# Looking at a Craftsman Blower should I?



## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

I've been looking around at getting a new/newer snow blower lately to replace my mid 90's Craftsman 5hp/22" that has served me well when the snow isn't too deep or wet. I'm just outside of Philly in South Jersey so we sometimes get hit pretty good. My new house is at the end of a dead end street so I end up with a mess at the end of my drive way so I figure it's time for a newer and bigger machine that will chew that stuff up and have less to no problems in deeper or wetter snow.

I have a chance to buy a Craftsman 9hp 28" EZ Steer machine I think it's model # 88790 that's about 2 maybe 3 years old. Any opinions on this machine? I'm hoping to get atleast 10-15 solid years out of it with as little problems as possible and not having to worry about how bad the storm is. I'm looking for something in the 8-9hp range but don't really want to go above $700 if I don't have to so I figure used is the way. I would maybe, maybe go 800-850 for new but kinda doubt it. New machines that are 8-9hp seem to be closer to 1,000 and I'm just not going to drop that kind of money.

So is my money spent wisely on this Craftsman model? Pros or any cons? Or should I be looking at something else?


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## Talon1189 (Nov 30, 2011)

samhane said:


> I've been looking around at getting a new/newer snow blower lately to replace my mid 90's Craftsman 5hp/22" that has served me well when the snow isn't too deep or wet. I'm just outside of Philly in South Jersey so we sometimes get hit pretty good. My new house is at the end of a dead end street so I end up with a mess at the end of my drive way so I figure it's time for a newer and bigger machine that will chew that stuff up and have less to no problems in deeper or wetter snow.
> 
> I have a chance to buy a Craftsman 9hp 28" EZ Steer machine I think it's model # 88790 that's about 2 maybe 3 years old. Any opinions on this machine? I'm hoping to get atleast 10-15 solid years out of it with as little problems as possible and not having to worry about how bad the storm is. I'm looking for something in the 8-9hp range but don't really want to go above $700 if I don't have to so I figure used is the way. I would maybe, maybe go 800-850 for new but kinda doubt it. New machines that are 8-9hp seem to be closer to 1,000 and I'm just not going to drop that kind of money.
> 
> So is my money spent wisely on this Craftsman model? Pros or any cons? Or should I be looking at something else?



I wish that I had a recommendation for you. You sound like you already have your mind made up with the Craftsman 9hp 28" EZ Steer machine


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

*Craftsman Snowblower*

Sam

I can't find that model number and it's not one I'm familiar with so I'll just throw out some general thoughts. First off, I'm prejudiced, I prefer the older Craftsman/Murray gear drive units. That said, you obviously know Sears resells machines made by someone else. With the full model number, some of that can be translated to identify who built it.
General things to look at in any snowblower. Are the augers 'free' on the auger shaft? If you remove the shear bolts, will the augers spin? How big are the impeller and augers (bigger typically moves more snow)? Does it have plastic or metal bushings on the auger and axel? What's the condition of the friction disc? Brand of engine and how's it's compression and condition? Condition of the belts? How many plastic parts are in it?

Not saying it's good or bad because I honestly don't know that model so it's hard to say. If you can get the full model number, see how parts availablity looks for replacements. 

The other thing you could do is if you can get the full model number, do a search on the internet on that model and see what shows up. People normally get verbal only for problems so take that into consideration also.

If you're mechanically inclined, also consider looking for used. I've bought a total of 10 older Craftsman's, 9 built by Murray and 1 by Roper/Murray, most with the Tecumseh Peerless transmission in them. I'm rebuilding most to resell. It's getting easier to find missing parts now that I know what I'm looking for and most wear parts are either available or have alternatives and these machines are built like a tank. They may not have all the whistles and bells the new ones have but then again, I look to move snow as fast as possible rather than how it looks or whether it has a radio or not  There are deals out there on used machines, but you need to do your homework ahead of time and be willing to fix whatever might need attention.

Good luck, hope it works our for you whatever you decide.


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Thanks guys. HCBPH it looks exactly like this one Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more if it helps.

I haven't seen it in person yet so unfortunately I don't have an answer to some of your questions. Thats why I asked here to see if anyone knew anything about it so when I do go to see it I'm alittle better off and know more of what I'm looking at. So hopefully the link will help with identifying it more and getting info.

I'm mechanically inclined but don't have the time to rebuild something or look for parts between my job and family life so I don't want to get into all that. 
I hate the customer reviews on the sites because most of these clueless people give it 5 stars because it shipped quick and looks cool but have yet to actually use the machine in the snow. Thats why I'm glad I found this forum


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

I can't seem to find the edit button so I'll post it here it looks to be model 247.887900 from the manual I just found. http://www.managemylife.com/mmh/lis_pdf/OWNM/L0712139.pdf it looks exactly like this one


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

*Snowblower*

I show a machine with a 247 s.n. prefix is a MTD originated machine. 
I did a quick look on the web, only issues I found seemed to be drive related.

Sorry, all I can find.


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

HCBPH said:


> I show a machine with a 247 s.n. prefix is a MTD originated machine.
> I did a quick look on the web, only issues I found seemed to be drive related.
> 
> Sorry, all I can find.


Thanks. So all in all it should be a decent machine by ball parking it? or is MTD not what it used to be? And of the issues you found does it seem to be major as in not worth the trouble or easily fixed by keeping certain things on hand or keeping an eye on it? or the ez steer trigger stuff or the actual forward and reverse movement? Appreciate you checking it out


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

*MTD's*

I honestly don't know about the newer ones, including MTD's. Maybe take a peek over on the MTD threads and see there any common issues there. I didnt' find enough info to draw a conclusion either way.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

MTD is definately not what it used to be..
generally the lower end of the quality scale these days..
personally, I would pass on any MTD, new or used..
Craftsman, Cub Cadet, Troy Bilt, White, and a few other names are all made by MTD now.

Most people consider the top three, in terms of quality, to be Ariens, Toro and Honda..and perhaps not coincidentally, those are also the only three manufacturers who have never "re-branded" their machines, and still make their machines themselves..

Rebranding means it has an old and once respected name, like Cub Cadet, but its now made by someone else..they are the old and respected brand "in name only"..like if Cadillac had cars made by Kia but they still had a Cadillac label on them..

MTD's arent necessarily *bad*..they do work fine..for awhile..just not as long or as reliably as other makes.

Scot


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

The current Briggs & Stratton line is also supposed to be on the higher end of the quality scale these days..Current John Deere, Snapper and Simplicity snowblowers.

JD had some lemons in their past, but the current Briggs line is supposed to be quite well respected, from what I have read..havent owned one myself though.

My opinion for good current names:

Ariens
Honda
Toro
John Deere
Snapper
Simplicity

dont ever buy ANYthing sold at Walmart!
Tractor Supply also sells some really low-end "generic name" machines..
I would avoid them too..

Scot


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

sscotsman said:


> My opinion for good current names:
> 
> Ariens
> Honda
> ...


Thanks but most of those are $1000+ in the size I'm looking for the 8-9hp range and I can't drop that kind of coin on them at this time they're nice machines and all but can't do it. As long as I can get something to last atleast 8-10 years and be decent I'm happy. I don't need to go 15-20 years it would be nice if it did but I don't mind getting something newer in 8-10 years again.

I did just see a used 26" Snapper come up looks to be a few years old maybe 5-10 y/o with a 8HP Tecumseh Snow King Engine for about $650. Sound decent?


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

samhane said:


> Thanks but most of those are $1000+ in the size I'm looking for the 8-9hp range and I can't drop that kind of coin on them at this time they're nice machines and all but can't do it.


Well, if you need a larger machine, 8-9HP, for under $1,000, then you cant do it!  because they dont exist brand new for less than that at that size..are you sure you *need* a machine that large? there are a lot of excellent brand new machines in the $700 $800 range that will be perfectly fine for 99% of people..

I dont know if I would drop $650 on a 10-year old machine..for another $100 you can get a very good brand new machine..$650 for used doesnt seem worth it to me..

I was considering spending $800 on a new snowblower, a "middle of the lineup" Ariens..spent $250 on a 40 year old snowblower instead..havent regreted it for a second..and I live in one of the snowiest regions in the USA..between Rochester and Buffalo NY.

IMO, my $250 40-year old Ariens is a FAR superior machine than literally half of the brand-new snowblowers on the market today..even when factoring in the age..

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/scottychaos/Ariens/Page2.html

If going used, I would look for a larger 10 to 40 year old Ariens for $200 to $400..there are a lot of them out there..if going used, avoid MTD brands all together..that $650 Snapper is probably a good machine, but I simply wouldnt bother to pay that much for a used machine, because the price is so close to a quality new machine..thats too much for used IMO..
(unless it was a large Honda, in which case $650 could be a steal! 
but thats just me..your mileage may vary! 

When used, condition and previous owner care are major factors of course..but snowblowers can often "age gracefully" if they are well cared for..and because in some regions they might only be used a few times a year..you can find a 30 year old snowblower that looks pristine and brand new, because the owner took good care of it: wiped it down after each use, stored it in the garage, maintained it well, etc..

Then you can find a 10 year old snowblower that is ready for the junk heap..because the owner never wiped it down after use, stored it outdoors where it got rained on, snowed on, piles of leaves landed on top of it, didnt bother with routine lubrication..etc..
So, like anything else, you have to look at it with a discerning eye..
but there are a LOT of 10, 20, 30, even 40 year snowblowers out there that are ready for another 30 years of service..

Sam, where do you live? what kind of snowfall do you get in your area?
and how big of an area do you need to clear?

Scot


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Thanks Scot

I live in South Jersey just outside of Philly so we get a pretty decent amount of snow maybe not like you get further up but usually relatively close since we are kinda close in the scheme of things. 

My house has a approx 30x60 driveway and I'm at the end of a dead end street so when the plows come I end up with a ton of snow, wet snow, ice, and mix of chunks that sometimes blocks part of my driveway thats why I'm looking for a more powerful machine. Plus because of the mail men around here I have to go above and beyond near the mail box because if they can't just stick their arm out the window to the box I won't get mail they will not lean or stretch in the least. The actually gave out cards from the post office with diagrams and instructions on how they want the area near our mailboxes shoveled out. So I have to use the blower the street too for another approx 10x 30-40 feet but that ends up being all the stuff left by the plows.

Doesn't seem like a big deal beacause the plows get pretty close to the curbs right? Wrong see even though we have an ordinance/law prohibiting parking on snow covered streets some of my neighbors and their "guests" leave their cars on the street so instead of having to clear out 2-3 feet from the curb I end up having to clear 10-12 feet. The police rarely do anything about this. My street is on the narrow side so the plow comes straight down only doing 1 pass and backs straight up and leaves. 

The 5hp blower I have now just isn't up to that job. Plus I do my mother in laws house she lives around the corner on a cul de sac and plows again can't get too close to the curb because of the bend and her ignorant neighbors. I end up doing more than I should with a shovel and with 2 bad elbows it makes it worse. That's why I'd like to have a bigger machine in the 8-9 hp range they usually have a bigger intake deck and a better sized impeller and chute. Even if its overkill for what I need I'd rather have and not need than need and not have. keeping all of my bases covered. Do we always end up with snow like last year no but I like to be prepared and ready for when we do.

Because of my schedule I work shift work 2-10pm and I have a long commute I leave at 1245 and don't get home till 1115pm so I don't have alot of free time I can invest in an older machine that needs tweaking or rebuilding especially with having a 3 y/o little man running around. And when the weather is bad I leave even earlier and get home later. 
I just need something thats ready to go when needed with the regular seasonal maintainence. Plus I'm handy and mechanically inclined and all but my specialty isn't with motors, etc. I can do some things and have a basic understanding but its just not my thing.

Thats why I was asking about the later model 9 hp Craftsman it seems to fit what I need and at the price I'm looking to spend but wanted to ask more knowledgable guys about info and opinions on it before I plopped down cash to see if there was anything else comparable in that neighborhood I should be looking at since I'm not up on this stuff.


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Meant to add this in last post but can't find edit button on my posts. 

I tried looking up reviews of a bunch of machines but most sites are biased since the have paid advertising from the companies they are reviewing. And when you look on the stores site or find another site it is being reviewed by unknowing dolts who haven't even used the machine once yet let alone for any peroid of time. 
These morons give it 5 stars for fast shipping and because it looks cool or pretty. But then nothing on actual performance or problems so I gave up looking at reviews as I have come to the conclusion they truly are useless.


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

samhane said:


> Thanks Scot
> 
> I live in South Jersey just outside of Philly so we get a pretty decent amount of snow maybe not like you get further up but usually relatively close since we are kinda close in the scheme of things.
> 
> ...


Where about in South Jersey, I'm in Mullica Hill


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Deptford


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

So your just up the road a few miles. My personal preference is to get an older snow blower mid 80's in fair to good condition or older and restore it.
The machine i used last was a restored 24" mid 80's Snapper that I put a 6.5hp ohv engine on. This year its a 1983 26" Cub Cadet that I put an 11hp engine on.

If you can find a good running old blower that would be my preference any day of the week. This are not contemplated machines and with good routine maintenance will last for a very long time.


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

CarlB said:


> So your just up the road a few miles. My personal preference is to get an older snow blower mid 80's in fair to good condition or older and restore it.
> The machine i used last was a restored 24" mid 80's Snapper that I put a 6.5hp ohv engine on. This year its a 1983 26" Cub Cadet that I put an 11hp engine on.
> 
> If you can find a good running old blower that would be my preference any day of the week. This are not contemplated machines and with good routine maintenance will last for a very long time.


I know and get what you guys are saying but I don't have that kind of time for restoring stuff etc. plus I have no desire nor find it relaxing to do that stuff just adds to my stress lol. And I don't have much knowledge of what to be looking for in the first place and I personally think this year we're going to get hit again like last year if not alittle worse. So I'd like something ready to go.

Know of any good spots in the area for service? I used to go to a guy in Woodbury but he closed up shop and doesn't do it anymore


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## CarlB (Jan 2, 2011)

sorry I don't know of any shops in the area.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

Sam,
based on everything you said, and especially the part about only needing a machine to last you 10-15 years or so, in that case the newer Craftsman will probably serve your needs very well..I am only "against" MTD's just because I know they arent built to *quite* the same robust standards of other makes..and I want a snowblower that will last 30 years!  but there are plenty of reasons to *not* need a snowblower to last 30 years..age, retiring to Florida in a few years, etc..in that case, perhaps long-term (multiple decades) isnt as big a deal..a new Craftsman should be fine for 10 years, when well maintained..

so for your case, a 2 or 3 year old Craftsman could be a good way to go..It still might not be quite as reliable as other brands!  (and IMO the odds of needing more repairs are higher, but not guarenteed, it could also go for years with no trouble) and being newer, and being well maintained, odds are good it should serve well for the years you need it..personally I would still look for a newer Ariens of the same vintage! 
but thats just me..MTD's arent terrible..just not "the best"..
sort of like buying a Chevy Cobalt instead of a Honda Accord..the Chevy isnt necessarily bad by any means..it will do the job, but probably not for as long a time or quite as repair free..

Scot


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Cool as long as I can get maybe 10 years or so out with normal regular maintainance of it I'm happy and maybe possibly in 2-3 years or so if I get my next promotion I'll sell it and look into getting a newer Ariens that fits the bill depending on how things go. And I'll have more free time when my little guy goes to school full time to try getting something older and retore it. Right now I dont exactly need the best at this time just something decent and understand what you're saying about how certain brands have fallen off from what they used to be it is very frustrating they slide down hill like that. And I'm usually all for buying and paying for the best it's just that at this time it's a little tough to do in these days right now.
Thanks again for the input and advice


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

*Used*

Sam

If you think the day will come when you may want to use an older machine, if you have the room to store something till you can do-your-thing, no time better than the present (or actually come spring) to watch for something to come along. It always happens at odd times so be ready if the chance happens.

I'm the anti-Ariens person (not really but I like the Craftsman's more with the actual Tecumseh transmissions in them), so take this as something from a prejudiced person.

Here are 3 of 10 machines I bought in the last 12 months.

























That's a pair of 10 HP 32" 3 stages and a 7 HP 26" 2 stage. The two red ones are done and I don't think I have under $200 in parts and upgrades to them, not bad seeing I bought them all three for under $125 total (not including gas). The grey one I just picked up so I haven't started that one yet but the other two were rebuilt over the spring and summer.

The older 536.918xxx & 536.882xxx 7 HP and up Craftsman/Murray machines you can either get through Sears or others all needed wear parts or there are alternatives available. These are from the era when they were built to last and do with normal maintenance. I bought a total of 10 machines in the last year to use and sell. I'm keeping 2, selling 5, 1 in progress and 2 used for parts so I think I can speak with some authority on them.

In all fairness, Ariens and many other brands also kick butt, have parts available for a long time and have a large following. That can in turn help drive prices up because there's more demand. Like anything else, it's supply and demand. Figure out what you might like, do some research then watch for the right one to come along.
Besides that, it's fun to see something brought back to like that can kick butt over some of the new stuff


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## Simplicity (Dec 8, 2011)

HCBPH said:


> Sam
> 
> If you think the day will come when you may want to use an older machine, if you have the room to store something till you can do-your-thing, no time better than the present (or actually come spring) to watch for something to come along. It always happens at odd times so be ready if the chance happens.
> 
> ...


I also was a proud owner of a 536. 9/26. Built to last granted had to do a few things here and there but heck if your reading this your not scratching your head when you hear the word snowblower maintenance.  Only qualm I had with this blower was that it did not have enough intake height but had the HP to power along through anything. One more thing I never liked from day 1 was the fact that it threw snow very little distance. Unless you were maxing out the chute I could never compete with my rival across the streets toro from mid 90's in terms of throwing distance but hey it still did the job . If you can find a 536 cherish it! I had many great times with my blower and glad it is now in the hands of a good friend so I know it will still be of use!


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

hate to rain on the crapsman parade but here is the facts. You'd be better off with a old 860 simplicity than a new craftsman, or a deere 826, or ariens or toro 824. The old ones were built better but hard to find parts for....see a craftsman dealer around? ever call that 800#??? Good luck with that. I work on a ton of throwers this time of year and I stay clear of the off brands, parts always must be ordered and it can take longer to find them online than the actual repair takes. Here in WI I have sold numerous machines for under $500 that would last 10-15 years with normal maintance and that is it. If I'm looking used I'm looking 1st for pro/commercial Simplicities(rear c-channel handle bars) then Ariens, toro and deere. The good Deeres were to older ones, the TRX/TRS ones are an overpriced MTD. I'd take an MTD or Murray over a craftsman too. Sears cheapens them up to meet there prices.


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## Simplicity (Dec 8, 2011)

twofishy4u said:


> hate to rain on the crapsman parade but here is the facts. You'd be better off with a old 860 simplicity than a new craftsman, or a deere 826, or ariens or toro 824. The old ones were built better but hard to find parts for....see a craftsman dealer around? ever call that 800#??? Good luck with that. I work on a ton of throwers this time of year and I stay clear of the off brands, parts always must be ordered and it can take longer to find them online than the actual repair takes. Here in WI I have sold numerous machines for under $500 that would last 10-15 years with normal maintance and that is it. If I'm looking used I'm looking 1st for pro/commercial Simplicities(rear c-channel handle bars) then Ariens, toro and deere. The good Deeres were to older ones, the TRX/TRS ones are an overpriced MTD. I'd take an MTD or Murray over a craftsman too. Sears cheapens them up to meet there prices.


Exactly those craftsman parts are pretty much extinct and also on the new ones they use a total of 6 sheer pins. The prices of pins are already kind of high unless anyone knows a good source, having 6 could be a real hassle. 1. because you need to have a min of at least 6 at a time to play it safe and 2. if you break more then one at time you got to replace a ton of pins. This is on the new craftsman pro 30". Only benefit I can maybe see is that if you need to replace a auger you can save some money because it uses several smaller auger blades.


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## HCBPH (Mar 8, 2011)

*Craftsman's*

Older large frame Murray/Craftsmans 536.918xxx or 536.882xxx models, you can get some real bang for your buck if you get the right one. Convert the axel and auger bushings to roller bearings (there's thread on that). Need a cable - even the special looped ends, either use a standard cable or cable ends are available from McMaster-Carr. Gearbox gear and seal are still available, same with the bearing on the impeller shaft along with the bushings and seals in the gearbox. Standard B&S parts. Even the smaller 4 & 5 HP machines, everything is available or substitutable with one exception - if you have the plastic bushings on the auger on the small frame units (4 & 5 hp with the 3/4" shaft). I haven't found a direct replacement for them unless you happen to have the clamshells for the earlier metal bushings, and those are available - again a B&S standard part. If I open the hole 1/4", I could use roller bearing but I'd rather not if I don't have to.

Those are your standard wear parts and I've replaced every one except for the auger gearcase gear but I've seen them available. Again I'm talking the 536-918xxx & 536-882xxx gear transmission machines only.

What else can wear out? Like I said, many machines can be picked up at a very reasonable price and put back into service even if not used for a long time as long as you know your parts or parts substitutions. This an example of some of the older Murray built Craftsmans, but many other brands have the same parts and options available.

I know different models were made by different companies, and unfortunately bean-counters have been involved for a number of years, cheapening up many brands of machines. Start with a good, well built machine (whatever the brand) and you can get years of use with as much or little time and money as you want to invest in it, having picked a solid starting point.


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

yea thinking about this I have a 80's deere 826 sitting in my garage. I got it for $100, new point, condensor, plug and fuel lines and filter....$20 (thanks tewarehouse) Went through it all and it is in great shape. Runs perfect and works perfect. I'd bet 20 years from now this thing is still alive and a new Craftsman bought this year is dead. I'll ask $425 or so for the Deere on Craigs and I should be able to get $400. I make descent cash and somebody will get a very nice solid blower that is way better built than anything new.


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## fronos4 (Jan 29, 2011)

samhane said:


> Thanks but most of those are $1000+ in the size I'm looking for the 8-9hp range and I can't drop that kind of coin on them at this time they're nice machines and all but can't do it. As long as I can get something to last atleast 8-10 years and be decent I'm happy. I don't need to go 15-20 years it would be nice if it did but I don't mind getting something newer in 8-10 years again.
> 
> I did just see a used 26" Snapper come up looks to be a few years old maybe 5-10 y/o with a 8HP Tecumseh Snow King Engine for about $650. Sound decent?


For around $600, have you considered the Ariens Sno-Tek 24 in. Two-Stage Gas Snow Blower (920402) I would choose this over a Craftsman any day. It's the "budget" Ariens who are looking for performance without the extra cost. I'm confident it would handle your snow removal needs. My neighbor has an older Ariens 520 (5hp/20") at first I thought it was a much larger machine from a distance cause it handled EOD snow very well 3+ feet at times. The Sno-Tek above is a bit larger and has more power so it shouldn't have any issues whatsoever. Just my 2 cents.


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

that sno-tek is a chineese built POS. Even the guys at depot don't want to sell them and my local ariens dealer won't carry them! Set your budget and buy a nice used unit if you need too.

Examples
Simplicity 860 or 870
Ariens 824
Deere anything without trx/trs
Toro 724, 824, 

should be able to find a nice one under $500, just sold my Deere 826 for $400, mid 80's but a perfectly nice looking and working machine.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

twofishy4u said:


> that sno-tek is a chineese built POS.


No, its not.
the snowblower itself is made by Ariens in Wisconsin, same as any other Ariens snowblower. 
the engine IS Chinese, I will grant you that..but so far people are having no problems with them, 
that I have read anywhere..

im no fan of things being made in China, but it is a fact that quality is greatly improving..
and the engines on the Ariens Sno-Tec machines are *not* low end clones..
they are a new design developed by Ariens and LCT..not a Honda ripoff..

so saying "that sno-tek is a chineese built POS" is totally untrue..
the snowblower itself, the entire machine except the engine, is not even made in China, 
so thats just flat out wrong, it is made in the USA by Ariens.

the engine is made in China, but no one has yet called it a POS..
they have been out 3 years now..have not heard of any complaints.

like it or not (and I dont like it) but Chinese engines are going to be on EVERYthing soon..
and they are getting much better in quality..as good as a classic American made briggs
or Kohler from 30 years ago? maybe not, but hopefully close..but thats going to be a moot point I think.

It sounds like the new Chinese made LCT engines on the Ariens black sno-tec machines are as good,
perhaps even better, than the Chinese-made briggs engines that have been on many snowblowers
and lawnmowers for 10 years now..most people didnt even know that was happening.

the only truly bad engines coming out of China right now are the true clones..the Honda clones.
these are engines where a Chinese company takes apart a genuine Honda engine and then literally copies (illegally) every single part, and builds a whole new engine that looks just like a Honda..but because they are built "on the cheap" they dont have *nearly* the quality of the geunine Honda engine..these clones are mostly found at Harbor Freight, (where yu can buy just the engine) and on *really* low end snowblowers and lawnmowers sold at Walmart, Tractor Supply, Costco, etc..the "brand name" snowblowers like Ariens, Toro, MTD, *are* all going with Chinese engines..but they are *not* the same engines as the clones..they are much better..and technicaly they cant be called "clones" at all..because they are not illegal copies of anything...

Scot


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## Talon1189 (Nov 30, 2011)

sscotsman said:


> No, its not.
> the snowblower itself is made by Ariens in Wisconsin, same as any other Ariens snowblower.
> the engine IS Chinese, I will grant you that..but so far people are having no problems with them,
> that I have read anywhere..
> ...



Daaayuum Scot......You really seem to know your chit buddy


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

So in fact the most important piece on the snowblower is chineese? Geeze I'm the idiot. So you'd rather have a new more expensive sno-tek than a nice used blower that I listed? I had a 1978 Ariens I sold for $275 this year that I'd bet my life on would have lasted longer than any sno-tek and you run an Ariens site and are appartently fine with this. No way should we be forced to buy these cheap overpriced POS snowblowers they build now. It's like buy a commercial unit, a japaneese unit or realize these things won't last more than 10 years. BTW how long since the 1st sno-tek has been out?


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

twofishy4u said:


> So you'd rather have a new more expensive sno-tek than a nice used blower that I listed?


I never said that..I will likely own nothing but 30, 40, 50 year old snowblowers for the rest of my life, im a huge fan of "old iron", my entire Ariens webpage is built around that premise..I was simply pointing out that your comment: "that sno-tek is a chineese built POS" is incorrect..and it is.
buying quality used snowblowers as an alternative to many new ones (which I highly agree with) wasnt the point..

Scot


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

Talon1189 said:


> Daaayuum Scot......You really seem to know your chit buddy


thanks! snowblower history has been a bit of an obsessive hobby of mine for several years now!  I plan to add a new section chronicling the switchover from American to Chinese engines on my webpage..the process started probably 10 years ago, accelerated dramatically when Tecumseh left the market in 2008, and will probably wrap up in another 1 to 5 years..we are right in the middle of the process right now.

(maybe im wrong and American-made Briggs engines will continue to made for a long time to come..but im not optimistic..)

Scot


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

Ok, I did some online research and I'm sure the sno-tek is much better than a craftsman but 10 years from now it may just be another POS. I did hear a rumor from a friend that works at Briggs that somebody may start producing tecumseh engines again. Where and when he didn't know.


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

twofishy4u said:


> I did hear a rumor from a friend that works at Briggs that somebody may start producing tecumseh engines again. Where and when he didn't know.


apparently there are some new chinese engines just out this year (appearing on new snowblowers that just came out this season, a few months ago) that are using the "Snow King" name again...Snow King is the old Tecumseh name for their snowblower engines, made in the USA up until 2008.

I dont yet know if these new "Snow King" engines are in fact the old Tecumseh designs, now made in China, or if its a different engine that simply licensed the Snow King name somehow, and is probably somehow connected with Tecumseh..

From what I have been able to find so far, they are only being used on current Husqvarna snowblowers this year:

Snow Thrower | Husqvarna | Homeowner

They definitely dont look like the old Tecumseh engines..I doubt they are based on them, probably a new design just licensing the "Snow King" name...I dont think they say "Tecumseh" on them anywhere either, but I havent checked out one in person yet to confirm..I have a Husqvarna dealer near me, I will go and take a look soon..

Scot


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## twofishy4u (Dec 6, 2011)

Looking at husky website I looked into the 208cc engine, seems many companies use this displacement motor. Seems as though it is a China briggs. Others don't seem to use the "snowking" name. Snotek also has a 208 in there lineup. See they have a 414cc monster, google that and I found the same cc at Northern tool under the powerhouse name????


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## Jkruseelle (Dec 2, 2011)

LTC (China) purchased Tecumseh small engine rights a while back!


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## sscotsman (Dec 8, 2010)

Jkruseelle said:


> LTC (China) purchased Tecumseh small engine rights a while back!


interesting! I hadnt heard that..
looks like LCT is shaping up to be the primary small engine supplier then..
they are building for Ariens, looks like Husky now too, and probably other names soon too...Looks like the market might end up to be a shakedown between LCT and Briggs..

I have never seen any confirmed connection between LCT and Briggs, but these days, who knows!
LCT pretty much filled the void left by Tecumseh in 2008..so it makes sense there could be a LCT-Tecumseh
connection..

Scot


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## samhane (Dec 3, 2011)

Here's a little update yesterday I ended up picking up a Toro 826 OXE like a year/little over old in my price range glad I held off this seems to be everything I'm looking for in a blower. As much as I hate the snow I'm kind hoping for a good storm to come through so I can try it out.

Thanks again for the input and info.


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## 69ariens (Jan 29, 2011)

I think you made good choice.


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