# Grrrrh - Honda HS720 vs. Block Heater Cord



## CalgaryPT (Dec 7, 2016)

I'm pretty anal when it comes to bylaws. Guess I figure if I follow them others should too. This AM when clearing about 4" worth I encountered my neighbour's block heather cord across the sidewalk hidden under the snow to his truck. The guy is a renter, and I notice that renters tend to care less about stuff like this than owners.

Also, the GFI it was plugged into is obviously faulty. I saw electrical sparks long before the GFI kicked in. No way could I get that cord out. I just cut it apart with wire cutters and tossed it back on his lawn. It also damaged my new set of rubber augers. Last time I'll be a nice guy and do his sidewalk going forward.

He was sleeping at the time and I saw him later looking at the pieces of cord all over his lawn. He looked mad. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and assuming he was mad at himself. Because if he comes over here with a tale of woe, it's going to get ugly.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

You have to figure what the by-laws are, was the neighbor allowed to do what he did?
Were you doing a "Favor" to clear the side-walk for other people?
Was it on your property where the cord was at?
There are a lot of questions with that situation.
You could have been doing a favor for others and got the cord stuck in your machine - unfortunate problem that is bound to happen, like getting a buried newspaper jammed in the snowblower. - Nothing can be done about that. - Nobody's fault
The cord was not supposed to be there - His fault.
Either way, it sucks when that happens.
That is one of the "Draw-backs" of living in a housing/condo/apartment complexes/developments or rental properties. Too many people too close together.
Sounds like it wasn't plugged into a GFCI outlet if you saw sparks before the circuit breaker blew, it was probably replaced with a regular outlet.


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## CalgaryPT (Dec 7, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> You have to figure what the by-laws are, was the neighbor allowed to do what he did?
> Were you doing a "Favor" to clear the side-walk for other people?
> Was it on your property where the cord was at?
> There are a lot of questions with that situation.
> ...


I worked for the municipality for 30 years as a senior manager. Not really any questions here—cut and dry (at least here and in most CND municipalities). Lots of court decisions to back it up. I actually helped write multiple bylaws related to this stuff over my career before I retired.

It's illegal to leave anything across a roadway under our Streets Bylaw. 
A sidewalk is a legal part of the roadway. You cannot even drape a cord or other object in the air (let alone on the ground) using a tree or a pole to hold it across a sidewalk.
There is no "his" property or "my" property with respect to sidewalks (part of the roadway). The sidewalk is municipal (public) property including utility rights of way (ROW) and pocket easements inside a 1 metre setback from the roadway. The sidewalk in front of your property isn't yours. But you are legally responsible to maintain it.
If someone even tripped on such a cord the homeowner's/renter's insurance would not cover liability as they are in violation of the Streets Bylaw by placing the cord there. Almost all insurance policies contain a exemption if the homeowner is in violation of local ordinance when the accident occurred.
Operation of motorized snow removal equipment on sidewalks is exempt under our Community Standards Bylaw for the immediate 48 hours after a snowfall; this is one way to facilitate "snow angel" (favour as you call it) removal.

Things might be drastically different elsewhere, but here it is illegal to leave a cord or anything across a sidewalk. 

I think you are right. It was plugged in to a regular outlet, probably in the garage as all outside outlets here are required to be GFIs by code.


It's been a tough week for my Honda. First a bent auger plate, then this. I need spring.


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## RedOctobyr (Mar 2, 2014)

That's a bummer, sorry. Even worse that it damaged the new paddles. Taking the time to untangle everything is bad enough, but also chewing up new parts is an extra twist of the knife. 

I've been fortunate that when I've helped out neighbors, I haven't yet sucked anything into the machine. But it always makes me kinda nervous. I know what's in my driveway (nothing), but I don't know what may be on their property.


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## melson (Feb 9, 2015)

I have learned, the hard way, no good deed goes unpunished.


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## CalgaryPT (Dec 7, 2016)

RedOctobyr said:


> That's a bummer, sorry. Even worse that it damaged the new paddles. Taking the time to untangle everything is bad enough, but also chewing up new parts is an extra twist of the knife.
> 
> I've been fortunate that when I've helped out neighbors, I haven't yet sucked anything into the machine. But it always makes me kinda nervous. I know what's in my driveway (nothing), but I don't know what may be on their property.


Agreed. I never do anyone's driveway unless they ask and I know they don't leave stuff out that could get caught. I guess doing 13 properties it was bound to happen. I'm over it now :crying: but that was a shocker...literally.

-33C w/ wind chill here now, so I'll cry about that next.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

did you talk to him and say you were trying to do him a favor? is this something you always do? that is do that sidewalk?

how much is a new cord? 

have had my share of problems with neighbors and it has been better for me anyway to find a happy solution . ( in most cases )


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Calgary,
That is a very good post you wrote for a lot of people who don't understand a lot of the laws concerning sidewalks.
I am glad you wrote that to help explain it to them.
Municipal and private developments are pretty much the same laws.
In my area you are responsible for any damage and repairs to a sidewalk in front of your property and have to pay for the maintenance and repair of them if they become damaged. You also have to keep them clear of snow,ice and anything else, plus you can also be sued in court if another person trips or gets hurt on the sidewalk in front of your own property, even if you did nothing wrong to cause them to fall and get injured.
The property owner is also responsible for paying the property taxes on the land where the sidewalk is located.
That is a reason a lot of people in my area don't want sidewalks in front of their property, but they have to have them according to the municipality they live in, sidewalks and curbing that the property owner has to pay for installation and repairs.
Some people are even afraid to shovel their neighbor's sidewalk in front of their homes in fear of being part of a liability suit if a stranger falls on the sidewalk, that's a shame, they try to help others out and somebody is looking for a "Free Pay-check" by slipping and falling on purpose, that happens a lot around here.
It only hurts the "Good Samaritan" who is trying to help out other people, that's a shame.


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## CalgaryPT (Dec 7, 2016)

ST1100A said:


> ...
> Some people are even afraid to shovel their neighbor's sidewalk in front of their homes in fear of being part of a liability suit if a stranger falls on the sidewalk, that's a shame, they try to help others out and somebody is looking for a "Free Pay-check" by slipping and falling on purpose, that happens a lot around here.
> It only hurts the "Good Samaritan" who is trying to help out other people, that's a shame.


The USA is more litigious than Canada, but as a general rule you can't be sued here if you are a volunteer/snow angel. I've done some other posts about this, but in a nutshell I ditched my plan to set up a business and do snow removal in my retirement because of the liability insurance required (about $1200/month + commercial vehicle insurance). At the time I was doing 26 properties, but have since pared it down to 13 (all as a snow angel).

The moment you accept compensation, that establishes a legal contract (oral or written). What most homeowners don't realize is that hiring a contractor this way nullifies their homeowner policy for liability. This means if you as a contractor do a poor job (in Calgary you cannot "clause out" ice removal in a contract and just do snow blowing—you must also remove ice), you are on the hook. If someone trips/slips, etc., liability is on the _contractor_, not the _homeowner_. That is why residential contractors take pics of the job they do. If, as a contractor, you fail to carry insurance, the homeowner will likely be "third partied" in the lawsuit. That means you as homeowner can also be sued. In such cases the homeowner typically recoups the settlement by then suing the contractor who was negligent by not carrying insurance. It gets nasty fast.

Calgary has some bylaws such as Community Standards bylaw that encourage snow angel removal and a marketing policy to actively promote it for seniors in your neighbourhood. We even used to have a "Adopt a Pathway" program where you pledged to do removal on walking pathways in parks, etc. But that was shut down by the municipal unions, sadly. 

Without money changing hands, there is no contract and insurance companies typically cover liability for the homeowner if someone slips on a sidewalk that was cleared (or even just blown) by a snow angel. There are of course a few exceptions—such as the neighbourhood kid who is too young to enter into a legally binding contract. In Calgary the legal government (corporation) is exempt from its own bylaws. This means they can't be sued for not clearing its own sidewalks. This responsibility is passed onto to homeowners (via the Municipal Government Act and taxes), and thus would be problematic if they didn't enforce safety. Hence the creation of bylaws to prohibit cords across sidewalks, overland drainage that results in ice patches, DIY curb cuts and "ramps" attached to the sidewalk to assist vehicles crossing into driveways.

An interesting implication of this is the emergence of smartphone apps where you can sign up to clear sidewalks in your immediate area as defined by GPS. You join up, mark your location and "accept" a snow clearing job in your area. You then do the job and get paid via the app, like Uber. Problem is, if you read the fine print, the company hosting the app won't indemnify you in the event of an accident. This includes everything from slips and falls, to you cutting up a homeowner's siding with a serrated auger on a two stage machine. God help you if Fido or little Billy Oblivious playing in the driveway slips into your machine. I thought about joining one of these apps/website, but ran away fast when they refused to answer my questions about indemnification and liability insurance (which they don't carry).

Having said all this, many a neighbour brings me cookies and cakes for my work. I can't see a judge deeming this as problematic. My doctor does though.

I'm past the whole cord thing now, and this post has helped. So thanks everyone here. I have a bunch of extra winter cords and will likely give one to my neighbour just to be nice, even though technically he should be wearing the badge of shame. Life's too short to be a southern orifice.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

CalgaryPT said:


> The USA is more litigious than Canada, but as a general rule you can't be sued here if you are a volunteer/snow angel. I've done some other posts about this, but in a nutshell I ditched my plan to set up a business and do snow removal in my retirement because of the liability insurance required (about $1200/month + commercial vehicle insurance). At the time I was doing 26 properties, but have since pared it down to 13 (all as a snow angel).
> 
> The moment you accept compensation, that establishes a legal contract (oral or written). What most homeowners don't realize is that hiring a contractor this way nullifies their homeowner policy for liability. This means if you as a contractor do a poor job (and in Calgary you cannot "clause out" ice removal in a contract and just do snow blowing—you must also remove ice). If someone trips/slips, etc., liability is on the _contractor_, not the _homeowner_. That is why residential contractors take pics of the job they do. If, as a contractor, you fail to carry insurance, the homeowner will likely be "third partied" in the lawsuit. That means you as homeowner can also be sued. In such cases the homeowner typically recoups the settlement by then suing the contractor who was negligent by not carrying insurance. It gets nasty fast.
> 
> ...


holy mackeral!!!!!

you need a lawyer following you around nowadays.
not worth it. 
snow angel? does that mean you do these 13 properties for free?
you are a better man than me.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

that sucks. i try to watch out for stuff like that or news papers or anything that could damage my machine while it is warmer out but doesn't always work. i usually at least roll my block heater cord up and hang it on my vehicle mirror when it is not in use just so i know where it is when the snow flies. even when i use it i try to keep it off the ground so i know where it is when snow blowing. it should be pretty common sense not to leave it accross a sidewalk. it will get damaged whether it is you with the snowblower or the town with a plow. i know i use to work in the warehouse part of the weekend work was plugging trucks in for work Monday morning. the company tried plugging trucks in out in the lot and quickly realized it just down't work. cords would get destroyed and we eventually just started having to park them as close to the build as possible so the plows or cars driving through the lot couldn't destroy them.


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## CalgaryPT (Dec 7, 2016)

orangputeh said:


> holy mackeral!!!!!
> 
> you need a lawyer following you around nowadays.
> not worth it.
> ...


Actually pretty simple: 
Snow angel/good samaritan/volunteer w/ no compensation = you're safe
Contractor/accept compensation = need your own insurance

Yes, I do 13 properties for free. It started 15 years ago when my wife slipped on someone's walk and broke two ribs and suffered a concussion. I started blowing the path she walks with our dog, and it just morphed. We have a lot of single moms, elderly people and working couples with no time on their hands to do walks. I retired early and was bored. It's nice to help people when you get older and can sit out the rat race. I'm super fortunate and know it


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