# Honda snow blower clogging concerns - update from Honda



## [email protected]

Hello snow blower community,

There has been a lot of discussion about the clogging issue for certain Honda snow blowers. We’d like to give you an update on what the issue is and how Honda is responding to it.

All snow blowers can clog under severe snow conditions, which is why Honda and other manufacturers supply a tool to help clear the chute.

But we do carefully monitor market quality and we do closely listen to what our customers tell us. Some customers have reported the chute seems to clog more easily than expected under certain wet, heavy snow conditions – conditions most commonly found around the Boston area. Fortunately, it only impacts a small number of customers. 

But, this has also made it much harder for us to find a solution, because we couldn’t duplicate the problem on a consistent basis. The right kind of snow had to fall in the right area before any testing could take place. That significantly delayed our ability to find a solution, especially this year, when snow did not fall until late in the season.

Honda’s quality team was in place during the last few snow storms. We were able to test possible solutions with a dozen different customers, with very positive results. Our quality engineers are now completing their analysis of the test data. 

The good news: we believe we are very close to finalizing a solution. More information will be coming once we have parts and service procedures in place. 

For those of you who are experiencing clogging issues, we recognize it has been a source of great frustration. We apologize most sincerely, and we thank you for your patience while we work to make this right.

A final note: [email protected] is not available to respond to forum inquiries at this time. We hope he will be back online soon. If you have questions for Honda, please reach out to our Customer Relations team directly. You can contact us here: https://powerequipment.honda.com/support/contact-us

Sincerely,
The Honda quality team


----------



## vinnycom

impressive customer support
.
.


----------



## UNDERTAKER

*Could have come to the Frozen Tundra with all of it's Super Duper snow storms that we have had Lately.k:k:k:k:k:*


----------



## TomHodge

_Maybe_ this means that I don't need to butcher the chute.


----------



## Miles

This response looks hopeful! It looks like Honda will stand behind it's product.


----------



## tabora

Worried about Robert, though... Sounds like he may be out of the office for some reason for an extended period... Hope he and his family are OK. I've tried contacting him a few times recently without success.


----------



## TomHodge

tabora said:


> Worried about Robert, though... Sounds like he may be out of the office for some reason for an extended period... Hope he and his family are OK. I've tried contacting him a few times recently without success.


Hope all is well.


----------



## drmerdp

I knew it was bound to happen eventually. Happy to see Honda form an official message and reach out to the community.


----------



## CalgaryPT

drmerdp said:


> I knew it was bound to happen eventually. Happy to see Honda form an official message and reach out to the community.


Aligns with my observations in Calgary where we see little wet snow and to date no issues with my machine. Nonetheless, I will watch the thread for any official Honda retrofits/mods.

Hope to hear from you soon [email protected] either way.


----------



## Bob_S

[email protected] said:


> The good news: we believe we are very close to finalizing a solution.


I just bought my HHS928 to my dealer for the #300 bulletin update. Maybe if they are slow enough it will be there long enough for Honda's upcoming fix.:smile2:


----------



## FullThrottle

What does the HSS928 #300 bulletin update refer too?




Bob_S said:


> I just bought my HHS928 to my dealer for the #300 bulletin update. Maybe if they are slow enough it will be there long enough for Honda's upcoming fix.:smile2:


----------



## tabora

FullThrottle said:


> What does the HSS928 #300 bulletin update refer too?


I'll bet he's referring to Service Bulletin #30 and just got an extra "0" in there...


----------



## FullThrottle

I just changed the oil and re-jetted my 928,I noticed the engine(GX270) as an oil plug on the opposite side of the drain plug and dip stick plug.
What's the reason for this extra plug?I put the oil back in to the engine via the dipstick plug,assuming that's where you fill it,then when I was removing the carb. bowl to install the new jet,I notice this other cap.Would be that if this engine is used on another unit ,and it be a place to change or fill the oil,if you couldn't do it the other way.


----------



## gregg

FullThrottle said:


> I just changed the oil and re-jetted my 928,I noticed the engine(GX270) as an oil plug on the opposite side of the drain plug and dip stick plug.
> What's the reason for this extra plug?I put the oil back in to the engine via the dipstick plug,assuming that's where you fill it,then when I was removing the carb. bowl to install the new jet,I notice this other cap.Would be that if this engine is used on another unit ,and it be a place to change or fill the oil,if you couldn't do it the other way.


Yes it can be used other ways. The Honda on my logsplitter has both .


----------



## TomHodge

It's been 3 weeks, any info from Honda?


----------



## tabora

TomHodge said:


> It's been 3 weeks, any info from Honda?



It's ONLY been 3 weeks... Good things take time. I'm willing to wait a while; hopefully they will come through before snow season.


----------



## jwasilko

Any update?


----------



## ZTMAN

Waiting for update


----------



## highlight

Talk is cheap. When they find a fix and then offers to fix my relatively new (JAn/2017) model with a fix that actually works then I will compliment Honda customer support. After buying a brand new 2015 Honda CRV only to be plaqued by constant engine vibration...listening to denials for over a year and then bringing it in for their comprehensive free fix which included new head rests, counterbalnce in rear taill gate, new radiator mounts etc only to have the vehicle returned to me with the same vibration issues....I find it hard to complement the Honda team just because they made a comment here on this forum.


----------



## leonz

Still waiting



:behindsofa:opcorn:opcorn:


----------



## gibbs296

Some soothing music and video to watch while you guys are waiting...


----------



## TomHodge

At least we get something!


----------



## TomHodge

11 weeks now. Nothing heard from Honda. Almost halfway to snow season here.


----------



## bigtim1985

I wonder if the fix is going to be something you can pickup from the dealer and do yourself, or have to leave at the dealer for a month and a half.


----------



## RedOctobyr

Anything is possible, obviously, and it's just my opinion. But given the area that's involved, my guess is there would at least be an option (preference?) to have the dealer do it. 



Hopefully, if it was something like changing something near the chute, maybe they could at least make parts available for people willing to do it themselves. 



But I wouldn't be shocked if they wanted the dealer to do it, so they have a record of what machines have received a fix, and so they know it's done by their service techs, etc. Or you could anticipate some trouble if something was installed wrong by a user, or came loose after, etc. 



Again, merely my perspective. This, obviously, would have to be weighed against machines needing a fix before the season starts, ideally, and dealers getting busy.


----------



## tabora

I contacted Honda Power Equipment directly and asked for an update... They promptly replied:

*From:* PE CR [mailto[email protected]] 
*Sent:* Thursday, July 12, 2018 3:14 PM
*To:* Andy Tabor
*Subject:* Snow Blowers - Issue with a Product [ ref:_00Do0JBy0._5001JbLLlh:ref ]

Hello Andy,

A service bulletin will be issued in the next few of months with the new chute design and all the information to repair customers units that have the problem of clogging in wet snow.

Dealers will be the first to see the bulletin when its released.

Please let me know if you have any questions.
Thank You









ref:_00Do0JBy0._5001JbLLlh:ref


----------



## Bob_S

> A service bulletin will be issued in the next few of month


Months?? You have to be kidding me. Will Honda fix machines that fall out of warranty during this time? The first batch of machines was sold three years ago come November/ December and that's when the warranty runs out. Weeks might mean 4-6-8 weeks, months could easily be into next year.:sad: At best if you can bring your machine to a dealer to get it fixed just before your warranty runs out, it could mean your snowblower is tied up at the dealer, potentially for weeks, during the first snow storms.


----------



## tabora

Bob_S said:


> Months?? You have to be kidding me. Will Honda fix machines that fall out of warranty during this time?


If you're concerned, take the 5 minutes it took me to contact Honda and ask them those questions, then post the response here... We'd all like to know the answer.

_"Better to act affirmatively than moan in ignorance."_


----------



## Bob_S

tabora said:


> If you're concerned, take the 5 minutes it took me to contact Honda and ask them those questions, then post the response here... We'd all like to know the answer.
> 
> _"Better to act affirmatively than moan in ignorance."_


Sure, I might try to call Honda but unless you get a specific commitment in writing I would not count on getting a no-cost fix for this problem after the warranty runs out.


----------



## tabora

Bob_S said:


> Sure, I might try to call Honda but unless you get a specific commitment in writing I would not count on getting a no-cost fix for this problem after the warranty runs out.



Don't call them, use their email system (the link is in the first post in this thread). Then you'll have a written record that you can share with us.


----------



## Lunta

tabora said:


> It's ONLY been 3 weeks... Good things take time.


Agree.

No point Honda publishing details of the fix until it is tested, validated and they are totally sure it will fix the problem. 

For lack of any other knowledge, let's assume the fix involves a shaped piece of plastic. They can test prototypes using 3D printed parts, making tweaks when required, then re-resting.

But when they finally find the exact dimensions of the part and they want to bring it to production, it doesn't happen overnight. I work with some parts that have a 6-24 month lead-time from the manufacturer just to make the tooling to form the part. That's before you even start making the part in any volume.

It's understandable that those with dodgy Honda blowers are frustrated, but equally understandable that a fix isn't rolled out as quickly as people might want.


----------



## DriverRider

Lunta said:


> For lack of any other knowledge, let's assume the fix involves a shaped piece of plastic. They can test prototypes using 3D printed parts, making tweaks when required, then re-resting.
> But when they finally find the exact dimensions of the part and they want to bring it to production, it doesn't happen overnight. I work with some parts that have a 6-24 month lead-time from the manufacturer just to make the tooling to form the part. That's before you even start making the part in any volume.
> It's understandable that those with dodgy Honda blowers are frustrated, but equally understandable that a fix isn't rolled out as quickly as people might want.



Huh? It is a freakin snowblower.:laugh: and ain't going to the moon. Time is running out as another season quickly approaches to retrofit existing machines. Honda dragged their heels even admitting there was an issue for what two or three years and a fix is past overdue. Car manufacturers make changes all the time during production runs and have parts available for campaigns within weeks when problems are acknowledged. Honda should certainly know the drill. Any design changes will first show on the next production run and to date? At this point another winter might come and go for further testing.


----------



## Lunta

DriverRider said:


> Car manufacturers make changes all the time during production runs and have parts available for campaigns within weeks when problems are acknowledged.


Nah. (I work in the vehicle industry and could give a longer explanation, but I doubt you would be interested in reading it  )


PS Nothing I wrote is factually incorrect and it's still entertaining to read your opinion.


----------



## RedOctobyr

The exact timing may vary, but I agree with Lunta. Molds take time (often months) to build. And then more time to ensure they are consistently making good parts, before you can start getting production parts from them.


----------



## TomHodge

RedOctobyr said:


> The exact timing may vary, but I agree with Lunta. Molds take time (often months) to build. And then more time to ensure they are consistently making good parts, before you can start getting production parts from them.


These blowers have been out for three years and in design and development months before that. Anyone from the NE would be able to tell them that wet snow packs.


----------



## orangputeh

spoke to dealer today about it. he said the reason the chute is designed that way is to protect the light. they can cut out some of the inside chute so it doesn't clog but then the light gets buried.


----------



## leonz

I have a wad of new stainless elevator bolts and nuts and I will be getting more blue stripe slick sheet plastic for my JD junk and If anyone wants their chute lined I will line their chute and spout for them after I cut the plate off for a minimal cost. 

Its crazy to have to wait for a simple fix when winter for some of us in the east is not that far away. And dealing with the END OF DRIVEWAY MONSTER is a given especially when salt is used by the municipality.

That reminds me I am still waiting on a response from the governor after I sent him a well written letter regarding salt wast and ice dams created by same on secondary roads.

I have found the power of the pen works well, as a matter of fact it cost the manager that fired me his old job as he was slid sideways to another glorified position.


----------



## DriverRider

orangputeh said:


> spoke to dealer today about it. he said the reason the chute is designed that way is to protect the light. they can cut out some of the inside chute so it doesn't clog but then the light gets buried.



Huh? What do you know that hasn't been hashed through in the forums. With the inside tract you have give us an example of whats to come ? Inquiring minds want to know.:grin:


----------



## DriverRider

Lunta said:


> Nah. (I work in the vehicle industry and could give a longer explanation, but I doubt you would be interested in reading it  )
> PS Nothing I wrote is factually incorrect and it's still entertaining to read your opinion.



Seventy five years ago for WWII we had had planes go from design to production in two years. yet a snowblower (freakin) now takes years? New cars roll off the assembly line and Chinlee has body panels for sale in the aftermarket before the first crash? 



PS Nothing I wrote is factually incorrect and it's still entertaining to read your opinion.[/QUOTE]


Don't know about Finland but here in the States that attitude ain't acceptable




Lunta said:


> Nah. (I work in the vehicle industry and could give a longer explanation, but I doubt you would be interested in reading it :smile: ).



Correct I do not have 24 months to wait for an answer.


----------



## RIT333

orangputeh said:


> spoke to dealer today about it. he said the reason the chute is designed that way is to protect the light. they can cut out some of the inside chute so it doesn't clog but then the light gets buried.



Somehow, I dis-credit your dealer's insights. Seems like it would have been easier to mount the light in a different location instead of compromising the blower's throwing capabilities. Just my $0.02


----------



## orangputeh

DriverRider said:


> Huh? What do you know that hasn't been hashed through in the forums. With the inside tract you have give us an example of whats to come ? Inquiring minds want to know.:grin:


I don't read every **** post here, fella. just reporting what I was told from the dealer.


----------



## TomHodge

Swapping a reduced visibility when blowing to the right at night for the ability to reliability blow snow is a no brainer. The could have just moved the light to the handlebar area.


----------



## RIT333

TomHodge said:


> Swapping a reduced visibility when blowing to the right at night for the ability to reliability blow snow is a no brainer. The could have just moved the light to the handlebar area.



Yep - like the Toro PowerMax, or even their previous generation light was fine. 



Personally, I think that Robert (from Honda) is a bit late with any follow-up posts to his initial post saying that a fix was forthcoming. I would NOT be real happy if I spent good money on a HSS,


----------



## TomHodge

RIT333 said:


> Yep - like the Toro PowerMax, or even their previous generation light was fine.
> 
> 
> 
> Personally, I think that Robert (from Honda) is a bit late with any follow-up posts to his initial post saying that a fix was forthcoming. I would be real happy if I spent good money on a HSS,


 I am actually embarrassed that I bought this pig. I have had Honda motorcycles back when I was young and foolish. And currently own two honda cars, a 2013 and 2018. So far, all have proved to be better than the blower, so Honda can do some things right.


----------



## CalgaryPT

I keep watching this thread because eventhough I haven't had a problem with my HSS 724ACTD in Calgary, I'll implement the fix myself if Honda doesn't back-date the warranty for it (doubtful).

More interesting to me is that Honda is missing a great opportunity to crowd-source a solution using this forum and its members' knowledge. Sharing their engineering findings, status updates, etc., could have really garnered a lot of good PR for them and turned an unfortunate design flaw into some bragging rights about their customer service. I could envision dealers being able to say, "even if problems are identified with our models, we work hand-in-hand with customers to fix them." Wow. That would reel me in if I were a potential customer (after I verified it with an example such as this thread of course).

Angry customers represent the greatest opportunity for customer loyalty when handled correctly. Few people take the time to complete a survey if everything goes well. More people complete it when they are angry. Everyone completes it if they were angry but the company redeemed itself.

Time will tell...


----------



## orangputeh

CalgaryPT said:


> I keep watching this thread because eventhough I haven't had a problem with my HSS 724ACTD in Calgary, I'll implement the fix myself if Honda doesn't back-date the warranty for it (doubtful).
> 
> More interesting to me is that Honda is missing a great opportunity to crowd-source a solution using this forum and its members' knowledge. Sharing their engineering findings, status updates, etc., could have really garnered a lot of good PR for them and turned an unfortunate design flaw into some bragging rights about their customer service. I could envision dealers being able to say, "even if problems are identified with our models, we work hand-in-hand with customers to fix them." Wow. That would reel me in if I were a potential customer (after I verified it with an example such as this thread of course).
> 
> Angry customers represent the greatest opportunity for customer loyalty when handled correctly. Few people take the time to complete a survey if everything goes well. More people complete it when they are angry. Everyone completes it if they were angry but the company redeemed itself.
> 
> Time will tell...


Excellent points. You're right. Honda could take these lemons and make lemonade .


----------



## TomHodge

orangputeh said:


> Excellent points. You're right. Honda could take these lemons and make lemonade .


_Can't resist._ 
Better than taking lemons and making snowblowers


----------



## DriverRider

RIT333 said:


> Personally, I think that Robert (from Honda) is a bit late with any follow-up posts to his initial post saying that a fix was forthcoming. I would be real happy if I spent good money on a HSS,



Robert was a good guy perhaps too good. I suspect he was reassigned and was made a casualty of this whole mess.


----------



## TomHodge

It's 90+ here with a 74 degree dew point! Why can't I get over the fact that the 7 month old $3,000 Honda HSS928ATD is sitting in my garage will be a severe pain in the ass for me this coming winter. I feel that Honda has stolen the $$ from me. and more importantly, ruined my sleep. Don't tell me to sell it, I wouldn't pass this POS on to anyone. I am convinced that Honda will just say TS sucker.


----------



## orangputeh

TomHodge said:


> It's 90+ here with a 74 degree dew point! Why can't I get over the fact that the 7 month old $3,000 Honda HSS928ATD is sitting in my garage will be a severe pain in the ass for me this coming winter. I feel that Honda has stolen the $$ from me. and more importantly, ruined my sleep. Don't tell me to sell it, I wouldn't pass this POS on to anyone. I am convinced that Honda will just say TS sucker.


if you are handy , you can cut out a part of that inside chute that is causing the clogging. maybe someone here can post a picture and a drawing line of the cut. the dealer showed me where but they are not doing it for free. ( of course )

most people i have spoken to love these machines except for this issue. the only other negative is the fact that the steering assist handles are cheap plastic which break easily. a 10 buck part but i think 50-75 bucks labor to install. not under warranty because they say "operator error"

that's why I would never buy a new Honda.


----------



## Bob_S

I have to think Honda is silent for a reason. The longer they put us off the less warrantee cost they may have to honor. If by chance the dealers get a green light to fix our machines come late fall, their won't be time to schedule in the work before snow hits. My dealer generally takes 6-8 weeks to get anything repaired.:icon-deadhorse:


----------



## RIT333

TomHodge said:


> It's 90+ here with a 74 degree dew point! Why can't I get over the fact that the 7 month old $3,000 Honda HSS928ATD is sitting in my garage will be a severe pain in the ass for me this coming winter. I feel that Honda has stolen the $$ from me. and more importantly, ruined my sleep. Don't tell me to sell it, I wouldn't pass this POS on to anyone. I am convinced that Honda will just say TS sucker.



Tom


Whenever you want to get rid of your "POS", let me know, and I will pick it up the next day - with no regrets. I am also in Upstate NY. Pin down your location a bit closer so i know how much gas I need in my SUV.


----------



## RIT333

orangputeh said:


> that's why I would never buy a new Honda.



I thought you had a Honda tattoo on your chest. Guess I am confused. 



Oh, I just noticed the caveat - "new".


----------



## CalgaryPT

orangputeh said:


> maybe someone here can post a picture and a drawing line of the cut. the dealer showed me where but they are not doing it for free. ( of course )


I too would like to know where the magical cut-line is for future ref. Once/if established this is indeed the problem, I'm happy to help others in the Calgary area with their machines.


----------



## panzer

After dealing with a 2011 F150 Ecoboost that let me start the list, factory auto start would work half the time, turbos cutting out, transmission leaking, transmission hunting for gears constantly, after cooler filling with condensation then when turbo would kick in the engine would literally flood with water, and the transmission would drop into second gear at 80 mph. So many trips to the dealer to have them tell me it is fine. After one year of battling it I took a bath on it when I traded in for a Titan. If I had all my time and money back from my Ecoboost I could buy myself a new HSS1332ATD and quite a few modified chutes. I spent more in and gas going to the dealership then what a modified chute cost. And even more time driving to the dealership. Sorry after dealing with 40k turd and hearing people get this upset over 80 dollar chute mod and a couple of hours of time. I just cant feel your pain. I will be ordering a HSS1332ATD or if you want to sell me yours I will take it off your hands.


----------



## leonz

Hello and good morning orangeputeh,


Did you move from Donner Pass to Lake Tahoe?

Is that a baby sasquatch you are holding under your arm or your four legged furbaby? 
I cannot read the sign you are holding, what does it say? 


Leon


----------



## orangputeh

leonz said:


> Hello and good morning orangeputeh,
> 
> 
> Did you move from Donner Pass to Lake Tahoe?
> 
> Is that a baby sasquatch you are holding under your arm or your four legged furbaby?
> I cannot read the sign you are holding, what does it say?
> 
> 
> Leon


get a magnifying glass!

I think the sign says "Need $$$ 4 Pooch!! Dog Bless!!"

I make good money with this sign and my killer watch dog.........need to living up here in Paradise.


----------



## cuz

This thread is bothering me because I’m about to buy a new Honda single stage blower. I hope Honda takes better care of it’s single stage owners. 

Good luck to you all, I hope you get a satisfactory resolution from Honda before this coming snow season.


----------



## leonz

I have 2 Toro Single stage 2 cycle engine snow pups. I would have all 4 of them but I did not have the 2 older ones repaired as it was in the middle of winter and I needed a snow thrower.
The great thing about single stage snow throwers is they have fewer parts and are much less difficult to own and operate.

What every you buy for snow removal just be sure to use some form of lubricant to slick up the chute and the paddles as you will see a 50% increase in throwing distance. I use fluid film and WD40 and I have to upgrade the JD JUNK with slick sheet material to protect the junk plastic chute and line the cross auger housing.

Using some form of lubricant will aid in slaying the END OF DRIVEWAY monster; Setting out bear traps for the plow trucks works once but they get really ornery after the first time............ 

OF course if they used HENKE high gate plows on the ends of the front plows or wing plows to avoid burying the driveways and cars they would create fewer problems but what do I know.


WHY JD does not go back to a single stage snow thrower I will never understand; BUT WE All know the reason is money and a junk RAD canadian imported 2 stage snow blowers they buy. 

There is a reason why RAD does not respond to e-mails or phone calls from individuals by the way.


----------



## CalgaryPT

I can tell you the single stages are great. I own a new 2016 dual stage HSS724 ACTD as well as a HS520 and do up to 26 properties. The single stage is my go-to machine 95% of the time because of the great job it does. I am replacing it with a newer 720 single stage this year only because a friend wants the 520 from me and I want to buy the slightly more powerful 720.

I've had the 520 for 10 years+ and it runs like a dream. Just change the oil regularly and swap out the augers as needed. Tell it you love once in a while too.

Don't let all the geek out talk about the dual stage ones scare you away. Every machine has its issues. I've had Toros, MTD's, Ariens, Craftsman, and a few others, single and dual staged, just because I like rebuilding and tinkering with them. 

The single stage Hondas are my fav. Only complaint is they vibrate a bit and after 26 properties you need to rest. But I've never met anyone dumb as me who uses a single stage for that many properties...I just like the way they clear the snow down to the pavement so well that I don't get out the dual stage when I should.

As I am getting older I won't be doing as many properties this year, but will still be using my Honda single stage.

You won't regret the decision.


----------



## leonz

Hello CalgaryPT,

Have you thought about putting larger jets in the carburator to cut down on the vibrations due to the detuning due to the EPA/Environment Canada rules and regs. about engine exhaust?


----------



## CalgaryPT

The vibration I'm experiencing is the paddles hitting the pavement--which gives the clean finish. These machines were intended largely for residential use, maybe a few properties at best. Commercial use is usually limited to pros packing the machines up and going to the next contract, or at least taking breaks on large properties (which I don't do, but should).

My mistake is doing repetitive sidewalks and driveways for all of my neighbours all at once. The vibration from the paddles migrates up the auger shaft to the handle then to my arms. The tingling (precursor to nerve damage) goes away when the auger is disengaged and I just stand there with the machine running, but not being pulled along by the rubber paddles. On days when the snow continues to fall, I am out in the hood two or three times/day--that's 6+ hrs. of vibration. I go through 5-6 sets of paddles/season. 

I mitigate it somewhat with thick gloves and foam pipe insulation on the handle. 

As mentioned, all my fault but should be less of a problem this season as I reduce the number of properties I do. 

WRT jets and the real point of this thread, I do intend to drill out my jet on my two stage before summer ends. But it's 34 C in Calgary today, so that would cut into my beer drinking today LOL.

Thanks for the suggestion. We'll see how the 724 behaves come snow season with a bigger jet.


----------



## YSHSfan

Hey CalgaryPT,


I think I know exactly what you need and that is a newly designed tracked HSS724 with a single stage auger design with rubber paddles and plastic scraper bar..... that should solve the vibration issues and clean all the way down to the pavement, though it would be heavier than the HS520/720.


----------



## RedOctobyr

CalgaryPT, are the handlebars 2-piece? Do they have a bolt partway up the handlebars that goes through a lower bar, and an upper bar, and is tightened to lock them together? 



If so, perhaps you could add some isolation there, as well. A piece of rubber sandwiched between the two bars (and preferably also between the bars and the bolt components that tighten them together) could help provide some vibration isolation for the upper bar. 



I confess I'm tying to figure out what changing the jet would do, relative to vibration. The paddles hitting the ground won't change, of course, and the physical shaking of the engine (due to imbalances) won't change. If you increase the power somewhat, it doesn't seem like that would reduce vibration, anyways. But hey, if you could add some power by addressing a lean-running condition (like for the larger Hondas), maybe you could clear more quickly, which would reduce the time exposed to the vibration, at least.


----------



## CalgaryPT

YSHSfan - I think you're a genius. How cool would that be?


----------



## CalgaryPT

RedOctobyr said:


> CalgaryPT, are the handlebars 2-piece? Do they have a bolt partway up the handlebars that goes through a lower bar, and an upper bar, and is tightened to lock them together?
> 
> 
> 
> If so, perhaps you could add some isolation there, as well. A piece of rubber sandwiched between the two bars (and preferably also between the bars and the bolt components that tighten them together) could help provide some vibration isolation for the upper bar.
> 
> 
> 
> I confess I'm tying to figure out what changing the jet would do, relative to vibration. The paddles hitting the ground won't change, of course, and the physical shaking of the engine (due to imbalances) won't change. If you increase the power somewhat, it doesn't seem like that would reduce vibration, anyways. But hey, if you could add some power by addressing a lean-running condition (like for the larger Hondas), maybe you could clear more quickly, which would reduce the time exposed to the vibration, at least.


I agree with you about jet issue -- I don't think for this particular issue it is connected. Personally I never found the 520 underpowered and was surprized Honda upped the HP, but hey...whatever.

I do like your isolation suggestion on the handlebars though. When I buy the new 720 in a few months I have to mod the handlebar anyways to add a light just as I did on my old 520.

Need to look and see if the setup is the same on the 720. Maybe some type of insert that is spring loaded between the two sections? 

Ooooooooooo ...... I see a fabrication project in my future. Great idea!! Thanks.


----------



## TomHodge

Any word from Honda?


----------



## leonz

TomHodge said:


> Any word from Honda?



I checked the honda power equipment page and the only ones they have listed are the 2015 snow blowers with transmission issues.so....
:crying:


----------



## tabora

As I suggested in Post #30 in this thread, everyone should use Honda's email system (the link is in the first post in this thread) to contact them for answers. Then you'll have a written record that you can share with us, and Honda may get the message that we're growing impatient... They answered me pretty quickly back on July 12th (see post #26).


----------



## jwasilko

I just emailed them from their website.


----------



## jwasilko

The two replies I received:


Honda is aware of the situation and our model engineers have evaluated the problem. 

We have determined this issue only occurs with certain conditions of snow (wet) along with only happening in certain areas of the United States.

The engineers are in the process of being able to correct the issue on new inventory being produced at the present time with updated parts.


******



I then asked about when modified inventory would be ready to purchase new and got:


There is no definite ETA at this time on new inventory. However updated parts will be available for dealers to order and install on units they have at their
location around October /November.


----------



## leonz

Mumble, mumble; do they mean the existing unsold and crated inventory in their shops or the units sold in the recent past that need them??? Mumble, mumble.


----------



## RIT333

To me, it sounds like if you already own an HSS, then you are SOL. Real sucks in my opinion.


----------



## RedOctobyr

RIT333 said:


> To me, it sounds like if you already own an HSS, then you are SOL. Real sucks in my opinion.



Without an explicit answer from Honda on what happens for retrofits of units that were already purchased, that's just guessing, though. Preferably, with asking them whether it makes a difference whether the machines are still under warranty. 



jwasilko, since you already have an open dialog with them, any chance you could ask them about this as a follow-up?


----------



## tabora

RIT333 said:


> To me, it sounds like if you already own an HSS, then you are SOL. Real sucks in my opinion.


Not true, based on my inquiries... Since it's a service bulletin, it should apply to units in the field; they're just trying to save money by getting to the unsold units first.


----------



## orangputeh

leonz said:


> Mumble, mumble; do they mean the existing unsold and crated inventory in their shops or the units sold in the recent past that need them??? Mumble, mumble.


exactly. our dealer has a ton of new honda's in crates. sales are down.

honda should be proactive and offer a free fix. they know there is a problem. instead they are dropping the ball.


----------



## boathik

Today, I received this response:

We are contacting you in response to your concerns regarding the problems you are having with your snow blowers chute clogging. *We apologize for any inconvenience this might have caused.

Honda is aware of the situation and our model engineers have evaluated the problem.*
*
We have determined this issue only occurs with certain conditions of snow (wet) along with only happening in certain areas of the United States.
*
The engineers are in the process of being able to correct the issue on new inventory being produced at the present time with updated parts.

Your dealer will be notified when parts become available for them to order to correct the problem as well.

Thank you for allowing us to review and respond.
*
Honda Power Equipment
Customer Relations

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk


----------



## leonz

Mumble, mumble, it still does not help the folks with the older machines nor does it answer the questions about fixing the older units for those buyers from 2015 forward.


----------



## SnowCat in Bend

QUOTE=boathik -- Today, I received this response:

We are contacting you in response to your concerns regarding the problems you are having with your snow blowers chute clogging. *We apologize for any inconvenience this might have caused.

Honda is aware of the situation and our model engineers have evaluated the problem.*
*
We have determined this issue only occurs with certain conditions of snow (wet) along with only happening in certain areas of the United States.


Honda Power Equipment
Customer Relations



I experienced this problem in Central Oregon on a brand new HSS928 from the first day of ownership. Returned it back to the dealer after contacting Honda directly. From my personal experience, the problem was not only happening in the Eastern United States.


----------



## leonz

Like I said, Mumble, mumble, deny, defer, delay, delay, delay, deny, mumble, mumble, mumble.
At least the Yamahas are tested for years on northern Honshu and Hokkaido Island for years before they cross the Pacific pond.


----------



## tabora

leonz said:


> Like I said, Mumble, mumble, deny, defer, delay, delay, delay, deny, mumble, mumble, mumble...


Is it really so hard to simply ASK HONDA directly what you want to know? The following exchange took me less than 5 minutes over the past hour:

TABORA @ 11:43: When specifically do you anticipate having a service bulletin issued and parts available for the chute clogging issue for units already sold since 2015?

HONDA @ 12:06: We anticipate the parts availability for the dealers to install on sold units and their inventory with instructions for installation around mid-October.


----------



## tmckaug1

Called dealer this morning they have nothing yet, looking for fall ?


----------



## leonz

tmckaug1 said:


> Called dealer this morning they have nothing yet, looking for fall ?




Something tells me we are in for one **** of a Halloween night snow storm with heavy wet snow and with no help for the honda owners anytime soon and in the few hours we will get saddled with a 12 inch dump of heavy wet snow because of a warm front even good shovels will be of little use.


OH SURE honda we only have wet snow in a few spots on the east coast of the United States. 
That reminds me of a boss I had underground once that told a machinery supplier that we had flat floors and the 6K axles they had as standard on the fuel trailer were just fine AKA, blown tires and broken spring city. Needless to say it ended up being a "Wooly Mammoth or Mastadon" stuck in the tar pits, as it was useless in the mine headings.


----------



## sgiustino

[email protected] said:


> Hello snow blower community,
> 
> There has been a lot of discussion about the clogging issue for certain Honda snow blowers. We’d like to give you an update on what the issue is and how Honda is responding to it.
> 
> All snow blowers can clog under severe snow conditions, which is why Honda and other manufacturers supply a tool to help clear the chute.
> 
> But we do carefully monitor market quality and we do closely listen to what our customers tell us. Some customers have reported the chute seems to clog more easily than expected under certain wet, heavy snow conditions – conditions most commonly found around the Boston area. Fortunately, it only impacts a small number of customers.
> 
> But, this has also made it much harder for us to find a solution, because we couldn’t duplicate the problem on a consistent basis. The right kind of snow had to fall in the right area before any testing could take place. That significantly delayed our ability to find a solution, especially this year, when snow did not fall until late in the season.
> 
> Honda’s quality team was in place during the last few snow storms. We were able to test possible solutions with a dozen different customers, with very positive results. Our quality engineers are now completing their analysis of the test data.
> 
> The good news: we believe we are very close to finalizing a solution. More information will be coming once we have parts and service procedures in place.
> 
> For those of you who are experiencing clogging issues, we recognize it has been a source of great frustration. We apologize most sincerely, and we thank you for your patience while we work to make this right.
> 
> A final note: [email protected] is not available to respond to forum inquiries at this time. We hope he will be back online soon. If you have questions for Honda, please reach out to our Customer Relations team directly. You can contact us here: https://powerequipment.honda.com/support/contact-us
> 
> Sincerely,
> The Honda quality team


This sounds like more top heavy Honda beurocratic white wash coming from Robert at Honda. They should have SOLVED THIS ISSUE BY NOW. It is not rocket science, people. Get it done already.


----------



## sgiustino

Sounds like the typical beaurocratic answer coming from the spokesman. Honda has been very LATE to fix this issue. Get it done already people. It is not rocket science!


----------



## orangputeh

no snow no worries.

you can do it yourself ( the fix ) .it's not rocket science.


----------



## tmckaug1

sgiustino said:


> This sounds like more top heavy Honda beurocratic white wash coming from Robert at Honda. They should have SOLVED THIS ISSUE BY NOW. It is not rocket science, people. Get it done already.


OK I opened a case as well, see what happens, thanks


----------



## tabora

People, READ THE ENTIRE THREAD... Parts and Service Bulletin will be available at dealers in October.


----------



## Lunta

tabora said:


> People, READ THE ENTIRE THREAD... Parts and Service Bulletin will be available at dealers in October.


Agree. 

Remember also that this is the internet. A place where people can be lazy without consequence, be an expert without qualification and generally mouth off excited (and sometimes drunken) opinions on subjects that they don't realise they don't fully understand. 

I'm equally guilty sometimes and love the internet :smile_big:


----------



## cwolcott

I opened a case with honda a couple days ago. Received a response today asking when the fix will be available under warranty for brand new hss928atd presenting this clogging problem all last winter. Response attached. They do only say they are working on getting it onto new units sold. Completely ignored answering when it will be available to me.









Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## cwolcott

tabora said:


> Is it really so hard to simply ASK HONDA directly what you want to know? The following exchange took me less than 5 minutes over the past hour:
> 
> TABORA @ 11:43: When specifically do you anticipate having a service bulletin issued and parts available for the chute clogging issue for units already sold since 2015?
> 
> HONDA @ 12:06: We anticipate the parts availability for the dealers to install on sold units and their inventory with instructions for installation around mid-October.


Nice to see the favorable response you received. Hope we can count on it. Honda's response to me today to the very same question did not address when I as an existing owner can get the fix. They only told me they are working to get the new parts on new machines in production. For a problem they've denied for so long that kind of non-responsive response is just unacceptable.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## cwolcott

Here's latest received from honda today on availability of the clogging fix for existing owners.









Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## leonz

Send me your chutes!!!


----------



## orangputeh

leonz said:


> Send me your chutes!!!


if you know how to fix these , leonz , maybe you can do a tutorial here with pictures.

you'd be a ROCK STAR!


----------



## cwolcott

Does anyone know exactly what the fix is that Honda has come up with? I've followed threads here that prescribe the fix requires modifying the chute to eliminate or reduce the size of the sheet metal flap at base of chute. Then I've seen too the fix is to increase the diameter of the fitting in the carburator fuel line. Curious whether either of these or both happens to also be the official design fix from Honda? If it is, I'd just as soon install those on my own and be done with it rather than wait any longer.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## RedOctobyr

If I'm not mistaken, the carburetor item that you're referring to is increasing the size of the carb's main jet, in the carb itself, for more power. You would do some minor disassembly of the carburetor to make this change, along with buying a larger jet. 



This certainly won't make clogging any worse. If the engine's making more power, and holding RPM better, that should help avoid clogging. But I would be surprised if Honda's upcoming fix did anything with the carb. The jet change is more of a general performance improvement, vs specifically being related to clogging. 



If you're looking for more power, I'd certainly look into changing the jet, while separately following the clogging-reduction changes from Honda. I don't think we've seen anything specific from Honda on what changes exactly they are planning for the clogging. Like whether it will be a replacement chute, etc.


----------



## Bob_S

Parts at dealer mid-November. Are you kidding me? My dealer can't get any work schedule in less than 3 weeks and their clock does not start unless they have the machine. What this means is it won't be fixed for this winter.


----------



## cwolcott

RedOctobyr said:


> If I'm not mistaken, the carburetor item that you're referring to is increasing the size of the carb's main jet, in the carb itself, for more power. You would do some minor disassembly of the carburetor to make this change, along with buying a larger jet.
> 
> 
> 
> This certainly won't make clogging any worse. If the engine's making more power, and holding RPM better, that should help avoid clogging. But I would be surprised if Honda's upcoming fix did anything with the carb. The jet change is more of a general performance improvement, vs specifically being related to clogging.
> 
> 
> 
> If you're looking for more power, I'd certainly look into changing the jet, while separately following the clogging-reduction changes from Honda. I don't think we've seen anything specific from Honda on what changes exactly they are planning for the clogging. Like whether it will be a replacement chute, etc.


Thanks redoctobyr. I just received the larger main jet yesterday. I order two different ones two sizes larger than factory size. I also ordered a new chute with modified outlet that takes the size of that big flap of steel down to something much smaller. Expect it Monday or Tuesday and next weekend I intend to do both mods. From what I now understand the primary culprit is that conical piece of metal at bottom of chute that is intentionally tall enough to prevent chute from blowing snows at the light when positioned in that direction. I have an hs724wa I bought new around 20 years ago. It has been an absolute champ ever since. Last year I was overcome by hunger for a new toy, so I bought the hss928atd, thinking with the success of my hs724wa how could I go wrong. Everytime last winter the hss928atd would clog I pulled out my trusty hs724wa and it ripped through the very same snow with no issues. And for all 20 years now it has started every year everytime 1st or 2nd pull of recoil start. After eating threads here I started comparing the two mchines and sure enough, the main jet on my older machine is much larger as shipped from the factory and it does not have that big honking flap of steel right at the bottom of the shoot.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## cwolcott

This photo shows big difference in the chute design between hs724wa on left and brand new hss928atd on right. That big flap of sheet metal that's actually beveled inward to boot is at least part of the problem. Looking forward to replace that booger next weekend along with the main jet diameter in the carb. In the meantime, I will hang onto my loyal hs724wa until snow falls and I can confirm these fixes do the trick for mine.









Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## leonz

Once you cut that snow concentrator off the base of the chute all you need to do is just have a snow brush handy with a rope to hang it on the handle bars unless you want to glue a piece of the kiddee roll up sled with gorilla glue or super glue to the light housing it after you heat it a little. by gluing a long piece of the kiddee sled to the plastic housing on the sides and the top you make it look like a traffic light cover guard to keep the crap off of the light and then you cna use it with no issues about covering the light.

Me-I would disconnect that *&^%$%^&*() light and park an LED lightbar on the plastic between the handlebars and an LED spot light on the chute OR several simple 12 volt light bulb housings onn the housing if that is possible to have a lot of light that will not be covered by snow.

Just have some fluid film handy to coat the cross auger housing and the augers and chute several times before the season starts and while your working with it.


----------



## cwolcott

leonz said:


> Once you cut that snow concentrator off the base of the chute all you need to do is just have a snow brush handy with a rope to hang it on the handle bars unless you want to glue a piece of the kiddee roll up sled with gorilla glue or super glue to the light housing it after you heat it a little. by gluing a long piece of the kiddee sled to the plastic housing on the sides and the top you make it look like a traffic light cover guard to keep the crap off of the light and then you cna use it with no issues about covering the light.
> 
> Me-I would disconnect that *&^%$%^&*() light and park an LED lightbar on the plastic between the handlebars and an LED spot light on the chute OR several simple 12 volt light bulb housings onn the housing if that is possible to have a lot of light that will not be covered by snow.
> 
> Just have some fluid film handy to coat the cross auger housing and the augers and chute several times before the season starts and while your working with it.


Thanks leonz. Great suggestions I will pursue with the alternate lighting. The led show on my older honda is a custom retrofit. I added a rectifier to convert the 12ac to 12vdc to drive the led instead of the factory halogen. Do you know if the factory wiring to the hss928atd led is something I can just tap into directly to drive a stronger, bigger led bar on front of the plastic control panel?

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk


----------



## leonz

I am not sure if it has enough amperage to do that but the information on the light bar and spot light on the chute if used will give you the total demand needed if you choose to pursue that method of lighting.


----------



## grump99

Does anyone know if the updated chute from Honda must be installed by a dealer or can we just install it ourselves? 

Also, is Honda going to charge us for this? I would hope not considering it's a design fault.


----------



## leonz

They will probably charge the owners of the machines that are out of warranty for the so called new chutes.


----------



## gibbs296

grump99 said:


> Does anyone know if the updated chute from Honda must be installed by a dealer or can we just install it ourselves?
> 
> Also, is Honda going to charge us for this? I would hope not considering it's a design fault.


I'm sure the dealer must install it as there will be some labor time, part to be charged out, part to be returned process that must be completed. If it's a recall, Honda will pay. Bulletin is covered as long as in under warranty time period.


----------



## RIT333

leonz said:


> They will probably charge the owners of the machines that are out of warranty for the so called new chutes.



Maybe I missed it, but how do you guys know that the factory fix for the HSS machines IS a new chute, or is this just an assumption ?


----------



## leonz

I never assume anything, 

I remember that they said the problem was not a problem (and the product of the owners imagination pretty much in my opinion), and this 2 stage model stage snow blower had no problems real or imaginary in the beginning of this snow blower saga.

Thinking back the model before the current type with the light in the cowling did not have a restricted chute and was completely open at the base so.....

I suppose they could offer to install an LED Spot light on the cowling and chop the chute to fix it. 
But using a snow brush on the light cowling or gluing a strip of a roll up kiddee sled to the light housing to cover it after the chute is chopped up would eliminate the worry about blocking the LED light. 

Hopefully the whole mess will not turn into a honda civic/ford pinto gas tank disaster (so to speak) as folks spend a lot of money on these things to remove snow.


----------



## [email protected]

Hi all, Honda has posted a new update on this issue. Please see the new thread for complete details. We hope this will address many of your questions. 
Thank you for your continued patience.


----------



## SkunkyLawnmowers

Hi & welcome Cycle!!!

This thread may answer many of your questions. 


https://www.snowblowerforum.com/for...erns-official-update-honda-parts-info-44.html


----------



## sscotsman

I never really noticed we had two seperate threads on this issue..im going to close this thread and move Clyde's reply over to the new thread: 

https://www.snowblowerforum.com/for...oncerns-official-update-honda-parts-info.html

Scot


----------

