# Troy Bilt Vortex 31BH5DR7563 revs up when taken off choke (brand new)



## Ahunata

Very strange problem I got here...

Bought 2 weeks ago, followed the instructions to the letter, had an oil change.

2 days ago it was running perfectly well, I start it today and its as if someone put nitro in there.

One, I barely pulled on the starting cord and honestly it almost scared me, like something explosive was in there and the engine started revving up to its maximum within half a second, I think it even burned the light.

Fresh gas (same tank), brand new machine, worked two days ago, now it wants to explode.

When I start it in full choke position it will idle somewhat normally... as soon as I touch the choke button (and I mean barely touch it) the engine revs up like there is no tomorrow.

Thats right, I'm not even switching it off full choke, merely pressing in the direction sends the engine in highest revs possible.

What can it be ?

Thanks in advance and merry christmas, an answer would be the best gift I could receive because I'm stucking in my driveway with 50 cm of heavy snow :/


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## classiccat

Welcome to SBF and Merry Christmas!

I assume you don't have access to a tachometer nor able to gauge what ~ 3600 RPMs sounds like.

Exceeding the recommended RPM could destroy the engine.

Asking you to upload a video of it puts the engine at risk.

Overrevving could be caused by a stuck carb throttle linkage, an obstruction or a busted internal governor (_assuming you didn't monkey with the linkage, governor spring tension, etc._)

Does the engine have a throttle control where you can run it at reduced-throttle?


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## Ahunata

classiccat said:


> Welcome to SBF and Merry Christmas!
> 
> I assume you don't have access to a tachometer nor able to gauge what ~ 3600 RPMs sounds like.
> 
> Exceeding the recommended RPM could destroy the engine.
> 
> Asking you to upload a video of it puts the engine at risk.
> 
> Overrevving could be caused by a stuck carb throttle linkage, an obstruction or a busted internal governor (_assuming you didn't monkey with the linkage, governor spring tension, etc._)
> 
> Does the engine have a throttle control where you can run it at reduced-throttle?


No, no access to RPM meter, but I'd assume around 3-4000 RPM, I didn't let it run for more than a few seconds at that rate it is scary and the whole thing vibrates.

The governor could be stucked even on a brand new machine ?

I didn't open it or nothing it is brand new and was working perfectly two days ago :/

What makes me think it could be a not well oiled throtle linkage is that there is absolutely no effect when I move the throtle, it only stops when I reach full stop !

The only other thing affecting the RPM is when I touch the choke button, as soon as I touch it it starts revving up to full speed.


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## Ahunata

@classiccat

There also used to be quite a marked difference between the levels on the choke button.

Now it simply goes crazy when I touch it...

But what puzzles me most, is how easy it started... it really felt like nitro, the engine didn't even do one rev and it was already firing up like it was warm ! I could have pulled the crank with two fingers it would have started.

I actually see the mechanism that moves when I move the throttle lever, it looks brand new, there is no water or corrosion in there.


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## classiccat

Ahunata said:


> @classiccat
> 
> There also used to be quite a marked difference between the levels on the choke button.
> 
> Now it simply goes crazy when I touch it...
> 
> But what puzzles me most, is how easy it started... it really felt like nitro, the engine didn't even do one rev and it was already firing up like it was warm ! I could have pulled the crank with two fingers it would have started.
> 
> I actually see the mechanism that moves when I move the throttle lever, it looks brand new, there is no water or corrosion in there.


I have to confess, I'm trying to gauge your experience with outdoor power equipment vs a malfunctioning machine. 

It sounds like it MIGHT be running properly, you're simply surprised with how quickly it popped to life when starting & it's running loud/rough b/c it's partially choked (_running too rich (due to partial choke) causing it to shake_).

Try starting at half-throttle (_this usually disengages the governor_) and get it off the choke without it sounding like it's running away.

_Sidenote: I usually avoid starting an engine at full throttle._

It should smooth-out as you open the choke...at that point gradually increase the throttle. 

At any point it sounds like it's running away on you, shut it off.

try to record a video and post it.


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## leonz

Now that I see this I agree with that diagnosis.


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## Ahunata

Sounds good I will try it...

One question however, previously to any of this happening when I pulled the throttle to the right the engine would slowly fade off. Now there is no difference until I hit the stop point.

so its either running a little too rich while fully choked, and when I move the throttle to attempt to lower the idle nothing happens until I hit stop.

Sorry if I'm repeating myself just want to make sure nothing gets lost in translation


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## Ahunata

I just want to make sure I don't break it... it sounds awfully high rpm...

can't take it back to the store unless I shovel 20 inches of snow on a good 50 feet... christmas will have to wait...

*sigh*

I will try to start it as previously said at half throttle and see if the governor kicks in tomorrow morning, thanks for the replies much appreciated !


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## Vermont007

Every engine that I have has its own personality, and likes to be treated as an individual; but to refresh my memory for this Thread, I just re-read the instructions for the Tecumseh Engine that powers my 2007 Snowblower . . . . something that I don't recall doing since it was new !

The Instructions, which I've been following religiously (or habitually) for over 10 years, say to move Speed Control (that seems to mean Throttle) all the way to *FAST* (which would indicate Full) and to position the Choke at *FULL* in preparation for Starting.

Then, upon being started (and paraphrasing Tecumseh's Instructions) I immediately begin being reducing the Engine Speed 25% or 50% and I set the Choke to about ½ or less while I let the engine warm up without missing, for a minute or so, and when warmed up, I eliminate the Choke altogether and return the Speed (Throttle) to FULL while I put the machine to work.

Choking any engine should be considered ONLY as an aide in getting it started; not as a setting while it's being used.

I recognize that Tecumseh is now out of business; but their instructions still work for me.


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## jonnied12

It sounds as if your throttle linkage may be disconnected in there somewhere. Get a good flashlight and operate the throttle lever without the engine running to see what moves or what doesn't move. It is also possible a governor control spring may have become disconnected.
Here is the engine repair manual that may help you out.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjGiMCqsaXYAhUm7oMKHWX2BHkQFggpMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mymowerparts.com%2Fpdf%2FMTD-Service-Repair-Manuals%2FMTD-Big-Bore-Engines-78-277cc-83-357cc-90-420cc-Repair-Manual.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2AlkfRBQX3Ev3zKHW3bNxJ
See Chapter 3 and 4.


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## nwcove

Did the machine set outside uncovered during any snow or after its last use? Might just be that the linkages are iced up.


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## Ahunata

Vermont007 said:


> Every engine that I have has its own personality, and likes to be treated as an individual; but to refresh my memory for this Thread, I just re-read the instructions for the Tecumseh Engine that powers my 2007 Snowblower . . . . something that I don't recall doing since it was new !
> 
> The Instructions, which I've been following religiously (or habitually) for over 10 years, say to move Speed Control (that seems to mean Throttle) all the way to *FAST* (which would indicate Full) and to position the Choke at *FULL* in preparation for Starting.
> 
> Then, upon being started (and paraphrasing Tecumseh's Instructions) I immediately begin being reducing the Engine Speed 25% or 50% and I set the Choke to about ½ or less while I let the engine warm up without missing, for a minute or so, and when warmed up, I eliminate the Choke altogether and return the Speed (Throttle) to FULL while I put the machine to work.
> 
> Choking any engine should be considered ONLY as an aide in getting it started; not as a setting while it's being used.
> 
> I recognize that Tecumseh is now out of business; but their instructions still work for me.


Indeed the instructions are very similar, they however do not tell me to reduce the throttle, they leave it on high, it used to make a nice generator like sound then rev up only in relation to the snow load, now I cannot take it off fully off choke without it feeling like its going to blow up...



> It sounds as if your throttle linkage may be disconnected in there somewhere. Get a good flashlight and operate the throttle lever without the engine running to see what moves or what doesn't move. It is also possible a governor control spring may have become disconnected.
> Here is the engine repair manual that may help you out.
> Redirect Notice
> See Chapter 3 and 4.


When I move the throttle lever, I see that the big metal piece attached to it moves... but nothing else seems to move. So it seems logical that the linkage is stucked, ice however dosen't seem to be the problem because its completely dry in there... I did use it once while it was snowing, but then it was so hot afterwards it had time to dry up in the shelter.

So I guess my best option is to remove the cover and see whats going on under there.

I will keep you guys updated 

I think that must be it... so if I remove the cover, will it void my warranty ? :/


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## Ahunata

nwcove said:


> Did the machine set outside uncovered during any snow or after its last use? Might just be that the linkages are iced up.


I hope thats not as simple as that, or I will have to write to complain... there are ways to make good protection for the carburator assembly I'm sure. If it lets in water in light snow, then its unuseable in a storm ? Thats where I need it the most... I live in the mountains.


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## Ahunata

Okay, well it looks very unlike all the other machines I have seen under there...

The throttle lever does indeed have a spring that looks like its attached to the governor... but when I move the lever there is absolutely no tension on that spring what so ever, which explains why it does nothing, there is a short pin that makes it stop thats why that works.

Also on the lever, and on other machines I have studied there are two springs on that throttle... on the lever inside there are two holes as if to fit two springs, is it possible I lost one of them ?

Or maybe it was never there ?

I'm puzzled on what to do, those new models are kind of a pain to take apart :/


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## Ahunata

classiccat said:


> I have to confess, I'm trying to gauge your experience with outdoor power equipment vs a malfunctioning machine.
> 
> It sounds like it MIGHT be running properly, you're simply surprised with how quickly it popped to life when starting & it's running loud/rough b/c it's partially choked (_running too rich (due to partial choke) causing it to shake_).
> 
> Try starting at half-throttle (_this usually disengages the governor_) and get it off the choke without it sounding like it's running away.
> 
> _Sidenote: I usually avoid starting an engine at full throttle._
> 
> It should smooth-out as you open the choke...at that point gradually increase the throttle.
> 
> At any point it sounds like it's running away on you, shut it off.
> 
> try to record a video and post it.


So that worked to start it up... but the governor is definately stucked there, I can see it, no ice, brand new shiny metals, there is a slight metal squeaking noise when I move the choke lever but it does not look related to the spring or governor which stay put whatever I do...

Can I throw some WD-40 in there and try to wiggle it without having to open it up ?

Or as I said just previously, am I supposed to have 2 springs attached on the choke lever ? that would mean it broke and fell somewhere ? :/


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## leonz

Bonjour Ahunata, joyeux Noel!

can you bring this snowblower in to a garage and heat it up with an electric space heater? 


You could try spraying it with WD-40. Can you tell us what brand and model engine you have on this snow blower? 
That would help as we could narrow down what the controls/cables/springs look like.


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## Ahunata

leonz said:


> Bonjour Ahunata, joyeux Noel!
> 
> can you bring this snowblower in to a garage and heat it up with an electric space heater?
> 
> 
> You could try spraying it with WD-40. Can you tell us what brand and model engine you have on this snow blower?
> That would help as we could narrow down what the controls/cables/springs look like.



Happy holidays to all 

You guys were right, it was a iced up throttle linkage... the cable was iced to the metal cover, thats why I didn't see any ice on the governor itself... 

the problem with my machine, is that the darn thing is fully open and very close to the casing, which means every time wind blows back some snow, it gets in there and will ice up every single time I use it.

Is there any thick grease I can put in there to prevent it from icing up ? Lithium grease maybe ? Will it harden in the cold and prevent the governor from moving freely ?

This is an engeneering problem for sure, the choke button also ices up because its not far away enough from the pannel, this looked like a great machine... but not well thought out. In the manual they say wait until it cools down a little and wiggle the buttons and lever before putting it in the shed. Great... bad design so I have to wait 10 minutes, get dressed up again and go wiggle my controls ? its freakin -34 celcius outside.

That part where the linkage is does not ever really get hot, it could have used an extra cover or something to prevent fine snow from going in there... or maybe a small heater wire to melt the ice quickly when it starts...

grrr... and I thought buying a 2017 would solve that kind of issues...

thanks for your suggestions everyone ! they should hire some of you


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## leonz

Bonne Soui'ree Ahunata,


No worries; they would tell 99% of us we have no usable skills or the favorite; "you were not what we wanted"; "or your over qualified for a "gardien emploi" or "we thought you had skills we could use so that is why we invited you"; so we would talk to you and we short listed you because of your resume which was very impressive- I went through that with locomotive cleaner/refueling laborers job interview with CNRR after I traveled 100 miles one way for an interview.

Down here in civil service they have the dreaded by applicants or blessed by civil service managers rule being "the rule of three" when it comes to civil service tests and open civil service jobs where if a candidate tests with the highest proficiency score they can play "god" and not hire him or her even though they live in the area where the job is and they have all the qualifications, licenses etc., for said job. I applied for a janitors job with the county and came to the interview on time well dressed with 2 extra copies of my resume to give to the interviewers and the first thing she said when she walked in was "Who are you and why are you here?? I wont insult her hair color.

I applied for a mechanics job in the next county over and of course I was well dressed and had two copies of my resume and then the fun started the manager asked me where the Mecklenburg road was" I had to spend the time to tell him it went through ten miles of his county before he had the next question- I said to myself VEET, VEET, ALAY, ALAY, I want to go back home. 




With these machine builders they would certainly not even consider have a small indoor ski slope with man made snow to test the bloody things like they have in Dubai for skiing, grand dieux!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

At least Yamaha tests their snow blowers almost all the year round on Hokkaido and the northern portion of the main island. 
with real residents that use them-if a tiny one hundred 110 pound girl can move a YS1024EJ around they must be doing something right. 


It may be worth the effort to use a leaf blower to try and break up any snow and ice that is stuck there before you shut the beast off for the night as the hot air from running at high idle and the blower air running across the engine controls will melt everything Ahunta as its still running at high idle and also very hot to enable you to clear off the snow and ice of you have no where to keep it warm. 

Even building a cheap hut with 2" by 4''s and stapling clear heavy plastic to it will help you a lot to keep it ice free.


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## vinnycom

heat gun, rubbing alcohol, windsheild washer fluid


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## leonz

I agree they will all work, but if he has a leaf blower it will be faster as the engine heat at high idle will l go all over the it and melt all the built up ice from snow blowing back and melting.


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## jonnied12

You may try some Teflon or Silicone spray to give everything a good coating, or maybe a very light coating of anti-seize on all of the moving parts.


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## Ahunata

leonz said:


> I agree they will all work, but if he has a leaf blower it will be faster as the engine heat at high idle will l go all over the it and melt all the built up ice from snow blowing back and melting.


The high idle was caused by the ice... I wouldn't use the blower at that high RPM, it already fused the heating handle circuit and blew up the light in a bang (was scary)...

So I took a heat gun to it before starting it up, that worked beautifully, rubbing alcohol is also a good suggestion thank you !

I think I will have to exchange it... because today at -25, there is no way to start it up... the crank shaft is like molass and there is no way to even get a burn.

Worse powertool experience in my whole life... looks like its made to plow snow indoors...

it does work good... when it works...


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## Ahunata

jonnied12 said:


> You may try some Teflon or Silicone spray to give everything a good coating, or maybe a very light coating of anti-seize on all of the moving parts.


Thats what I was thinking... theres probably a silicone or vaseline type lube I can put on there that does not seize up in cold temps ?


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## leonz

I am sorry you are going through this, Is there a Yamaha snow blower dealer nearby? 

If you can find it locally purchase a spray can of Fluid Film or PB blaster,
The PB blaster penetrating oil spray will work faster to free up stuck parts.

It sounds like you need to run a straight ten weight motor oil up where you are
or purchase a kerosene fired space heater.
.

Leon


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## nwcove

not so much a design issue , powder snow will get into everything ! dont use heavy grease on it.....that could cause more issues. the icing wont happen every time you use the machine.....or its only happened to me a few times ! now that you know whats going on......careful use of a hair dryer or heat gun should get you going in a very short time.


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## Ahunata

leonz said:


> I am sorry you are going through this, Is there a Yamaha snow blower dealer nearby?
> 
> If you can find it locally purchase a spray can of Fluid Film or PB blaster,
> The PB blaster penetrating oil spray will work faster to free up stuck parts.
> 
> It sounds like you need to run a straight ten weight motor oil up where you are
> or purchase a kerosene fired space heater.
> .
> 
> Leon


The parts are new so they don't really stick, they just get caught in ice and the governer is so sensitive (zero to full throttle in half a centimeter) that it takes very little ice to prevent it from moving back to idle.

Thats why I was talking more of a thick grease than a penetrating oil, because I want it to stay there and that the ice forms on top of the grease instead of on the linkage itself.

Here all the snowblowers are supposed to be made to run in our weather, the only motor oil available is already the thinnest with additives in it for the cold. I guess I just wasn't lucky and/or the shop owner botched the adjusting job. I will have to call the manufacturer tomorrow and see if they tell me to bring it back 

I'll keep you guys informed, I'm just puzzled at how open to snow the whole control mechanism is... I can see all around the motor with a flashlight theres already thick plates of ice everywhere that does not get super hot and I used the darn thing only 5 times, and not under snow or storm, this is only from wind blowback getting in there, its in a shelter the rest of the time.

Looks like it was engeneered like a lawnmower to be honest  they just changed the frame lol

really not satisfied...


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## Ahunata

nwcove said:


> not so much a design issue , powder snow will get into everything ! dont use heavy grease on it.....that could cause more issues. the icing wont happen every time you use the machine.....or its only happened to me a few times ! now that you know whats going on......careful use of a hair dryer or heat gun should get you going in a very short time.


but whats the goal of leaving those very precise linkages so exposed ?

I mean with all the new tech I would have expected a fully closed mechanism that is even dried by a small airpump and humidity trap that costs peanuts to run especially on a big motor like that.

I can understand the lever being exposed... I can hit on it to make the ice fall, fine...


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## Ahunata

@nwcove

This part of the motor barely gets hot even if warm around freezing temperatures... it gets just hot enough for powdery snow to stick and slightly melt so a very thick and solid iceplate is forming in there...


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## nwcove

Ahunata said:


> @nwcove
> 
> This part of the motor barely gets hot even if warm around freezing temperatures... it gets just hot enough for powdery snow to stick and slightly melt so a very thick and solid iceplate is forming in there...


the "heater box" that encloses the carb and linkages is heated mostly by the muffler, and its designed to keep those linkages ice free. does it always work ? ...nope. when blowing powdery snow in the wind....the snow will get into places it shouldnt be.....the carb area , the recoil area etc. that icing usually only happens under the right/wrong conditions . if you have time after clearing snow, allow the machine to run for a few minutes , it may help a bit.


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## jonnied12

Ahunata said:


> @*nwcove*
> 
> This part of the motor barely gets hot even if warm around freezing temperatures... it gets just hot enough for powdery snow to stick and slightly melt so a very thick and solid iceplate is forming in there...


 I use a leaf blower to blow as much snow off the snow blower before I shut it down, then I use a long bristle brush to knock as much snow and ice off as possible. 
You know where the problem area is now so just give this area a little extra attention when putting the snow blower away.
Maybe a quick blast of WD-40 when you are done. It is made to displace water.


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