# Can I fix this hole with some JB Weld? Or do I replace the Tecumseh 8hp?



## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

Cranked it up this morning to deal with about 5" of snow, ran about 20 feet out of the garage and crack. This is the classic thrown rod on a Tecumseh engine.

Of course, my real question is what sort of motor can I put on here to replace this one. The snowblower is a Spirit 27" with the 8hp Tecumseh.










This is an older model but it sat idle for a long time so the rest of the machine has a lot of life left. I'd love to save it from the scrapyard. Is there a motor I can buy to replace this one? I've read about Northern Tool stocking some things but that information is a few years old. Looking at prices of similar or suitable snowblowers I figure I have a max of about $250 to spend on an engine for this one. I might go to $300 but north of that and I'm going to look for a complete snowblower.











I do not know a lot about these things but I can follow instructions and will provide any information you all need to hopefully get answers.http://www.snowblowerforum.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

Since it is a single shaft engine it will be easy to replace it with HF 301cc Predator engine. Since you have a 27 inch I would go with the bigger engine. Although I have a Predator 212cc on a 26 inch Montgomery Wards Gilson and it works well. The 212cc is very torquey and it seems to work pretty well in blowers up to 26 inches even. There is no way you can fix that hole with JB weld. Sell the starter from 8 HP engine to recoup some of your money.


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## Sblg43 (Jan 18, 2014)

I once fixed a cracked block with JB Weld and that engine still runs strong after two seasons, but you have one doozy of a hole.

Hopefully the starter survived. The few times that I had to deal with a blown engine, the starter gets hits so hard that it refuses to work. 

Other parts can be sold, such as the crank shaft, fuel tank, flywheel, etc..


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

part out the engine and by a predator


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## nt40lanman (Dec 31, 2012)

I'm all for fixing the existing but ****!!! Head for Harbor Freight!!! Get the big engine!!


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

dang! took out the block & crank cover. That would be an ambitious repair to say the least. 

Another_ used _HM80 can be had for < $100. Plug-n-play.


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## detdrbuzzard (Jan 20, 2012)

see if you can find a short block if everything else is good and you have to have a tecumseh


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

classiccat said:


> dang! took out the block & crank cover. That would be an ambitious repair to say the least.
> 
> Another_ used _HM80 can be had for < $100. Plug-n-play.


Why buy a used L- head engine when you can have a new OHV engine that is much more fuel efficient and more powerful and quiet too. The 8hp Tecumseh engines were know to have connecting rod problems as you are definitely aware of. The new engines are easy to start with just 1 to 2 pulls of the recoil so a starter is not even needed


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

you do not know the history of a used tecumseh engine. buy a predator and be done with it. there are a lot of people on this forum that will try to steer you away from them, but they have never used them so dont listen to the crap they will give you about the clones


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

GustoGuy said:


> Why buy a used L- head engine when you can have a new OHV engine that is much more fuel efficient and more powerful and quiet too. The 8hp Tecumseh engines were know to have connecting rod problems *as you are* definitely aware of. The new engines are easy to start with just 1 to 2 pulls of the recoil so a starter is not even needed


 My personal preference...possibly the OP's as well.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

Great advice everyone. Thanks. So the question now is the 6.5 vs 8 hp predator. I appreciate GustoGuy suggesting the bigger one which was echoed by nt40lanman. I had been reading that the 6.5 is a good replacement for the 8hp Tecumseh.

I don't need a 27" snowblower bc I live on a small lot in St Paul MN. I use this thing for my sidewalk and helping out some neighbors. By that I'm saying that it should get relatively light use. Which leans me toward the smaller engine. But I don't want to be cheap and stupid which leans me toward the bigger one. 

Right now the 6.5 is $120 - down from $250. The 8 is $230 - down from $300. Does the price on the 8 get any lower?


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

43128 said:


> you do not know the history of a used tecumseh engine. buy a predator and be done with it. there are a lot of people on this forum that will try to steer you away from them, but they have never used them so dont listen to the crap they will give you about the clones


I've had luck with my HF purchases. Mostly a huge tile saw that the pros in the forums crap on but which works fine for me. I've only been reading about the predators tonight but I've seen enought to a) understand the controversy and b) know that I'm the type that will try the Chinese knock-off. 



classiccat said:


> My personal preference...possibly the OP's as well.


I appreciate the input. I don't really have a preference. If I could find a Tecumseh for under $100 I'd probably risk it. Maybe. My neighbor and his buddies are already laughing at me though. They would get a kick out of it if I replaced the engine and blew that one too! So based on that, maybe I wouldn't risk it!


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

20% off anything in store and free light. you can rejet the carb on the 6.5 and get about 8.5hp out of it. the 6.5 really feels more like an 8 just because of the torque they make


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

43128 said:


> you do not know the history of a used tecumseh engine. buy a predator and be done with it. there are a lot of people on this forum that will try to steer you away from them, but they have never used them so dont listen to the crap they will give you about the clones


I own 3 HF Predator engines and one is on a mini bike and the other 2 are on snowblowers. All 3 engines run great and start easily. I used to be a skeptical too so I first replaced my 2.8hp Doodle bug engine with the 6.5hp 212cc and I was impressed with how well the engine ran. Powerful and quiet with easy 1 pull starting. The next engine to go was the hard to start Tecumseh 5 HP on my MTD 5/22. Now I use the blower more often and it tosses snow over 40 feet. Check out my video of my blower sometime under Mrgustoguy on YouTube.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

The 6.5 has the 3/4" shaft which is what I need. I know I could get different pulleys but that puts me into unfamiliar territory. I'm leaning toward the 6.5. If it's underpowered I'll find a smaller snowblower with a bad engine and transplant it. 

That rejet is an interesting and I'll keep it in mind. 

Regarding coupons - the ones I'm seeing exclude "Predator Gas Power Items."


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

The rejetting help the engine run good in the cold weather since the engine is jetted lean for emissions reasons and summer running. NR racing replaced the stock air cleaner assembly with a low restriction K&N style air filter with a 140 emulsion tube and a larger main jet and dynoed the engine and found it put out just over 9hp with just a low restriction air filter and fatter jetting. I did a free mod on my mini bike I enlarged the air opening inside the air cleaner housing then I needed to enlarge the main jet and it improved the tottle response and turned the Doodle bug into the Doodle beast and I needed to add some weight to the front end because it turned into a wheelie machine. I may even do this to the snowblowers too. Ton's of parts too to hot rod this engine. Billet connecting rods and flywheels rated to 8500 rpms. Check out NR racing Predator stage kit's


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## 43128 (Feb 14, 2014)

thats bs, i have used 20% coupons on a 212cc engine in there and they took it, just bring it in and try it


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## HJames (Oct 28, 2013)

I have the 212cc on a 24" bucket and it works well. I'm getting ready to install the 301cc on a 27". I was able to use the 20% off coupon for the purchase, but HF is inconsistent across locations, some accept them and some don't. As far as which to buy, if you don't see yourself taking a full bucket with every pass, I would say you can get away with the 212cc, just take your time on the first pass when you don't have a choice but to take a full bucket. Either way I don't think you will be disappointed with your choice. I think the 212cc is the best bang for your buck.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

I have used several 6.5hp engines on 24" and 26" machines and they work very well. I have an 11hp on a 26" cub but it is overkill. You can get the 6.5 on sale for under 100 dollars and if you can use the 20% off that puts it near 80 bucks.

Go with the 6.5 it will be fine.

carl


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

So, let me know what you think about this problem. As I see it I need to get some sort of crank shaft extension or drill new holes in the snow blower "engine deck."

Got any thought on this?

And oh yeah, my garage floor feels like the Exxon Valdez drove through here; everytime I turn or rotate this snowblower more oil leaks out of the nooks and crannies.

I put the new motor on the snowblower and it sits too far back.










As it sits it will reach the pulley for the wheels, but not the auger:










You can see the old motor sat forward, almost touching the tensioner:










I could drill some new holes and bolt this thing down with nuts and bolts, right?(Note in this picture you can see the rear "old" mounting hole.









The only problem with that is that I will need to somehow get through or remove all of this stuff to get a tool on the nut/bolt going through the new holes:







http://www.snowblowerforum.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/


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## HJames (Oct 28, 2013)

Yup, been there done that. You can drill new holes, a nice long socket extension should help with the forward holes so you don't have to remove anything. Put the bolts in through the bottom and I suggest you pick up some lock washers to hold the bolts while you set the engine on them. Fasten the rear 2 bolts securely with lock nuts and you can tip the blower on its bucket to fasten the forward holes. On a side note it appears you went with the 301cc.


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## JerryD (Jan 19, 2014)

When I was a kid I blew a hole about that big in my Clinton go cart engine. My neighbor welded up the hole and my Father fixed the engine.
My Cousin"s kids still have the go cart with the same engine in it. I think the engine was welded up back in 1968. 
I was told it has thrown a couple rods over the years but the block is bulletproof.


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## Shryp (Jan 1, 2011)

In 1968 the block was probably cast iron and not aluminum like new ones. I have seen videos of people welding small cracks in the aluminum ones, but not giant holes.


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## gsnod (Sep 2, 2013)

jmkeuning -- I just this week did this same thing -- put a HF 301 CC onto a Craftsman 27 inch that had a 8.5 HP B&S engine on it. Had to redrill the mounting holes, as the replacement was wides at the base. Also had to get two 1 inch pulleys. The hardest part is lining up the engine and marking where to drill the mounting holes. To correctly do this, you need to line-up the pulleys and then scratch your drill spots. Then mount one or two bolts before you put the blower up on the bucket to lock everything down. 



jmkeuning said:


> So, let me know what you think about this problem. As I see it I need to get some sort of crank shaft extension or drill new holes in the snow blower "engine deck."
> 
> Got any thought on this?
> 
> ...


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

gsnod said:


> jmkeuning -- I just this week did this same thing -- put a HF 301 CC onto a Craftsman 27 inch that had a 8.5 HP B&S engine on it. Had to redrill the mounting holes, as the replacement was wides at the base. Also had to get two 1 inch pulleys. The hardest part is lining up the engine and marking where to drill the mounting holes. To correctly do this, you need to line-up the pulleys and then scratch your drill spots. Then mount one or two bolts before you put the blower up on the bucket to lock everything down.


I thought that I just needed to move things forward but I realized that things were also not matching side-to-side. Fortunately the shaft on both engines is the same height - so I am only dealing with two dimensions.

I can easily dry fit the fore/aft position as I just need to nudge the engine up to that tension pulley. For the side-to-side I put the old engine on the snowblower and positioned it next to a wall. I measured from the wall to the shaft. That measurement was then used to put the new engine in the correct place side-to-side. From there it was a matter of marking the holes. I could only get my spring-punch into one of the holes (this was one of the front holes). Once that hole was marked I measured carefully and marked the other front hole. These two front holes are drilled now and the engine sits where I need it. Now I am making a paper template to mark the back two holes. Drilling those out will be straight-forward. Last I will attempt to noodle a long socket extension in there and bolt this thing on some how. I am thinking I will push the bolt up from the bottom and attach the nuts from the top. I imagine some acrobatics, silly putty, and sky hooks might be involved. I also thought about using a variety of ratchet straps to put the engine in place so that I could tip the snowblower forward... but I can imagine a bad result!


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## nt40lanman (Dec 31, 2012)

That's the 8HP? If it is you won't be sorry. More power is more better. Does anyone know about the tuning on the 8hp similar to the 6.5? If a 6.5 can go 8 or 9, maybe an 8 can go over 10!!!

Now lets talk 13s!!!


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## suspicionofignorance2 (Jan 26, 2014)

Of course, there's always Ebay ----




 
Also, just curious..were you using 5w-20 oil ? and how cold was the temps..?


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

Sounds like you got it pretty much figured out and will be running soon. You will want to open up the carb jet to keep the engine from surging in cold weather. These engines are tuned for warmer weather.

I don't know about the 11hp predator that you bought. Maybe someone here can give you some guidance so you don't have to experiment and reinvent the wheel.

On the 6.5 HP I put a .032 jet in place of the stock .028 and it seems to be good. Has not gone under 25 degree yet. I will find out at some point how it does in colder temps. I may want to go to .033 or .034.

You may not be able to fit the belt guard on with out cutting some of it but that is fine.

If you have some time and inclination you could look for a 8 hp Tecumseh parts engine on Craig's list and make one good engine out of two broken.

So far I am happy with my Pedator but it has very little use so far. 

I will also throw in that the 20% HF coupon will exclude some items like tool boxes and Gas engines. As someone pointed out this may be a regional thing. Read the fine print on the coupon.

If not too late get some Nylock nuts (nylon insert). They never vibrate loose. Split lock washer are not very effective. But better than no washer.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

nt40lanman said:


> That's the 8HP? If it is you won't be sorry. More power is more better. Does anyone know about the tuning on the 8hp similar to the 6.5? If a 6.5 can go 8 or 9, maybe an 8 can go over 10!!!
> 
> Now lets talk 13s!!!


Not the 8, it's the 6.5.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

suspicionofignorance2 said:


> ...
> 
> Also, just curious..were you using 5w-20 oil ? and how cold was the temps..?


I had 5w-30. But that's a whole other story - This snowblower had been idle for a few years. I had run a few oil changes through but I think I still had some condensation in there.

It was not too cold; probably around 20.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

Toro-8-2-4 said:


> ...
> 
> On the 6.5 HP I put a .032 jet in place of the stock .028 and it seems to be good. Has not gone under 25 degree yet. I will find out at some point how it does in colder temps. I may want to go to .033 or .034.


Is that jet a particular fitting that you swapped out or did you drill the existing jets?


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## suspicionofignorance2 (Jan 26, 2014)

Maybe I'm just lazy..I'd buy a used Tecumseh short block, avoid all the conversion --and use 10w-30 oil if above zero deg...Heck, I wouldn't be outside anyhow, if were below zero....But that's just me..!


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

suspicionofignorance2 said:


> Maybe I'm just lazy..I'd buy a used Tecumseh short block, avoid all the conversion --and use 10w-30 oil if above zero deg...Heck, I wouldn't be outside anyhow, if were below zero....But that's just me..!


It's not hard to bolt a Honda clone on at all. I would never buy a used Tecumseh block since you would not know whether it was abused or ran low on oil and look what happened to his original engine. Plus I have never had any luck with a Tecumseh running well anyway, that is why I replaced my 5hp one. I did a much harder dual shaft to single shaft conversion and it runs great.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

I have the holes drilled and the temporary mounting bolts through the two back holes - the _easy_ holes. The front bolts are going to be a real PITA and I am not looking forward to it. The good news so far is that the holes are in the correct place.

I need a socket extension shaped like this:

```
____   ___
     /    \_/
____/
```


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## suspicionofignorance2 (Jan 26, 2014)

That's a good one...show it to a snap on truck guy...!


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## Shryp (Jan 1, 2011)

jmkeuning said:


> I need a socket extension shaped like this:
> 
> ```
> ____   ___
> ...


Can you use a standard swivel?


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## gsnod (Sep 2, 2013)

jmkeuning -- is it possible to put the bolts in from the top, so the nuts are inside the unit? Of course you need to be aware of interference onto the chain or linkage. When I replaced an engine, I put in two bolts anyway I could to secure the engine to the body, simply so I could tip the unit onto the auger, and then put the rest of the bolts in. Then you can rearrange the orientation of the initial bolts if that's important to ya....

Another option is to put the wheels onto ramps and while laying on that cold garage floor....thread the nuts onto the bolts.


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## Lakota (Nov 19, 2014)

For mounting problem, might get a beefy piece of steel like 1/4" -1/2" from junk yard and use old holes to mount new plate then work with bolts in rear and new studs (drill/tap/permatex) in front? Then might have to address new belt size?


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

I was able to connect various swivels held fast with various tape products (think "duck") and with the bolts taped to the socket I did it. I do not know what sort of jokes are appropriate around here but I'll say did quite a bit of poking around and leave it at that.

Got the pulleys reattached and I am ready to rock.

Other than gas and oil do I need to do anything before firing up this predator? I figure I'll double-check the gap on the spark plug. But other than that... anything I should be aware of?


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

gsnod said:


> I put in two bolts anyway I could to secure the engine to the body, simply so I could tip the unit onto the auger, and then put the rest of the bolts in. Then you can rearrange the orientation of the initial bolts


That's what I ended up doing. I had a clear shot at two so I tipped the unit onto the scoop and held the engine with one arm and threaded the bolt through with the other, then supported the engine with my knee while I hand-tightened the first bolt. Still holding the engine on my knee I then stretch-armstronged the other bolt through the other clear hole and hand tightened it. (A reasonable person would have voided my warranty on the spot.) With the engine then hanging from the two half-tightened bolts I used proper tools to tighten them home, checking the position of the engine as I went. Once those were done I started on the other two.


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

jmkeuning said:


> I was able to connect various swivels held fast with various tape products (think "duck") and with the bolts taped to the socket I did it. I do not know what sort of jokes are appropriate around here but I'll say did quite a bit of poking around and leave it at that.
> 
> Got the pulleys reattached and I am ready to rock.
> 
> Other than gas and oil do I need to do anything before firing up this predator? I figure I'll double-check the gap on the spark plug. But other than that... anything I should be aware of?


Replace the cheap Torch spark plug with NGK BP-6ES spark plug. I have this plug on all three engines and they run better with this plug than the cheap original Torch plug. I also use Amsoil synthetic on all three engines however any synthetic oil is better than the cheapest non synthetic oil​


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

What weight oil?


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

5w/30 or 10w/30 will do. With synthetic the 10w/30 or 5w/30 is fine with non synthetic I would go with the 5w/30 only since regular oil will get pretty viscous when really cold unlike a good synthetic which will still pour and lubricate. virtually all small engines are splash lubricated so conventional motor oil will be thick as honey at 10 below zero F will not lubricate at all until the heat from the engine warms the oil.


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## Toro-8-2-4 (Dec 28, 2013)

jmkeuning said:


> Is that jet a particular fitting that you swapped out or did you drill the existing jets?


I purchased some aftermarket jets for Honda and Honda clone engines.

Remove the carb bowl and the then unscrew the jet with a flat screw driver. It should just drop out

You can buy them on OMB or on the NR Racing websites. They are relatively cheap. They have OEM Honda or clone which are a few bucks cheaper.

I bought a series to play around with. That way I could always go back if I over sized it.

Or you can buy a micro drill set and open it up yourself.

Again, I don't know what the stock jet diameter is for the 11HP Predator. 

I hope someone who has worked with this particular engine can give you specific guidance. 

If by chance you have access to a pin gauge set you can measure the jet yourself to baseline where you need to go from. If you know someone who works in a machine shop they may be able measure it for you.


Some on here an other sites believe that during engine break in you should use regular oil. Then after your first oil change you can switch to synthetic. I don't know but I thought I would mention it and you can do what makes sense to you. 
Happy New Year!


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## GustoGuy (Nov 19, 2012)

I just use Amsoil 5W/30 and I never had a problems with the engine breaking in and all 3 engines run great. It may take a bit longer for the rings to seat fully with synthetic because it's film strength is higher than conventional oil. Change the oil after about 5 hours or so of running and you are good to go for a whole season.


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## jmkeuning (Nov 15, 2014)

Old snowblower has a new $120 engine. I can get $40 for the old Tecumseh electric starter and who knows what for some other parts. For $80 the changeover was well worth it! Started up on the first pull and idles smoothly. 

Drilling out the jets or buying the OEM jets seems like a good idea. Also maybe fabricating a heater box but that stuff can all wait.

Thanks for all the help everyone. I'll likely be back in a few months asking how to winterize this thing.


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## classiccat (Mar 1, 2014)

jmkeuning said:


> Old snowblower has a new $120 engine. I can get $40 for the old Tecumseh electric starter and who knows what for some other parts. For $80 the changeover was well worth it! Started up on the first pull and idles smoothly.
> 
> Drilling out the jets or buying the OEM jets seems like a good idea. Also maybe fabricating a heater box but that stuff can all wait.
> 
> Thanks for all the help everyone. I'll likely be back in a few months asking how to winterize this thing.


 Good Job! Well Done!!!


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