# Toro TWO-STAGE POWER MAX HA 60V E26



## kemlyn (Oct 16, 2018)

Went in for some parts for my Stihl pack pack blower yesterday. Speakeing with my dealer I asked his opinion of the new Toro EV 26 inch snowblower on his showroom floor. 
His response surprised me he said he received one early last year and decided to test it at his home. He explained that it’s fine with light powder snow 25-30 feet throw. But if its wet heavy snow it barely moves the snow 10 feet and with the grip heaters on under load each battery lasts about 11 minutes per battery on a three pack of 60v batteries. So after 35 minutes under load then you're blinking red looking for the charger. He said for a small 30x10 driveway you’re all set. In NE we get a mixed bag of sleet, wet and rain crusted snowstorms so he explained he’d be hesitant to lay down $1,600 bucks for one. 
He then informed me Toro has set quotas to sell more EV machines than gas in 2023. I won’t say how much more but it’s significantly more he also explained that Toro will limit gas blowers provided to his inventory if he doesn’t meet his dictated EV blower quota. 
He’s very Independent and doesn’t t believe a supplier should manipulate his business with an directive on what he sells from the showroom floor to his lifelong customers.
He told me he’s about to double is Fall order with a competitive brand. He didn’t say the brand but he said he was voting with feet and purchase orders for the 2023 and it’s bye-bye Toro for his business.


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## Ziggy65 (Jan 18, 2020)

If I was a dealer, I would also run, not walk from Toro if they forced ridiculous quotas and bullying tactics like that on my business. 
His reputation and livelihood will suffer if he is forced to push products that his customers may not want or be satisfied with.


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## Yanmar Ronin (Jan 31, 2015)

Moved to the Electric Snowblower forum.


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## bisonp (Mar 23, 2018)

Toro probably sees the writing on the wall. Electric is the future and if they don't get a solid foothold now they may not be in the market 20 years from now. From what I can find electric mowers are now 40-50% of their market. Blowers may not be where they need to be yet to get that kind of market share, but it's all about building the battery ecosystem. It stinks that Toro is trying to do this on the backs of their dealers, but I can see their logic.


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## JJG723 (Mar 7, 2015)

If 100% accurate, far from cool on Toro's part.


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## Auger1 (Dec 4, 2020)

While battery powered stuff makes a lot of tq. and that's what you need to plow with, then there's the other problem cold and batteries. Neither work well together and batteries just go to crap when it's super cold outside making their performance less than stellar if have a lot to plow. Besides, just like electric cars the all the battery powered stuff is too damn expensive.


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

Auger1 said:


> batteries just go to crap when it's super cold outside making their performance less than stellar if have a lot to plow.


Actually, in my experience they're fine above 0°F as long as they start off warm from the house. (I don't work too well below that temperature, either.) They stay warm as you use them so it's usually not a problem. I keep the extras right inside the door so I can easily swap them. Here's the note from the Greenworks manuals:

*Cold Weather Operation: Lithium Ion batteries can be safely used from temperatures ranging*​_*from -17 degrees to 45 degrees Celsius (1°F to 113°F). NOTE: Do not store or charge battery *_​_*outside. Battery must be charged and stored indoors prior to use of the snow thrower.*_​​_*Battery may not properly start if its temperature is -17˚C or lower. If unit does not start remove*_​_*battery from snow thrower. Place battery on charger and allow to charge for 10 minutes to allow*_​*battery to warm. Remove from charger and install in snow thrower for use.*​


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## kemlyn (Oct 16, 2018)

My dealer friend said the same a warm battery runs much longer. I’m not familiar with the changing configuration if they can be brought into the house for charging. In a previous home I had a small garage and kept my snowblower in an outside shed that was unheated without a electric service so charging a battery on the machine would have been impossible. Then I asked why not just buy 3 more batteries so you’d have a total of six. A good idea until I learned the 60v Toro batteries cost between 300-400 dollars each. Here’s one price from HomeDepot for $350 dollars plus tax. See attached
My current driveway takes me 1-2 hours depending on snow weight and depth to clear using an Ariens 1332 Pro which is 21 years old. I have a large driveway and get significant snowfall I’ve attach a couple of shots I’m not convinced that battery capacity and technology is to the point I can retire my gas powered machine. 
Hoping for the day when a battery powered machine can meet my needs. 🫰


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## tabora (Mar 1, 2017)

kemlyn said:


> Hoping for the day when a battery powered machine can meet my needs.


That's a large area to be cleared... Probably 3 times the size of mine. I can do mine with the Greenworks single stage when there's under 6" of snow, but the big Honda is required for big storms. It may be a while for us to get a top-end cordless 2-stage blower...


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## HillnGullyRider (Feb 9, 2014)

It's not limited to dealer manipulation. You also need to be very careful when reviewing YT review videos, that they can be misleading is somewhat of an understatement. Try and look for things they aren't telling you. Keep in mind, that many of them are filmed when the equipment is under full charge with fresh batteries and under optimized or semi optimized load conditions. However, this isn't deliberate deceit on the streamer's part, they can't order up conditions, so they just try to tackle what's in front of them, and 98% of the time it's NOT going to be the worst possible circumstances that a machine is likely to encounter. Keep in mind, that many big-time manufactures give out FREE machines for top YT channels to test, and by FREE, I mean they don't just give them their model they are trying to hawk, but they also go out and purchase competitors models and give those to the YT reviewer for FREE as well.. They don't outright tell the reviewer what to say, but I highly suspect that in the contract it's implied that next seasons free swag will be cut off if less than favorable reviews are expressed.


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## denwood (10 mo ago)

kemlyn said:


> My dealer friend said the same a warm battery runs much longer. I’m not familiar with the changing configuration if they can be brought into the house for charging. In a previous home I had a small garage and kept my snowblower in an outside shed that was unheated without a electric service so charging a battery on the machine would have been impossible. Then I asked why not just buy 3 more batteries so you’d have a total of six. A good idea until I learned the 60v Toro batteries cost between 300-400 dollars each. Here’s one price from HomeDepot for $350 dollars plus tax. See attached
> My current driveway takes me 1-2 hours depending on snow weight and depth to clear using an Ariens 1332 Pro which is 21 years old. I have a large driveway and get significant snowfall I’ve attach a couple of shots I’m not convinced that battery capacity and technology is to the point I can retire my gas powered machine.
> Hoping for the day when a battery powered machine can meet my needs. 🫰


I'm a big fan of switching over to electric corded tools (the snowblower and inverter/generator are my only gas consumers in the house/shop) and drive an EV. I also live in a very cold climate.

Lithium cells like to live at room temperature..like a person. So charging and storing them at room temp will prolong their life. They will also last longer if left at 50% charge. Your use case (1-2 hours with a 32" blower) would make it very difficult to use a battery powered blower, at least with today's technology...and it's pretty obvious if you look at the video reviews out there. Corded electric is a different story and all of our yard tools are corded electric because I'd rather deal with a cord, than battery costs/maintenance. For some tools (like an impact gun and drill) battery power makes a lot of sense as run times are short and portability is a big asset. Snow blowers are one application where high power requirements, smaller(er) size, and long run times in cold weather will limit their use case for battery power. This of course will change with battery technology...hopefully soon. A corded snowblower to replace my 11 hp TORO would require a 55 amp, 240 volt extension cord and circuit which is evidently why you'll never see one  It does give you an idea though of much battery power you'd need to replicate that workload.

If you examine the drive train on an internal combustion vehicle (been working on them for 38 years) and compare it to an EV, the difference with respect to mechanical simplicity is crazy. Our EV will also accelerate from 0 with an instant 250 ft/lbs of torque. To the axles, there are only eight moving parts. That snowblower motor has one moving part (the rotor) attached to a pulley (and maybe one reduction gear)..that's it. Once the battery tech is there, we'll all want to go that way.

I have noticed that many retailers are pushing battery power for every tool out there, but the KISS rule dictates (for me anyway) that if a corded electric device will work, I'll always go there first.


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## HillnGullyRider (Feb 9, 2014)

denwood said:


> I'm a big fan of switching over to electric corded tools (the snowblower and inverter/generator are my only gas consumers in the house/shop) and drive an EV. I also live in a very cold climate.
> 
> Lithium cells like to live at room temperature..like a person. So charging and storing them at room temp will prolong their life. They will also last longer if left at 50% charge. Your use case (1-2 hours with a 32" blower) would make it very difficult to use a battery powered blower, at least with today's technology...and it's pretty obvious if you look at the video reviews out there. Corded electric is a different story and all of our yard tools are corded electric because I'd rather deal with a cord, than battery costs/maintenance. For some tools (like an impact gun and drill) battery power makes a lot of sense as run times are short and portability is a big asset. Snow blowers are one application where high power requirements, smaller(er) size, and long run times in cold weather will limit their use case for battery power. This of course will change with battery technology...hopefully soon. A corded snowblower to replace my 11 hp TORO would require a 55 amp, 240 volt extension cord and circuit which is evidently why you'll never see one  It does give you an idea though of much battery power you'd need to replicate that workload.
> 
> ...


I'm also a fan of corded (for those on a budget, price and simplicity is unrivaled). I have a corded two stage. Ariens 932017 from the early 80's. It features a high quality brushed Briggs and Stratton ELECTRIC motor, I think it's 12amp, so about 1- 1.5 electric horsepower which is about the maximum on a 15 amp AC circuit without blowing the breakers. It may throw 25-30 feet if the snow conditions are light and dry(20" bucket). It's fun to use for a novelty , but the further you get from an outlet, the less fun it becomes because of cord drag in snow accumulation. For this reason I relegated it to summer usage with the tiller attachment, and for this it works great (and for much longer than a battery electric version.)


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## bisonp (Mar 23, 2018)

Yeah, given the size of the OP's driveway and the amount of snow in it, anything electric would be absolutely miserable.


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## michaelnel (Feb 12, 2019)

I took delivery of an E26 a couple days ago. Installed ArmorSkids on it because none of the area I have to blow is paved.... all dirt with mulch on top of it. I set the scraper bar at about 1" clearance. I can always lower it if need be.

Last year we didn't get our first big snow until December 27th. Hope it comes sooner this year!


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