# 2 stage or 3 stage



## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

Hello! I am new to this forum. I have never ever used a snowblower. I went through the FAQ and found a bit of useful info, but now I just have a question.

I have a straight driveway, about 100 feet. ALL GRAVEL. If I were to get a snowblower I would do the sidewalk that goes in front of the house which is concrete. ( I live in a tri-plex apartment type setup, I am in the back so I drive the "furthest" and deal with the driveway)

The main reason why I would like to purchase a snowblower is at the end of the driveway is the wonderfully packed pile of snow left from the snowplows :smile2: 
This pile can sometimes get up to my stomach in height and I am 6'. I drive a truck but my wife drives a very low Ford Fusion. I usually don't mind shoveling the driveway except for the very end. It usually just gets driven over a bunch of times and is a deep thick mess.

So, now more on to the question... I am wondering If I should go with a 2 stage or 3 stage to plow thru that pile on the end... I have been looking at 3 stages only because I don't really mind spending around 1500+ on this snowblower as I expect it to last a while, and I have always been that way. If I'm going to spend the money might as well get the best of the best even if I don't have use right away Ill sure be happy when the time comes. But would a 2 stage do just fine and should I just go with that? Or, spend the extra money on tracks and power steering and bells and whistles... I don't know.. 

Sorry if this post is all over the place lol... Thank you in advance for all feedback/opinions!


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## Jae0 (Jan 6, 2017)

For gravel, a 2-stage track machine like an Ariens or Honda would be best (or a wheel/track hybrid like Ariens RapidTrak). That way you can adjust the bucket height and leave the gravel where it belongs. In my reading, the 3-stage seems to be more of a marketing gimmick than a true value-add. “If 2 stages are good, 3 must be better!”


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

Honda HSS1332


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## JLawrence08648 (Jan 15, 2017)

There are comments on here from complaining 3 Stage users.


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

*snow blower needs*

Hello Blake welcome to the forum,

SO am I correct in assuming your co tenants will not help with the purchase or are you the property owner????

Have you been shopping for snow blowers or are you beginning your search?? how close to the Canadian border are you or are you located in Canada? 

The wider the cut the more power and the more reserve power you have to use 10 years down the road. 
Having a snow blower with longer skis is a must for gravel and grass. You can purchase longer skis through the forum here.

You can spend a lot of good money on a bad snow blower-ask me I know how this is done personally.
I have two older 2 cycle toro snow pups that make my 2 stage john deere 44 inch snow blower cry in shame.

Have you asked your neighbors what they use and are they happy with the local dealers service?
How much time do you have to clear snow everyday if you get buried every few days or more often???

Please fill out the rest of your information when you have time. It is not because we are nosey we just want to know where you are as we may have a member that could help you. 

The three stages are not what they are cracked up to be as they plug, the cross augers are thin and the shear pins break to often and they are a (*&^%$^&* to change with cold bare hands. The third stage snow breaking propeller is nothing more than a thin sheet metal hindrance in areas with wide temperature changes and not ice friendly.

What you refer to as the pile at the end of the driveway is what many of us affectionately refer to as the "THE END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER" and feeding the moat monsters in the ditch with its remains is a hobby of mine.

1. you need weight to create adhesion to create traction to cut into the snowpack and THE END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER. if your municipality uses salt that means they use too much salt rathe than sand and it is one more thing to not thank them for as it makes the snowpack heavier and freezes thicker during the overnight periods.

2. the EPA has made the small gas engines work harder with smaller fuel jets and they should be whipped with wet snow noodles. Changing them is not hard or expensive to enable you to have better high idle. torque. 

3. The more horsepower you have the more high end torque you will have to deliver to the snow blower and its drive train. That also means that you will have more reserve power when you need to dispose the of the END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER and feed the moat monsters as they get pretty hungry.

4. the more money you spend on horsepower the better off you will be 5-10 years down the road as you will be older and snow removal will be much less of a chore.

5. If you expect the spousal unit to clear snow having electroc start and steering brakes are a must-what do I know-but I have seen thin tall beautiful Japanese woman ride herd over the older Yamaha 1070s with no steering brakes. 

6. even the wheeled 1428 and 1432 Toro OXE are good machines to look at as they have electric and manual start and they have the patented TORO anti clog feature that meters the snow into the impeller housing. These units have the air cooled 14 horsepower engines. 
a. how much room do you have to store it during the snow season? 
b. the same question goes for the off season too
c. can you keep it in an area that is at least out of the weather and can you reach it with an extension cord to power the 110 volt starter?
d. can you wash it off with warm water between uses or at least use a space heater melt off the ice and snow to make the snow blower hot to the touch and in doing so you know the salt was baked off from the heat. 

Once you purchase the right size snow mule with the most horsepower the work load will not faze it in the least.

7. you have time to look now so do it slowly and just take your time and do not take a salesman's word as gospel as commissions are what they are after. If this person refuses to sell a snow blower to you know that he is only interested in selling you the right snow blower for your needs as he knows that you need power and that is the number one concern for the homeowner. 

We only want to help you not get in your way.


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## Dauntae (Nov 10, 2016)

Leon’s has a bit of a long post but he has some great points, never tried one but have heard from a few sources that the 3 stage are not that great, A tracked machine would be good only because they can hold the bucket up higher so not to dig into the gravel BUT are much over your budget for the quality ones, For $1500 I would look at the Ariens and as said use longer aftermarket skids so they don’t dig into the gravel.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

leonz said:


> Hello Blake welcome to the forum,
> 
> SO am I correct in assuming your co tenants will not help with the purchase or are you the property owner????
> 
> ...


Hello! Some forums I know you can hide all of what the previous user wrote while still quoting.. cant figure it out here so sorry if this thread gets a little bit messy. 

You are correct about the Co-Tenants not chipping in. Only one other parks on the driveway.. kind of hard to explain. Maybe a paint photo will be involved here soon. I have filled out more of my profile info. I live in the southern end of Minnesota! I am currently 24, married and have a child coming in hopefully under 9 days!!! I work in a factory producing fireplaces.. I believe last year we made over 150,000 fireplaces. Wife is a nurse. 

Now, I am looking into purchasing a snowblower for the sake of wanting one lol. I have no real reason besides I like the idea of having one. I enjoy shoveling to be honest... just the erm "THE END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER" is a pain. Last winter it was alright because I would just smash thru it in my trusty '99 F-150 and my wife would follow in a decent ride height cobalt. Now, this year she will be going about it in a very VERY low Ford Fusion... so I am just looking for something that will demolish the Driveway Monster with little to no effort. 

I am in the very beginning stages of looking at snowblowers. I was honestly looking at ATVs with plows at first but living in town I wouldn't get an extreme amount of use out of it and my only difficult task is the end of the driveway. 

I was looking at three-stage snowblowers cause what I briefly read they are able to move snow a lot faster. I am somewhat capable of fixing my own things but if they are truly a pain I would rather avoid it, I was just simply looking for the DEWALT of snowblowers...

I don't think I will be purchasing anything till we get a tad bit closer. I read that October 1st is when the new models roll out and they have sales sometimes on them even. 


I would like to get up and snowblow about an hour before work starts so that the wife can get out aswell. We both start work around 6:00 AM and I usually get home about an hour before her so I would then snowblow once more making sure she can get back in. The snowblower would be stored in our garage. Our unit comes with an attached two-car garage which is heated so that's where it would spend its life when not outside tearing up the snow. 

I do not NEED electric start but it's one of those things that I would just rather have. I have plenty of access points to hook it up so I don't believe that would be an issue. Heated handles seem like a gimmick but I assume most models will have it. Tracks would be nice because I have read that units that have tracks are able to be lifted or something to make clearance for the gravel. The entire driveway is gravel except for about a two-car spot located right outside our garage doors. I would like to also go along the sidewalk tho while I'm out there for fun. 

I probably missed some of your questions so I apologize but I would love to answer more as you think of them. Like you also said I have a good amount of time before I need one and I'm really looking for suggestions // tips. I will be keeping an eye out for the new models rolling out near October. I would like to stay away from used models only because I don't want to have to worry about issues right away. 

Thank you very much for the responses!


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## micah68kj (Oct 8, 2011)

Welcome to SBF, Blake.
Whatever blower you choose (avoid any 3 stage) be sure you attack the 
End of driveway monster ASAP. Don't give it time to freeze or solidify. The sooner you attack it the easier it will move.
Honda, Toro, Ariens Etc are all good machines. There are many out there that are not worth buying. Here is a link to a thread that discusses offshore blowers (chinese built) and other brand names besides the brands mentioned above.
https://www.snowblowerforum.com/for...scussion/1364-made-usa-versus-made-china.html


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

*snow etc.*

OK, stupid question time; who cleans the driveway and sidewalk when you do not do it????????????????
There is a problem with liability on your part if you have to deal with a landlord or condominium board as tenancy does not normally require the tenant to maintain the property.

If it is a rental property the landlord should be clearing the snow not you. If they are not, not why not? if not they are required to maintain the property in most states as far as I know; If you have a landlord you may end up having to deal with/pay for damage to the property that the landlord could blame you for.

(trust me when I say the electric start will prevent the engine from kicking back on you and causing you a lot of shoulder pain from a stretching injury)

(the larger honda and Yamaha track drive units have the advantage of climbing stairs if the rise and run is not too steep or if ramps are used)

(You need weight and or good traction in the snow mule to enable the quick disposal of the frozen END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER to feed the moat monsters. 

(As of right now you will be spending more than your stated amount as you need a snowblower with power and large tires and snow chains. The anticlog feature of the larger toros will only help you) 

(If you have heated handles your hands will not become cold and reduce the blood flow to your fingers; good gloves are OK but they are no comparison to heated handles not all brands have them)


Don't expect to clear "your" snow and "END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER" in an hour without a high power machine as a smaller one will be overwhelmed if you are dealing with a limited timespan to clear snow.

You need to check with your insurer about this as you could/can/will be held liable UNLESS you are the landlord for the property. Even if your home is a condo you are only responsible for the area inside your homes living space as that is all you physically own.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

leonz said:


> OK, stupid question time; who cleans the driveway and sidewalk when you do not do it????????????????
> There is a problem with liability on your part if you have to deal with a landlord or condominium board as tenancy does not normally require the tenant to maintain the property.
> 
> If it is a rental property the landlord should be clearing the snow not you. If they are not, not why not? if not they are required to maintain the property in most states as far as I know; If you have a landlord you may end up having to deal with/pay for damage to the property that the landlord could blame you for.
> ...



The driveway will get cleared after it is too late. Usually will come by if I text him. Usually, we run into the problem at the end of the driveway at around 5:30 AM when we leave for work. I suppose that could be addressed but just has never gotten cleared that early. Sidewalk doesn't usually get cleared often... But the landlord is the one who does deal with this stuff.. when he does.

As for like me or other tenants doing things besides the landlord, another tenant mows the lawn for 75$ off the rent every month. If we were to not do it he would come and do it but he's a super laid back guy. I've been renting from him for a little over 4 years now. I suppose there are laws but I don't see him having an issue but will definitely be mentioned next time I bring out rent.


I would rather have electric start as well, I am lazy and I don't want to throw out my shoulder lol. 

For steepness, the area being cleared is all flat except for a small portion in front of our garage, but it is very small incline... barely anything at all.

I am honestly thinking about drawing out the driveway for helping see the area. I measured the main stretch and it came out to 144'. 

For the money being spent it really isn't an issue... I don't mean that as in I'm rich but I'd rather get something that is strong and durable and will last a long time. I don't think I want to spend $3000 on one but I am willing to go higher than $1500. 

One thing I would like to mention I read somewhere that the units with tracks are hard to move when not turned on... not sure if that is true or not but If it is that might be an issue. I would like to be able to push the unit out of the garage before starting it for the majority of the time due to the new baby on the way that will be doing a lot of sleeping around this time.

I guess you say the heated handles are nice so I'll take your word on that I just didn't expect it to be very effective.

For the time crunch trying to clear the driveway. It would only be an hour time frame if it's before work and when I'm going out there to clear at that time my plan was to just go straight towards the end clear it and make my way back. If I have extra time I would then clear more, but for the most part I will clear the area after work every day like I did last year and so the only issue is usually from the lovely snowplows..


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

buy too cheap , buy twice


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

orangputeh said:


> buy too cheap , buy twice


Or, as my Dad used to say, "Buy a quality tool and you'll pay for it once; buy a cheap tool and you'll pay for it the rest of your life."


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

tabora said:


> Or, as my Dad used to say, "Buy a quality tool and you'll pay for it once; buy a cheap tool and you'll pay for it the rest of your life."


i have learned this lesson the hard way more than once even though my Dad also tried to teach me to buy quality.

but as a kid you think you know more than your parents. I try to teach my children this , who are all grown , and for a couple of them it goes in one ear and out the other.


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

Hello and good evening Blake,

You have come at the right time to deal with this. 

I don't know what to tell you about your landlord but buying an hour of your attorneys time is a must here as one flying rock can break a window with very little effort and one of your neighbors will not be happy duck taping cardboard to a window or coming home to a broken window that you may not be aware of if it happens. 

Case in point was me when my absentee landlord neighbor bough the 64 acres behind me and hired a forestry mower mounted on a front end loader and it picked up a small rock and broke a garage window 200 feet from where the logger was mowing in 64 acre pasture. 

My absentee neighbor is a ……………………. so I just covered the window with a sheet of plexiglass to seal it up.

You need power and weight so looking at the three largest Toro OXE 2 stage snow blowers with chains is something you need to do as your wife may end up clearing the driveway if you are laid up and electric start and steering brakes are a must for your wife to clear the snow and feed the moat monsters with the END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER. 

But you need to spend time with an attorney as you will be liable for damages if something happens to a car or a window or someone slips on ice SO, PLEASE DO YOUR LEGAL LIABILITY HOMEWORK BEFORE YOU GO ANY FURTHER. 
If you can get him to sign a snow removal contract and absolve you of any liability in snow removal in the contract, great, you will be able to buy a Toro 1428 OXE with steering brakes, heated handles, snow chains and the snow cab. Your wife will really like the toro snow cab by the way.


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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

The big Toro's are nice

.


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## trellis (Mar 14, 2018)

Take a look at the center auger of the 3 stage units ( they call it the accelerator ). That accelerator was primarily designed to push the snow cut by the side augers back to the impeller. It doesn’t have enough of an angle to cut into the heavy snow at the end of driveway piles. You need “normal” augers that can cut into that dense snow. I had a 3-stage for awhile and when I backed up from a snow pile you can see the imprint of the center auger, it stops the blower from moving forward. A 3-stage works fine in perfect snow, just not dense snow piles. 

I went with an Ariens SHO 24, and it handles the end of driveway much better. And I’m sure the previously mentioned Toro’s would also work as well. I liked the larger engine in the Ariens. I’ve cut preset notches in my skids because I also have flat and gravel areas to deal with, and it makes changing the skid height easier. A Honda track blower would make this a non-issue, but for more $$.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

To really throw all of this off... the wife wants a four-wheeler with a plow rather than a snowblower... there are many more cons vs pros with a four-wheeler imo.. and the one she shared with me is $3000... that could get a nice snowblower...


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

Hello Blake,

You should remind your lovely wife that she will run out of room to stack snow and it will freeze solid by the way.

If you have 3 feet of snow in the driveway to get rid of she will no have anywhere to put it let alone throw it by hand and your neighbors are in no hurry to do any of the work.

You may as well tell your landlord that since you have a new rug rat that is too young to shovel and you may need to take the rug rat to the doctor and she cannot do that with a driveway that is ass deep in snow pack as a tenant it is not your legal responsibility to do this.

It is his responsibility to maintain the property to safe standards which includes snow and ice removal.
It is not your responsibility to maintain the property, it is your landlords. 
He better step up or hire a contractor on a per snow fall trigger basis to clear snow and spread salt and or sand as needed as your neighbors are not going to do anything nor should they as it his liability in maintaining the property to take care of. 

Your wife will not be happy if she is unable to get out to take the child to the doctor either and you will no doubt hear about it in spades.


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## WVguy (Nov 24, 2018)

leonz said:


> You may as well tell your landlord that since you have a new rug rat that is too young to shovel and you may need to take the rug rat to the doctor and she cannot do that with a driveway that is ass deep in snow pack as a tenant it is not your legal responsibility to do this.
> 
> It is his responsibility to maintain the property to safe standards which includes snow and ice removal.
> It is not your responsibility to maintain the property, it is your landlords.
> He better step up or hire a contractor on a per snow fall trigger basis to clear snow and spread salt and or sand as needed as your neighbors are not going to do anything nor should they as it his liability in maintaining the property to take care of.


What he said.

Save yourself $1,000 and spend $500 (probably much less) on an attorney. He/she will write what we used to call at work a "nastygram" on the law office's stationery. That tends to get people's full and undivided attention.

If the landlord has any more sense than a stillborn jackass he/she/it will promptly arrange for a reputable contractor to clear that driveway and the entrance of any trace of snow and keep it cleared. Failure to do so can have very expensive consequences for the landlord/property manager/property owner.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

BAAAAAABY!!! Baby was born Saturday morning so that’s why I disappeared haha. I agree 100% on it being his responsibility. I’ll probably bring it up to him that he needs to prepare and be ready when snow is coming. Their is no reason for me to purchase a snowblower. I honestly want one so that I can have one... I enjoy going out and shoveling so I think the thought of getting a machine to tear up the snow excites me a little bit haha.. just imagine walking down the sidewalk clearing it for the neighbors. Great times. Lmao. I even opt to mow my own section of yard rather then have the other tenant mow it. ( I work with the other tenant we are really close friends ) I just enjoy doing extra work. My only issue would be the damage if something bad happened. I have to draw a photo for you guys. Is their away to aim snowblowers at the ground? I never thought about launching a rock. Theirs a high chance of me getting a snowblower but I will definitely talk to the landlord first. Our rent is cheap right now so buying stuff like this makes sense to me for some reason. I expect it to last long we should be looking at houses end of next year or 2021. I even bought our own washer and dryer and will just swap his back in when we leave. But they should last towards 10 years so I bought them now because we have the extra money for now.


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

Congratulations on the new rug rat Blake,

I would pass on buying anything right now except for a replacement vehicle as your rug rat expenses will eat up all your extra money and the extra deduction in April will only add to saving more money for rug rat expenses.

If I remember correctly the amount of money needed to raise a rug rat to 18 years of age is or was $220,000.00.

You will not be able to buy a snow blower that will effectively let you blow the snow forward and down unless you have a snow mule that has 100+ plus horsepower.

Just save your money and ask the landlord to hire someone to do the snow and ice removal as you have a new child to worry about and you or the wife will need to take the boy to the doctor
AND you will both be up at all hours for months until the rug rat sleeps all night.


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## JiminRI (Mar 26, 2016)

Welcome to the forum, Blake,

Congratulations on the new baby!

Have you considered a plow for the F-150?


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## Rooskie (Feb 12, 2015)

Hello, Blake and welcome to the forum! Congratulations on your first(?) child! I would like to humbly offer wisdom from down the road of life, looking back over the years with tear-filled eyes on opportunities lost. Life has changed very dramatically for you, although you are truly unaware at this juncture by how much. That will change in the next 6 months! Reading your posts, I see myself at 24 very clearly. This snowblower idea is a wonderful thing to take your mind off of the little bundle the missus has been carrying around in front of her for the past 9 months. But the little bundle has now evolved into a bundle of joy and needs your attention as much as mama's. Be sure to get involved and dont let mama carry the responsibility alone. It will benefit your married life. It is more awkward handling a baby than any snowblower, but jump right in and it will get easier. Those first couple years fly by, try to hold on to every moment. From 2 to 9 years of age, you will be the greatest thing on earth to your child. Be SURE not to work those years away. SPEND time with them. Take every opportunity to be with them at this age. You will NEVER regret it. It is a great responsibility to be a good father and many of us men equate that with making sure there is enough money in the till to provide for baby's every need, and that is a good thing. But you and your child will benefit more having you at home. Best of Luck to you and the little mother. PS: I say this with all due respect to mom, but she is never going to run any of that snow equipment as her proper and primary duty from now on is to care for baby. She wont be able to leave baby to plow a driveway, that is Daddy's job. Daddy takes care of the 'big' jobs. Embrace that, as well. It will be a source of pride as the years roll. I'll close by saying I know I wasn't an absentee father, but even so, I would give ANYTHING to have one of those days back where my 3 and 7 yr olds would perform for me when I got home and I was so tired from a 12 hour day.................
OK, blew my nose and wiped my eyes. Back to business: My shtick here is to argue for the old Ariens equipment. Mine is a 1971 724 powered by Tecumseh, 'Murican made. Why spend $3000 when $300 will get you a serviceable 1030? This gang here can help you fix anything on it, parts are still available. A snowblower is cumbersome to store when not in use. Save your money, wait till this current over-inflated real estate market bursts, regardless of who's in office, in about 3 years. Then buy your house at a discount, get a nice, old John Deere garden tractor to cut the lawn and a snowblower attachment for it, as well. If you think there's a fan club for Ariens, wait till you meet the fanatics at John Deere!

-For now, the advice to contact a lawyer is the best route to take, hands down. I dont care for lawyers, so that is quite a statement from me. Not only if you knock out a window, but what if you get hurt?


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

leonz said:


> Congratulations on the new rug rat Blake,
> 
> I would pass on buying anything right now except for a replacement vehicle as your rug rat expenses will eat up all your extra money and the extra deduction in April will only add to saving more money for rug rat expenses.
> 
> ...


"If I remember correctly the amount of money needed to raise a rug rat to 18 years of age is or was $220,000.00."
Wow! That was probably back in the 60's. Or you forgot to add one or two Zero's to the end of that figure in today's world/costs.
But welcome to the forum. The older Honda's one piece discharge chute deflector did a good job of blowing the snow out and down pretty well. But if you did that with some wet types of snow for an extended period you could risk some buildup or clogging in the chute if it was very wet heavy slop snow.
When Honda changed to the two piece deflector it smoothed out the discharge angle to help prevent the "backup" or buildup. It was like hitting a brick wall with the old one piece deflector, but the Honda still did a very good job at throwing the snow away.
Good luck with your new child, and listen to these guys on the forum, they know what they are talking about, and with the "liability" issues and talking with a Lawyer first before clearing snow that would be the landlords responsibility, these guys know from experience.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

On those three stage machines built by MTD-Cub Cadet, I would stay away from them, it is a very poor design and does not work well at all. It is just a sales marketing gimmick to get people to buy them thinking it is a better design machine.
They are built very poorly with extremely weak thin auger paddles, and the middle paddle mounted in the front center will bend, break, distort if you hit anything solid like heavy snow, ice, or the "End of Driveway" monster.
They constantly break shear pins in the center paddle. They usually get stuck in the shaft because they bend as they are snapping, instead of giving a clean break, they get jammed in the shaft and they are a real pain in the butt to get a punch tool in to press them out of the shaft. Also when they clog, which they do quite often from the design, they are extremely hard to get a removal tool in back towards the discharge paddle to remove a blockage.
Wait till you pick up a newspaper or any other foreign object that was buried in the snow and it jams everything up, and the work involved to get that removed. You will be disassembling the entire auger mechanism, the paddles, shafts and worm gear box to get your hands in to clear it out and replace the bent, busted, broken auger paddles and shear pins.
You will be glad you did not waste your money on a Three Stage because they do not work as good as they advertise. They will leave you stranded with a non operating machine more than you will get to use them if you ever get anything jammed up in the auger housing. Most of the time you will be taking them back to the shop for repair or getting your money back from them because you did not want it after you saw how poorly they perform.
If you ever had to unclog, repair them and the excessive time it takes, even for experienced technicians, you would know what I am talking about and be glad I either steered you away from them or at least warned you about them.


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## cranman (Jan 23, 2016)

I second everything Rooskie said........an ST824 Ariens from the eighties or nineties will make short work of any storm you'll ever have to clear, and is cheap and reliable.....with the $99 Predator, an impeller kit and a taller chute...watch out! I'll take an older hotrodded blower over a new one anyday, and save my money.


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## AriensProMike (Dec 2, 2014)

ST824 is for sure one of the best models made. Only machine that is as good or better is a sho or a pro model from the same time period. Good luck and happy hunting.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

I talked with the landlord. He offered to pay for me to even do it. I’ve got awhile to go before winter hits / those “October deals” if those are a thing. 

I’m looking at older ones posted on Facebook but not really sure what I’m looking for. 

But Facebook or brand new, I’m basically looking for 420cc so it has the power. 2 stage due to 3 stage being a gimmick. I’d like tracks because people say it’s better for gravel. For cutting width.. not sure yet. I was gonna measure the sidewalk. 

How fast or slow do these things go? Say on the straight away with normal fluffy snow? I’ll probably shovel that I guess.. I like to shovel I did it all of last year just could never really deal with the end of driveway.. it usually became a sloppy mess because I would drive over it a million times with the truck flattening it. 



I think I’m gonna look into some kind of liability thing. Something he can sign that clears me of any damage or injury type thing. I really don’t think any issues will ever surface. I’ve never used a snowblower but can’t I just aim it not towards the house? I have a feeling on the mornings that I have to clear the end I’d just go straight down the driveway shooting the snow forward and then work on aiming it in other spots.


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## leonz (Dec 12, 2014)

Blake, walk away please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He is not doing you any favors. Clearing snow is a big job even for a home owner. Your insurer is going to laugh you out of their office as a million dollar umbrella policy is just for starters and workmans compensation insurance is meted out on a per hour basis or per job basis with a very big insurer like zurich.

Sure he can pay you, but in no way will that be enough to cover any umbrella liability insurance and fire insurance to cover the snow blower and the replacement cost of any vehicle or the homes that could catch fire from a gasoline fire or an electrical fire from using the electric starter on a snow blower.


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## ST1100A (Feb 7, 2015)

Blake, listen to what Leonz Says. I take it he is VERY Experienced in what he stated in his post. Once you accept any type of payment for your services, snow removal, whether it be in money or even a break on your rent, you are considered a "Commercial User" in the eyes of the Courts. You are required to have at least 1 million dollars of coverage for your insurance policy that you must have, and the premium cost is not cheap.
You sound like a good type of person who is willing to help other people, too bad there isn't more people around like that anymore.
You always have to watch out for the "Ambulance Chaser" type of people who got out and look for someone using a snowblower that is out blowing snow so that they can drive by with their car with a broken windshield, and file a fake claim that you just broke it for them, and they will claim a fake injury just so they can get rich off of something that never happened. Yes, that does happen. You also have the person who claims property damage even though you weren't near their property. Those are only a few things that can happen, also personal injury, like someone claiming they were struck by a foreign object that was thrown out of your snowblower. Believe me, it does happen, especially here in the Northeast. Everybody is Lawsuit happy these days.
Everything that Leonz said is very correct and true. Your landlord may sign something to help you with not having to pay for any damages or release you from liability to him, but that would only be for him and you, not for anybody else, like other tenants or any other person in the area where you are working.
Blake, we are trying to help you with good advice on this Forum and what to watch out for. Somewhere on this forum you will find lots of stories about good honest people out clearing snow and something bad happened, whether it was some type of property damage or someone being injured from an unknown projectile coming out of a snowblower and being struck by it, and the litigation's and lawsuits the operator had to go through, and money it cost them to pay for it. 
Things happen while you are trying to be a good helpful person to others, and they take advantage of it and you. 
Bad things can happen when you least expect it. I don't mean to scare you away from helping other people in time of need, but you are young and starting a new family now, so we wish you all the best and don't want to see anything bad happen to you that could end up costing you a lot of money.


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## RIT333 (Feb 6, 2014)

Wow - forgot how much the World has changed since I was a little kid when I would spend a whole day blowing snow for neighbors just to pocket $10 and be able to bowl for money the whole next day, and pocket another $10. Never thought about having a lawyer on my staff !


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

Okay I have found two options. 

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/508963253175252/

I assume that one will be the popular choice due to the brand. 

Or this one
http://www.searshometownstores.com/...-420cc-Dual-Stage-Snowblower-w-Power-Steering

Or this one... smaller motor but has that anti clogging... 

https://www.toro.com/en/homeowner/snow-blowers/power-max-hd-1028-ohxe-38841


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## Frankenblower (Aug 19, 2019)

Tire chains and 2 stage


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

Frankenblower said:


> Tire chains and 2 stage


Yeah.. I think Imma go with the Toro 1428. I'll buy some chains, and I think imma look into skids for it. Not sure if it comes with some out of the box but I'll look into some metal ones.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

Blake Boysen said:


> Okay I have found two options.
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/508963253175252/
> 
> I assume that one will be the popular choice due to the brand.


At least take a look at the Ariens. The Toro will always be there. The Hydro Pro is sweet and nicely balanced. Maybe he will negotiate a bit on price. You will be giving up some HP in going with the Toro, although I've never seen anyone here complain about the Toro's.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

Zavie said:


> At least take a look at the Ariens. The Toro will always be there. The Hydro Pro is sweet and nicely balanced. Maybe he will negotiate a bit on price. You will be giving up some HP in going with the Toro, although I've never seen anyone here complain about the Toro's.


They have the same motor unless I'm missing something... The other reason for the Toro is the no need for shear pins. I am very new to snowblowers though so I'm not sure


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

Blake Boysen said:


> They have the same motor unless I'm missing something... The other reason for the Toro is the no need for shear pins. I am very new to snowblowers though so I'm not sure


https://www.toro.com/en/homeowner/snow-blowers/power-max-hd-1428-ohxe-commercial-38843


Yes the 1428 does have the bigger motor. At first I thought you were looking at the HD1028, lol:angel:

Before you spend any hard earned money take a look at the Ariens Pro 28 926077 :https://www.ariens.com/en-us/snow-products/snow-blowers/professional

I've been behind both machines and I like the balance and controls more on the Ariens. But that's me and I think both are excellent machines, it comes down to which machine feels right to you.


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## Blake Boysen (Aug 1, 2019)

Zavie said:


> https://www.toro.com/en/homeowner/snow-blowers/power-max-hd-1428-ohxe-commercial-38843
> 
> 
> Yes the 1428 does have the bigger motor. At first I thought you were looking at the HD1028, lol:angel:
> ...


Man that one looks good aswell. Hard to choose haha! I will have to keep looking I guess. I'm still waiting till they start showing up in stores.


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