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## RoyP

Next, the engineer tells me the Honda is fully aware of the "showroom stiffness" of the Snow Director control. The fit of the chute-to-auger is tight to ensure a complete seal, and has been typically resolved with application of some lubricant. Whatever countermeasure is applied will probably be implemented at the factory, since the HS720 is to be frequently sold "in the box" to a customer and should not require anything more than some basic assembly of the handlebar.[/QUOTE]

Robert: I so enjoy reading your post....most informative and right on. Your a large asset to this forum.


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## BobCat520

As I was price shopping for this machine I caught this on hold message on one dealers site. Maybe I'll wait until next season to dive in to one of these.
Honda HS720AM 20 inch snow blower | Wise Sales


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## markd

I'm on hold as well. I was getting ready to get the Honda too, but I'm concerned about the reported vibration issues. Doesn't look like there's going to be much snow this year anyway.  Maybe things will get straightened out in the next production run.


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