# AX 414 gas tank



## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Hello,

It's been touched on a few different threads here and rather than hijack those threads I figured I'd just start a fresh one dedicated to it. My 2014 Plat30 SHO has the 414 motor with the small trapezoidal tank and there seems to be a few guys with a taller square tank. Just saw some full size pictures of a 2014 28 with the 414 on another thread with the square tank. I started doing some web searches and found the pdf manuals for a Gen II AX414 manual stating it's pre-2014 and then the pdf for the Gen III AX414 stating it's 2014+ unfortunately the manuals use the same generic picture for the gas tank setup so no help there but the Ariens website has a bullet point list of the Gen III changes for 2014 and reference a new "low profile" design. So in the other member's case, it looks like his 2014 28" blower is sporting a 2013 motor on it that maybe the factory was using up the last of the Gen II motors before changing to the new design. Based on the placement of the oil fill tube between the two different tanks designs, I don't think I can swap tanks. Does anyone out there happen to have both styles at hand to physically look at, or post some detailed pictures of the square tank and oil neck areas? From the square tank picture, that oil fill neck is on the right side of the motor, mine has the neck coming from the middle of the motor so unless the square tank has a narrower footprint, I don't think it'll clear the neck on mine. I can't get over having the gas supply as such a problem 50 years after they started making snow blowers! That'd be like buying my brand new F350 pickup truck for hauling across the country and finding out it has a 4 gallon gas tank!


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

I would think that you could get the bigger tank on there, though you'd have to buy a few other parts to make the configuration amenable to that. You might also have to get the oil fill tube, perhaps some sheet metal covers, etc. Sounds like you'd also have to get a different muffler.

I can take some detailed photos of my machines for you if that will help, just have to wait until the weekend for me to have time.


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

Are you sure the older version is even any larger or just different shaped? In Ariens sales sheets both the Gen II and III claim a 2+ hour runtime. Its not that bad is it? I am not sure how long mine runs but, it doesnt seem that bad unless it is a really heavy snowfall. I guess a larger one wouldnt be bad though. On the plus side, the Gen III has other improvements which still make it the desired motor to have of the two imo.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

This is why my "Dream" Ariens 24" SHO would have the 420cc Briggs and Stratton. Oh BTW it does have a nice 3 liter fuel tank. Guess I will have to
re-power my new SHO, (if I ever get lucky enough to have one) when I get it.


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

Zavie said:


> This is why my "Dream" Ariens 24" SHO would have the 420cc Briggs and Stratton. Oh BTW it does have a nice 3 liter fuel tank. Guess I will have to
> re-power my new SHO, (if I ever get lucky enough to have one) when I get it.


Despite having what some say is a bit of a small fuel tank(its not that bad imo), the Gen III AX414 engine is a better quality engine then the 420cc Briggs for a number of reasons. I dont think a larger fuel tank and one more foot pound of torque is worth switching to a less reliable engine with a much shorter lifespan. Just something to think about. Briggs arent what they used to be man. I think an aux tank or just sucking it up and filling more often is a better option.


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## cparise (Jan 10, 2014)

Tachead said:


> Despite having what some say is a bit of a small fuel tank(its not that bad imo), the Gen III AX414 engine is a better quality engine then the 420cc Briggs for a number of reasons. I dont think a larger fuel tank and one more foot pound of torque is worth switching to a less reliable engine with a much shorter lifespan. Just something to think about. Briggs arent what they used to be man. I think an aux tank or just sucking it up and filling more often is a better option.


i have a hydro pro 28 with the 420cc 21ft pounds tourque 14hp the thing is a beast im in boston and its saved my ass. the motor is smooth and starts on the first pull every time.


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

cparise said:


> i have a hydro pro 28 with the 420cc 21ft pounds tourque 14hp the thing is a beast im in boston and its saved my ass. the motor is smooth and starts on the first pull every time.


I know this motor rocks as I've seen it in action also. It's good to know that the
the AX414 is good a engine too. It will be worth something when I tear it off and sell it and put the 420cc on.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

Zavie said:


> I know this motor rocks as I've seen it in action also. It's good to know that the
> the AX414 is good a engine too. It will be worth something when I tear it off and sell it and put the 420cc on.


 And according a lot of reading I've done about lifespan of the two engines it appears you may have wished to keep the LCT 414 for after 150 hours or so of run time on the B&S.

I'll take my chances with the sacrifice of 6cc of displacement and 5% less torque if it'll last more than twice as long. Some estimates are more like 5 times the life.


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## buddman (Sep 16, 2014)

Tachead said:


> Are you sure the older version is even any larger or just different shaped? In Ariens sales sheets both the Gen II and III claim a 2+ hour runtime. Its not that bad is it? I am not sure how long mine runs but, it doesnt seem that bad unless it is a really heavy snowfall. I guess a larger one wouldnt be bad though. On the plus side, the Gen III has other improvements which still make it the desired motor to have of the two imo.


takes me 4 hrs to clean the yard..and 2 tanks of fuel..I also clear about 8'000 sq ft...used a little more when the machine was new..but its at 2 tanks now..25 hrs on the machine..I really don't think that's so bad...after all when I bought the machine I wasn't shopping for a Prius..mine has a low profile tank


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## buddman (Sep 16, 2014)

this machine also gives a fair amount of warning when it's getting thirsty I can tell 5 minutes before it runs out..I usually make sure I end up back at the gas can..let the motor cool a little while I clean and move the cars..fill'er up and finish the job


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

My 921029 with Gen II motor got just over 2 hours of run time on a tank the first time I used it. I can't complain about that, it was working hard on a deep snow and about a third of it was the compacted plow berms.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

Pixman I also have the Deluxe 28+ (Special edition model) I have not used it I'm hoping that it is a beast I upgraded from the Deluxe 28 with the 254cc motor. I had a question does the oil drain plug on your AX414 motor have the oil drain plug terminating on the right side of the motor instead of facing the rear of the machine? If so have you had any issues changing the engine oil being that it is so close to the RT tire?


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

I have the Deluxe 28+ (special edition) with the previous Gen II AX 414. I was told by Ariens tech support that the fuel capacity on mine is 3.8 quarts. I do think the improvements on the Gen III outweigh the smaller fuel capacity, especially the oil draining to the rear this is a huge advantage in my opinion. By the same token I am surprised that they would lower fuel capacity on a 414cc motor. I know on their Pro series models They are using Briggs engines with a much higher fuel capacity, which makes sense for a larger engine machine. Good luck with your Platinum 30 SHO it is a really nice unit.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Are you sure the older version is even any larger or just different shaped? In Ariens sales sheets both the Gen II and III claim a 2+ hour runtime. Its not that bad is it? I am not sure how long mine runs but, it doesnt seem that bad unless it is a really heavy snowfall. I guess a larger one wouldnt be bad though. On the plus side, the Gen III has other improvements which still make it the desired motor to have of the two imo.


2 hr runtime? Not in a million years as far as my experience goes with this machine. I'd estimate around 30-45 minutes with it so far. I've got maybe 4 hours on it so far and I'm on the 6th tank full of gas. It's also a major pain in the neck trying to top it off. This gas tank design is horrible. I get a big kick out of Ariens description: "An easy to use, large diameter fuel cap" I guess they got the large diameter part right, but easy to use? HA!

Pixman, yeah, when you get a chance. I don't know about that oil fill tube just being shorter thing though, it appears to come out of a different spot in the top of the motor. Your picture shows it on the right side of the engine, mine comes from the middle of the motor.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

Cardo111 said:


> Pixman I also have the Deluxe 28+ (Special edition model) I have not used it I'm hoping that it is a beast I upgraded from the Deluxe 28 with the 254cc motor. I had a question does the oil drain plug on your AX414 motor have the oil drain plug terminating on the right side of the motor instead of facing the rear of the machine? If so have you had any issues changing the engine oil being that it is so close to the RT tire?


I'll have to look but that won't happen until perhaps later today. I did say I would try and get photos of it for the OP.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Cardo111 said:


> I have the Deluxe 28+ (special edition) with the previous Gen II AX 414. I was told by Ariens tech support that the fuel capacity on mine is 3.8 quarts. I do think the improvements on the Gen III outweigh the smaller fuel capacity, especially the oil draining to the rear this is a huge advantage in my opinion. By the same token I am surprised that they would lower fuel capacity on a 414cc motor. I know on their Pro series models They are using Briggs engines with a much higher fuel capacity, which makes sense for a larger engine machine. Good luck with your Platinum 30 SHO it is a really nice unit.


I remember reading somewhere Ariens has the same size capacity listed for the newer unit as well, but a member here on one of the threads measured the actual capacity at 2.0 litres, and got 2.25 with it spilling over the top. I'm guessing they sacrificed the capacity to fit the low profile of the new design. I'm sure I could get a few more minutes out of it if it was just sucking and spitting powder, but I've been running it through a bunch of heavy stuff, beyond the standard eod plow mess. I've got one of those CoverIt car storage tents in the back yard and the snow shedding off the roof piles up on the sides of the tent. I need to go back there periodically and clear the sides of the tent to allow more room for additional snow load to drop. That stuff tends to get icy and you can hear the machine working the governor with the extra load so I'm sure it's sucking down more gas for the extended load work vs the average kind of snow out on a driveway. It's just getting a bit comical how many times I've run out of gas with it and had the long walk to the garage to get the fuel can.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

Sounds like you've nailed the problem, OR the fuel just isn't emptying the tank that is actually carrying the full stated capacity.

Have you ever tried dipping a screwdriver or other inert object (which wouldn't foul the fuel with crap) into the tank when it runs out to see if the level is actually down to within a fraction of the bottom of the tank? Is it possible they have a stanchion of some kind the keep intake of fuel off the bottom where there might be sediment?


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

gto4evr said:


> I remember reading somewhere Ariens has the same size capacity listed for the newer unit as well, but a member here on one of the threads measured the actual capacity at 2.0 litres, and got 2.25 with it spilling over the top. I'm guessing they sacrificed the capacity to fit the low profile of the new design. I'm sure I could get a few more minutes out of it if it was just sucking and spitting powder, but I've been running it through a bunch of heavy stuff, beyond the standard eod plow mess. I've got one of those CoverIt car storage tents in the back yard and the snow shedding off the roof piles up on the sides of the tent. I need to go back there periodically and clear the sides of the tent to allow more room for additional snow load to drop. That stuff tends to get icy and you can hear the machine working the governor with the extra load so I'm sure it's sucking down more gas for the extended load work vs the average kind of snow out on a driveway. It's just getting a bit comical how many times I've run out of gas with it and had the long walk to the garage to get the fuel can.



I understand it is certainly an inconvenience especially on a higher end machine. I am not so sure I believe that my GEN II AX414 has a 3.8 quart capacity, I think that may be optimistic. According to the LCT website, they show the engine on my unit with the exception being the lack of the throttle control on their photo, their specs show the fuel capacity at 2.7 quarts for the GEN II Motor? Even on my 254cc Deluxe 28, I seemed to be filling up quite often with the LCT stated 2.9 quart fuel tank. 

My experience with Ariens customer support is they seem to shy away from engine questions often stating "we don't make the engines." Trying to deal with LCT is often a challenge, it is very difficult if not impossible to get a straight answer at their tech support line: 1-800-558-5402 for any question where the info is not readily available. I tried to get the thread size for the oil drain tube in order to put an aftermarket release valve to use with a plastic tube on mine for easier oil changes and was unable to get that info. In fairness to Ariens customer service/tech support it is arguably the best in the business. I always get someone on the phone usually within a reasonable amount of time and they really do try to address all of your concerns.

Additionally they seem to listen to their customers concerns for example a lot of people complained in their reviews about the newer headlight design blinding them as they used their machine and on my Deluxe 28+ I noticed they added a tinted upper portion on the headlight to address this from last year's model. That being said I believe if enough of us complain about the small fuel tanks on their larger engine machines they will address it in future models, unfortunately that won't help us who already own them. We shouldn't have to buy a $2100.00 unit to get the proper gas tank size. However we will then have to worry where they will have to cut corners to pay for the larger fuel tank..lol


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

PixMan said:


> Sounds like you've nailed the problem, OR the fuel just isn't emptying the tank that is actually carrying the full stated capacity.
> 
> Have you ever tried dipping a screwdriver or other inert object (which wouldn't foul the fuel with crap) into the tank when it runs out to see if the level is actually down to within a fraction of the bottom of the tank? Is it possible they have a stanchion of some kind the keep intake of fuel off the bottom where there might be sediment?


The fuel tank empties completely, there is just a film at the bottom. I measured it with a tape measure and there is no depth to the remaining fuel. Add 2 liters of gas and the level is just over the top of the screen where the metal part is a larger diameter. Continue filling the tank to the bottom of the cut-outs where the fuel cap fits down into the neck with the strainer in place and fuel pours out at just over 2.25 liters and less than 2.5 liters. So in my opinion the tank holds 2 liters allowing for air space and avoiding gas spills that are not small.

The low profile tank is spec'd at 3 liters (3.2 quarts) according to Ariens documentation. My dealer has talked to Ariens and Ariens ordered a new tank about 2 weeks ago and will be measuring its capacity. Mary Lyn of the Ariens Company (user id on this site) is also looking into the situation.

While the shape of the prior year model fuel tank looks larger than the current I have not heard of anyone measuring its capacity. It would be interesting to learn what the measured capacity is.


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

gto4evr said:


> I remember reading somewhere Ariens has the same size capacity listed for the newer unit as well, but a member here on one of the threads measured the actual capacity at 2.0 litres, and got 2.25 with it spilling over the top. I'm guessing they sacrificed the capacity to fit the low profile of the new design. I'm sure I could get a few more minutes out of it if it was just sucking and spitting powder, but I've been running it through a bunch of heavy stuff, beyond the standard eod plow mess. I've got one of those CoverIt car storage tents in the back yard and the snow shedding off the roof piles up on the sides of the tent. I need to go back there periodically and clear the sides of the tent to allow more room for additional snow load to drop. That stuff tends to get icy and you can hear the machine working the governor with the extra load so I'm sure it's sucking down more gas for the extended load work vs the average kind of snow out on a driveway. It's just getting a bit comical how many times I've run out of gas with it and had the long walk to the garage to get the fuel can.


Maybe you should fill up early, while your at the garage, instead of waiting till it runs dry and having to walk back to your garage.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Tachead said:


> Maybe you should fill up early, while your at the garage, instead of waiting till it runs dry and having to walk back to your garage.


Thanks for the pointer ...however that's already covered in my newly modified starting instructions for using the blower: Step 1 is no longer turning the key to the on position prior to full choke and primer bulb, NOW step 1 is to top off the gas tank! As I stated, I'm running out of gas before I finish blowing the driveway and back yard out, around 30-40 minutes.

Pix: yeah, it's dry, just a skim of gas over the shiny metal tank floor.

Town: thanks for chiming in, I couldn't find the thread at a quick glance where you were talking about having a new tank ordered. I'm eagerly awaiting their findings along with Mary Lyn's update about it. I really doubt there will be a warranty issue if they do find the tank out of spec since I'm sure there's a ton of fine print absolving them of any deviation to stated specs, but how about they talk to the manufacturer, get one half of that tank pressed deeper and offer us an optional high capacity tank that doesn't take the unit out of warranty for modification? 

Of course I can suck it up and just keep constantly filling it, however, I'd rather worry about other things like if the neighbors are about to call the cops because the 40 ft plume I'm pumping up into the wind is blowing snow back across their driveways 50 ft away from me!


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## Tachead (Feb 19, 2015)

Loco-diablo said:


> I'm not convinced or have seen proof that the LCT is a better engine than the B&S. I think all the 'great engine' hype is from LCT owners. These engines haven't been around long enough to determine longevity. From what I've read on this forum, LCT's seem to have their own issues.
> 
> If LCT are superior engines, why does Ariens still use B&S on the top of the line machines? Professional and Hydro-pros?


Well, I will help educate you man because your google foo seams to be lacking. I do have better things to do but, just so this is put to rest. 

LCT is an American company that owns their own factory in China(where the engines are built but not engineered) and has full control over all aspects of design, production, quality control, exc. 

Briggs and Stratton on the other hand, sub-contracts out all aspects of the production of their engines and has no control what so ever. They just put in an order(probably with the cheapest bidder) and brand X Chinese factory makes the engines. 

This alone allows LCT to be in full control and produce engines with a much smaller failure rate, better quality control, and a higher service life. 

Failure rates for B&S engines in 2012/2013 were about 1% or about 1 in every 100 engines. 

Failure rates for LCT engines were about 0.17% or about 1 in every 1000.

Even Honda engines only have a 0.33% failure rate.

LCT engines also have about 4 times the average useful life vs. comparable B&S models. LCT is rated at 1000hours vs 250hours for B&S.

LCT engines also bought out Tecumseh engines so has assimilated their many years of knowledge as well. 

LCT engines can also be repaired/warrantied by the manufacturer of the power equipment vs. B&S who has to be brought to a much harder to find B&S service center. 

So, as you can see, LCT are the best of the best when it comes to snow engines. Honda engines would be another good choice though. 

As to why Ariens uses the Briggs on the pro models, you just answered that question imo(marketing or maybe getting rid of old stock). Your average Joe thinks Briggs is the best and still made in the US when in actuality they are one of the lowest quality options produced in a random Chinese factory. People are very brand loyal and generally too lazy to do the research to find these answers. This is the reason people still buy some of Honda's products(ATV's for instance) even though a lot of them are really old designs that have been far surpassed by other brands. People just get stuck on brands, its a human psychology thing.


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## bwdbrn1 (Nov 24, 2010)

Seems the thread started out addressing the relative size of the gas tank on gto4evr's machine, and it has drifted into a discussion about the quality of one engine over another, where they are built, and what quality controls exist.

It might be interesting if there was a separate thread started, complete with citations of where information was obtained, for such discussion.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

bwdbrn1 said:


> Seems the thread started out addressing the relative size of the gas tank on gto4evr's machine, and it has drifted into a discussion about the quality of one engine over another, where they are built, and what quality controls exist.
> 
> It might be interesting if there was a separate thread started, complete with citations of where information was obtained, for such discussion.


bwd, thanks for the redirect, no worries on the thread hijack, I've done my fair share of that too. I'm sure we'll get back on track once Town updates me on the new tank test!
I'd be interested in following the motor discussion. I'm sure there will be arguments (discussions!) on both sides of the fence since a discussion like this wanders into the same danger zone as one on Politics and Religion. I'm not at all familiar with the LCT motors since I've had Tecs most of my life so I'm interested in hearing more about the motors.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

Back on topic, I took some photos of the engine on my 2013 Platinum 30 with it's Gen II LCT 414cc motor and (apparently) taller tank setup.

If you need a more specific view let me know. I think you can figure out from the views which is front, rear, left and right sides, though I'm sure I'm not posting them in any particular order because I'm too lazy to figure it out.

HTH.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Pix, thanks for the pics! yeah, I see it's not practical to try making that fit on my Gen III, the designs are too different.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

Thanks PixMan for the pictures. I think the second picture of the 2013 Platinum shows a much taller tank where the floor is not flat like the 2014 Platinum. It follows the shape of the engine. 

Attached is a picture of my 2014 Platinum from a somewhat similar angle and a view from the front. On mine there is a piece of metal that hides the engine under the tank. It does not appear the two tanks are interchangeable directly.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

It could be done but not without swapping a LOT of different parts on the engine.

One thing I noticed on mine is that it appears to have TWO drain plugs and THREE ways of checking and/or adding oil! Two ports down low plus the one with the long filing tube.

Strange.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

This is what I posted in the thread that discussed the capacity of the fuel tank on a 2015 Ariens Platinum 30 SHO:

"My dealer called yesterday to inform me that the fuel tank does hold 3 liters. He levelled the tank in a vice and was able to pour 3 one liter containers of gas into the tank to fill it to the top of the neck. 

I went to see it today and it is exactly the same tank as I have with exactly the same dimensions. So to get the rated capacity the fuel must be to the top of the neck. There is no allowance for air gap which probably means ditching the screen assembly to view the fuel level. I imagine the raised part of the tank above the fuel neck provides the required air expansion volume.

Quite disappointing; so I will continue to fill the tank to the top of the screen and allow an air gap that I can see to be safe at the 2 liter mark."

Seems to me that I will have to live with the reduced range to deal with a single snowfall.


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

bwdbrn1 said:


> Seems the thread started out addressing the relative size of the gas tank on gto4evr's machine, and it has drifted into a discussion about the quality of one engine over another, where they are built, and what quality controls exist.
> 
> It might be interesting if there was a separate thread started, complete with citations of where information was obtained, for such discussion.


I'm with ya BWDBRN1,
Especially that part about 'citations of where information was obtained '

Loco


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

I see on LCT's website the current 414cc Stormforce engine lists "2.7 quarts", which converts to only 2.55 litres.

That seems crazy small.

http://www.lctusa.com/detail_print.cfm?i=16


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## Snowhawg (Feb 20, 2015)

On my Platinum 30 there is no way I can put in 3 liters without it overflowing. Without measuring I am guessing my tank only holds 2.5 liters max. One huge flaw to me was the insanely small gas tank. That was one big reason I went with the Pro series for my second machine, even though it has a Briggs in it. The fuel capacity on the Briggs is 1.5 gallons and greatly appreciated. No gas cap leaking either. I was petrified in getting another Briggs after their quality has gone down so much, but I was assured their commercial grade of engines are built to a higher standard. God I hope so.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

Suddenly I'm grateful I have the Gen II version of the LCT 414 motors.

I don't know exactly what the volume is on these, but I DEFINITELY get 2+ hours of run time out of them.

Believe me, after 2 hours out there, I'm ready for a break so it's fine with me.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

PixMan said:


> I see on LCT's website the current 414cc Stormforce engine lists "2.7 quarts", which converts to only 2.55 litres.
> 
> That seems crazy small.
> 
> LCT USA: Liquid Combustion Technology | Global by Design


Well, unless they're mixing old pics with new specs, I'd say that's the Gen II engine, since the motor config doesn't look anything like mine, but looks exactly like the motor on my dad's 2 yr old Husqvarna as well as your pics and if you look at the bottom of the link, it says the pictures are copyrighted from 2009. Dang, I didn't realize the motors were the same between the husq and the ariens or I could have answered my own questions!

On a side note, I've used my dad's 414 quite extensively and I did not have the running out of gas issue with it or the pain in the neck gas cap design either. 

One thing I did have a serious problem with that motor that you may want to check. First year he had it, no issues at all. Probably about 7 or 8 hrs of use. Start of the season this year, I was working through our 6 ft dumping in Lancaster NY and about 20 minutes in, lost the forward motion. Pulled the cover and found oil all over the flywheel. Dried it off, got another 2 minutes out of it before it happened again. Then I notice the real culprit that there's oil pouring down the side of the block. Bolts holding the front engine cover had come loose. I tightened them up, cleaned it all up, topped off the oil and went back to work. 30 minutes later, same issue. Oil pouring again through the case side due to loosened bolts. I tightened them down so hard I was sure they were about to strip. another half hour and it happened again. Got to the point that I kept the 12mm wrench in my pocket and checked/tightened the bolts every few passes. Next day I tightened them again when the motor was cold and haven't had an issue since. I really want to pull the bolts and locktite them but I'm afraid of messing with it because I'm afraid the bolt and/or block threads are going to fail if I screw with them again.

Anyways, I know that tank lasts way longer than mine since after the final clean out of his driveway that day, I headed out onto the street, dodging snow plows and illegal traffic (since we had a driving ban in effect) and drove the blower to my house a mile away to dig myself out since both my junk blower had died within 10 minutes of use during that storm and my back up wouldn't start either. You don't know how long a mile is until you're walking it with a snow blower! I wish I had some pics of the looks on some guys faces as they watched me walk it by their driveways! And man, my back hurt by the time I got home with it since I was balancing it on the wheels so the front wouldn't plow. Took me 2 days to dig my truck out of the side of the garage so I could return it since there was no way I was going to do that again.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

I got warranties which I hope (and expect) I won't need. Only 20 months remaining on the 2013, but better than nothing.

When you say oil on the flywheel, what do you mean? Loss of forward motion indicates to me oil on the friction disk drive.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

PixMan said:


> I got warranties which I hope (and expect) I won't need. Only 20 months remaining on the 2013, but better than nothing.
> 
> When you say oil on the flywheel, what do you mean? Loss of forward motion indicates to me oil on the friction disk drive.


Pix, yep, sorry, I mean that oil got on the drive plate contaminating the friction disc. I may have to replace the disc because even after repeated cleanings, if you put your thumbnail into the rubber, you could still see a sheen of oil squeeze out of it. That's the one spot on the unit you don't want lubricated!


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

gto4evr, have you seen the service bulletin for the LCT414?
Here is a link to it:http://www.lausonpower.com/pdf/TSB%20-414cc%20PTO%20COVER%20ANAMOLIES%20-%20updated%20041213.pdf


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

zavie,

wow, thanks for the link. He bought it around Jan 2013 so it's probably of the 2012 vintage and has that old style cover on it. I'm sure it's passed the warranty window, I'm guessing a year on motors? Good thing for me is that the leak stopped when the bolts were tightened, I just need to KEEP the bolts tightened. When it warms up a bit around here I think I'm going to remove each bolt one at a time and locktite them. I laughed at the 230 inch pounds of torque though, That's 19 ft pounds and I probably had DOUBLE that on those bolts when I cranked the crap out of them and they still kept loosening up. That's one reason I'm afraid of messing with it, I don't trust the threads anymore in that aluminum head after I had to re-tighten them so many times. It hasn't leaked in the last two weeks he's been using it so if I was smart I'd leave well enough alone. 

"if it ain't broke, don't fix it" can definitely be the best choice some times.


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## Town (Jan 31, 2015)

gto4evr said:


> zavie,
> 
> wow, thanks for the link. ......
> 
> "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" can definitely be the best choice some times.


But it is broke due to a faulty design. So doing nothing will surely mean it will leak again. Talk to Ariens and see if they will fix the problem properly. You may be surprised.

Good luck


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## Zavie (Sep 23, 2014)

Town, this thread kind of drifted slightly to gto4evr's dad's Husqvarna that has the LCT 414cc also. As far as warranty's go Husqvarna current warranty for its own LCT engines is a 5 year warranty. Hard to say what the warranty was back when gto4evr's dad bought his snow blower but if it was covered under the Husqvarna warranty it might have been as long as 3 years. I do agree with Town that it is likely to leak again. Might be worth a quick call to the dealer or Husqvarna.


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## gto4evr (Feb 6, 2015)

Zavie said:


> Town, this thread kind of drifted slightly to gto4evr's dad's Husqvarna that has the LCT 414cc also. As far as warranty's go Husqvarna current warranty for its own LCT engines is a 5 year warranty. Hard to say what the warranty was back when gto4evr's dad bought his snow blower but if it was covered under the Husqvarna warranty it might have been as long as 3 years. I do agree with Town that it is likely to leak again. Might be worth a quick call to the dealer or Husqvarna.


Yeah, I'm planning on at least pursuing it that far. I'm going to head over there tomorrow to see if he has his paperwork on it. I'm not holding my breath on dealer support. The fiasco with the purchase from that dealer in the first place is what put the icing on my cake of dislike for the dealer mentality and is what has me at such extreme odds with the general love most on this forum feel for their local dealers. I'll take my own wrenches plus the online dealers and savings any day over the elitism I felt from that dealer when we picked it up after a two week delay so their "experienced service staff" could set the machine up. Then once we had it home I had to have to fix and adjust the drive linkage and attach the chute deflector cable that was way out of whack just to make it usable. It's making me angry now years later just thinking about it again! Man I wanted to call that place up and scream but I'm not normally confrontational and since I'd already fixed it, what would be the point of getting my blood pressure up for? It just gets under my skin, I can still remember that snide dismissive look on that jerks face when we went to pick it up after the delay and he basically scoffed at me that it was worth the wait to have it set up correctly by mechanics that know their machines rather than me who must be a monkey with a gerbil brain transplant that couldn't possibly figure out how to do anything on the machine. Plus, the dealer's too far of a drive to have to keep transporting it back and forth for something I can easily handle without waiting weeks for. 

Oh well, I'll follow up later even though I guess this part of the topic should be moved to the Husqvarna room on the forum.


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## Cardo111 (Feb 16, 2015)

Wow this thread got pretty long, not sure if it has been mentioned already in the thread. Per Ariens 2014 Snow Thro catalog (available as a PDF on their website at the time of this post). The GEN III LCT engines in the following displacements: 306cc, 369cc & 414cc all have a 3.2 Quart (102.4 ounces) fuel tank capacity. I'm not sure why Ariens/LCT went this route when everybody would seem to want higher fuel capacity especially with larger displacement engines, possibly cost cutting or maybe to reduce ethanol related problems because you will constantly be out of gas...lol.


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## Loco-diablo (Feb 12, 2015)

Cardo111 said:


> Wow this thread got pretty long, not sure if it has been mentioned already in the thread. Per Ariens 2014 Snow Thro catalog (available as a PDF on their website at the time of this post). The GEN III LCT engines in the following displacements: 306cc, 369cc & 414cc all have a 3.2 Quart (102.4 ounces) fuel tank capacity. I'm not sure why Ariens/LCT went this route when everybody would seem to want higher fuel capacity especially with larger displacement engines, possibly cost cutting or maybe to reduce ethanol related problems because you will constantly be out of gas...lol.


Definitely too small for a larger fuel thirsty engine compared to the B&S which holds 1.5 gallons, so I don't think a larger tank would contribute to ethanol issues. 
As far an LCT AX 414cc engine lasting 5 times longer than a comparable B&S 420cc professional series, i think that's a lot of bunk. I've seen no facts to support it. None. The only place I've seen that on the internet is here and one guys opinion on some snow moving website (which I think is where some folks here got the unscientific spec). His credentials include 'professional landscaper'! One person's post here quotes the guy's article verbatim. The move to these Chinese built engines by almost all manufacturers is purely for cost savings.


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## Snowhawg (Feb 20, 2015)

I own both the Briggs Pro and the LCT engine, and I agree firsthand there is no way the LCT will outlast the Briggs. I have to refuel my Platinum 30 every hour when working it hard, and with the Hydro Pro/Briggs I can do everything I need to and NEVER have to refuel. It lasts so much longer with 1.5 gallons vs. 3.2 quarts (and that's overflowing) that I have never timed it. Whoever said the LCT lasts 5 times as long is smoking some serious dope.


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## PixMan (Feb 14, 2015)

No one is saying the LCT will outlast the _running time per tank_ of the Briggs & Stratton!

The life of the engines (MBTF, mean time between failures) of the two Chinese built engines is what has been documented as being in favor of the LCT. That is all.


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## Snowhawg (Feb 20, 2015)

That makes a lot more sense! Post didn't read that way. I can believe there's a possibility the LCT might last longer since Briggs has been struggling to make a quality engine for years now (except the Vanguard which they don't even make). But 5x times longer? I think that's a lot of bunk too. All these engines are built in China anyway. My LCT does look and feel cheaper than my Briggs Pro I admit, and the carb/governor on the LCT has iced-up a few times which never happens on the Briggs.


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