# toro 824



## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

I could buy cheap a toro 824. don't know the details or exact year, Just pict.
I would like to know is it friction disk driven or it has a transmission.
The guy probably got it free and tried to rebuild it. he says only first works second gear moves barely and third doesnt work.

thanks


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

whats the model number?? toro still uses 824 in the new power max line so just 824 isn't any help


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

All I have for the time being is brief description and pictures but you can see it's old. Adding a 2nd pict.

I don't know much about toros so thats why I'm asking you conaissors !!!!

I have looked at different models, and even me can see this is 80 or 90 model just buy handles levers on top. But I don't know the internals if it's friction disk or transmission like the power shift models.

He says is probably just a spring adjustment, so in theory it would be friction disk ???

Thats what I'm wondering ...


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

remove the rear plate, on the tractor unit, where the info sticker is normally from there you can plan see if it's disc or a trans


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

So the more I look seems a 1990 Toro 824 Model: 38080 

It has the same chute that is rounded.

Image is from here on the forum from classiccat


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

87powershiftx2 said:


> remove the rear plate, on the tractor unit, where the info sticker is normally from there you can plan see if it's disc or a trans


I know how to tell lol.

I just don't have it yet. I wanted to see with Toro owners would know by the pictures and features about what year it would be and disc or transmission.

If it is a transmission and slips, that's a different project.

I did ask the owner and I'm waiting for an answer.


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

Friction disk transmission. My guess is that it's a 38080, early 80's. Is a fin missing from the flywheel in pic 2? In that condition it should be *very* cheap.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

toromike said:


> Friction disk transmission. My guess is that it's a 38080, early 80's. Is a fin missing from the flywheel in pic 2? In that condition it should be *very* cheap.


Just saw it !!!!!

What would be the repurcussions ?? unballanced?? 
Would it still be worth it to buy it ??


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

Pic in post #3, click on the pic to get a larger view, the flywheel looks very dark almost black, it looks to me that the fins on the flywheel are light gray, just below the gas tank shut off valve, one just above the throttle cable looks to be missing.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

toromike said:


> Pic in post #3, click on the pic to get a larger view, the flywheel looks very dark almost black, it looks to me that the fins on the flywheel are light gray, just below the gas tank shut off valve, one just above the throttle cable looks to be missing.


Yes you are right. I did not pay attention. Actually I think that more then 1 finn is missing ...

But what would be the repurcussion of missing fins lol


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

close up of flywheel

btw it's $90 us or 120 cad not negotiated lol

so maybe 65 or 70 ...


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

It would be unbalanced, the right thing to do would be to replace the flywheel. I agree with you, I can't tell for sure but there may also be a fin missing under the throttle cable. I think the 38080 model was made for 1979 to 1991, I think this one is 79 to 81. With the serial number you can determine the year. This should be free.


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## db130 (Feb 16, 2013)

I'd think you'd need all the fins intact for the engine to run balanced? 

What are your plans with it? Fix and keep? Fix and sell?

Some folks have noted here that the resale value on these old Toros is somewhat low, due to the lack of safety features. It is possible to have the snowblower in gear and start the engine (and you'll be running after it).

I have a 524 version of that snowblower with a Predator 212cc swap.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

db130 said:


> I'd think you'd need all the fins intact for the engine to run balanced?
> 
> What are your plans with it? Fix and keep? Fix and sell?
> 
> ...


I would keep it. If it would be worth it. With not too much maintenance, and a good flywheel.

Probably won't touch this one.


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

db130 said:


> . . . Some folks have noted here that the resale value on these old Toros is somewhat low, due to the lack of safety features. It is possible to have the snowblower in gear and start the engine (and you'll be running after it).
> 
> I have a 524 version of that snowblower with a Predator 212cc swap.


These models are not much in demand. This model does have a safety interlock system. If all the switches and the interlock module work, this model can only be started in neutral with the auger disengaged. I too have a repowered 1986 524 version of this machine and it is my favorite. In general they are a solid machine.


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## Grunt (Nov 11, 2013)

I would GUESS it's an early 80's model since it appears to have ignition points under the flywheel. The finned part of the flywheel is a separate piece made of nylon and I doubt the motor would be terribly out of balance, but should be replaced at some time. 
The drive gear issues could be a broken\missing spring, worn friction disc, bad bearings or linkage adjustment.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

Grunt said:


> I would GUESS it's an early 80's model since it appears to have ignition points under the flywheel. The finned part of the flywheel is a separate piece made of nylon and I doubt the motor would be terribly out of balance, but should be replaced at some time.
> The drive gear issues could be a broken\missing spring, worn friction disc or linkage adjustment.


If it is a friction disk, that's exactly what i thought.

Thanks to all for the input.


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## crazzywolfie (Jun 2, 2014)

heck i sold one of those a bit over 1 year ago and only got $100CAD for it but it needed tires. guy that bought it showed up with a trailer full of machines just like it lol. other than the tires it was a good running/working machine. also sold the one i got off my BIL about 4-5 years ago and only got $150cad for it but i might have let it go a bit cheap just to get it gone and wasn't quite as familiar with machines back then. 

personally i would be hesitant to pay more than $50 for it in the condition it is in. they are good machine but even then still might be better off finding a machine that is complete and working for that $100 or so instead of spending a ton on a machine that needs work.


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## db130 (Feb 16, 2013)

toromike said:


> If all the switches and the interlock module work, this model can only be started in neutral with the auger disengaged. I too have a repowered 1986 524 version of this machine and it is my favorite.


 @toromike, did you keep the interlocks on your repowered 524? On mine, I do have the interlock set up so that if the augers are engaged without the interlock squeezed, it will shut off the engine.

However, I'm pretty sure I can start it with the snowblower in gear.


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

db130 said:


> @*toromike*, did you keep the interlocks on your repowered 524? On mine, I do have the interlock set up so that if the augers are engaged without the interlock squeezed, it will shut off the engine.
> 
> However, I'm pretty sure I can start it with the snowblower in gear.


I do not have the interlock module setup on my 524, I'm the only one that uses it, so I wasn't concerned about it functioning. I still have the interlock module. I tested it a few days ago on the Predator 212 that is now on the 524 and the module did not work. The test was part of my research on developing a replacement for the interlock module. (I need to see if the module still functions properly on the Tecumseh engine.) The module did function properly when the Tecumseh 5hp engine was installed on the machine a couple years ago; as I remember, the Tecumseh engine would not start unless the drive was in neutral and the auger off.


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

@db130, my OCD got the better of me and I just had to know. I dragged my Tec 5hp outside, put oil and gas in it and got it started. My interlock module does still work on the Tec. With the push on terminals on the interlock module shorted, the engine would start and run. While running if the short between the push on terminals was removed, the engine stopped. With no short between the push on terminals, the engine would not start. If your engine will start while in gear, your drive selector safety switch may be defective or jumped out.


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## 2.137269 (Nov 15, 2019)

out of balance from missing fins yes they will run but will vibrate a tad more .would i buy ?NO WAY ! 

my remarks about the tag info is with the id and serial number you can find it's real age in the toro site not guess


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

Diamond in the rough right there! I like it! 

These machines are tanks in the right hands can clear a driveway faster than just about anything out there.

If it's a 1980 824 (like my '80 724) it doesn't have an interlock module but rather a normal grounding circuit.











Edit: 
something seems a little off on that sideplate. check for excessive wear and whether or not that spring-loaded scraper is in good shape.


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## toromike (Aug 20, 2018)

classiccat said:


> . . . If it's a 1980 824 (like my '80 724) it doesn't have an interlock module but rather a normal grounding circuit.


It looks like the interlock module first appeared in 1981, I didn't know that. Thanks classiccat.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

I did see a similar model supposed ok at $140 not negotiable. Might look at that instead. A bit more less worry as i am not experienced with toros with all their problems.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

classiccat said:


> Diamond in the rough right there! I like it!
> 
> These machines are tanks in the right hands can clear a driveway faster than just about anything out there.
> 
> ...


Diamond in the ruff lol that's what I was thinking also. But don't want to have to invest $400 in parts.

As somebody said earlier fins are supposed to be in plastic ??? they seem to be metal ?? have to check. If plastic less wable or very minor. Just fun to find a replacement.

And price was $120 cad


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

Last question, if you had a choice between this model in a bit better shape, and an old ariens, about same HP and bucket, which one would you choose.

Is the front transfer case on the toro much better then ariens ???

What about thickness of metal body and bearings ??


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

squid3083 said:


> Diamond in the ruff lol that's what I was thinking also. But don't want to have to invest $400 in parts.
> 
> As somebody said earlier fins are supposed to be in plastic ??? they seem to be metal ?? have to check. If plastic less wable or very minor. Just fun to find a replacement.
> 
> And price was $120 cad


The only time I spent that much $$$ on a refurb is when I had to purchase a new shortblock.

At a minimum I'd drop some cabbage on a new head and breather gaskets for doing a valve job. With the head off, a good time to give the ignition some love and set the spark advance. Carb rebuild kit with new intake gaskets. Muffler might be roached as well. 

the machine itself, I'd ditch those MTD skids just out of principle  ...then expect some new bushings ($60), belts ($36) and and possibly a new friction disc ($? i've only had to replace 1 friction disc on 3 toros). 




squid3083 said:


> Last question, if you had a choice between this model in a bit better shape, and an old ariens, about same HP and bucket, which one would you choose.
> 
> Is the front transfer case on the toro much better then ariens ???
> 
> What about thickness of metal body and bearings ??


Alot of it depends on your needs and ability. That Toro is built for speed and dependability; the drum allows it to stuff its face with minimal clogs...esp with the impeller kit and some better tires. the auger gearcase is super tough...even with the aluminum housing. The don't require shear pins. Super easy to perform maintenance; I like how the side panels unbolt and the overall balance of the machine is perfect.

Older teardrop bucket ariens are tough as nails and also simple/robust mechanicals...really nice if you like to take your time and enjoy the throw. 

Why not buy both and determine which one you like for yourself? :devil:


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

classiccat said:


> The only time I spent that much $$$ on a refurb is when I had to purchase a new shortblock.


I was exagerating at $400 but I can get nice ones maintained at around $250 - $300

Around my area blowers that need tlc are around $100 - $150 so I can't put $150 - $200 of parts, not worth it.



classiccat said:


> Why not buy both and determine which one you like for yourself? :devil:


Why not one for everyday of the week ????? :wink2:

I saw a video of 3 snowblowers side by side of same snow same height and pushing all 3
Huskvarna Ariens and Toro.

The Ariens did not throw snow as far but was eating the snow better then the other 2 and was faster finishing the row.
The Huskvarna had a better engine and was throwing like a honda very high and further.


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## Mike C. (Jan 28, 2016)

classiccat said:


> Alot of it depends on your needs and ability. That Toro is built for speed and dependability; the drum allows it to stuff its face with minimal clogs...


CC,
Are those old Toros capable of fast ground speeds?I have a Toro 521 and it's slower than death and my Allis Sno Pro(five speed) isn't much better.I'd like a classic Toro,and a faster machine, but I've worried that it may be just as slow as my 521 with it's three speed tranny.


I have no interest in "enjoying the throw" as you put it,the faster I can get it done ,the better.


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

Mike C. said:


> CC,
> Are those old Toros capable of fast ground speeds?I have a Toro 521 and it's slower than death and my Allis Sno Pro(five speed) isn't much better.I'd like a classic Toro,and a faster machine, but I've worried that it may be just as slow as my 521 with it's three speed tranny.
> 
> 
> I have no interest in "enjoying the throw" as you put it,the faster I can get it done ,the better.


Ya know Mike C. it's one of the mysteries between my '80 and '89 machines. My '89 flies...almost need to jog to keep up even in 1st where my '80 machine is noticeably slower.

Traction hardware is identical as far as I can tell; without doing a full breakdown to measure all of the components (radius, sprocket teeth, etc.). Both machines are matched for RPMs. 

You can adjust friction wheel placement...based on the 3rd speed location. 

One obvious major difference is the tires. the '89 has the monster 14" knobbies and my '80 has the old ~13" originals. Next time I have both machines down from the blower loft, I'll swap tires and see if the speeds follow them. :thumbsup:


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

Mike C. said:


> CC,Are those old Toros capable of fast ground speeds?I have a Toro 521 and it's slower than death and my Allis Sno Pro(five speed) isn't much better.I'd like a classic Toro,and a faster machine, but I've worried that it may be just as slow as my 521 with it's three speed tranny.


For speed my Yard man 927 98 or 99 is way to fast. First gear ok for munching thick snow. 2 -5 ramming into heavy snow bank, and walking too fast. I have not done the impeller mod yet. It's in the works. Should change everything.



Mike C. said:


> CC, I have no interest in "enjoying the throw" as you put it,the faster I can get it done ,the better.


My point exactly !!! In my case I have a big car tempo and the snow is always in front packed by the city tractor at least 1 to 1.5 foot high by 30 feet long, and packed by 4 feet wide and 2 row on each side of the tempo about 16 feet long that is packed bcus it fell from the roof of the tempo. So hard job (for me at least).

I am doing major maintenance on my yard man that has not been done since I bought it last year. Waiting on new carb, rust sanding grease everything belts new bearings for shaft of friction disk, new friction disk (was worn down to the metal) new cables, and now had one front auger soldered solder joint broke.


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## slingshot (Feb 8, 2011)

Beyond the broken fins on the flywheel (which I think should be replaced before using....just my hunch).

I ran a Toro Power Shift for 20 years....it's auger is just like this one. A drum with the auger flutes welded to it. The good thing with this is that I have never in 20 years broken a shear pin. The bad thing with this design is that it limits how much snow can be fed into the impeller. The scraper will ride up and over snow as the drum it self-limits the amount the auger can pull in.


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## squid3083 (Jan 20, 2020)

slingshot said:


> Beyond the broken fins on the flywheel (which I think should be replaced before using....just my hunch).
> 
> I ran a Toro Power Shift for 20 years....it's auger is just like this one. A drum with the auger flutes welded to it. The good thing with this is that I have never in 20 years broken a shear pin. The bad thing with this design is that it limits how much snow can be fed into the impeller. The scraper will ride up and over snow as the drum it self-limits the amount the auger can pull in.


I was thinking the same about this drum that is limiting the input of snow. They say it's there so the impeller doesn't clog or overwhelmed by the amount of snow and it's supposed to be as efficient as empty augers like I have. Would you say that it can handle less show then normal augers Compared to same HP blower ???


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

squid3083 said:


> I was thinking the same about this drum that is limiting the input of snow. They say it's there so the impeller doesn't clog or overwhelmed by the amount of snow and it's supposed to be as efficient as empty augers like I have. Would you say that it can handle less show then normal augers Compared to same HP blower ???


That hasn't been my experience; quite the opposite actually.


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