# The stuff people do to their machines....



## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

Did you ever see a machine that you just felt sorry for, because it was clearly existing in an "abusive relationship"? :crying:

Recently, I came across a Toro PowerMax 826 OXE that fit that description. Looking at the paperwork for the machine, I see the original owner bought it new in late 2010 for $1400.

Although the engine started right up, sounded good, and ran strong, I could see that the blower had seen some hard times. First thing I noticed as I approached the machine, was that the skids were flipped because they had been completely worn through on one side. Why do people let them get that bad, especially when they are reversible? At least he flipped them, before doing any damage to the bucket....

The "quick stick" chute control had been literally busted right off by one of the owner's kids, and the original owner's attempt to repair it, not only failed, but resulted in some additional lost parts. :facepalm_zpsdj194qh

The paint inside the auger housing was peeling off in spots, and rust was already forming on the bared metal. A shame, I thought, for what by me would be considered a "new" machine, compared to the "vintage" stuff that I already owned.

Apparently, some of the welds on the muffler had also broken, so the engine was dumping hot exhaust gases practically right out of the exhaust port. This was allowed to continue to such a degree that it litteraly melted some of the plastic snow shields in the vicinity of the muffler. :surprise:

There were numerous other less serious issues with it, not the least of which was the auger belt was adjusted so poorly that it is doubtful this poor thing could have thrown snow more that 5 feet.

With all these problems, the guy had taken it to his "friendly" Toro dealership where they looked at the machine and gave him a written quote to fix it, complete with a list of parts they'd replace. 
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>>>>>>>>> NINE HUNDRED BUCKS and change!!!!......*_

Basically, I think they were trying to get him to abandon the machine, or take a trivial amount in trade towards a new one, so they could fix it up and sell it for a hefty profit.

Long story short, I gave him 250 bucks for it, and since he was in the next town, he even delivered it for me. I'll leave it to others who know a lot more about these machines as to whether or not it was a good deal. But I had to do it. I mean, it looks like a pretty nice machine, and I actually felt sorry for this poor thing! I've never owned a Toro 2 stage, only a couple of their handy single stages for small snowfalls, so I don't know what to expect from this one.
:blowerhug:
The machine has been kind of a "background task" for me, working on it at a very leisurely pace. 
I think I have about $80 invested in it for parts, and some number of hours of effort which doesn't bother me, because I really enjoy working on snowblowers. At this point, I have pretty much gone through everything, adjusted, fixed, replaced, where I deemed necessary.

The only other thing I want to do with it, is split the machine and tear down the auger box, so I can repaint it. But that will wait for the warmer weather.

It's ready to go now.....I think....lol. And maybe it will get it's first test this weekend as we are finally supposed to get some measurable snow here in Southern New England.



Keeping my fingers crossed! :hope:
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## Lottstodo (Feb 16, 2018)

It is mind boggling as to what people do to misuse and abuse and neglect their equipment then say the MFG. builds crap.
I had a guy a couple years ago that for whatever reason has dumped all of his wood stove ashes on the driveway for years and has gone through many snowblowers.
The one he brought to me a big craftsman was literally gone in the front, everything was rusted and in spots completely through. even the aluminum gear box was losing metal. The augers were even flimsy from lack of metal due to rust. The machine was only 4 years old at the time and looked like it was 50. I told him about his use of ashes not being good and he replied B#$--S#@$#! They make junk. 
I then told him that I was not interested in working on his machine.

However on Yours you said that you were going to paint it after tearing it down. 
I looked at one that a guy tore down and sent the parts to a place that does powder coatings and for $55.00 they dipped and cleaned and coated, and did a very good job of color match. The same place sprayed Rhino truck bed liner in the chute and got it just as flat as any paint that they did for free just to see how well it would hold up.

I have not talked to him since last season to see how his blower was doing with the dress up ! But it looked good. and was very slick to the touch.


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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

Lotts'


That's surprising about the "wood ash guy"....lol. First of all I can't imagine why he would dump the ashes there, (they are supposed to be good for your gardens, or so I've heard). I could understand the damage he did if it was ashes from a coal stove, with the sulfur residue, but I wonder what is in wood ash that would be so corrosive. :question:

Obviously though, you hate seeing abused equipment as much as I do......lol.

Anyway, that's a good idea regarding restoring the paint on the auger bucket. You reminded me that the last time I did something like this, was on my old Noma(Murray) 9/27. The machine is a beast, but it still functioned well, and the old TEC 9hp was still strong. So I decided to strip the thing down and repaint it.

I really enjoy working on the mechanical aspects of power equipment. However, I really hate painting....and I hate the "prep" even more. I swore that if I ever did this again, I would have someone sand blast the parts. Sanding and grinding took many hours, the worst being auger rakes. What a PITA ! :facepalm_zpsdj194qh


So if this machine works out well in the next 24 hours in this upcoming storm, I will certainly consider pulling it apart, having someone sand blast it, and paint or powder coat like you suggested. I don't know what part of the country you are in, but I doubt that here in Mass. that I'll get the kind of price that you did.

Let's find out what it can do first. Like I said: This is my first Toro 2 stage. So far, my total cash outlay to buy and fix up this machine is about 330 bucks. Not too bad I guess for a machine that cost $1400 or so a little over 8 years ago. :thumbsup:
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## Lottstodo (Feb 16, 2018)

Wood ash when mixed with water becomes a corrosive lye if you will, and loves to eat metal. I believe it is a lot stronger when boiled, such as they do with lye soap made from hardwood ash and fat.


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## tadawson (Jan 3, 2018)

Yeah, it's the calcium/calcium carbonate in ashes that push the pH to somewhere between 9 and 13 . . . it's basically the same as lime . . . very corrosive!


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## 94EG8 (Feb 13, 2014)

It's pretty common for people to use ashes from a wood stove or furnace as a traction aid on icy driveways.


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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

tadawson said:


> _Yeah, it's the calcium/calcium carbonate in ashes that push the pH to somewhere between 9 and 13 . . . it's basically the same as lime . . . very corrosive!_



I never knew that. It's pretty common around here to have acidic soil, and I have always heard people say how good wood ash is for gardens and even lawns. I could never get anyone to explain why, but it's something I've seen since I was a kid. Apparently, what they're trying to do there, is bring the ph level to something more neutral using the ash.


That said, based on this information, I would never put it on my driveway, as I think causing problems for my snowblower of the type that Lotts' described might be the least of my worries.


Doesn't make much sense for the floor pans and exhaust systems of your vehicles to be continually parking them in a potentially corrosive environment! :wink2:

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## jrcjr (Sep 23, 2017)

Yep, the Sodium (Na), Potassium (K), and Calcium (Ca) in the ash are all metals with a higher reactivity level than Iron (Fe), or Aluminum (Al). (Keep in mind that steel is an alloy of mostly Iron and 0.7 to around 2% Carbon (C)). Metals higher in reactivity will actively displace metals lower in reactivity.


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## zandor (Dec 15, 2017)

SayItAintSnow said:


> I never knew that. It's pretty common around here to have acidic soil, and I have always heard people say how good wood ash is for gardens and even lawns. I could never get anyone to explain why, but it's something I've seen since I was a kid. Apparently, what they're trying to do there, is bring the ph level to something more neutral using the ash.
> .


That's exactly when wood ash is useful in the garden. It raises the soil ph, which can be a good thing if you have acidic soil. Some of the minerals left in wood ash are good too. Mine's slightly on the alkaline side, so no wood ash for me. Also, don't use ash from wood "products" or charcoal briquettes, just natural wood and natural lump charcoal. They tend to have extra gunk in them which can be bad for your plants and potentially end up in your food if you use the ashes in a vegetable garden.

Strong bases don't eat metal like acid, but they are pretty effective at damaging organic materials, polymers, etc. so I wouldn't be a bit surprised if wood ash ate the paint off a snowblower. I'm sure wood ash is also full of various salts. So yeah, peel the paint off and cover the snow blower in salt.


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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

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_*Thought I'd momentarily veer back on topic and report on how the restored Toro 826 OXE, (described in the initial post of this thread), did with this most recent snow event...:wink2:*_

Although this wasn't the kind of test I was looking for, the machine performed pretty well.
Most of the snow occured over the period of 11 pm Sat. night until about 4am Sun, which is not optimum snowblowing time, unless you want to keep your neighbors awake.

Around 3-4am it began to rain, and rained hard for about 10 hours afterward.

My daughter was part of the opening crew Sunday for a local coffee shop, so I went out around 5:30 to clear the driveway, so I could drive her to work.

The Toro did a respectable job throwing the 5 inches of slush. I'd say about 10 feet on average. This stuff was really heavy. Occasionally, when I would hit a patch of snow that appeared to be just a little drier, the throwing distance nearly doubled. 



_*O.K. So far so good! :smile2:*_
The EOD mess was at least 20 inches high, extremely slushy, and extremely heavy. I had to take my time with this as I could occasionally hear the engine start to bog down if I took too big a bite. The machine was able to toss the EOD stuff a useful distance. My old Murray/Noma 927 is still pretty powerful, but it would have been lucky to toss this stuff beyond the top of the auger bucket, and with it's "clog free" rectangular impeller exit, likely would have clogged or started crapping out "bricks" of ice, which it is apparently fond of doing, in slushy conditions. _(Whoever came up with the engineering wizardry, that suggested a squared off impeller port would eliminate clogging, is today, probably reduced to designing the little bumpers that attached to the underside of toilet seats). :icon-thumbsdown:_

At the base of my driveway which runs downhill to the street, was a very deep puddle. Maybe about 8 inches deep. O.K.....it was kind of childish I know, but I decided to run the machine into the puddle. I was shocked, that this thing actually threw the water about 10-12 feet into the street! My old Noma would have just sat there, like a 9hp blender, homogenizing the liquid...:surprise:

*So it appears that this snowblower's story has a happy ending. All in all, I'm pretty pleased so far, and although I'm not one that wishes for snow, I'm eager to see how this machine handles a foot or more of the drier stuff. Thus far at least, it appears to have earned its way into my snow blowing arsenal, as of now, consisting of 4 blowers. I feel like it was well worth the time and money, to rescue this machine from its former neglected life! :blowerhug:
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## paulm12 (May 22, 2015)

awesome save. Lets see some pictures.


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## tlshawks (Feb 9, 2018)

Yeah...the two machines in my avatar. They were darn near basket cases when I inherited them via neglect from relatives through the years. They both for the most part run great now - better than I've ever known them to (in my family since the mid 1970's). 

I was given them, and took both projects on as a matter of principle. I knew they could still be great machines if they just got the attention they had been lacking for roughly 30 years.

12 months later...run like champs.


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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

tlshawks said:


> _Yeah...the two machines in my avatar. They were darn near basket cases when I inherited them via neglect from relatives through the years. They both for the most part run great now - better than I've ever known them to (in my family since the mid 1970's).
> 
> I was given them, and took both projects on as a matter of principle. I knew they could still be great machines if they just got the attention they had been lacking for roughly 30 years.
> 
> 12 months later...run like champs._



I know exactly what you mean. For me, and I suspect for a lot of others, there is special satisfaction to be derived from rescuing a piece of power equipment, either from the scrap metal guys, the landfill, or one that has spent most of its life to that point being abused. :wink2:

In addition to that 826 I described in previous posts, I also have a Toro Powerlite that I fished out of someone's trash. I got it to run, and now it always starts on the first pull. It's a machine of limited use, because it is so small, but for those nuisance 1 to 2 inch snowfalls, for which you might have to take the push scoop to otherwise, it will have its place. We haven't had an appropriate storm yet to try it out, so we'll see how it does hopefully before the winter is through.


For slightly bigger snowfalls I have a Toro 2450 which I paid about $50 for and only needed very minor work to bring up to speed. Another one that starts on the first pull.

The next step in terms of heavier snow fall will likely be this newest 826OXE, and then finally, if we are really buried, I'll drag out the old Noma 927 beast. 

The Noma is a prime candidate for the impeller modification. The gap on that thing is ridiculous. My biggest problem with that machine is that it is tough to start, without the electric starter, but the holes in the block are all stripped out, and the aluminum is so soft that even tapping new threads results in further breaking out of aluminum. Maybe I can fab up a vertical bracket, that attaches to the top of the transmission housing, next to the motor mounts. Or, I suppose just find another TEC SnowKing 9hp or bigger and swap it out. :confused2:
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## rslifkin (Mar 5, 2018)

For the starter issue on the Noma, I'd either re-power it if you have a desire for more power (or get a cheap engine to use on it) or helicoil the mounting holes if there's enough meat around them. Done properly it should be plenty strong for mounting a starter.


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## orangputeh (Nov 24, 2016)

i sold a really nice hs928 to a guy the next street over. I put a lot of work into this machine and this guy just leaves it out in the weather. He paid a lot for this but I think he's one of these "trust fund babies" that have been populating our town in recent years.

These people are sons and daughters of the rich that the parents buy homes for and give them a monthly allowance. They are in their 20's and 30's and don't even haggle on price. just pull out the cash.

anyway, of course he had a problem with it because it was covered in ice. I fixed it for him and told him he should have a cover for it. **** , he has a shed 10 feet where he leaves the blower in the driveway. I told him if he were my kid i would smack him. he kind of looked at me sideways and i laughed and told him not to worry because "you ain't my good, don't worry. "

people who have little or no respect for these machines make me sick.


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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

.
If you enjoy laughing watch Taryl work on this farkled-up Case. "It's a Classic"






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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

tdipaul said:


> .
> _If you enjoy laughing watch Taryl work on this farkled-up Case. "It's a Classic"_
> 
> .



Tdi':


Thanks for posting that. That was enjoyable....:thumbsup:

Taryl is certainly an original....lol. A true "one-of-a-kind". But one thing's for sure, once you get past all the goofy ******* satire, you can always learn something useful from his videos, just like you can from Donyboy73. 
_
Quite a contrast in style between the two of them though!_ I've heard some folks say they prefer one over the other, but I think the internet is big enough for the two of them, and others as well. So long as it's possible to learn something from someone's video, then I'm appreciative of the effort they undertook to make it, and post it. k:

I'm still chuckling over "Fluffy" the rat......:grin:
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## tdipaul (Jul 11, 2015)

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I subscribe to both of them they are awesome!

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## SayItAintSnow (Dec 15, 2017)

FINALLY! :yahoo:

Well, as "Cranman" outlined in his comprehensive and enjoyable post detailing the use of various machines in this latest Southern New Snowfall, (I'm about 25 minutes north of his location), we finally got a snowstorm worthy of testing the machine described earlier in this thread.

As Cranman stated, this snow was heavy, and in our location averaged a bit over one foot.

My Toro 826 OXE that had been rescued from a "bad home", finally had a chance to demonstrate what it could do. As it turns out, I really didn't need to use the electric starter, as each time I needed to restart the machine, she started right up on the first pull.

I'm not sure what this machine would do with light powdery stuff, but it was able to throw this heavy stuff a bit over 20 feet, which is good enough for me!

I have a lot of area to clean up, and was probably out there for a total of 4 hours, and in that time it only clogged twice, and only when trying to tackle the 3 1/2 foot high pile of slushy mess at the two EOD locations. It is still amazing to me how this slushy stuff can turn to ice if it is left to sit in the machine as you pause for even less than a minute. You would think that all the road salt would prevent that. Must be all the water runs out and the rest gets compressed.... I just know that my old 927 Noma would have been continually spitting out perfect ice bricks with this stuff, until it clogged.

_So all in all, great performance from my first Toro 2 stage, and thus far I can see only one remaining problem. First speed select is way too slow-- barely moves, and the 2nd reverse seems a little too fast. I was concerned about knocking myself over going backwards..._:grin:.

Haven't looked at it, but it is likely that the friction wheel is landing too close to center for first speed, and too far "out there" for the 2nd reverse. Should be an easy adjustment.


Right now, it's perched out there, bucket and chute pointed towards the Sun, with a block under the scraper bar. Between the Sun and wind today, everything left inside should melt and the machine should dry out really well, before I put it back into our out building. :blowerhug:


*It's a nice feeling to know this machine has been given a second chance to live out a useful life! :wink2:
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