# toro's at tractor supply



## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

seems toro is out to try to out sell the others, they are now being sold at tractor supply ,right now they are stocking in summer OPE's and parts, the manager stated come fall they will have snow blowers,

to me that's the total fall of a brand to be selling what was dealer only in box stores 

https://www.tractorsupply.com/landi...-event?cm_sp=Banner-_-Search-_-House+Of+Power


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

not really that surprising. probably make better money selling machines with your brand name on them but not having to pay to keep a store open to sell and service them. really no different than home depot selling toro equipment. its not like there is that many companies making machines just like snowblowers. just a bunch of machines re-branded with other names.


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

Home Depot has been selling them as well.


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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

In this day and age, with all the mom and pop stores closing, it would be foolish of a major equipment manufacturer not to take advantage of corporate venues to sell there merchandise in a broad and wide market.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

agree oneracer

just the brands that were rock solid toro. Jd, ariens, all seem to have lost the quality they did have so they could be sold in bulk at box stores or on line at places like snow blowers direct at full mspr.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

87, we saw that happen with Honda back in the 90's when they first started going to the big box stores and by the early 2000's they put a hurting on a lot of their independent dealers so much that many of them ended up going out of business because of what Honda Corporate did to them.
That happened after Mr Soichiro Honda died and the new management took over and every division went down hill big time in a hurry just so they could boost their sales for the CEO's.
Honda was never like that or ran like that when Mr Honda was around, his way was quality over quantity.
Around the turn of the century is when a lot of the top people at Honda left the company because they did not approve of what Honda Corp was doing and how they were running the show.
Many of the top Execs and field supervisors were either switched to a different division or kind of forced out because they didn't agree with they way the new top guys were trying to run the show.
Honda's quality went downhill big time and they closed all of their regional training facilities and outsourced everything including most of their parts suppliers. A lot of components that were made "In House" and built with quality were then outsourced to the cheapest bidder. They did away with many of their good field Reps and decided to try to do everything online to try to do things as cheap as possible, they could have cared less about the quality going downhill, they just wanted to make their money on the Big Box sales, knowing people would buy their product just by the name on it that said Honda. They figured people would buy their products on the name because the price dropped and they could afford it then. 
People did buy their Products, but they expected the original quality that Honda was noted for, and they did not get that quality on the new products that was available in the old products.
So not only the public got taken advantage of, but so did many of their former employees and all of their independent dealerships that were around for a long time, like ones that started back in the early 60's.


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

oneacer said:


> In this day and age, with all the mom and pop stores closing, it would be foolish of a major equipment manufacturer not to take advantage of corporate venues to sell there merchandise in a broad and wide market.


Indeed..when sales of one manufacturer goes up by doing the big store route .. it cuts into the sales of other manufacturers.. they end up doing the same thing or lose out. 
Why we now have tacos at Burger King. 



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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

ST1100A said:


> 87, we saw that happen with Honda back in the 90's when they first started going to the big box stores and by the early 2000's they put a hurting on a lot of their independent dealers so much that many of them ended up going out of business because of what Honda Corporate did to them.
> That happened after Mr Soichiro Honda died and the new management took over and every division went down hill big time in a hurry just so they could boost their sales for the CEO's.
> Honda was never like that or ran like that when Mr Honda was around, his way was quality over quantity.
> Around the turn of the century is when a lot of the top people at Honda left the company because they did not approve of what Honda Corp was doing and how they were running the show.
> ...


How right you are about Honda. Here is my mower with it's poor cheap design. Three problems are cheap plastic bushings, cheap metal used on shaft, cheap design that actually engages gearbox when pulling back on mower so you have to overcome gearbox internals instead of freewheeling in reverse:


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Zavie, my 27 year old mower is still running good with none of the problems in that video, but my newer mower has the same problem with the wheels not wanting to turn when you back it up, and the video showed the problem.
The older model used ball bearings in the wheel adjusters so you never had that problem like the new "Cheapo" models with the cheap plastic and recycled metal they use now.
That's what happens when they go the "Big Box Route". They could care less about quality anymore. I bet old Mr Soichiro Honda is rolling over in his grave now because of how cheap his company got with their products and quality.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

ST1100A

how true. to me it seems when they go big box they go elcheapo on the machine, lots of made in china, and it's all of them cheaping out for sales numbers over returning customers 

mowers! i have a 2019 self propelled toro high wheel walk behind, kohler motor, made in china ,the machine assembled in mexico good thing it's only for edge trimming as doubt it will last long after the warranty ends . and before it's asked? yes it's one of those never change the oil they brag about


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

87,
The never change the oil engines scare me.
I asked the Briggs Reps about that, and their answer to me was, "We don't expect the engine to last that long because we didn't build it to last more than a season or two". "We have to cut corners and save money somehow to be able to sell at big discount stores".


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## johnwick (Dec 16, 2019)




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## Oneacer (Jan 3, 2011)

@ST11,

Respectfully, for a rep to say that not only would be very surprising, but wonder why he is even in that position.

I highly doubt B&S only build engines to last one or 2 seasons … I mean really, think about it … 

That does not go without saying that many people don't go many years without changing there oil in their snowblower.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

Ugh, it hurts to hear about good-reputation companies making sub-par products. 

All my equipment is somewhat old. My blower is more of my more-recent items, and it's about 19 years old. 

Reading about nice garden tractors, I've read about a number of machines from, say, the 80's or 90's, which sold for, say $4,000+ at the time. That would be *big* money today. And I have to expect that you'd find fewer buyers at that sort of price range today. 

I don't want companies making cheap crap. I'd be pretty pissed if I ponied up for what would hopefully be a good-quality new machine, and it turned out to be disappointing. But as consumers, we are also a factor. If we were all itching to buy new high-end, solidly-built equipment, at whatever that price may be, then the manufacturers would likely be happy to oblige. 

I'll likely keep trying to buy good-quality used stuff, and hope for the best. I'm hoping to find a solid used garden tractor sometime this season to replace my lawn tractor. Still have to decide what kind of price range I'm willing to go to, however


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

oneacer said:


> @ST11,
> 
> Respectfully, for a rep to say that not only would be very surprising, but wonder why he is even in that position.
> 
> ...


Oneacer, At least the rep was honest about the engine, that is very rare today for people to be honest anymore.
Our Rep is an "Old Timer" who has been in the industry for 4 decades and knows our customer base are also a bunch of "Old Timers" who expect nothing but quality and longevity.
You are correct about customers never changing oil and doing periodic maintenance when they are supposed to, and that was a big reason Briggs designed and built those engines, they built them cheap knowing people were just going to blow them up by not maintaining them so they would not be expensive to replace, as we are living in a "Throw away" society in today's world.
Now a young Rep with a college degree in marketing and "B.S.ing" would never say that or tell the truth about things so he could make his money. I am sure our Rep is disgusted about his company building a cheap product like that, something that will hurt his company's reputation in the long run.
I give our Rep credit for being honest, and so does many of our customers that he steered away from those power units. He is much more into longevity of the power units as our customers are.
We deal with many commercial users more so than the Big Box customers, that's where we make our money more than the "Cheapo Store" buyer.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

AMEN to that post brother ST1100A,

we suffer the very same issues in our shop. but we don't have a honest rep. more like that bsing kid with his or her 4 year deg .

my issue in posting was we now have another outlet selling toro ,(what we sell or what we were selling ) within 5 miles by air around us , we have 2 tractor supply stores and a home depot. plus 3 other ope shops also selling toro. plus for other brands tractor supply now sells a lowes, 

go out to 15 miles around, 4 tractor supply, 5 home depot, 4 lowes, and countless ope, of which 2 are more like walking into a large car dealer 1 stop shop, how can the mom and pop repair/sales shop's keep up with box stores? we can't. just the floor plan cuts into our bottom end just paying the interest on whats sitting.

another factor playing in is,there is 4 grades of machines like other things today,
home owner, soso grade 1, the super cheap throw away, consumer hd grade 2 , heavy duty a soso grade 3 and commercial top of the line. grade 4
engines are the same. grade 1 last a few years on a throw away machine, grade 2 may last 10 years while a grade 3 commercial could run 20 years

and even commercial brands like scag cut corners, like a close friend who went out and got a scag zero turn last summer. 
(OH it's got a hd hydro lifter kohler v twin on it, ) i had to wake him up to dealer bull. it has a KT 7000 series kohler is not a command Cv series that does have hydro lifters and that has a KT you need to adjust the valves,his jaw hit the floor,


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

ST1100A said:


> Zavie, my 27 year old mower is still running good with none of the problems in that video, but my newer mower has the same problem with the wheels not wanting to turn when you back it up, and the video showed the problem.
> The older model used ball bearings in the wheel adjusters so you never had that problem like the new "Cheapo" models with the cheap plastic and recycled metal they use now.
> That's what happens when they go the "Big Box Route". They could care less about quality anymore. I bet old Mr Soichiro Honda is rolling over in his grave now because of how cheap his company got with their products and quality.


Big box route for sure. That's why Home Depot has them displayed up high so you can't get behind them and see if you really like it. Wonder why Honda came out with the GCV200 anyway? Was it pressure from Home Depot to "make a fuss" over the new engine? Is the GCV200 necessary over the GCV190? Seems odd that they would do that.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Zavie said:


> Big box route for sure. That's why Home Depot has them displayed up high so you can't get behind them and see if you really like it. Wonder why Honda came out with the GCV200 anyway? Was it pressure from Home Depot to "make a fuss" over the new engine? Is the GCV200 necessary over the GCV190? Seems odd that they would do that.


Everybody is going with "The Bigger The Better" routine now.
They figured a bigger engine to keep up with the other manufacturers.
You are correct about them placing them up high where you can't really get to see and feel them plus really look them over before you buy them.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

Zavie said:


> Big box route for sure. That's why Home Depot has them displayed up high so you can't get behind them and see if you really like it. Wonder why Honda came out with the GCV200 anyway? Was it pressure from Home Depot to "make a fuss" over the new engine? Is the GCV200 necessary over the GCV190? Seems odd that they would do that.


hope some of this helps zavie 

https://powerequipment.honda.com/lawn-mowers/gcv200


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

i don't mind bigger or better engines on machines. i dropped a honda GCV160 engine on my mower to replace the old flathead 3.5 engine. i have no problem upgrading a nice older machine for myself. the mower i use for abusing has a 173cc powermore engine. i will probably keep running older rebuilt equipment unless they make something newer and nicer. the biggest issue is usually just the cheap rotten decks. good engines are a dime a dozen but clean decks are not as common.


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## foggysail (Feb 21, 2015)

Zavie said:


> How right you are about Honda. Here is my mower with it's poor cheap design. Three problems are *cheap plastic bushings,* cheap metal used on shaft, cheap design that actually engages gearbox when pulling back on mower so you have to overcome gearbox internals instead of freewheeling in reverse:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubnpTirPBu4



YEAH.... but Honda is not alone. And cheap plastic bushings/bearings are the reasons I elected to pay more $$$ for an Ariens 28 PRO. Just got fed up with that crap! OK,OK.......yes I know! Someone is going to post about his 45 year old something with plastic bushings.bearings telling it is still going strong while most are not. There is NO free lunch


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

foggy
the thread has already shifted side ways from point of sales to fixing lawn mowers which is right around the corner as it is.


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## Kiss4aFrog (Nov 3, 2013)

Let's try to stick a little closer to: Toro Snowblowers > Toro's at tractor supply

For lawnmowers and their blades, discussions are more appropriate at - - > http://www.mylawnmowerforum.com/

.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

For those who must shop at TSC, the addition of Toro will add a bit of class and quality to the overall assortment of their power equipment IMHO.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

my starting this thread was due to having to deal with more sales competition for a brand we were selling, that's ending, no more toro , we can't com-peat with online and box store sales and the 5 other ope shops with in a 15 mile radius by air . 

also any one checking out tractor supply will also see they are adding the full husqvarna line of mowers, while in the past they went back and forth with husky and jonserred chain saws ,the new ope machines lined up in side was like a car dealer line up of lawn care brands, cheap to good. look online you see buy on line pick up at store .

Ok summer and lawn care is very near, so i personally wouldn't expect them to line up snow blowers right now, only try to dump remaining cub blowers which they seem to be doing . surly come sept we will see the red,orange and yellow snow blowers lined up out side just like at home depot and lowes.

our many loved mom and pop shops that have treated so many with love and care for all so long are seemingly being forced out in favor of large number sales .


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## Shovel (Mar 26, 2019)

Zavie said:


> For those who must shop at TSC, the addition of Toro will add a bit of class and quality to the overall assortment of their power equipment IMHO.


It's a long drive for me to the nearest one.
There is a Lowe's not far away that started selling Husqvarna snow blowers..Shops here might have an occasional single stage..But it's the box stores that have the two stages...Most people use a plow here..Truck with a plow..four wheelers and tractors are common.
The shops missed out by not carrying snowblowers here.



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## niteshft (Nov 17, 2018)

I'm not saying this is the case here, I haven't even seen it. But, my experience has been that "Box Stores", have a very different, (cheaper made), model then what you get at the dealer. My gas cap formed a crack and I couldn't find a replacement because the "Box Store", didn't sell that model anymore. The dealer said he couldn't locate anything for the model number.

Buying at the "Box Store" creates risks.


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## groomerz (Feb 7, 2015)

87powershiftx2 said:


> my starting this thread was due to having to deal with more sales competition for a brand we were selling, that's ending, no more toro , we can't com-peat with online and box store sales and the 5 other ope shops with in a 15 mile radius by air .
> 
> 
> 
> ...




It is all about price now with most consumers. They don’t care about advantage of buying at a ope shop. I think some of this has occurred because of some ope shops past treatment of homeowners during the boom days when they were the only source of name brands . Some ope shops prioritized commercial repairs over homeowner repairs even though equipment was purchased there. It was the big picture of commercial is my bread and butter. Homeowners not so much. Can’t have it both ways. Big box saw the homeowner opportunity and took it and now some ope are realizing that they are partly to blame by not prioritizing repairs to homeowners purchased machines. The only way ope can beat big box is customer service and quick repairs. Imo


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

My nearest TSC is selling the Cub Cadet 2X 24 in. Two-Stage Snow Thrower, 31AM5CVR709 For $764.99.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

OK GUYS
i have asked the mods to close this one down,

as to ope shop time backup's, we don't put lawn care ahead in all cases, the real reason is we have to do all of the warranty work on machines sold in the box stores , on top of the few a year we sell, box stores only sell, they half A assemble, they don't repair . all that work gets dumped on us ope shops under contract with the many manufacturers of ope items to repair ,


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## kgloff (Oct 13, 2017)

Is there a difference between the same model at the big box and the dealer. I was under the impression for the same model they were the same. Is an ariens deluxe 24 model the same at a big box and a dealer?


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