# Summary of Impeller Mod Best Practices?



## Stang

Hi all, 

I've done lots of reading on these forums regarding the impeller mod and decided this is a definite must before I paint and reassemble my 1979 Ariens 924039. Lots of people went about this mod in distinct ways, but I'm trying to gather what's generally been regarded as best practice. Here's what I settled on and bought so far:

Baler belt from TSC
Zinc plated steel punched flat bar, 1-3/8" wide, 1/16" thick, Everbilt brand (Home depot)
Zinc plated 5/16" nylock nuts
Stainless 5/16 x 1 coarse threaded hex bolts

What I'm still undecided on is the following:

1) I have a 4-blade impeller. Do I mount 2 of them, or all 4? I've seen arguments for both, but never a generally-accepted best practice

2) My impeller blades have about 3.25" of flat space before curving upward. I've seen people mount the rubber only on the flat portion, and I've also seen it mounted up the curve. Is going up the curve necessary?

3) How many bolts are needed? I've seen 2, 3, and even 4 per blade. The center of each hole in the plate steel is about 3/4" apart, so my bolt spacing will be either 3/4" or 1.5"


My impeller fan is currently free of the blower and shaft. What's the best way to drill through thick steel like this? Vice grip and a good drill bit with oil?

Also, most impellers like mine have a dip in the middle of the blade and that's where people usually drill. If I mount the impeller and plate steel over this, there will be a gap that I assume will retain moisture from time to time. Is this a recipe for accelerating rust/rot?

Thanks in advance.


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## Jackmels

*My Method for Seals*

Here's one I did last week on a 4 blade ariens 32 impeller.( I don't do seals on the 6 blade Ariens machines; I don't feel they need it.) I first cut 4 pieces of belt and backing plate, and then remove the chute. I then set the belt on the impeller blade in the position I want it, and then mark holes on the belt, taking into consideration the distance of the holes on the backing plate you are using. I then drill holes in the belt, and then re position it where it was. I then mark the impeller by using a sharpie through the holes in the belt. I then remove the belt, and place a large screwdriver between the impeller blade and the wall to keep the impeller from moving. I then drill the holes in the impeller blade and attach the belt and backing plate. Rinse and repeat. Use a "Good" New Drill bit, and drill using low RPMs. I use 2 bolts per side with red loctite applied. I Generously Spray the entire area with PB Blaster to help it break in. Make sure you look at the bottom side of the impeller before you drill holes, there's a flange that can interfere with the bolts. Good Luck with your "First Rodeo"! Addenda.... I use 1/4"hardware ...5/16 is overkill IMHO


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## 43128

this is how i do it for ariens snowblowers. i use toro s200 paddles. i remove the chute. measure the impeller blades and cut them to size using an angle grinder. i then cut a piece of sheet aluminum or sheet steel slightly smaller them the piece of rubber i cut out. then i take the rubber and sheet metal and lay it on the the impeller blade pushing the rubber as close to the impeller housing as possible. i then use self tapping screws with i believe a 5/16 hex head, and use my impact driver to put it in the screws, making sure that the screws are not hitting any impeller support brackets. i then start the engine, let it get up to operating temperature, set the throttle to full, and engage the attachment clutch slowly, dont engage it suddenly like you normally would or you will more then likely stall the engine, when you feel you can safely completely engage the augers. i then allow the snowblower to run with the augers engaged for 5-10 minutes to wear them in, i dont use a lubricant to help break them in. after i check to make sure everything working properly, i then reinstall the chute. you will be amazed by the difference in not only dry snow but especially in wet snow. ****, mine can even slow the super wet slush far without clogging. if you have a honda clone, feel free to crank up the rpms to 3800, and bore out the main jet with some micro drill bits or a torch tip cleaner. i just bought a tach for setting up my machines that i sell and i just clocked in my 910018 at 4400 rpms, with a pretty much stock predator that only has a bored out main jet. the clones can take the abuse(mines been running like that for two years and the engine was used when i bought it with an unknown service history), and the engine still runs great with no signs of developing . oh, and i only do half the impeller blades, so if you have four blades, do the two opposite of each other, the impeller spins so fast that it wont even matter that you do all four, the goal is to keep the impeller wall as clean as possible so ice and slush doesnt build up and cause clogging


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## ctdave

how I did mine while out of the machine. cut square holes to use carriage bolts. steel backing plates from h d. used thick reinforced Honda paddles, ( they were the size I wanted) lock washers and nylon insert lock nuts, with loc tight. put on all 4 paddles. sprayed with fluid film, then ran for about a min or 2 to fit in. you can see the rubber marks and the black from the burn in. i put them on the back side and used carriage bolts because of the full paddle design on these.i did not want to interfere with cintrifical force from the center outward and have snow pack on the edge of the paddle. made a big difference with the slush and water.


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## Stang

@Jack: So it looks like you use 2 screws per paddle. I can't tell from the picture - do your paddles continue to follow the curve of the blade? Also, it looks like you did not drill in the center "dip" of the blade, correct? Would it matter if you did?
@43128: What would you have done differently if you have the fan out on the bench like I do? Also, you're the only one of the three that did only 2 blades. You're sure there's no difference?
@ctdave: That looks great! I can tell you had just painted yours. I am on the fence about painting mine now or next year. One of my holdups is the idea of breaking in rubber paddles on brand new paint and stripping it. How's the paint where you broke yours in? I also noticed you put your paddles below the blade instead of above. How come?


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## 43128

sorry forgot that yours was out on the bench. assuming that all of bearings were in spec?tolerance, i would have measured the gap before disassembly and then left however much i had measured hanging over the edge of the impeller blades(so if you measured a 1/4 inch gap before disassembly, leave a 1/4 inch overhang when installing the paddles. i believe that two paddles is just as good as doing all four, i have not experienced any issues with accelerated bearing wear or anything like that, and for somebody like me that buys and sells equipment for a hobby, it saves me money in materials when i go to sell these machines. and im not doing the two blade impeller kit on only machines i sell, i do it on my personal machines because i believe it is the best and most economical way to do it


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## Stang

Bearings were all in spec (but I'm replacing them while I have them out anyway). I seem to remember about a 3/8-5/16" gap, but I'm kicking myself for not writing it down as I could be wrong about that.


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## ctdave

Stang said:


> @Jack: So it looks like you use 2 screws per paddle. I can't tell from the picture - do your paddles continue to follow the curve of the blade? Also, it looks like you did not drill in the center "dip" of the blade, correct? Would it matter if you did?
> 
> @*43128*: What would you have done differently if you have the fan out on the bench like I do? Also, you're the only one of the three that did only 2 blades. You're sure there's no difference?
> 
> @*ctdave*: That looks great! I can tell you had just painted yours. I am on the fence about painting mine now or next year. One of my holdups is the idea of breaking in rubber paddles on brand new paint and stripping it. How's the paint where you broke yours in? I also noticed you put your paddles below the blade instead of above. How come?


why below blade, i say why in my post, the style of impeller blade (full) on that series. just my reasoning though, not sure if it makes a diff .......paint ; so far just the rubber marks from wearing them in, you can see in the pic


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## Stang

ctdave said:


> why below blade, i say why in my post, the style of impeller blade (full) on that series. just my reasoning though, not sure if it makes a diff .......paint ; so far just the rubber marks from wearing them in, you can see in the pic


Ah I misread your post. I thoughts you meant "i put them on the back side *and used carriage bolts because of the full paddle design*" instead of "*i put them on the back side* and used carriage bolts* because of the full paddle design*". I'm not sure if I understand what you mean by full paddle design, though ::shrugs::


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## Stang

Regarding my question about drilling into the center "dip" versus the edge of the paddle, here's a visual of the dip I am referring to:


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## 43128

for that style impeller i always use self tapping screws on the outermost edge so the rubber is held up nice and tight against the impeller wall. its parts of the reason why i use self tapping screws, not only are they easier to use but they are thinner and just as strong so you can fit them in tight areas that you wouldnt be able to drill large holes into. sometimes i dont even use a piece of sheet metal its not necessary for every snowblower


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## 43128

here are the pictures of my impeller kit on my personal machine, on mine i chose not to use a piece of sheet metal. also i have some pictures of my predator, maybe someone can decode my serial number


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## dbert

I think ctdaves version looks slick. Literally slick, with the seal underneath and the smooth carriage bolts. I was after something similar (slick) when I used full size plastic seals on top.
This blower has been operated since this old thread linked below was written and seems to work well. 
Link to HDPE impeller seals thread


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## ctdave

Stang said:


> Ah I misread your post. I thoughts you meant "i put them on the back side *and used carriage bolts because of the full paddle design*" instead of "*i put them on the back side* and used carriage bolts* because of the full paddle design*". I'm not sure if I understand what you mean by full paddle design, though ::shrugs::


 sorry for the confusion. on my series of machine ,look close at the shape of the impeller, then look at the shape of yours and the other pics in this thread the impeller blade are a different design.my series (older) are one solid piece from the inner edge to the outer edge


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## ctdave

dbert said:


> I think ctdaves version looks slick. Literally slick, with the seal underneath and the smooth carriage bolts. I was after something similar (slick) when I used full size plastic seals on top.
> This blower has been operated since this old thread linked below was written and seems to work well.
> Link to HDPE impeller seals thread


thanks, slick is why I wanted to do it this way ,with this style of impeller. i did not want interference with snow over the impeller blade, from the inside edge to the outer edge, and I keep it sprayed with fluid film. I did the square holes while I had the impeller out of the machine. the rubber paddles, have a slot that I cut, so if needed ( if it gets worn to much for any reason) I can reach in loosen the nuts and adjust the rubber paddle without removing from the machine


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## Stang

Thanks for the followup info and pics. 

Given the perpendicular metal below each fan blade, I would have to mount the rubber on top, so I guess it's just a question of whether I drill through the dip or up along the lip. Has anyone had any issues with trapping moisture in the dip and subsequent corrosion?


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## Kielbasa

I am wondering how much of a space people have on their machines between the impeller fan edge and the body where they think they need these impeller kits. I just went down in to the cellar and I checked my space. I checked right at the exit hole at the top and I have maybe... 3/16" of an inch, maybe. I can just get a slight finger tip in there. Then I checked down in side of the impeller area at about 4 o'clock. I have just about the same amount of clearance and this is with all four fins. I can throw in the range of about about 35'-40' (ish). 

Now when guys add these kits, what kind clearance space left? And how much do you actually gain in throwing distance? 

Here is my clearance kit...


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## ctdave

Kielbasa said:


> I am wondering how much of a space people have on their machines between the impeller fan edge and the body where they think they need these impeller kits. I just went down in to the cellar and I checked my space. I checked right at the exit hole at the top and I have maybe... 3/16" of an inch, maybe. I can just get a slight finger tip in there. Then I checked down in side of the impeller area at about 4 o'clock. I have just about the same amount of clearance and this is with all four fins. I can throw in the range of about about 35'-40' (ish).
> 
> Now when guys add these kits, what kind clearance space left? And how much do you actually gain in throwing distance?
> 
> Here is my clearance kit...


on the 24" machine I had a 1/4" and slightly more on one of the blades. probably from hitting stuff over the years. the addition of paddles made a huge difference. we had little snow last year here, but I went along the edge of the street in about 5-6 inches of slush (mostly water) and was able to throw it with no prob and no clogging. my 32 inch machine like yours has very little space. no paddles needed. it never clogged on me and throws 40' or so.. the impeller paddles close the gap on the impeller housing to zero they run right up against the housing.


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## Stang

I haven't been able to find any info about moisture/crud getting into the "dip"/channel. It seems to me like that would be a recipe for causing it to rot out over time, no?


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## Stang

Ok so I opted not to cut the rubber long enough to travel up the curve, figuring I would keep the "dip" open so water and slush can be flung out and not get trapped. 

On to my next question: This may be a silly one, but do I want my holes to be threaded so my 5/16" bolts screw into the fan blades (and still get secured with a nylock nut on the other end)? Or do I want to drill slightly larger than 5/16 so the screw passes through? I suspect it doesn't matter and I could probably just drill a 5/16" hole so it snugs right through, but I figured I'd ask before I drill.


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## jermar

I used stainless bolts, and red Loctite. I cut up an old blade from a single stage. I made the rubber sit tight against the barrel. I sprayed cheap silicone tire shine to break in the rubber.


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## Stang

I ended up drilling 5/16" holes for a snug fit. Also, taking my time and keeping the bit clean and well-oiled, I was able to do this with an 18v cordless drill. I gave myself plenty of "meat" (between 3/8" and 1/2") past the fan blade, figuring it'll wear down. 








One quick question: As you can see from the middle picture, the steel bar bent a little when snugging the bolts down with the nylock nuts. Should I use large washers to prevent this from happening?


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## blindfaith429

Been thinking about doing this to my 20" Ariens. I need to get it going first though lol (rebuilding the carb).
What "gap" will need this upgrade? I need to measure mine still.
Thanks!


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## Stang

blindfaith429 said:


> Been thinking about doing this to my 20" Ariens. I need to get it going first though lol (rebuilding the carb).
> What "gap" will need this upgrade? I need to measure mine still.
> Thanks!


I'd say for a gap of anything greater than 1/4", it should be worth it. As a disclaimer, though, this is my first impeller mod so I haven't tested it out yet.


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## Stang

I just wanted to provide some pictures for anyone thinking about this mod in the future. I've attached a picture of the impeller fan after I first mounted it, with the rubber pressed up against the housing. The other two pictures are from after I ran it for 5-10 minutes or so with some PB blaster sprayed in the housing. It wore down nicely. Can't wait to test it out.


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## danmp

Really good mod !


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## Duff Daddy

Saved. Scheduled trip to TSC and HD

Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk


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## driz

Just watch your finger drilling those holes. The way it ended up with mine your trigger finger was right over that sharp edge of that chute. When that drill bit breaks through each and every time I mased my finger in there was no way to avoid it and it was always right there waiting. That was the worst part, drilling the holes🤕. By the second one you can see what's happening and your waiting for it which just makes it hurt even more.😖 I just locked my auger in place with a piece of 2x4 stub rammed it in there so that I can drill down from the top straight. Myself all I had laying around was some treadmill belt so I cut off 3 pieces of that and it's been holding up fine for two years now , works great . Two years and not one single plugged chute not ever 👍.


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## Duff Daddy

Fack I may just buy the kit off eBay for 40 bucks

Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk


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## Stang

Duff Daddy said:


> Fack I may just buy the kit off eBay for 40 bucks
> 
> Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk


Not a bad idea. I assembled it myself in case I wanted to do more machines in the future, but the eBay kit is well-priced. 




driz said:


> Just watch your finger drilling those holes. The way it ended up with mine your trigger finger was right over that sharp edge of that chute. When that drill bit breaks through each and every time I mased my finger in there was no way to avoid it and it was always right there waiting. That was the worst part, drilling the holes🤕. By the second one you can see what's happening and your waiting for it which just makes it hurt even more.😖 I just locked my auger in place with a piece of 2x4 stub rammed it in there so that I can drill down from the top straight. Myself all I had laying around was some treadmill belt so I cut off 3 pieces of that and it's been holding up fine for two years now , works great . Two years and not one single plugged chute not ever 👍.


I drilled mine when it was off the machine and on the bench, which made it much easier I imagine. I realize this may not be an option for everyone, but I suggest doing it so you can also grease/unseize anything and change the bearing while you're at it.


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## all3939

Did my mod on the Ariens 7524E six years ago and doesn't show any wear. I used conveyor belting using the smooth side facing the the snow.

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## Dauntae

No pics but I finally did it to my 6/22 Snapper, only did 2 of the 4 blades however but keeps the snow off the housing, only got to try it in some serious slush and did clog the chute a few times but this slush would have stuck to anything, though it did throw it quit a bit farther than I remember it throwing snow. Just need some good snow to see how it really does.


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## all3939

Dauntae said:


> No pics but I finally did it to my 6/22 Snapper, only did 2 of the 4 blades however but keeps the snow off the housing, only got to try it in some serious slush and did clog the chute a few times but this slush would have stuck to anything, though it did throw it quit a bit farther than I remember it throwing snow. Just need some good snow to see how it really does.


That's like saying the impeller needs only two blades why did they put four. They put four because it's designed around four. 2 out of 4 is in my opinion a waste of effort. That's like walking with one shoe. The two impeller blades with the kit will work much harder then necessary. To me it's simple logic why it's still clogs. Yes slush isn't easy on the blower but I will tell you if all else is up to par your issue is the slush from the non modified blade falls back to the next blade which is modified but just can't handle that much. Probably not beneficial for the impeller bearing either. Then again it's only my opinion.


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## Dauntae

Actually the reasoning of the mod is to stop the impeller housing from getting any build up so if you have 4 blades only 2 are required and as long as there on opposing blades balence shouldn't be a issue. The rubber does not help the throwing it basically just keeps the housing cleared, Why it throws farther is because there is no snow obstruction blocking it from being thrown, My blockage was the sticky slush actually sticking to the top of the plastic chute, Once it started getting stuck at the top it just built up from the top on down.


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## n84434

No pictures, but I did the mod to all four blades on my 1983 Toro 724 and finally was able to try it out this last weekend. Amazing difference, I have to say.

I used a paddle from a single stage and stainless hardware through a strap to hold it all in place.

It's pretty cool how much better this old workhorse runs, with such a simple change.

No clogging and I'm throwing snow like a pro!


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## Stang

I finally got to test out the mod on a difficult job (5 inches, wet and heavy, slush on the bottom). All I can say is WOW. I managed to do the whole job, including the dreaded end-of-driveway slush, without stopping to de-clog once. There is no doubt in my mind that this is completely worth the time and effort. 

I was a little nervous when I disengaged the augers for a few minutes and some of the caked on stuff melted a bit. When I re-engaged, I had some slush buildup that wouldn't clear. However I fed it some fresh snow and it "pooped" the slush out and eventually cleared itself. I doubt it would have done this without the mod. I don't think this is a result of me only doing 2 blades instead of 4, though. Having seen this in action, I think Dauntae is correct about the purpose just being to keep the impeller housing clear, which 2 blades will accomplish just as well as 4 blades. With rusty paint, the chute still gets caked on slush that will melt as you continue to use the machine. 

Really, really cool mod.


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## all3939

Stang said:


> I finally got to test out the mod on a difficult job (5 inches, wet and heavy, slush on the bottom). All I can say is WOW. I managed to do the whole job, including the dreaded end-of-driveway slush, without stopping to de-clog once. There is no doubt in my mind that this is completely worth the time and effort.
> 
> I was a little nervous when I disengaged the augers for a few minutes and some of the caked on stuff melted a bit. When I re-engaged, I had some slush buildup that wouldn't clear. However I fed it some fresh snow and it "pooped" the slush out and eventually cleared itself. I doubt it would have done this without the mod. I don't think this is a result of me only doing 2 blades instead of 4, though. Having seen this in action, I think Dauntae is correct about the purpose just being to keep the impeller housing clear, which 2 blades will accomplish just as well as 4 blades. With rusty paint, the chute still gets caked on slush that will melt as you continue to use the machine.
> 
> Really, really cool mod.


Stang, 
I'm glad you got to use it but I disagree with your logic about 2 blades versus 4. Then again, it's your machine.


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## Tony P.

Stang said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Lots of people went about this mod in distinct ways, but I'm trying to gather what's generally been regarded as best practice. Here's what I settled on and bought so far:
> 
> Baler belt from TSC
> Zinc plated steel punched flat bar, 1-3/8" wide, 1/16" thick, Everbilt brand (Home depot)
> Zinc plated 5/16" nylock nuts
> Stainless 5/16 x 1 coarse threaded hex bolts


I know you already bought some stuff, but given you're mentioning the desire to identify best practices I want to add some comments.

Clearly baler belts are frequently used but the type of material/rubber (rather than it's alternative use) is critical to creating the best paddles. Almost all baler belts are made of SBR (styrene-butadiene). SBR is inferior to neoprene in many regards and neoprene rubber should be used rather than SBR. For example, SBR does not hold up well to petroleum products or natural oils. As a result, oil-based lubricants shouldn't be sprayed on the housing with SBR paddles - which is done by many owners to keep snow off the housing. Neoprene does not have these issues and costs the same.

I also believe stainless steel should be used throughout rather than only for the screws or bolts. Zinc plating will not stand up well to either snow/water or salt.


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## RIT333

I disagree about the only purpose of the mod is to tightened the gap, and keep the snow off the housing's edge. If you start with a 12" impeller, and add 3/8" of rubber to it, you will increases the impeller's diameter by about 3%. This will increase the tip speed by 3% and also help to throw the snow farther along with the sealed impeller resulting in an overall g-normous improvement that most have reported.

My question is - Why don't the manufacturers do this at the factory ? We must be missing some downside, right ?


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## all3939

RIT333 said:


> I disagree about the only purpose of the mod is to tightened the gap, and keep the snow off the housing's edge. If you start with a 12" impeller, and add 3/8" of rubber to it, you will increases the impeller's diameter by about 3%. This will increase the tip speed by 3% and also help to throw the snow farther along with the sealed impeller resulting in an overall g-normous improvement that most have reported.
> 
> My question is - Why don't the manufacturers do this at the factory ? We must be missing some downside, right ?


I believe it can be done but here's my take why they don't. Precision comes at a cost and when ope does his own repair it will be impossible to get the impeller perfectly centered and a whole new set of problems start. Some time back one of the members rebuilt a snowblower and extended the impeller tips via welding to a very close tolerance. The outcome was impressive to say the least but a slight misalignment will have the impeller hitting the housing. When I have nothing else to do I may try.


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## Stang

Information and debates like this are why I started this thread to get a good summary of best practices. Keep it coming. 

For what it's worth, I do plan to dig into this machine for a repaint (probably when it's warm again), so modding the remaining 2 blades is still on the table. I like the point about increasing the impeller's diameter. I have to ponder some facts about centripetal force to see if it would, in theory, make a noticeable difference. 
@Tony P. - Thanks for the great info on supplies. Do you have a source for appropriate neoprene rubber, and stainless hardware? I wasn't able to find a punched flat bar in high grade stainless and the only nylock nuts my hardware stores had were zinc plated.


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## Tony P.

Stang said:


> @Tony P. - Thanks for the great info on supplies. Do you have a source for appropriate neoprene rubber, and stainless hardware? I wasn't able to find a punched flat bar in high grade stainless and the only nylock nuts my hardware stores had were zinc plated.


Here's some information on neoprene. I used 3/8" because my gap was 5/8" and I needed the extra strength. Cut strips 2 1/4". Become familiar with durometer hardness scale. The link I supplied is a hardness level of 30A, equal to a tire tread.

https://www.grainger.com/product/E-JAMES-Rubber-Strip-1DTZ5?functionCode=P2IDP2PCP

On stainless steel, to be honest I used galvanized although I believe stainless to be a best practice. They're called mending plates and are available at Lowes and HD. Brass is also good.


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## Town

Stang said:


> ... I like the point about increasing the impeller's diameter. I have to ponder some facts about centripetal force to see if it would, in theory, make a noticeable difference.
> 
> ....


I think centripetal force is what keeps the impeller blade (and anything attached to it) attached to the impeller "rod". The snow is subject to centrifugal force which moves the snow to the end of the impeller and out the chute opening.

For the same rotational speed (and enough engine power) a larger impeller will move the tip of the blade faster and impart more force to blow the snow out the chute faster and farther. For a 14" impeller an increase of 1/4" radius would give about a 3% increase in diameter while a 12" impeller would be 4%. 

I did not notice a large increase in throwing distance going from a 11hp 30" blower with 12" impeller to a 12.5 hp 30" blower with 14" impeller. The bigger machine is faster for the same snow conditions.


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## RIT333

Town said:


> I did not notice a large increase in throwing distance going from a 11hp 30" blower with 12" impeller to a 12.5 hp 30" blower with 14" impeller. The bigger machine is faster for the same snow conditions.


Have you checked Arien's quoted spec for impeller rpm for your 2 machine comparison. They may have changed pulley sizes which may be why the extra 1/2" did not change your throwing distance.


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## RIT333

all3939 said:


> I believe it can be done but here's my take why they don't. Precision comes at a cost and when ope does his own repair it will be impossible to get the impeller perfectly centered and a whole new set of problems start. Some time back one of the members rebuilt a snowblower and extended the impeller tips via welding to a very close tolerance. The outcome was impressive to say the least but a slight misalignment will have the impeller hitting the housing. When I have nothing else to do I may try.


Thinking more about this - 

OEM can probably get the impeller accurately centered in the housing and extend the tips with longer blades, but then as the bearing wears, they would now get a metal to metal scraping, and customers would not like that one bit. But, it would seem that they could extend the tips with rubber as many users have.


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## Town

RIT333 said:


> Have you checked Arien's quoted spec for impeller rpm for your 2 machine comparison. They may have changed pulley sizes which may be why the extra 1/2" did not change your throwing distance.


The 11 hp is a 2005 Craftsman that has all the features of a Husqvarna that I gave to my son. The 12.5 hp is my Ariens Platinum SHO. So quite different machines. Here there is 2" difference in impeller diameter. The benefit of a larger engine and larger impeller is that you move more snow faster so you run in a higher gear. Ariens is not accurate in specs on impeller rpm. Check out the Ariens Pro versus the Platinum 30 SHO specs. Same engine rpm, same engine pulley diameter, same impeller shaft pulley diameter (same pulley part #). Yet the Pro impeller speed is rated 29 rpm faster than the Platinum (1112 compared to 1083). It is difficult to compare specs across manufacturers when not all relevant info is available. 

The 1/2" difference in impeller diameter refers to adding a 1/4" of belting to increase the impeller radius. I have no experience doing this. The Craftsman gap at the impeller to housing is about 1/8" while the Ariens is 3/8". Seems to me the small gap on the Craftsman makes a big difference in performance, but that is pure speculation.


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## jermar

I have a new Ariens compact 24. Is this mod worth the effort on a new machine?


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## RIT333

jermar said:


> I have a new Ariens compact 24. Is this mod worth the effort on a new machine?


Depends on how big the gap is between the blade tip and the housing, but most would say "Just Do it".


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## cranman

I just did a mod on my ST824 with fantastic results. I used the Tractor Supply Baler belting and 1'' 5/16 regular bolts and nylon lock nuts. I used it in some heavy snow with slush on the bottom and it threw better then ever. I then used the same model machine to finish up but without the impeller mod, and it seemed pitiful next to the one that had the impeller mod. I will do the mod on any machine I plan on keeping for myself from now on.


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## Stang

Thanks to the unexpected Nor'easter I have more data to report. 

We received 12 inches of pretty nasty stuff. It was basically a "lasagna" of different snow types. The ground was still wet and slushy, followed by heavy snow, and a layer of sleet, topped off by more heavy snow. My old Ariens handled everything without complaint. More significantly, it did not clog. Not once. Not even close. It even chewed through the end-of-driveway stuff without any fuss. I was even able to re-throw EOD crap that I already threw on top of untouched snow. All in all, I had this thing working hard for over an hour. 

Here is the end result:



Completely clear. With only 2 blades modded. I honestly can't think of a tougher task to give this machine. 

Hmm..


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## Vincent_Diesel

*Impeller parts for Ariens Deluxe 24*

Forgive me if it's already been mentioned.

This last storm was heavy wet snow. As some of you mentioned, this mod is great for throwing that slushy mess with good results. Couple of quick questions.

1. Looked at eBay and found a few kits. Do you only measure the flat part of the impeller blade and order the correct length appropriately? (not including the curved part of an Ariens impeller).

2. Is it worth extending the rubber piece along the entire edge of blade, including the curved part? Is it difficult to fasten the rubber along the curve / entire edge?

3. Besides eBay what are the alternatives? Part numbers?

Thank you.


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## cranman

Tractor supply.....4" baler belting.....home depot steel strap with holes......5/16 x1" bolts....lock nuts......Jam a screwdriver between the impeller and housing. Use the strap to place holes in the baler belting.....take the belting and place on the impeller and mark holes with a 5/16 long drill on the impeller......drill holes...bolt belting and strap on the impeller....repeat.


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## RIT333

cranman said:


> Tractor supply.....4" baler belting.....home depot steel strap with holes......5/16 x1" bolts....lock nuts......Jam a screwdriver between the impeller and housing. Use the strap to place holes in the baler belting.....take the belting and place on the impeller and mark holes with a 5/16 long drill on the impeller......drill holes...bolt belting and strap on the impeller....repeat.


You left out the most important steps -

Start up snowblower

Blow some wet snow

Smile !


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## KennyW in CT

All my customers that went with what I call the "squeegee treatment" paddle upgrade called me to say they never had so much fun blowing heavy wet slushy snow. Definitely a great modification. And cheap too!


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## cranman

On my 8-26 Jacobsen this year I went from clogging every two feet to throwing slush and that was just doing two of the paddles. I'll absolutely do any "keeper" machines from now on.


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## Stang

Keep the data coming. 

I'm still interested in gathering "Two versus four" experiences here.


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## The Q

I will be doing this modification this spring before I put her up for the summer. 4 paddles and I will be doing all 4


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## drmerdp

First, Definitely install paddles on all impeller blades.

(After typing this I realized it was me thinking out loud.)

Second, So I have a thought. I am planning on going in 1 of 2 directions. I want to either add paddles to my impeller blades or make a UHMW Liner for my impeller housing. Essentially the same end result of eliminating the gap between the blades and the housing.

The machine in question is my HSS honda. My main reasoning for the liner that my street is loaded with pebbles, that are noticeably scraping at my impeller housing to the point of polishing the metal surface. This will Kill Two Birds With One Stone. Protect my Housing and assist with slushy snow. 

Now heres the interesting part, My MTD 826 with an impeller kit is not experiencing the same type of damage to its impeller housing. I painted the impeller housings on both machines before this past storm (stella!). The honda is down to metal again, and the MTDs paint was worn but not even close to as much.

So this got me thinking, on the Honda The pebbles are the perfect size to lightly jam between the impeller and housing (1/8" - 3/16") causing gouging. As for the MTD, there is a 1/16" or less gap. So it would appear that an impeller kit could also possibly Kill Two Birds With One Stone.

Fabricating a UHMW liner is not impossible, but would require a lot more effort. The liner would need to be mechanically fasten to the housing with counter sunk screws. And I'm estimating that 16 is the minimum, considering the violence occurring in that space. Besides, there is something so permanant about drilling 16 holes into an impeller housing. Kinda hard to stomach on something so new and expensive.

Simply fabing up impeller seals seem like the way to go.


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## BillE

May I ask a couple of questions?

1) How long should the 'paddles' be? Rubbing on the housing? Just kissing the housing? Bit of a gap?

2) Seen it two ways but, 'paddles' on the attack side or trailing side?

3) Last one (for now)-Does it matter if the 'paddle' follows the total width of the (thru the bend) or just the flat part?


Just to say...this is for a Craftsman/MTD and the gap is around 5/8"!

Thanx!

Bill


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## RIT333

If you have a gap between the paddle and the housing, you are giving up some of the reason/advantage of doing the project.

If you extend past and hit the housing, it will eventually wear to the point of just touching the housing at its closest point. And, it will make the impeller and engine work hard to wear off the rubber, so don't make them too long. 

So, the optimum length is the length that will just hit hit housing at its closest point. There will possibly be a gap at some points in the housing, but probably not very much.

Next, the paddles should be mounted on the leading edge of the impeller. This will provide the most strength, and less likely to tear the rubber.

Finally, I have seen that most people just try to put them on the flat edge of the blades. I think this is because it may be too hard to bend the rubber to match the blades curvature. So, my opinion that it depends on how flexible the rubber is that you use, and also how much curvature there is in your blade. Seems like the longer that the rubber is along the blade, the better - but the flat part alone should be enough to hit your neighbor's roof !

Report back when finished to compare notes.


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## all3939

BillE said:


> May I ask a couple of questions?
> 
> 1) How long should the 'paddles' be? Rubbing on the housing? Just kissing the housing? Bit of a gap?
> 
> 2) Seen it two ways but, 'paddles' on the attack side or trailing side?
> 
> 3) Last one (for now)-Does it matter if the 'paddle' follows the total width of the (thru the bend) or just the flat part?
> 
> 
> Just to say...this is for a Craftsman/MTD and the gap is around 5/8"!
> 
> Thanx!
> 
> Bill


Bill, look at this link where I address some of your concerns
http://www.snowblowerforum.com/forum/general-snowblower-discussion/96905-summary-impeller-mod-best-practices-4.html


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## 43128

i rip the paddles out of old toro s200 s620 snowmaster 20 single stage snowblowers


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## BillE

RIT333 said:


> If you have a gap between the paddle and the housing, you are giving up some of the reason/advantage of doing the project.
> 
> If you extend past and hit the housing, it will eventually wear to the point of just touching the housing at its closest point. And, it will make the impeller and engine work hard to wear off the rubber, so don't make them too long.
> 
> So, the optimum length is the length that will just hit hit housing at its closest point. There will possibly be a gap at some points in the housing, but probably not very much.
> 
> Next, the paddles should be mounted on the leading edge of the impeller. This will provide the most strength, and less likely to tear the rubber.
> 
> Finally, I have seen that most people just try to put them on the flat edge of the blades. I think this is because it may be too hard to bend the rubber to match the blades curvature. So, my opinion that it depends on how flexible the rubber is that you use, and also how much curvature there is in your blade. Seems like the longer that the rubber is along the blade, the better - but the flat part alone should be enough to hit your neighbor's roof !
> 
> Report back when finished to compare notes.


 That is pretty much exactly the way I've been thinkin'. 


I won't be doing the mod until spring (the real spring-not calendar). Even with a semi-heated garage, it's just too cold to be playing with steel.

Thanx for the info!

Bill


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## BillE

all3939 said:


> Bill, look at this link where I address some of your concerns
> http://www.snowblowerforum.com/foru...05-summary-impeller-mod-best-practices-4.html


I had seen those earlier-it does help.


Thank you.


Bill


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## Fly By Night

Alright I'm bringing this one back from the dead. I have materials for a kit on hand and hope to get to it this weekend. My biggest question about the project is how far out to take the rubber. If you don't go 'around the curve' the snow gets scooped by the curve, gets pushed around the radius and smacks the end of the rubber. I see two ways to alleviate this. 

1. Chamfer one end so it blends into the curve sans hitting the end of the belting. 

2. Run the rubber all the way out the curve so there is no transition to worry about. The tips of my impeller are getting beat up from my gravel driveway so I like the idea of having rubber out there to take the abuse. 

I searched YouTube hoping to find a slow motion on an impeller to get an idea of what it looks like as snow gets scooped from behind the augers and flung to no avail. 

Has anyone experimented with these concepts?


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## Mike H

Tony P. said:


> Here's some information on neoprene. I used 3/8" because my gap was 5/8" and I needed the extra strength. Cut strips 2 1/4". Become familiar with durometer hardness scale. The link I supplied is a hardness level of 30A, equal to a tire tread.
> 
> Rubber Strip, Neoprene, Rubber Width 2 in, Rubber Length 3 ft, Rubber Thickness 3/8 in, 30A
> 
> On stainless steel, to be honest I used galvanized although I believe stainless to be a best practice. They're called mending plates and are available at Lowes and HD. Brass is also good.


Hey Tony, how's the neoprene from graingers holding up? I'm considering ordering some of the same up here in Canada. Thanks, Mike


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